I've been an Army wife for just under 17 years. All but ten days of our entire married life, as a matter of fact. It certainly has its *challenges* <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" />, but with all the added stresses, we have a pretty good life. Problems have presented themselves and we've also (duh, this is the infidelity section of the forum!) had problems brought into our marriage. I've got to admit, the extra pressure of military life makes it doubly hard sometimes to hold to MB principles. Pretty much every single policy has a loophole when it comes to life in the military. Especially when it comes to rebuilding our relationship after an A.

If nothing else, I just wanted to start a dialogue with some other military folks (active, retired or spouses) to see how you have adjusted MB principles in your own situations. How do you work around the special circumstances of deployments and security clearances and TDY and.....and.....and.....ad nauseum? How has military life posed a significant challenge to your recovery from infidelity? Has it helped?

It is wonderful to hear from another military spouse. My husband has been in the military 15 years, we have been married 9, in recovery 2 years 2 months. It was I, the WW who had th affair 3 years ago. I can say, we are making it. We spent 6+ months separated legally and by 3,000 miles. Then my husband got orders overseas, where we are currently living. He had to decide if he was going alone, or with me...well, he took me. We have been here a year and a half, and of that he has been deployed frequently (from weeks to months, for a grad total of about 6 months apart). He feared that he could not trust me, but I proved myself trust worthy, a little more each day. We are getting ready for a 9+ month deployment to Afganistan, it will be our longest separation ever. We feel strong, and know this is the next giant step in our recovery.

Military wife for 17 years (3 more years and we are out....yahoooo!)- married 20 years- 13 months into recovering after H's A.

I think the military throws us some extra challenges that we would not have thrown at us if we were civilians.

My H had an A with another soldiers wife last summer, it lasted for several months. Her H was deployed (go figure!) Our marriage was going down hill before the A, mostly it was taking each other for granted after 19 years of marriage-seemed like our M had no emotions holding it together. Anyways, I found out and we have worked things out with a lot of changes in our life.

One thing that makes our life harder is the deployments-if our spouse deploys or if the OP's spouse deploys. (the H of the woman my H had an A with will be deploying again in a few months.....stomach is already doing flip-flops because I know from past behavior of hers that she will most likely try to start up contact with him when her H leaves) We live off post, she lives on post. I can't follow my H every minute of the day while he is at work-nor would I want to.

One thing that is good is the military offers counciling for free- we spoke to a Chaplin that really helped in our situation. I am not sure how many use what is offered free to them, but it is there!

With all these deployments it breeds of people who feel they have the right to get affection elsewhere, no matter who it hurts. Situations in the military make it easy for A's to be covered up. BUT, if our spouse messes with another soliders wife/soldier it is very easy to get a lot of info on them. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> I couldn't believe how easy it was once I found out her name. Bumping into "them" is likely if you shop on post. (Thank God for Walmart!)

Bottom line, the military makes us stronger. We are multitaskers to the biggest degree! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> Somewhere in the mix of our never ending multitasking we were thrown a nasty bone(an A!!!) and it is wonderful to see that there is another military wife out there that is surviving it! Nice to meet you!

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />Maggie

GettnThere, it's nice to "meet" you! I'm also along for the ride on an overseas assignment (Germany), and up till last week we were getting ready for yet another deployment. We just found out that my H will be on rear detachment, a major relief for both of us and our teenage kids. We're a year behind you in recovery, it took both of us a while to get to the point where we were fully convinced that NC had to be permanent and all-encompassing. My H found it a little too easy to email and call the OW behind my back from work.....so our trust factor is still, well, gettin' there! It's great that you have proven yourself trustworthy before this upcoming deployment. What kind of safeguards to you guys have in place for your H's peace of mind and your protection? It makes it hard to engage in some of the things "normal" couples would--suddenly family friends become a little bit more dangerous when only one spouse is around. That's how my H's A happened--he "took care" of his best friend's W while BF was overseas. From hero to scumbucket in two months flat.

My H and I have spent just over three and a half years of our 17 year marriage apart, but oddly enough none of it was following D-day. It just seemed a little counterproductive in our situation, I guess. One of these days we're going to have some "us" time, but it likely won't be for another three years. I guess it's slowing down our recovery process a bit.

So how are you planning on dealing with the challenges of this deployment?

Hello,
I'm on the flip side...I am the AD member and H the WS. Lots of our M deterioration happened with a gradual erosion from me spending most of my efforts at work and then after work with the kids and very little H time. Too tired to meet H EN's and at the time not aware of MB principles. H was a bit resentful of all the kudos/recognition/accolades I recieved although through it all he continued to encourage me and tell me to do what I needed to for my career...all the while he was brewing, getting more and more bitter and resentful and I was oblivious thinking he was just a wonderful and supportive spouse! I had no idea. Obviously we did not communicate well.

H had a "friend" this entire 4yr timeframe that I was never comfortable with and just last week he admitted it crossed the line (which I figured all along but was too entrenched with work and committments to do much about sad as it is). He has since had 2+ OWs to meet his needs and we are now in the trenches trying to make some sense of this and how we got here.

Trust and honesty are our 2 biggest issues and having chunks of time away only makes these issues ever so important. My personal goal is to work on these issues and build our friendship back so that H doesn't need to rely on others to meet these needs (this was actually his suggestion). It is difficult with any AD deployment/separation but when the H is the one at home or primary caretaker during separations he is usually relating and getting support from other military spouses and often they are wives. Huge challenge for us since H has hard time with boundaries.


Just wanted to intro self and join in your discussion; nice to meet you all...gotta run for now! Would love to hear your challenges, strategies, opinions!

It is wonderful to meet you too! We are in Japan.
I never thought moving overseas could be a gift, but in our case it has. We have been able to basically start over again. My affair was with our mutual best friend, a co-worker of my husband's. Our physical affair did not take place while my husband was away, but the emotional affair did. He too, trusted our "friend" to look after me. Big mistake! To make a long story short, I no longer have any male friends.

Since we have been here, my husband has deployed a lot. The shortest was a few weeks, the longest was a few months. With each deployment that we made it through, we got stronger.

As for safeguards, we live on Okinawa, it is a small island, and if I do anything, my husband will find out about it...our lives are really a fishbowl here. We share an e-mail account now, which helps because that is how he found out about the affair in the first place. No more cell phone, etc. He even put a listening device on our home phone to listen to my calls while he was deployed. I only found out later. He says he finally trusts me. It has been a very long hard road.

This upcoming deployment is going to be rough, but I know it is really going to help our recovery to make to through this!

2much, you hit on a biggie there. From either side of the fence, I think military marriages don't make for the best "friendships", so to speak. It is HARD to be each other's best friend when you spend so much of your time/effort/energy on nearly separate lives. Add in those deployments/TDY's and WOW....it's like there is a huge gap in the friendship overnight. When my H came home from his first deployment to the Middle East, I realized I barely knew this guy, and we'd been married ten years at the time. He had six months to form friendships with the guys he was bunking with, to work on his career without my assistance (or help sewing patches...the ONLY reason I like the new ACU's, by the way!) or needing my input or encouragement almost at all! I was home working my butt off being two parents and he came home and.....nothing.

For some of us it is hard to keep seeing the military member heaped with medals/kudos/accolades while we jsut "live". I mean what kind of thanks is there for holding down the fort? It's hard sometimes, but I think by and large every single one of us is proud of "our" servicemember.

That support we can get from family support groups (readiness groups, whatever they are this week) can be a double-edged sword. I was a co-leader during the war and it was shocking how many "way too close" relationships were formed just during those hour-long monthly meetings. You've gotta be on guard, EA's can sneak up on you in the strangest of places!

Hey Maggie, you're doing the three-year-retirement-countdown too, huh? Wow, our timelines are pretty close! I had the run-into-the-OW-at-Walmart problem too....and church.....and everywhere else, it seemed. Strike one plus for military life, this overseas assignment four months after D-day saved my sanity--and probably my marriage!

"My H found it a little too easy to email and call the OW behind my back from work"


Yikes, are we married to the same guy? Maybe they are brothers? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />I guess they don't think we would find out, or that we had on our super duper radar hats!

I am 99% sure that there has been no physical contact between my H and the ow since the day I told him I knew. Now he knows without a doubt what ANY contact will do to our marriage....I hope it sticks. I wonder if there will be a day where I can say to myself that he will never contact her or respond to her. I am just not there yet.

I applaud the rest of you who are proving your trust to your spouses. It is hard work no matter what end you are at.

Treading, I feel sorry for you in the aspect you don't feel recognized for your efforts and support.

In so many ways the stress put on a spouse during deployment is much greater, and certianly more dynamic than the AD member.

Factor in the basketball team you are often raising solo is an incredible accomplishment.

I can honestly answer if I were asked... Which is harder the job of a spouse raising childern normally without additional family support, or being put in harms way in a foreign country? What times my flight!

I guess as anything else. You train yourself to handle the task required. You have to, what other options do you have?

For this 2+ year retired squid... What you are doing is recognized, and applauded! Thank You

We moved overseas to Japan 9 months after d-day, and it has really be a "gift" to get away from our old lives and start fresh.

We too are counting down, 5 years till retirement for us.

I agree with support groups being a double edged sword. My affair was with a close frind to both my husband and myself. Over the course of 3 years our friendship became too close. It began as an emotional affair, turned into both a EA/PA, then ended as an emotional affair. The emotional aspect has by far been the most difficult part for my husband and I both to deal with. For us, the solution is absolutely no male friends what so ever for me.

All,
I have to chime and and say...I have spent the past year in a position where I am at home as the primary caretaker and H is gone to work 12+ hr/day.

I can tell you that I have a new and improved appreciation and respect for the primary homecare spouse and can see how there is little visible appreciation. I used to tell H that his reward was in knowing that he molded, shaped and formed future leaders (kids) and got to experience all the first's (steps, words, lost teeth, day in kindergarten etc).
I was there when I could be and carried heavy guilt for missing all that I did. I do appreciate the military kudo's however my family/children are my prized possessions and always have been. I think that is what irritated me the most is that I could live happily without all the accolades etc I'd rather have a hug from my kid...H never understood that since I believe we are wired differently.

I've pretty much been single parent the past year and understand how easily it would be to have support and friends that could cross the line...it happens home and abroad and although it is situational there are many things one can do to try and build up preventive measures to use in times of crisis. This being said, we all have a hard time regardless of which role we are in.

My H's suggestion is to start from scratch and begin getting to know each other again---like meeting a new friend. No dates, just outings to rediscover fun and laughter since we are both so bitter and resentful of each other. No more saying ILY until it actual means something and has the actions to back it up.

As far as the trust and honesty goes...it will be a long haul to get to a place when I can believe anything. Right now I am trying to back off and enjoy life, take each day as it comes and be forgiving and try to be the best I can be for kids and H. I'm working on my shortfalls and trying to find a place where I am happy with myself and life with or without H. If it gets to D at least we will be friends for the sake of the kids and will have our business issues all wrapped up!

I'm sure you all have tremendous challenges and lessons learned to share. I really feel that the military should have ongoing Marriage Education/Enrichment programs that are a part of the AD/spouse training. I know the Army used the PREP for a while and there are lots of resources to use short term in crisis situations but I believe there is a need for more long-term and consistent programs. I have always told H, "as long as we are ok I can handle anything at work or with others"...life has been much more difficult since we have not been "ok" for past 7 months. I guess you learn to dig deep and pull out all the tricks when you have too!

wow

more and more of us are appearing here lately. My husband has been in our country defence force for just under 20 years and we married when I was just 18.

So much of what you have discussed, even though not our military, is very familiar. Its so EASY to fail as a wife, or husband in such circumstances.

I was the ww in our M and it was at the end of some very tough dark times for us both. We lost our little boy through illness while my H was away, mutual blame society began and so it went.
Took years to rebuild our lives and very slow at first but we have a 21 yr old daughter, my 20 yr old son is in the Military training to be an officer and is so annoyed to not be allowed to go to Iraq or Afghanistan like his dad has now 5 times. Sure upset about that ..not!!
And we have a 12 month old boy who is sooo heavy lol ... totally unplanned too. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" /> but a joy.
Unfortunately my H is being deployed again this month for goodness knows how long.

I have to say the separation and security is a big hurdle to cross but MB principles can still be used,, its just harder in some ways. Like the trust building issue... how do you do that 1000's of kms and months away from each other? I've used a blog to record what I do every day, have my family around, my mum who wasn't a happy camper about my behaviour but a great support and gave heaps of encouragement and a shoulder to whinge on.... and wouldn't accept excuses and became like a trustee if you will. It can work but needs some thought and commitment, especially when the trust level is nil.


Good to hear from some fellow survivors <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
(don't you just hate those bloody dress uniforms??? ) <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

As for marriage support from the military community...

We have used the free couseling, and will continue to do so. We have both recieved individual as well as marriage counseling. (Through mental health).

The Marine Corps still offers PREP classes. Personal Services center.

My husband and I also attended a CREDO (Chaplans Religious Development Organization), Marriage Enrichment Weekend Retreat. This is a wonderful gift to your marriage. It is a free weekend retreat for couples, focusing on communication. It is actually not religious at all. It is available to Navy and Marine Corps, I'm not sure about the other services. We went on one last year to a beautiful 5 star resort, completely free. It was wonderful even thought we were just a mere year into recovery at the time. I highly recommend CREDO retreats. I also attended a personal growth retreat through CREDO, it was wonderful!

Hi Treading lightly.

I am ex-Navy and my husband is an active duty Marine w/ ~ 20 years in.

We met just as I was preparing to leave the military & we married shortly thereafter. As of today we have had no infidelity in our marriage-but from what I have observed, infidelity is said to be part of military life. The long deployments / travel seem to be the root cause. Many of the guys complain that their wives are unfaithful, and many of the women worry that their husbands are sleeping with fellow soldiers.

I will be reading this thread for info, because I am afraid that I really cannot say that anything other than the long deployments / travel make military infidelity different than infidelity between civilian couples.

[color:"red"]A big "THANK YOU" and blessings to those who hold down the fort, sacrificing their family time to protect ours!" [/color]

GettnThere, those sound like great programs. Long time in coming, that's for sure. Here in the community I'm in, there is not much for marriage enrichment, unfortunately. The PWOC just held a marriage enrichment retreat for spouses of deployed soldiers (????), and pretty much everyone I talked to who went said the same thing--the timing was WAY off, because it needs to be something the couples do together! No kidding, ya know? The Army just does stuff backward I guess. I'd LOVE to do the five-star resort thing, especially now while I'm still in shock from my H coming home from his latest two-week field exercise telling me that they had real beds, a sauna, nice air-conditioned gym, internet access, hot meals, and they watched all of the World Cup games on a big-screen TV whilst kicking back on comfy sofas! No fair....when do I get to go "to the field"???? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" /> LOL Sorry, that was a bit of an off-topic rant!

We PCS'ed a year ago from a HUGE Army base, and quite honestly I never ONCE came across any marriage enrichment activities through the chapels or otherwise. Family Advocacy was the only resource we ever heard of, and it was advertised as being a lifeline for those already IN crisis--mainly abusive situations, I guess, because there wasn't much info given on what was available. Odd that a military installation as big as that one had so little available. We haven't had good experiences with counseling services through the military, and honestly H's schedule makes "extracurricular" counseling almost an impossibility. I've gotten my own IC through a family friend who is also a counselor, and it was counseling that could go with us when we moved.

I think one of the biggest assets to our recovery was having my H's CO and 1SG give him a direct order to have NC with the OW. It served its purpose while we were there, that's for sure. He had people looking over his shoulder all the time. But of course, once we moved, all that security disappeared. Suddenly nobody was paying attention to morale calls he made and who he was emailing on the job.

I heard a startling statistic the other day--that in the years since 9/11, there have been over 55,000 divorces among military members. That's scary, and of course it doesn't count marriages like the ones you see represented here on MB who are in the process of trying to rebuild after major destruction. It also doesn't take into account the number of servicemembers who have gotten out of the military and THEN had their marriages go sour (I know of two personally, one of which "Fort Bragg Syndrome" was a primary factor in their divorce), or the marriages like my in-laws who divorce after retirement because they have nothing left of the marriage after nearly 25 years of joint service. This stuff HAS to effect morale and deployment readiness...not to mention the overall mental health of our fighting forces! It's sickening to me to look back on just one of my H's deployments and be able to isolate three divorces, two instances of "internal" infidelity (two female soldiers came back from Iraq pregnant), and two marriages that ended up in legal separation within a year of homecoming.....and that was just my H's platoon of 14 soldiers/NCO's. Ouch. We caught up with a family last weekend that we had been stationed with during the guys' yearlong training and found out that among the six families that were part of that training, only three of us are still together--and one is a "marriage of convenience" (they're together because finances are better married than divorced, but they've turned their son over to a guardian because he's too much of a "burden" to raise themselves). Yikes!

I guess if anything, the military sort of "forces" you to be more independent, and that can be a blessing and a curse depending on which way you're looking at it. I personally have very little contact (other than phone calls) with my family, mainly because we've not been able to be geographically close to them for the majority of H's career. We don't have the in-law issues that a lot of civilian couples have, because our parents just don't know much about our lives.

Ok, enough banter for this morning. I'm off to round up my "basketball team" for lunch.

Hey AW, nice to finally "meet" you; I think we've managed to post around each other for way too long! Oh, by the way, my 16yoDS is already planning his military career, so it seems my days of worrying are only going to increase in the next few years!

Hi ladies. Another military spouse here. Nice to meet you all. I haven't been military for very long. Things have been tough. ANd goash darn just not very fulfilling as my H has had 2 As and we haven't even been married for 5 years yet. Well anywho, such is life, for me anyway.

I've found it is all too easy period for Infidelity to take place in the military. Yet, how could I wonder why with the easy oppurtunities. My H's friends that were married before us were basically one-sided swingers without their wives' permission.

On the other hand and to be fair I feel it is a matter of personal choice and inner fortitude that makes the man or woman. There are some outstanding people that I've met in
the military that were really stand up people who didn't choose to stray. So I don't lump everyone in the same category. Anyway, nice ot meet you all and I hope for great recoveries for you.

Hi everyone.Don't post much mostly just read but had to post here.Husband is army,been in 7 years and married 8.I know how easy it is for them to be unfaithful on deployment.My husband had a 6 month long EA while stationed in Afghanistan with a women he met over the internet.Even got a plane ticket to see her after returning here.Thankfully he came out of the fog before he came home so he never seen her.We are currently on a overseas tour though no where as far as some of you.We are in Hawaii.We are 15 months into recovery and I dread when he will leave again,the internet is so easy for them to get on now even while fighting a war.It has been a battle but we have made it through.He also had two ONS before the EA,one while he was deployed to NY.Nice to see people that know where I am coming from.

CinnamonSugar, sorry, I didn't mean to leave this out....brain drain I guess. I'm not sure if you were saying you don't understand how infidelity recovery is different or if you understand that it is...I'm going to just go out on a limb and throw out the issues I've seen folks dealing with. I'm sure there are others who can elaborate with their own experiences.

In 'our' A situation, OW'sH was overseas on D-day. Being away from his W and family was really hard on him, it forced him to focus on his own individual recovery until he could be back home and deal with his WW directly. Made for a really nasty 8 months for him, he was a wreck mentally, especially since his WW started hurling all sorts of insults and accusations at him and he had no way to have any clue what was going on back home, with the exception of what I was telling him. For the most part, his "friends" weren't supportive of him remaining married and they didn't offer much (if any) emotional support.

That's the one side. The other side was that my H was doing full-time staff duty on D-day. Every third day, he was working 24-hour shifts. We never had a 'convenient' time to talk. His free time wasn't his, it belonged to the military, and he had to handle soldier issues on his "time off", so our recovery was pretty much pushed off until we PCS'ed. Now he still has no "free time", he's working 16-hour days and is on call all the time and still working from home when he's not at work. There is no POJA'ing anything for us. He can't "decide" to spend more time at home; he (like any other military member) doesn't have that luxury. Meeting ENs is difficult when you can barely find 15 hours of ANY time, and undivided attention....well, that's almost nonexistent. Maybe if there were no children, but I don't know many in that situation.

I know there's other things, but right now I'm drawing a blank. I'll come back to this when I get my brain thinking in one direction.

Oh and a couple other things. My H too, was with people who's spouses were deplyed. And what is funny they were all (OW and their BSs)soldiers. He would fail to tell me these details and I had to hunt the info down for myself.

My H will agree to do something then back down. He agreed to write NC letter then refused when it came time. He agreed to counseling in first A but backed off. Now he told me that OW was leaving his job a month ago. I've waited for motnhs (9) now for this to happen. I went to the job the other day only to find she is still there.

I see some of you are recovered if you'd like to volunteer tips, please do. I'm almost at my wit's end. I've gotten to the point where I refuse to compromise at all either. And the Love Bank is riding on gas fumes at this point.

Riding on fumes.....that sputtering gets to wear you down, doesn't it?

{{{{LLG}}}}

Does your H's chain of command know about his infidelity? You don't have to get anyone court-martialed to get results.

TL,

The OW'sH you mentioned....other than working on himself during the deployment, did he do anything else in terms of MB?

Those who don't know, I am in Iraq right now.

Those who do, I am still trying to get a last name and unit #.

Have a good one all.

TreadingLightly,


Well yes and no. His immediate superior did know. He was a real respectful, caring person. He got onto both of them right off and seperated them (in the same office only though). However he just left. PCS somewhere else. Now I don't know who is over my H.

I was keeping in contact with his superior every so often because my H dind't want to talk much about it and her H but stopped b/c I thought she was about to meet him where he is. I'm seriously considering talking to him again and my H's boss also again.

LLG, if I were you, I'd tell my H that if he didn't do something to insure NC, I would. I'd then march my hiney right into that office and let his superiors know, if that's what it took. If there's one thing you don't need, it's the instability of daily contact. Your H will NOT be an asset to the unit if he's saddled with divorce proceedings, so it's in the unit's best interests to make efforts to separate these two PERMANENTLY. Most commanders (most...don't want to paint any sweeping generalizations) are supportive of marital issues when you respectfully present your predicament and don't expect them to move mountains. Let your WH's superiors know that you don't want to interfere with their mission or with unit cohesion, but that your H's current working conditions are placing a severe hardship on your marriage and you'd like to know if there is ANY way for things to be altered in favor of rebuilding marital unity. There is also a good chance that the commander could give your husband a "strong suggestion" (just short of an order) to attend counseling.

USSoldier, the OW'sH in our sitch is divorcing his W, all of the marriage-building he tried to do was prior to D-day. This was his second bout with her infidelity and he just finally decided he'd had enough. He was pretty active on this forum a while ago, the folks here ended up being pretty much his only support. He did the best he could, but he ended up losing all feelings for his W. He also spent the last two and a half years off and on antidepressants, lost his position due to PTSD that was compounded an hundredfold thanks to his W's actions, and was "grounded" from any deployment. I really wish he'd have had someone he could have leaned on emotionally. He's a close family friend and I love the man dearly, but even though I offered *some* support, he needed more than I could morally or ethically give him. I'm not saying this to depress you, but please, make sure you've got someone watching your back, ok? Even if you can't do everything you'd be able to do offensively and defensively for your M if you were home, your mind and your heart need to stay intact.

USS, I've done a little more mind-bending to try to remember some of the things the OW'sH did from a distance before his heart gave out. He actually did more from thousands of miles away than my own H ever did--it broke my heart to see the man trying so hard only to have his efforts thrown back in his face. He sent his WW little teddy bears (she had amassed quite a collection of the Me to You bears in the time he was away), romantic notes, called her constantly, emailed all the time, sent her a copy of HN/HN that they read through and discussed together, he really did everything he could to meet her EN's for conversation and affection. Problem was, she was involved with my H. Nothing her H did made any deposit at all in her Love Bank, because she'd convinced herself that her own H didn't care.

See, that's unfortunately the power of that elusive "fog" everyone talks about. While the WS's head is in it, nothing the BS does makes a hill of beans. That's why ending the A is so important--until that supply of Love Unit deposits is cut off from the OP (and yes, even a slight "fix" will keep that account open and very much active), all the work in the world won't endear the WS to the BS. By the time the A was outed in our sitch, the OW's H was so exhausted and his Love Bank was so overdrawn....well, there was nothing left.

I can fully understand why you want to do things in the order you're planning. Just be careful with yourself. Don't focus on doing "everything she needs" until you know for absolutely certain that the A is over and that NC is in place. Your energies need to go to self-preservation right now, mentally and physically. It sounds like you're doing well. Keep it up.

I don't quite have the nerve for this one again. When we had an argument recently my H made a statement that concerned me. But I let it go. Now to find out that OW is still on the job....I'm wondering. I did talk to her H. He said there was a sitch with her orders so that's why she hasn't left yet.

He seems to be a little concerned but doesn't want to get in worry mode since he is far away. Can't do anything about it right now. But he is in a higher position I would think he could talk to soemone to have the sitch observed from afar.

LLG, I'm not sure I understand your second paragraph. Were you talking about the OW'sH being concerned but not wanting to be in worry mode? I think I'd be more than a "little" concerned if I were in his boots.

If you don't have the nerve to deal with the military side of things, I'd like to suggest you read "Love Must Be Tough". You may be able to glean something from it that will back up the Plan A and prompt your H to act in favor of your M.

Hang in there.

Hi Treadlightly, I meant to say that I thought that the deployments / travel associated with the military lifestyle make cheating more tempting and easier, but I think that other than that-the dynamics if infidelity are roughly the same as with a non-military couple.

I wanted to read the other folks' experiences to actually confirm whether this was the case or not...

Yes, I meant her H. He is trying to stay out of worry mode. I felt also that he might want to look deeper into the sitch but I think he just feels the sitch will roll over.


Yes, I'm a little shaky and tired to do it again.
THinking about going through the days of him being angry and not talking to me, just seems a waste of effort. He hasn't done things any differently than he is doing them now.

That book sounds interesting, "Love Must Be Tough". I'll look into it. I'm trying to read "His needs Her needs" also.

Well, CinnamonSugar, my H hasn't traveled or been deployed since 2003. His A occurred right under my nose while he was at home. He hasn't been away from me except for work since D-day, but his secure computer gave him ample means to continue contact with the OW. I'm not sure that the military made anything "easier" with respect to him having his A but some of the things that are paramount to recovery that we've found "extra" challenges with are:

**Transparency and radical honesty--this only goes so far when you literally have a gag order on your daily activities due to operational security, and it's impossible for me to have access to my H 24/7. I literally did not sleep every night he was on staff duty after D-day. I laid awake shaking uncontrollably and slept only when he was home next to me.
**Extraordinary precautions--there is only so much we can do to insure NC. Dr. Harley advocates even moving to another state if necessary to prevent contact with the OP, but unless the military says so, we have no choice but to stay put. Jobs stay the same. My H and I were blessed to have a fluke happen just four months past D-day when we got orders for an overseas assignment, but that rarely happens. In a good number of cases I've seen even on this forum, military couples are "stuck" trying to maintain NC without moving, and quite often they're located in a small town where the OP is also "stuck" waiting for another assignment.
**Timelines--these are a nightmare. When you have a "deadline" of an upcoming field exercise or deployment or even a PCS, everything (including the marriage) gets pushed off to the side. It has to.
**Stigmas--I personally detest these. In our seventeen years, I have only known a very small handful of military folks whose marriages were affected by infidelity. Yet there are countless millions willing to say that infidelity "runs rampant" in the military. I truly don't think it's any more "rampant" in the military than out, to be honest. My H was not some stereotypical beast just waiting for the opportunity to cheat, and his A shocked everyone who knew him--military and otherwise. Yet when I have approached anyone in the military community for help since D-day, I was looked down on as yet another poor sod who couldn't keep her wandering husband faithful. I've also heard "When the cat's away, the mouse will play" so many times in reference to the "typical" left-behind, sex-crazed housewife that I was left wondering if these folks even believe military marriages CAN be infidelity-free. Maybe stigmas are one of those things that crosses over into civilian life, I don't know. I just know that I got to a point where I stopped asking for help within the military community, because I felt like an instant outcast.
**Distance from family/close friends--this was the biggest problem for me, personally. When I fell apart on D-day, I was 5 hours away from the nearest family member, 5 hours away from my best (female) friend, and I really did feel like I had nowhere to run and no support. My local "friends" were instant problems. I dealt with a nervous breakdown completely by myself, and I quite literally had not a single person (other than my H, who was reeling from the whole mess himself and working 24-hour-shifts anyway) to help me through it. All this while taking care of a newborn and a one-year-old. I was a wreck, and it kills me that all of my support was so far away. It was weeks before I was able to venture out of the immediate area and visit my parents. Now that we've moved overseas, even the 5-hour drive is an impossibility. During the worst of my H's withdrawal and when I was literally ready to walk out the door, all (and I do mean ALL) of my "shoulders to lean on" were and are a long-distance phone call away. Of course this does happen in civilian marriages as well, but not nearly as often as with military ones. Just another perk of the job.

I'm not saying we have it "harder" in recovery, but there certainly are challenges there that wouldn't be there if the primary breadwinner wore a suit instead of camouflage. One of the biggest hurdles that my H and I have had to overcome is the emotional distance that 15 years of military service caused. We had no choice over those years but to put a bit of a wall between us. If we hadn't, we'd have never survived the hardships. Problem is, we were never given the tools to bring the wall down when we no longer needed it. Defense mechanisms are good when you're under attack, but they really make life difficult when you're trying to make peace and foster healthy relationships.

We are having to re-learn SO much--about everything. It's not coming easy. Soon (ok, so three years isn't exactly soon, but it feels that way!) we'll have the luxury of putting the POJA and PORH into practice for REAL, spend that good chunk of time together, and we'll be in a situation where our marriage can, at last, be a priority. But for now, mission first.

They say the Internet has made cheating easy / convenient. They also say the Internet has generated new ways of cheating too...

I found your comments to be interesting


I would tend to think that this concept applies to relationship issues, not workplace issues.


I think Dr. H has some great things to say; however I do not necessarily agree with some aspects of his philosophy on this one...It seems to me that a cheater will cheat, and if one mistress becomes unavailable they'll simply find a new one.


You made a good point here. I would say that the miltary draws its numbers from the general population so trends among military memners will closely mimic those in the civilian world. But-people always have something negative to say about "those military people."



This is a very good point, but I don't see this as being directly related to cheating unless we're talking about the recovery stage. In some cases family and friends can make things worse though. It depends on their values and whether they are supportive & respectful of your marriage.

Oh, and just as a bit of a sidenote, I was not "on board" with all of Dr. Harley's advice for those in infidelity recovery when I originally came here (under another username) over a year ago. Then again, I never fully believed until I was confronted with the reality that this had indeed happened in MY marriage that I'd do anything but immediately move out and divorce my H for breaking our vows. You learn and grow from real-life experience, and the tools found in Harley's books (as well as several others) and on this site have been integral to my personal and marital recovery. I shot myself in the foot on many occasions by trying to "fix" things with the OW personally (between me and her) and I didn't fully believe that NC for life and taking extraordinary precautions was of utmost importance. Over the last 16 months, my beliefs have changed 100%, and so have those of my H. I have found more comfort in extraordinary precautions and the principles that will protect and preserve romantic love than I have found in any other "method" of caring for a marriage.
My point in starting this thread was not to wallow in a "woe is me, life is so hard" pity party at the military's expense, but rather to learn from other military couples how to better integrate Harley's principles into military life, because there are of course many concessions that have to be made. There are some amazingly creative and intelligent people here; I have learned much already, I seek only to learn more, to improve the marriage my H and I are rebuilding.

Peace to you, CinnamonSugar. I hope that you never find yourself in the circumstances that the vast majority of people on this board have come here for help with.

TL,

Ok, I've been urged by several people to look into this matter again regarding H with working with OW. It is suppose to be that she is leaving soon. I think I want to talk to my H a little first. I found out who is the new person over him but I don't thnk I need to stop at this person. With your being aware more than I being that you and H have been in military system longer how would you suggest I find out who is over his direct superior? Thanks.

TL,

Hi. I've added u to my address book. I saw you were out here. If you don't mind and you have time would you mind posting to my thread. And I haven't talked to my Hs superior yet, if you remember me. I'm the chick wh's H's 2nd OW worked with him.

H may be angry enough to look into the big "D"

LLG,

Your H should have a recall roster that should give the chain of command. If it doesn't go up that far, you might want to see who typed the roster and contact them for more information. JMHO