this comment was made in this forum and it was very disturbing to me. i would like to know what the population at mb's has more of: continuing cheaters or recovered marriages.

It takes just one cheater that stopped cheating to disprove that statement. And we have many WS' on this forum who can disprove it.

I would be interested in know ing that also. There has to be a study somewhere.

I don't think there is a study on the Marriage Builders population. But there doesn't need to be, because the statement is easily disproved. Just one example will do that.

I do not think once a cheater always a cheater.If a BS thinks this they would have no faith in saving there M.No one would bother trying.

Like ML said it only takes one person to prove that.There are alot of FWS here.God Bless Them All

#1mom

If that's true - then I am doomed...my Dad after 11 years of his affair is also doomed...why did he bother becoming a Christian and making all the changes he did in his life - and why am I bothering my changes - since no matter who i become - I am just going to cheat again and again in my life....my husband is also doomed...which means my marriage is not going to make it long term...why am I wasting my time then?

See how silly I find that comment. I believe if a cheater doesn't acknowledge they are a cheater and make real changes - just puts it behind them very quickly - they may be once again a cheater...but I think a GREAT many cheaters who really look at themselves...never become cheaters again...

If it's not a fact - then i have a sad future ahead of me - tearing my husband and family apart again...

I am not so self centered that I believe I am INCAPABLE of ever having one again - but since expereincing it first hand and having that scar on my marriage for life - I wont be forgetting...and it's hard to repeat the same mistake when you don't forget. Just like my appendix scar will always remind me of that surgery - this scar on my marriage will always remind me...and for that - and all the personal changes I have made - I don't think I will be cheating again...but just in case - I have also set up a support group of people who can hold me accountable...

Once a cheater, always a cheater...???I just don't and can't believe it...

That's true, but I suspect it's also irrelevant. I think the question 2334 is really asking is "What are the odds that this will happen again?" For instance, it's not true that nobody ever wins the Powerball lottery, but if I invest $10,000 in lottery tickets, what are the odds that I'll win? Low enough that I'd prefer to find a better investment, like say, pork belly futures. I suspect 2334 is not asking, "Is there a remote chance, like on the order of winning a lottery, that my cheating spouse will reform?" but more like "What are the chances that my cheating spouse will reform, and are they high enough that I'd be willing to take the risk?" And I think that's a good question.

I agree that might be a relevent statistic, but that is not what she asked. Read the title of this thread: "once a cheater always a cheater." She is asking if this is true and then seeks validation with the vague question: "i would like to know what the population at mb's has more of: continuing cheaters or recovered marriages."

I think if that's the question - like the Harley's say - we are all subseptable to affairs. many Bs's really feel they are immune...sounds just like me who's father cheated and an ex cheated on me and gave me an STD - I would NEVER have an affair. My H, a BS who said the same thing. It takes the right mix.

There are NO garuntees...its a risk we all take, but I do believe that those of us enlightened now make the risks SOOO small...as we recognize warning signs now...both BS and WS alike. And so things will probably never progress due to that awareness.

Maybe it's just me....maybe I am saying this as a FWS?? I dont know - sorry if it makes anyone mad...

I think the only true prevention in many cases is knowledge...Of course there are many of those cases where there are 50+ years of no cheating, etc...without knowledge - but if you look at their marriages - in alot of cases - even with ups and downs they have been doing somethng right and naturally seem to be meeting eachothers needs without even knowing the Harleys....

I don't find that question vague at all. The answer would be specific enough-count up all the MB'er's who have recovered marriages, count up all the MB'ers whose spouses continue to cheat, and see which number is higher. The logistics of arriving at those numbers may be tricky, but the concept is clear enough, to me anyway.

I think 2334 used the expression "once a cheater always a cheater" as the lead-in to the real questions, which were "what are the statistics here?are there more continued cheaters than recovered spouses?" If the honest answer is "we don't know what the numbers are" or "we don't know how to disaggregate the total numbers in a way that would be useful to you", then say so.

Again, you can see what she is asking, yet want to overlook her clear question and add meaning that is not there. Her goal is to prove or disprove the statement:


Her question about a MB poll was a vague attempt at a tactic, but a tactic to answer that very specific question.

Read what she has asked. Seems pretty clear to me!

Well, IMHO, the fact that any of us are here, and many of us consider ourselves either as recovered or recovering, MB probably has a higher success rate because we have a better understanding of the dynamics of the affair...why it happened and what it takes to recover.

But...I am equally certain that there are probably many WS out there who have cheated and continue to cheat throughout their marriages without the knowledge of their spouses.

Because I trusted my FWH completely prior to his A, had he made any real effort to adequately hide it from me, it is very possible that I might never have known at all. The truth is, that he left credit card bills with local hotel charges laying on the kitchen table. At least on a subconscious level, he wanted me to know so he could end it.

For me, I can't come here with the attitude that my FWH will cheat again. If I really believed that, then I would have to end my marriage now. We have made so much effort to meet each others EM's and strengthen our marriage that if he cheated again, it would simply because of a defect in him....and it would be the deal-breaker.

There is no simple survey on this question.

Who

2334pem,

From my own experience and from what I’ve witnessed on these boards, A’s can be “one time mistakes” and WS’s CAN change and not make the same mistakes & wrong choices again. Most A’s happen because people are not aware of their own weaknesses & vulnerabilities and because they don’t take the necessary precautions to safeguard themselves and their marriages from this. However, as you have already witnessed on these boards, many WS’s learn from their mistakes & wrong choices, take the necessary precautions to protect themselves and therefore become FORMER and RECOVERED WS’s who are very “sensitized” to A’s and will not allow themselves to make the same mistakes & wrong choices again.

Personally I am so “sensitized” to A’s now that I won’t even allow myself to have any opposite sex friendship where my H is not part of the friendship and where both of us can spend time with the person. Before my inappropriate friendship I was not so “sensitized” to opposite sex friendships and therefore allowed myself to enter such a friendship on e-mail with a man at my work…

Therefore, as someone who’ve almost been involvement in a serious EA myself, I understand now how easily people can get involved in A’s and/or develop inappropriate feelings for someone of the opposite sex if not very cautious & carefull… If I can explain: Although my involvement hasn’t yet progressed to a serious level, the feelings I’ve developed were extremely intense. So intense that it scared me… And because of this, I have more understanding & empathy now for the weaknesses of people who get caught up in A’s. From my own experience, I know how hard it is and how much willpower it take NOT to act on those feelings. I was lucky that certain internal factors (like my anxiousness, fear etc.) helped prevented me from acting on those feelings...

I think part of Satan's strategy is to use these inappropriate feelings and sexual attraction people often develop for a member of the opposite sex to cause them to stray. And I think during infidelity these type of feelings are intensified to the 100th power. We ALL are wired for an affairs. Prior to my involvement I thought I was immune against this, but I’ve learned the hard way and my experience was an eye-opener to me.

In conclusion I want to say that the words ”once a cheater...always a cheater" can be true for some cheaters (serial cheaters etc.), but as I’ve said, many, many A’s happen to ‘decent’ people who've made "one-time mistakes" but have learned and grown from their mistakes & bad choices… Some people may always have certain weaknesses & vulnerabilites that can make them vulnerable to the opposite sex, but that’s why it’s important to work on those weaknesses; put certain boundaries in place and avoid ALL opposite sex friendships if necessary. Some people may need stronger boundaries than others – it all depends on the individual and specific circumstances.

Hope this could help to shed some light on the subject from the perspective of a FWW…