Marriage Builders
Okay, folks, I need a quick reality check here. On Tuesday my S was working in Longmont, which is about a one hour drive from my home. I went to pick him up after work (my D came with me) and I needed to be to MY work that night by 5pm, so OS volunteered to drop me at work and then he would drive home. I thought that was pretty thoughtful!

Anyway, exH was supposed to pick up our D at our house at 5:30pm for his weekly visit with her, and he happened to arrive at our house before the kids got back. Sooooo...he gets to the house, rings the doorbell and no one answers...and "he's worried" so he uses the key we have hidden outside and LETS HIMSELF INTO THE HOUSE!! Now, there was no one at home, the lights were off in the house, the house was LOCKED, and he never tried calling the home phone or cell phone. "He's worried" so he just unlocks the door and WALKS IN!!! >:

When I found out about it, I told him IN NO UNCERTAIN TERMS that he was NOT allowed to enter my home without my permission, and that I sure as heck did NOT give him permission!! :flambe He then proceeded to try to explain that he had the right to enter the house because the kids told him they would be there and they weren't...and "he was worried." :2argu Furthermore, when I told him I thought it was illegal, he told me "Fine; I guess next time I'll just call the police." Maybe it's just me, but I took that as if he were trying to intimidate me.

DUH--HELLLOOOOO!! If he were to arrange to meet his boss at his boss' home at 5:30pm, and arrive at the boss's home to find no one home, would he walk into the boss's house?? I doubt it!! He might call the home phone...then a cell phone...then wait a while...then leave a note saying, "I was here, you were not." I seriously doubt he would just enter the house!!!! If he were to arrange to meet his girlfriend...or ANY friend for that matter...and arrive at their house before they got there, it would be breaking and entering to just go into their house! But somehow he's trying to convince me that it's not illegal to enter my home without my permission!!

(BTW, I would never in a million years give him permission!!)

FURTHERMORE...I seriously doubt if he really would call the police, but if he actually did, what would he say? "They were supposed to meet me here, and they're not here?" Is that a crime? The police would laugh in his face! He has no reason to call them or "be worried"

So vote here. I call it illegal breaking and entering. He thinks he had the right because "he was worried." Give me a reality check and let me know what YOU think!!


FNCJ
Illegal!
If not Illegal..then at least Lazy with a hearty splash of Entitlement.

I admit it..if H and I were divorced..and I was coming to pick the kids up and they weren't answering..I might begin to really panick and enter. Not as a first choice though. After exhausting efforts to get in touch..I would be concerned about things like CO poisoning, and I might go in.

However, as soon as I had determined that they were not inside I would leave..and leave a "sorry for the intrusion but I couldn't get ahold of anyone and had myself a little panick attack" note and suggest that we come up with a plan for such things as this..

If he came in and made himself a sandwich, then ran up the phone bill and did some laundry <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> I would have a hard time buying the story. Which is probably a LOT closer to what happened.

But I'm just sayin' <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

Noodle
I would say it's time to find a new hiding spot for the key!
First, it is illegal, for anyone to enter your home without permission--

but more importantly WHY do you have a key outside for ANYONE to find??? How do you know someone isn't casing your house and see even you or one of your kids get out the spare key and use it when you aren't home???

And if someone used YOUR key to get in YOUR home it's not really breaking and entering--it would be considered trespassing though--and they would then get onto you about leaving a key out for someone to find--

I mean think about this--what if while you were out someone got the key--unlocked the door, put the key back, went inside your home locked the door behind them and waited inside for you or your kids to get home???? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

I would get rid of the key--place an extra key at a trusted neighbors house if need be--but never leave a key outside for ANYONE not just your EX-H to find--

I have a question--if you have a garage do you open the garage pull into it--then close the garage before you get out of your car???

Do you have bushes growing up around the front sides of your garage if you have a garage?? Or how about your front door??

Sure those are great for looks but they are also great for someone to hide behind when your not paying attention--

If you have a garage and bushes growing around the
sides--someone could hide there--and if you open the garage and close the door before you get out--
they crawl in behind your car and you could lock them in with you--

yes, this is meant to scare you or others--but more importantly--to help keep YOU safe--
FNCJ, do you live in the mile high state? I do.
Same security issues in Aussie too..we have a small magnetic key box we place in the wheel hub of our cars, when we had more then one car, for the house.

it has no tag nothing to ID it but we know its there if we need it. Wouldn't hide it outside though, too easy for those hanging around watching too get at it.

other thing we have is a darn good dog & NO ONE but those who live in the house can get in not even my MIL who by the way is a gem & welcome anytime.
We leave the side sliding door open for the dog to go into & out of the house...no one gets in past that bloke.
FaithfulnewCJ,

I'm in Canada....your country, and your state may differ.

Here....to actually be charged with break and enter, you must do it with the intent to or actually commit an indictable offence. (that's sorta like a felony) If he stole something, assaulted someone or did it with the intent to, that is enough if he has no legal authority to be in there. The fact that he used a key has absolutely no bearing on it...even if he walked into an unlocked door is considered break and enter.

In the absence of that set of circumstances, he could be charged with "unlawfully in a dwelling house". Pretty minor stuff. His excuse, though weak, may be enough to deflect a charge and/or a conviction. It of course would have to take in account all the circumstances with which he reached that conclusion. The courts are generally a pretty lousy way to solve the issue. You obviously have made it clear to him not to enter the house under those circumstances again.

A key hidden is a security risk. Get rid of it, or at least move it. Change your locks if you think he might have made a copy, or get one of those fancy electric combination push button locks. You have to trust your kids not to give out the combination though.

Like I said, your state may be different than here, but probably covers the same bases.

<small>[ January 28, 2005, 12:09 AM: Message edited by: Binder ]</small>
CJ,

As I recall this dog has bitten you before. As in, break in, mess with your computer, and I don't recall what else.

Just another example of his lack of respect for your boundaries, and a lack of consideration for anyone else. Of course I'm interpreting things in the light of more recollection of your past with your ex than perhaps most here.

Anyway, my vote is that it's another demonstration that people don't often change their basic character. At least not without really wanting to, and he doesn't seem to want to. Pay attention to what they do, not what they say...
Just a quick note about who's where, etc:

My exH and I are officially divorced and have been for nearly two years. We are living in entirely separate homes that are only in our respective names. In other words, there is no confusion about whose home is whose...we don't still each have our name on a mortgage or lease...etc. This is extremely clearly MY property, and he extremely clearly opened a LOCKED property that was not his, and he knowingly and unlawfully entered. He does not now, nor has he ever had a key to my property; nor do I have a key to his. When I moved in here some two years ago, I had the locks changed and got brand new locks...so the keys are not "that" old--and there are five copies (landlord, me, 2 kids, hide-a-key). On our patio, we had one of those "hide-a-key" deals that had a key in the unlikely event that one of us forgot our housekey or accidentally got locked out. Apparently either the kids told him where it was, or he SAW them use it , or something. It was supposed to be used in the event of an emergency!

Anyway, the very, very FIRST thing I did was to bring in that "hide-a-key" and leave it in the house. For the time being, until we figure out how to proceed, there will be no key outside.

The second thing I did was to look at Colorado State Statutes, to actually read the law for myself. Now, since I do not know what he did while he was in the house, I can not prove whether he entered with the intent to commit a crime or not, but I can say that some things were moved around in the house enough to let us know someone had been in our home. To me, that is on the verge of stalking. Soooo...after reading state laws, it was either first degree criminal trespass (knowingly and unlawfully entering with the intent to commit a crime), second degree criminal trespass (knowingly and unlawfully entering a dwelling), or stalking/harrassment (knowingly and unlawfully entering with the intent to intimidate or harrass). Frankly, I think all three!! Thus, it would appear that by legal definition alone, what he did was indeed illegal.

The next thing I did was call my landlord and ask about the price and process of changing locks. Hey, how do I know he didn't go get a copy of my key?? I will be discussing the options with the landlord tomorrow (after I meet with stillwed!!)

The next thing I did was to investigate the different options of reporting, documenting, filing RO...just looking at what's available. Thankfully, in my city they have a Telephone Reporting Unit at the police department which you can call and make a police report and let the officer know it's a cold crime, you just want to report. I thought that sounded like an EXCELLENT option for me. I will sleep on it tonight, but I think I am going to choose to file a telephone report, and then it's on legal record...and if he ever does something like this again, I have legal documentation of it.

I don't mean to sound paranoid, but StillHers is right...my exH has done this stuff before. Two years ago, he broke into the house a couple of times: Once while I was sleeping he came into my room and when I woke up, he said "Just wanted you to know I can get in here any time I want." Another time, he broke in while I was sleeping, woke me up, and said, "I could have snatched the kids and you would have never even known." Another time he broke in while we were at the movies and deleted my hard drives. Yet another time he broke in while one kid was home (he didn't realize that at the time) and took a sledgehammer to the walls.

Yeah...this man is pretty sick, so I think telephone reporting is appropriate. I don't think "document this time and report if he does it again" will quite cut it. Plus there's the whole CS court thingy, and I think he might be trying to (GEEZ, I don't know...) get evidence or something??? Snoop around??? The man is not right in his head!

I think tonight might be an EXCELLENT night for a beer and an early bedtime...don't you??


FNCJ

P.S. Grapegirl...yes I live in the Mile Hi City, the Rocky Mountain State. If you'd like to shoot me an email, my addy is in my signature. Hey, we may be neighbors!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />
FaithfulnewCJ,

In light of the additional information I would pursue this as far as possible; the prior occurrences should have been. The latter two charges you referred to may apply. Speak to the police about what your options are in charging him and if there is enough evidence to do so. He may deny being in there, did anyone see him or do you just have his spoken word to you? They'll want to know.

An RO is a good option as well given the past history.

This goes beyond marriage building and the support offered here, your X has exhibited a pattern of devious behavior. I'd be concerned. Speak to the professionals there and make some decisions with personal/property safety as your goal.

<small>[ January 28, 2005, 08:28 AM: Message edited by: Binder ]</small>
Binder,

Thanks for your concern. Just so you are not thinking I'm "unsafe", the other incidents occurred about two years ago. At that time, I did file a restraining order, and it was added into our divorce when it was finalized.

This is most definitely beyond "marriage building" in that my exH is abusive and mentally ill. It would require years and probably decades of intensive, individual counseling to address this! I do not mean to sound dramatic, but that is just a statement. Thus...I'm not asking for advice to "Plan A or Plan B" (haha) <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> I'm just doing a reality check to make sure *I* am thinking straight...and I am!


FNCJ
Nothing to add, CJ. Just saying HI.

And be safe. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

GC
That would make me way nervous and I am big rough guy.

I think you should persue whatever legal avenues are available to make your home safe for you and your kids.

All the best

-OAK
File an official complaint with the police ... so there is a record in case this behavior escalates.

This is done as a self-protective move on your part. You do not need to justify making a complaint when your home has been illegally entered, so don't even go there. It is both ethical and smart to file an offical complaint.

Pep

<small>[ January 28, 2005, 10:02 AM: Message edited by: Pepperband ]</small>
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