My wife and I seperated a month ago, and she is living with her mom and dad in the same town our house is in. I am in the house. She took a suitcase full of clothes, and some shoes, and her hair stuff. She said she has been angry at me for over a year now, because she feels I didn't meet her needs emotionally, and wasn't there for her when I should have been. I take ownership of that. And she hates the person she has become. She said she left to get away from the anger, and cannot be in the same house as me when she is angry because it is not fair for any of us. We have been married for almost 7 years, and I am devestated. In the past month, she has went to see a counselor once (he went out of town after the first visit) and I have been going to counseling (the same guy). She has told her parents, and me, that she does eventually want to work on our marriage, but doesn't know if it's going to work. She said she might not be able to get over the anger and hurt, and etc. But she did tell her mom and dad this week, that she does want to work on our marriage, and doesn't want to tear the family apart, but she is going to need time to find herself, deal with the anger, and if she can she will work on the marriage, she just doesn't know when. She told me, because I was about to just leave, that she doesn't want me to leave. But she hasn't given me anything to hope for. She won't go to counseling with me, she will just go to work, go to her parents house, and go to counseling by herself. She told me she still loved me, but when I gave her my "I can't do this anymore" speech, she started crying hard, and said it wasnt all my fault, she loved me so much, and I let her down by not being there for her for all these years. Then I told her good bye, and told her I was going to make arrangements, and she got a bit frantic, and told me she would call me later that night when she got a break from work. She called, and basically talked me out of it, by saying she sees us in the future at least going to conseling together, and working on our marriage, not just working on ourselves. I am horrified that our marriage of 7 years could be over, without even giving it a chance. The past month, at least once a week, we did the "Why should I do what everyone else thinks I should, and give you another chance?" thing. I begged, I pleaded, I tried giving her reasons, all of which we met by "I am not ready yet". I want to just scream.

There is no one else in the picture. She is 26 and I am 29. We have a 5 year old little girl, whom I am taking care of 5 days out of the week. The inlaws are for the marriage, and both tell me, with various friends who have went through this, and my family, just give her time, and she will at LEAST give you another chance. She will come back. My wife's anger is so deep though, from what I can tell. She has told her family she doesn't want to tear our family apart, and does want to eventually work it out, but she can't do it until she deals with herself. Until then, she is just going to live with her mom and dad I guess. She also doesn't talk to her mom and dad about her anger, she just ..... goes to work and goes to their house. Any insight? Does seperations usually end up at least TRYING to be worked out at least? Counseling together? Moving back in? I am just dieing without her, and through my counseling I am changing myself to be the way I should have been all along. Please, all your input is valuable to me. I know I am not "there" yet with my counseling, but, I feel I have went a LONG way since day one. I gave up my addictive behavior (hobby I spent ALL my time on) and I just want another CHANCE. I know we will have to work on this, but what can I do to make her want to at least TRY to work things out? Am I being to negative about my situation? Why can't I see what a lot of others see in she will come back if I give her time and space? If she did want a divorce, why didn't she just go get one? Why is she in her mom and dad's house? What must I do to make her see, with minimal contact, because she is still so angry at me even after a month, that I want to work on this marriage and save it. All I need is one more chance, and I will make it count. In all of your guy's expertise, etc, does the person who left usually at LEAST comes back to try to make it work, especially when a child and family is involved? Help <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

A

A,

I feel for you, as I have been accused of the very same things. It's been 20 months for me, and 10 months of seperation. I am no closer to an answer than you are. My wife got involved in an affair due to this 18 months ago, so my situation is a bit more complicated. I've done quite a bit of counseling and understand where I went wrong, but like you my wife won't go to MC.

Also like you I have accepted on several occassions the fact that it's over and also like you my wife pulls me back every time. As it stands right now I have filed for divorce, have done the waiting period, have the agreements signed. All that it needs is a judge to sign off.

BUT

Wife steps up and I waffle. Then she steps back. WTF??

I gave myself a moniker about 14 months ago it's 'Yo-Yo Man'. My wife thinks this moniker is cute. I think it's pathetic.

Have you checked out the first thread on the EN board? There are quick links there to lots of information on this site.

Are you doing any counseling? Working on yourself? What are her 5 top emotional needs and how can you try to meet them? Remember, you have a role in the creation of your present situation.

I know you say you want her & your marriage. How desperate are you acting? Women like strong men. Maybe you should read Dobson's book - something like "Love Must be Tough"? It's basic premise is - if they aren't sure and you let them know you can go on without them, sometimes you appear more valuable.

Right now, my wife will not talk about "us" because she said she needs time and space, and then we will work on the marriage. She says her anger is that bad, that she doesn't trust herself yet to be open and honest. She said that I was just not there for her, and let her do things on her own when she needed my help. She is very angry. As to specific 5 things, she hasn't given them to me yet, because she is working on herself with the anger. I am also going to counseling to make myself better. I feel 80% of human right now, because I know I have work to do, but I have changed a lot so far. I know I have.

I had been acting desperate up until 4 days ago, when I just basically keep conversation to "our daughter" and chit chat. I answer her questions when she calls, and that's it. I do not prolong the conversation anymore. BUT it's so hard. She has told her parents she eventually does want to work out our family and not tear it apart, but jeez, I wish we could start now. I know with her anger it wouldn't do a bit of good to do that right now. Is there hope for me? She said she doesn't want a divorce at this point, but also said she doesn't know if she can get past the anger. How often does the person that left, come back and at least TRY if the person who got left just "gives the space" ? Do I have a good shot at making my family not tear apart here? Please anyone?

Boy, what a wierd week. Where to begin....

My mother in law asked me if I wanted to go eat with her Sat night at their house, as my wife was at work. I did, and sitting at their computer, I found a reciept from Wal-Mart from a little over 2 weeks ago, that had a package of condoms on it. I was so upset, and insane. Her mother looked at it, and just got really upset. She said she doesn't understand, because the only place my wife goes is to work, and she works wierd hours, and watches our daughter when she is at home. I didn't know how to handle the situation, so I just left it alone then. Her mom confronted her about it, and was very upset, and my wife said she did not buy them, it must be a mistake. Etc Etc. She cried to her mom that she didn't do anything, and promises to her mom and to God that she didn't......

I bought my mother in law a present to give to her sunday. I did so, went over there, and gave her the present, and my wife said I could come in the room and join them. I didn't want to. I was so angry about that reciept. I went outside, and she followed. We talked, and I told her after seeing that, I just couldn't do a seperation anymore, because I thought I was getting lied to. She looked me straight in the eyes, and told me she was so sorry, but she didn't buy them. I told her that even if she cheated on me, I would want in my heart to forgive her, but she had to STOP doing if she is doing, and start working on the marriage. We cried, we hurt, and we basically got to where we were of the "I am not ready to make a decision to work on our marriage or not". "I can't ever be treated like that again". Etc Etc. I told her I wasn't going to beg, but I am going to go live my life now, without her. I was ready to move back home to our state of TX. She cried, asked me not to go, etc. She wanted to "be my friend" because no one knew her like "I did". That hurt. I left. She calls me crying begging me to not leave. I told her I didn't want to talk to her, and it was best if we just not talk for a while. She calls and calls and calls and said she is just so confused, etc. At one point she said she doesn't know if the marriage could be worked out, and I asked if it was over. She said yes, and was just crying. I told her fine. Went back over there, gave her mom a hug goodbye and gave my wife a hug and kiss good bye, and she wouldn't let me go. It was so wierd.... She told me please dont leave, she was just angry, and she doesn't know if its over etc etc. She said she is just scared of being like it was. I finally left, gave her a hug and a kiss on the forehead, and told her "You keep asking me for reason's to give it another chance, there's a pretty good one right there". And pointed to my daughter playing next door. And...I told her she has some tough decisions to make, and I loved her. I left. She calls me after I am asleep, and asks me why I left the car alarm remote I had for her car, in her car. She said "It's still OUR car isn't it?" And she asked what I was going to do, and I told her I didn't know. And I don't know. It is hard for me to accept she doesn't know if she wants our family to be kept together? She doesn't know if she wants to work on our marriage? To me, that hurts. ALOT.

She calls this morning, I am at work, and talks a bit, about nothing, and still wierded out by yesterday and last night, she asked me what's wrong? I told her I didn't have much to say to her, and I am sorry. She wanted to talk a bit about "us" and asked me why I keep making her make decisions she is not ready to make. I told her that reciept threw me over the edge. It hurt, and I hate standing here waiting. She said her anger is getting better, and she is going to keep going to counseling. She asked me for a little more time. I told her ok. I agreed more time. I asked her if she would wear her wedding ring, and she said yes.

My mother in law thinks that my wife and I broke down a major barrier yesterday, but I just don't know what to think. We are talking more now, and hopefully she can fall back in love with me, and find it in her heart to give me another chance. Patience is one thing, but when you find a reciept for condoms, it hurts. Her mom also told her, she needed to talk to me more, just talk, about ... stuff. Not just about us, but just talk. I can agree to that. If my wife is asking for "just a little more time" ... that's scary. I just don't see her not being able to give me another chance, and her family. Do you guys think our conversations yesterday did anything? Hopefully the counselor can add more insight to things in the next couple of weeks, and her parents could help a bit. I just don't know, but for the first time yesterday, I was ready to quit. What would be in my best interest to do now? Still leave her alone as much as possible? I just dont want her "having her cake and eating it too". Any thoughts? I just don't know what to do, and what to plan? Plan A? Plan B? Argh...

A,

Bro.... Oh man. Reading this gave me so much deja vu from before my D-Day. My suggestion is to prepare yourself for the worst and hope for the best.

WS's will lie to the face of God about their transgressions. She might now be at the point where she's close to spilling the beans. My suggestion to you right now is gurd your loins as this is about to get much, much worse.

Ack51,

I do not think that my opinion here is going to be very popular, but here it is. In my opinion you are being COMPLETELY disrespectful of your wife and what she has said she needs.

Based on your own post, for more than a year your wife needed you to be there for her, and you were not there. You had the chance to choose your obsession or her, and your obsession was more important than she was--and that hurt her deeply, DEEPLY, and then even more DEEPLY!! For more than a year, she begged you for your love and attention and time and protection--and you turned her away AND acted in a way the demonstrated to her that she was less important to you than your hobby!!

So finally, after feeling like dirt and resenting the heck out of you and feeling so unloved and unwanted that she was ANGRY because she knew that she was valuable, she decided, "Fine! I NEEDED you and I told you I needed you, and the hobby is more important to you, so I'm going to go and get my head on straight and see if I can get over this hurt." So after hurting and hurting and hurting for more than a year, she went somewhere emotionally safe for her...her mom and dad's.

Now she has been at a place that is emotionally safe for her for about a month--and it's tearing YOU apart, so you want her to not care what is good for her and safe for her, and do what does not hurt YOU! Can you see that?? She was torn apart for more than A YEAR, and you did not care that she was being torn apart--yet now that YOU are being torn apart, you want her to ease your pain.

She has TOLD you that she does not want to end the relationship or tear apart the family, but that she needs some time to get over being hurt by you, to get over feeling abandoned, and to figure out how to communicate with you in a healthy way. She needs TIME to recover from the ways that you have hurt her.

Yet despite the fact that she has clearly communicated what she needs, and that she loves you, and that she does not want to tear apart the family...you are FORCING her to do it your way, when YOU want it and when YOU need it. This is very disrespectful of what SHE needs and seems to be a pretty consistent message that you are sending her! You care about YOU and what you want or need, but do not care about HER or what she wants or needs!! And that has GOT to hurt her!!

It's like a patient who has been hit by a car saying to their boss, "Hey, I don't want to quit working for the company--I love my job and love my co-workers--but I need a little time to mend my broken leg and my fear of trucks." And you are the boss, saying, "I don't care if your leg is broken and painful--you need to either be at work tomorrow or I'm moving on!" And the patient has two kids, a mortgage, a car payment, and can't lose their job!!!

Ack51, I beg of you to respect your wife and focus on her and what SHE needs. For a brief time, put your own needs aside and recognize what she needs. Envision a fencepost, and every time you weren't there for her, you put a nail in the post. Well, a) start pulling the nails out of the post first! and b) when you do pull the nails out, realize that the nail holes will still be there!

I would suggest that you start by telling your wife that NOW you finally understand that all this time you have been putting your own needs first and not thinking of her and how much she's hurting. Then, tell her that if she needs time it's going to be scary for you and hurt, but that you understand that's how she felt for more than a year. Finally, see if she'd be willing to do a Controlled Seperation: which is that you two negotiate how long and what YOU are going to work on and what SHE is going to work on and when you two will do things together and when you can call and she can call you, etc. That way YOU know that it's going to end and have some of what you need, and SHE knows that you are respecting her and giving her some of what she needs.


CJ

Ack51,

What CJ has written maybe tough for you to hear about yourself, but she pretty much hit the nail on the head. This is not about you and your wants or needs but about your wife and the disrespect you have shown to her. Stop it!! Go read about Plan A and give your wife the time that she has asked for with no more ultimatiums (sp) of you leaving and moving back to TX.

CJ, an awesome job with words, everything I was thinking but could get into words!!!!

Dawn <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

What CJ posted is right on the money!

I would take a long look at your situation, and stop thinking about your wants and needs, and start giving her, her time a space as she has requested.

You need to start looking at her wants and needs first, and putting them first and foremost... otherwise your going to be going down a very rough road.

I would Plan A. like crazy, while time is still on your side.

Stay Strong! (But not as strong as your coming on at this point in time).

Wallace

<img border="0" alt="[Teary]" title="" src="graemlins/teary.gif" />

This whole thread was hard to swallow, and I have read it about 100 times. I have come to the conclusion, that you are correct. All of you.

Yesterday, I went to pick my daughter up, and she asked me to come in, and we talked for over 2 hours, about absolutely nothing. I mean really talked. It felt so good. Her mom got home, and I asked her if she wanted to go eat with me, and my daughter, and asked if I could pick my wife up something so she could eat it later. My wife actually agreed, she let me DO SOMETHING FOR HER. It felt so great. My wife told me she would wear her wedding ring, and I gave it to her. I then told her it is scary, I love her so much, and I will give her emotionally whatever she needs, and I am trying. I will give her time, and I pray for her to find it in her heart, to work on herself and find a way to give our marriage and family another chance. I told her no more ultimatums, no more pressure, nothing. I would be there when she needed me, and when she wanted, if she wanted, to work our marriage and family out.

Her mom and I went to dinner, and her mom told me she is coming around. I told her mom that she deserved time, and she deserved whatever emotionally she needs from me. I will just "be here" when she is ready, if she gets ready.

I know it might take some time. I agree the hurt was just so bad. I was frantic, and hurt, and lost without her. But you guys are right. She is the one that needs me more than ever now, in giving her what I can, and space, without ultimatums. I trust God and my family and friends, for they have told me this will work out as long as I don't push. I have pushed the last time. I am done pushing. She needs me, I have to be there for her emotionally, and Plan A it like a mother, but not overdo it. Thank you all for your honest opinions.

Yesterday, go pick up my daughter, and talked to my wife again about just nothing, conversation. I had a wonderful time. She was so sleepy however, with her new schedule change. We talked for about an hour and a half, and I told her I wanted to leave to let her get some sleep. She was falling asleep, and I kissed her on the forehead, and asked her to please get some rest, and take it easy when she can, and her health and how she felt was important to me. I also gave her some compliments, subtle, not coming on to strong. Am I plan A'ing well?

She was still wearing the wedding ring. I went to my counselor's office prior to going to pick up my daughter, and he said he saw a lot of effort, and a lot of healing the last couple of days. She actually let me get close to her, even if it was a kiss on the cheek Monday and a kiss on her forehead and hand Tuesday. It seems she is letting me closer to her again. I am trying to take it slow, and see how things develop. Man I miss her, and I love her so much. In the end, if this works out, I know with work, and help, we will be a stronger family in the end.

Now my question is, what now? Just wait it out and see what happens in the next couple of weeks? See if she lets me even closer? I love this woman, am not pressuring her, but just seeing her is good enough for me right now. How does one usually come home? Decide one day and call me and just tell me? I would be happy if soon she wanted to go to counseling together, but I will let her come to me with that. I don't want to lose her.

Any insight? Let me know. Thanks.

Last night I was having a rough night, as I didn't talk to her at all. Went through my hurt, laying in bed. I got up, and walked around the dark empty house, lonely, just ... hurting. I went to the front of the house, peeked out the blinds (I don't know, just a habit) and I saw her car drive up, and she slowed down to a crawl, and was trying to lean over and look in the house or see if lights were on or something. I guess she was checking up on me, and it kinda felt good. I wish she would have stopped, and tried to come in or something. I don't know why she did it, but it was nice to be thought about. My daughter was at her mom and dad's house with her, so, I dunno. Wierd.

This is so hard, I wish I knew how to cope with her not being there, and how to cope with not knowing if she will come back to work our marriage out with me. I am dieing inside a little bit each day. I love her still so much.

Yesterday, my wife was upset with me, because she apparently went by the house to check up on things and told me I lied to her about being on the computer at all. You see I had a gaming/internet addiction. She said I lied to her, and told her I hadn't been on the computer at all. I told her I didnt game, or internet stuff, just bought a book at amazon.com and went to this website. She said it didn't matter, I lied to her, and she was mad. I told her:

1. I am very sorry I lied to her.
2. I will take care of the problem she has with the computers.
3. Her feelings are very important to me, and I was very sorry I hurt her. I do not feel the want, or need to lie to her.

I am thinking 1 of two scenerios here. If she didn't care, why would she be checking on me in the aspect of what she feels was a huge problem in our marriage? OR, she is knitpicking and finding a reason to stay mad at me or go further away from me.

After I apologized, she was fine, and acted like nothing was wrong anymore. I took my daughter over there this morning while my wife was at work, so I could go to work, and my mother in law said my wife feels like the computer was the main problem in our marriage, that I couldn't ever get off of it. Any thoughts in to why she would check on that stuff, and be upset that I was even ON the computer? Is she finding a way to just leave me or something? Or do you feel her reasoning is valid? If she didn't care, why would she even check?

Bro,
Get rid of the computer man. Give it to goodwill, give it to some underpriveleged kid.

If you realize it or not,m you were having an affair with that computer, so you neet to establish NC with the computer.

Get rid of the damn thing, but don't tell your wife. She'll notice it is gone and ask. Then you tell her that you realize the damn thing was destroying your marriage and you don't want that to ever happen again.

Already taken care of. I dismantled them, and stuck em in the closet. I told her I didn't need them anymore, and I will not use them, etc. My question is, why would she check up on me if she didn't care? She also TOLD me it bothered her, she didn't hold it in. I told her her feelings were very important to me, and that I will do what I need to do to make her feel better. Are we going somewhere with all this? Is the healing process begginning? The quitting counseling scares me though. Do I just keep plan A'ing?

I think that you’re going to be OK man. Your wife sounds like she is in the same exact spot that mine was a few months ago. The only difference is that my wife withdrew mentally, not physically. But we are separated now (not due to marriage) and we have been able to fix our relationship over the phone.

What I’ve found is the KEY to a good marriage is communication. Let me say that again. What I’ve found is the KEY to a good marriage is communication. What my wife and I have found is that we both want the same exact things from our relationship. We both have the same goals. We’re both on the same page, but somehow, our communication got so bad that neither one of us would listen to the other.

The first thing that I had to do was to figure out what I did wrong and stop that behavior immediately. It sounds like you have done that. You’re going to have to sit down and let her know exactly what you did to her so that she knows you understand what you did. Then you need to let her know that you are going to change that because you don’t want to be that guy who sits on the computer and ignores his family. And you must be sincere. If you don’t mean it, don’t say it.

Then I had to let my wife know that I had changed. That’s a little harder and takes more time. The way I did that was by being consistent and letting her know.

“Look at me. Can you see that I’m trying? I KNOW that it’s going to take time before you trust me again, and that’s OK. I’m the one who screwed up and I’m just going to have to deal with that. All I’m asking is for you to let me prove you wrong. Just watch me and allow me to prove it to you.”

I said that an awful lot and I was consistent about it and slowly, she started to realize that something was going on in my head and she really started watching, and believing, and then she started opening her heart up a little bit.

At that point, we began to really talk. Not about the past, but about the future. I asked her what she WANTED from a marriage. Not what she wanted DIFFERENT, or what she thought she could have, but what she really wanted from a marriage. She told me, and I told her, and we both wanted the same thing. That was HUGE because now we could start to figure out how to get there. We have a common goal.

She’s not going to open up to you right away, and she’s definitely not going to tell you any of the big stuff right away. That’s OK, after you have demonstrated that you are trying, ask her to give you something little. I told my wife, “Have you seen me trying for the past few months? Have you seen me making the effort to change?” She said Yes. I said, “Eventually, you have to open up to me again. You have to trust me and you have to be able to tell me what’s in your heart. I know that’s hard and I don’t expect big things, but can you give me just a little bit and allow me to rebuild that trust, bit by bit?” She agreed to that.

And then you just have to do it. I got angry and yelled a lot. I would refuse to speak to my wife for days on end. I would withdraw and not be there, even when I was.

I still get angry, but I control it now. My wife still gets scared when I get angry. I admit that I am angry, but I still love her and I WILL NOT act the way I used to. I don’t know how to deal with that anger yet, but I’m working on it. She sees that and she appreciates it so much because she sees me struggle with that and she knows that I am giving this everything I have.

Bringing your wife back is going to be like getting a cat to come to you. You need to be patient and consistent and let the cat realize that you are not going to hurt it. Then it will come to within 15 feet of you, the ten, then five. But if you jump up or make a loud noise, it will run.

Good luck Bro. It’s a tough fight, but it’s worth it. I will be married 9 years soon. I can honestly say that right now my marriage is better than it has eve been. And that’s after doing this for about 5 months.