Unlike most of you, I was not able to accept the oc into my life and family. 7 years ago my H had oc with ow. This child is only 5 months older than my youngest child. The ow was a friend and my boss at work and I knew her history of cheating on her husband and persuing past lovers for 10 years inluding her own brother in law. #1 I could not risk her being a part of our lives forever #2 it was just to painful for me to accept this child. I just could not do it. I swear it was killing me. It haunts me everyday that this child even exists and the pain and devestation that it has caused. we pay support but do not visit although OW tried insisting on us having him and called me everything under the sun for not having him be apart of our family. I just couldn't even bear the thought. I loved my H very much but when it came down to it he had to decide. I would not have blamed him for choosing a divorce but I could not be healthy emotionally with the oc in our lives and I did not feel it was in the best interest of my own children to have to explain this to them. Were we wrong for making this decision? It was the only way our marriage could survive. I feel guilty because I "couldn't handle" this emotionally. Am I a bad person? I didn't want to hurt anyone but I couldn't let myself be hurt anymore and I couldn't live with this constant connection to the ow and their child.

Dear sc34,<BR>No, you weren't wrong. Also most of the women here do not accept oc.<P>Only you can know what it will take to stay with your H.<P>Only the two people involved in the marriage can decide together what's best for them.<P>I hope things are going well for you now.<P>Love<BR>Debi<P>------------------<BR>Imagine....

Dear sc34:<P>You are another prime example of 'misplaced guilt'. You have done absolutely nothing wrong, yet YOU feel guilty for not being able to accept a child that is not yours, born out of an affair your husband had with another woman.<P>This woman was a predator, a serial cheater with no conscience or morals, who gave no thought of how her selfish actions would impact a family of innocent people...nor did she care. Yet, so many of US feel guilty. It's lunacy. But, it is normal for decent people to feel an empathy for the OC which often feels like guilt. <P>It never ceases to amaze me the crust of these OW. First, they boldly go ahead and knowingly screw a married man, and more often than not, deliberately get themselves pregnant to secure income shares for themselves or get the man away from the wife because of ego issues. (It's much more fun for them if it is a challenge and for a couple seconds they can believe they are better than the wife and get their ego fed that way) But what really gets me is when they start making demands and have the nerve to whine about how their child is fatherless and have expectations...not giving a rip about the wife or the children or the heartache they are enduring.<P>You are new here but you have been in this alone for many, many years. I commend you on being able to get this far with your marriage intact without a support group like Marriage Builders. How ever did you get through this alone? I cannot imagine where I would be if I had not had this site almost from the beginning. The support, love, care, concern and deep friendships that develop here have been my lifeline. I would like to welcome you to our little group and tell you I wish you didn't need to be here but so glad you found us...you came to the right place.<P>I have chosen not to have contact with OC and there are many here like me that simply cannot or will not accept the OC, for whatever reason. Our feelings and point of view are as accepted as those who have been able to make this sacrifice. Most who have been able to accept OC have evolved into it over a period of time, if the OW was not threatening to the marriage. Some do not have contact because of distance, others are open to it, and some, like me, refuse contact or even to tell our grown children about it. Whereever anyone is on the scale of acceptance, their feelings are valid, accepted and not questioned here.<P>You are not a bad person. The OW is a bad person. You were the victim, the innocent victim in all this who had nothing to say about what was done and therefore is completely without any responsibility. This was not your doing, no one consulted you about your feelings on the matter ot whether or not it was OK with you if some other woman waltzed into your life, did your husband, had a kid and then changed your life forever. No one asked you for permission or consulted you on if it was OK for them to keep the kid or what should be done with it. Therefore, it is their problem and they have a lot of nerve chastising you for not wanting it in your life.<P>She intruded upon your life, you did not intrude yourself into hers.<P>sc34, you've come to the right place. <P>Catnip >^..^<

Dear sc34<P>It is NEVER wrong to put your marriage and your family first! It is your DUTY to do that.<P>Catnip is absolutely right. You are feeling misplaced guilt.<P>I am one of the wives who does have contact with the oc. But I don't think that contact is the right choice for everybody. <P>You have to do what you have to do to protect your family. If that means no contact, then you shouldn't feel badly about it at all. You have NOTHING to feel badly about.<BR>keep posting, we're here for you.<BR>-cd

sc34,<BR> Sorry you have been put into this situation. Please dont feel guilty you did not ask for any of this. The ow made her choice when she allowed a child to be created out of lies and betrayal the guilt is hers not yours. <BR> We have no contact with the oc either he will be 2yrs old this Oct we pay the support thats the only support she gets is money. Glad you found us I dont think I would have ever made it without this group of wonderful people. with love flowerseed

I also echo the sentiments the others have stated here. I understand about not being able to handle things emotionally and we all know our own tolerance levels. At one point I had to cut myself off from my husband completely if only to heal myself. Only you knows what works for you.<P>Please don't feel guilty for doing what's right for you and your family. You certainly never asked to be put in this horrible situation. God give you and the rest of us the strength to carry on. Keep posting here, the support you get will be immeasurable<BR> Kris

Thank you so much for all your comments. I haven't had anyone to talk to for 7 years. My H can only take so much but I couldn't share this with anyone else. It's been very hard and Ive struggled as I'm sure all of you have with every part of my being. I've questioned everything about myself, my life and God and have tried to come up with answers on my own. I've struggled with my faith because children are supossed to be a "gift" from God and of course ow who has never set foot in a church had to tell me how this child was a gift from God to her and my H. But I don't believe it is that way. I mean of course God loves this child just as he does any of us but he didn't reward them for having an affair. He didn't create these circumstances, they did. I believe I did the right thing by staying with my H (most of the time! LOL!) although it's not the easiest thing. And we do have a functional family, it's just I feel the pain will never go away and although my husband is very affectionate and always expresses his love, (of course he did through the whole affair too) I jsut wish I could "feel" loved. Some days are harder than others. I'm glad I stumbled upon this website. I could definitely have used this over the past 7 years! I'm sorry any of us are in this situation but so glad I'm not alone anymore.

You are so right. You have found the best place to be. Have you been in counseling? That would be a place where you could talk about your feelings without any feelings of repercussions. I don't know how you ever were able to not talk about this for 7 years. I would have burst! I told many people about what happened - not that I went around blasting it but at a certain point I felt like why protect him? You have to be a strong woman to do that. Be proud of yourself!!!<P> Kris

HI,<P>I just wanted to add my welcome...<BR>I cant believe you held it in for 7 years!<BR>You are amazingly strong to get thru this all<BR>on your own. I know that our H's can only listen<BR>so much. As you can see, we have all taken individual<BR>paths dealing with this but everyone respects the<BR>others decisions. You do what you can. The ow is ultimately<BR>responsible for how she raises her child.<BR>Keep posting and get to know everyone and you wont feel<BR>so alone anymore. Take care, fluke

Welcome to the site and the group.<P>I am one of those who have visitation with OC, which also means I see OW. That is the right decision for me, my H and our marriage.<P>It is not right for everyone. Each person here must work out for herself what is right for her *and* what is right for their marriage.<P>Welcome. I hope you get a lot from this group. I know that I have.<P>Mrs. Job

Dear sc34,<P>I want to add my warm welcome to you and let you know that I understand what it is like to hold this horrible secret -- I held mine for 10 years.<P>I felt so ashamed that such a thing had happened in my family that I could not bear to let anyone know. Like you, if we had kept contact with the OC it would have been the end of my marriage for sure. I also knew the OW - she was a friend of my H's sister - and she ingratiated herself with his whole family. They all know about the OC and it caused us to sever relations with them for a very long time.<BR>We are now cordial, but not warm to them. <P>Without my knowledge, my H was keeping some contact with the OW and OC. When I found out, the whole issue exploded again like it just happened. That is when I found MarriageBuilders and it has been wonderful to talk to other women in this situation. No one really understands what we are going through except others who are experiencing this.<P>I am so glad that you found us. Don't waste another of your precious moments on guilt. Your marriage vows are sacred and should be protected at all costs. The OW chose to keep her child, she should raise it as best she can without creating additional victims - namely you and your children.<P>My H gladly gives financial support but now he has absolutely no contact with the OC. Believe me I obsessed over that for a very long time. And, even now and then, I get pangs of guilt, but I quickly get over them.<P>Stay on track and come here whenever you feel the need for support or just to vent. It is a long road, but there are lots of wonderful people here on that road with you to help you along the way.<P>love,<BR>heavenly

Does God think I'm bad for keeping the oc and his mother out of our lives? I sought God out for every decision, I read every book I could (only Christian) to find answers, I met with a counselor... I truly felt God lead me to the decision not to have the oc in our lives. (I feel the affair could have continued. I know her and how she was with other men behind her husbands back and I certainly didn't need any temptation for my H) I just don't want to be judged by God for this decision. I know he knows my heart and that this was not based on evil feeling sfor the oc but because I just could not survive this and don't think it would have been right for my kids. Like I said this happened 7 years ago. The ow divorced her H in hopes of having mine. She has since remarried and she does not want us as part of the oc's life now except for cs. (she really tried to force visitations when she divorced her H though and wanted mine. She acted as if she were the victim and I was the ow... she was sick) So things won't change. What do you think God thinks about our decision though? Many of you have said that my guilt is misplaced. It felt so good to hear that. Tell me again...

Thank you heavenly and everyone else. I was posting my next "what does God think" reply at the same time you were. My husband had also had contact with oc behind my back in the beginning, of course he was still having the affair. I didn't find out about the contact etc until a year after the affair and all contact had ended. It was over but it hurt just as bad as when I first found out. There has been no contact what so ever in about 61/2 years and it is the only way we could survive. My H never makes me feel bad about the decision, he says it was the only decision and that even if I begged him to make contact now he never would. He wants to protect our kids and family and make up for all the pain he caused. A part of me will just always feel bad. I didn't do it to hurt my H. I can't imagine having to give up one of my own children but on the other hand I would never have put myself in the situation to have to make the decision in the first place. Thanks again for the support!

sc34, I am relatively new to this site, having found out my H of over 20 years had an affair with a woman for 3 years which produced a child now over one. I found out in Feb. when he was forced to tell me because he was going to have to pay 1100 a month child support out of our joint account. I was shocked, devastated, felt my life was ruined.WE have two young kids ourselves, waited a long time to have kids, so ours are only 4 and 8. I felt my H threw our life away for sex, and he has done grave damage to our marriage. He never intended to leave me, he says, claims he still loved me all throughout affair but did grow to love the OW I think the OW convinced him we would be one big happy family and her child deserved to know my kids as siblings. It sickens me.<BR>anyway, at this juncture, I cannot accept OC into our life at all. I am much like you-my marriage will not survive if H chooses contact. I have told him as much, am prepared to separate should he choose contact, and we nearly did and sought a mediation attorney but have now stopped the process to work on marriage. I have many days I do not think even without contact I can live like this, knowing the child exists and CS payments keeps us attached for 17 years. I hate that. We pay huge payments, that upsets me as well. As someone said above, no one asked us for permission for the affair relationship, the pregnancy, the birth of child, etc. I know my OW wanted the child desperately-had always wanted kids, had none of her own, felt she first would do it all by self, and then 6 months later sought CS . I know she put her needs first, her desire for child superseded even best interests of child , because would it not have been better for all concerned if child had been adopted out?She had no thought of how child's existence would affect my life, my kids, my marriage-=she did what she wanted to do.<BR>I do not feel guilty at all for denying her contact with my H >That is what I need to do to protect my kids and try to salvage some life we may have. Some of the people who post here have also discussed issue with religious clergy, and many of the clergy have said obligation to child is merely financial, that first priority should be marriage and original family.Perhaps that will make you feel less guilty. I feel sick about what h did to me and all of us, and furious at OW for her selfish choice.But I do not feel guilt at all for OC's situation-her mother put her there. Tell me how old your kids are, how far away OW lives with OC, have you managed to keep it a secret? this board is my own salvation. Keep posting. I am there for you.<p>[This message has been edited by lsb (edited June 20, 2001).]

Isb, thank you for your reply. My children are now 9 and 6. The OC is 5 months older than my 6 year old. The affair begain when my first child was 9 mo old. I found out about it several months later (ow was my boss and told all of my co workers) She was also married but had messed around on her husband before, including with her brother in law. They ended it or so I thought. She was preg and didn't know who the father was. The affair continued until the oc was almost a year old. Of course I didn't find this out until a year after that. We do pay support. I tried my hardest to fathom having oc in our lives when we first found out it was his. But I couldn't do it. I couldn't do it to my kids and I couldn't torture myself anymore. The thought was unbearable. I did not threaten my H with a decision, with a broken heart I told him that I understood if he need to be a father to oc but that I could not stay married to him. It broke my heart, and still does. He had to decide. It was an ultimatum but not in a threatening way. I for the first time had to love myself and my kids more than my h and do what was right for us. It couldn't be any other way although that doesn't make it any easier to live with. As I said I didn't even know about the contact until a year after there had been no contact and this was all 6-7 years ago. The ow/oc did live within 5 miles of us but now lives about 25 miles from us. My H does not regret the decision and always tells me the only thing he regrets is putting us in the situation in the first place. We both hurt over the fact that the oc even exists. I will keep this secret as long as I can. I hope the oc never comes looking for us. If he does then I will probably have to tell my children. I don't ever want to relive this and I don't want them to be hurt so I pray it can just die with us. At first our cs only left us with $400 take home pay a month for a family of 4. The ow and her attorney lied about my H's wages and my H let it go into default cuz he didn't believe ow would do anything to hurt us.... obviously he was screwed up in his thinking. After many court battles our support is far lower and now she leaves us alone. My H claims he did not love the ow although he of course told her he did. He never stopped telling me he loved me and insists he still loved me the whole time. Can someone really be with someone for 2 years and not love them? And can someone really love you and do this to you at the same time? This haunts me. I'd like to believe he didn't love her but I know I couldn't be with someone that I didn't love. But maybe I'm just different.(She became pregn 4 months into the affair and he says he stayed with her because she was pregn...????) I love my H although it will never be the same and will always morn the loss of the marriage I thought I had. After several years, I do believe he is a better man and know it is also hard for him to live with the guilt of what he has done. It's just scarey to ever trust anyone again and hard for me to live with the guilt of thinking I did something wrong by not allowing oc into our family. It's like I feel if I did something in MY best interest there must be something wrong with it. I just feel better now that I've found this place and wish I would have had it 7 years ago!

sc34, a quick response, I have to get off computer and do something. OUr ow lives about 5 miles away too- it makes it so hard for me to walk around and fear I will run into her, especially with my kids. I only saw her once briefly, not sure I would recognize her or she recognize me,but she knows my kids so when I am with them, I fear she will say hello to them and they to her and the OC. I hope the OW leaves area, if not I think I will have to move, something H does not want to do, we are very entrenched in area whereby OW is not I understand about fear for your own kids, I worry about them being damaged daily, when right now they are so happy, carefree, just as they have a right to be in their childhood.I am furious OW thinks their life should be disrupted to know OC-she has no rights to them,What a Crock-as if what she did grants her rights to my family??she is dreaming! I understand feeling as if the pain will never go away-I think how am I going to deal with this for the rest of my life? how do you move on and not be miserable with all this? How did H do this to all of us, risking all for an affair and sex? I don't think he even understands why he took such a risk-I hope he enters therapy to process that one out, but he does not believe in therapy,is a very reluctant customer of it,and I fear would be do defensive in the process he would not get anything out of it.<BR>H sees my issue of no contact as ultimatum-I like you, see it as what I need to stay in marriage.NO more or less.The way I see it he and OW have done everything they can to end our life, our family life, our marriage, our sanctity and security for our children. I am therefore left with having to do what he did not=protect me from further pain, although the pain will always be there,a nd protect at all costs my kids' life. If H cannot see that, and work with me on that, and realize our children must have some priority, I am then not sure I can stay with a man who does not feel that way. He was obligated to us before he did affair -and those obligations come first in my estimation. Keep posting.<p>[This message has been edited by lsb (edited June 20, 2001).]

sc34,<P>first of all, welcome. secondly, as everyone has already said, NO you guys didn't do anything wrong. especially YOU. like catnip said, misplaced guilt. we've all been there, i've asked the question many times myself.<P>glad you finally found this place. come here often, read back in the old posts, there is so much helpful information here in all our old posts. <P>BTW, me and H are 4+ years into recovery. OC will be 4 this year. We have been married 5 1/2 years. No kids yet. This was planned. I am still going to school. We have no contact with OC, just pay child support. <P>Welcome!!!<P>happy_girl

sc said: "can someone really love you and do this to you at the same time?"<P>SC, welcome to our board! In answer to that question (oh, I think it a lot!), yes it's possible. The answer has to be yes in many cases. I have learned so much from reading about the psychology of affairs. I'd rather not be in the position to need this wisdom, but I think it is wisdom. And it also follows that your H felt too guilty to end the affair after the XOW got pregnant... aren't responsible men taught not to do that? So betrayer gets more and more confused, one mistake leading to others. Did you do the right thing by the OC? I hope so. You followed your heart and God knows your heart better than any human. All good people struggle with it.<P>That's all I have time for right now.<BR>Congradulations on repairing your marriage! <BR>Best wishes,<BR>J, in recovery 2+years

SC,<P>Dont have much time on here so let me apologize in advance for being breif. As everyone else said "NO, absolutley not!" Stick around....the guilt will ease..lol. I felt the same way you do when I was first going through all this. You worry about God? Please do not. God wants you to have priorities and those priorities are 1) Him 2) your marriage and 3) kids. Your marriage is #2 only to God.<BR>Read the story of Abraham and Sarah in the Bible..somewhere in Genesis...I believe Happy girl knows exactly. Or it is in here post Recovery thoughts for Newbies. That story helped me greatly. The circumstances surrounding the birth of oc are different but the message is the same. Marriage and children of marriage are priority. Also I reccomend reading Surviving An Affair (on this site for cheaper than bookstore). It really helped me understand how my H could have done this. Mine told her he loved her also, as he was telling me. My H is totally devoted now and we are doing well. It is a fantasy world they live in. There are no true feelings in fantasies...except maybe lust.<BR>There must definately be something special in your marriage to have survivred this long with no support group. It has been 2 years for me and I really do not think I would have made it that far without MB and these beautiful people on here.<BR>Love and Prayers<BR>broken_wings

My husband and I attended Retrouvaille in March of 99, just two months after D-day and the end of his fling.<P>Retrouvaille is French for Rediscovery,...a place for troubled marriages.<P>During the Retrouvaille weekend there are many revelations and quesions answered. I asked the officiating Priest what obligation we have to the OC. He told me "Absolutely none...your first, foremost and only responsiblity is to each other and to your marriage. The only thing you owe OC is some finanacial support. Other than that, nothing. Concentrate on your spouse and on your marriage and let it heal."<P>I can't tell you how relieved I was to hear this. He went onto explain how the marriage was the foundation, the bedrock where everything else came from in a family and that needed to be protect above all else.<P>Catnip >^..^<