I LOVE the OM! How can I give him up? - Marriage Builders® Forums

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The OM I am involved with is the most incredible person I have ever met. We love each other deeply and talk constantly about a real future together. We compliment each other on every level: intelectually, emotially, sexually, spiritually. It is as if he is my soul mate - the one I have been looking for all my life.The hard part is that H is a good man who loves me dearly and takes good care of me. Sadly, I never will and probably never did love him the way I love OM. But if what everyone on this forum says is true - I should give up OM and try to work things out with H.But how do I give up OM. He is the best part of my life right now - my only strength. How do I get him out of my life, out of my mind, out of my heart? How can I possibly ever forget my one true love? And who do I turn to when I am going through withdrawal? H? How could I ever explain this too him and expect I marriage to survive?

[QUOTE]Originally posted by saf: The OM I am involved with is the most incredible person I have ever met. We love each other deeply and talk constantly about a real future together. We compliment each other on every level: intelectually, emotially, sexually, spiritually. It is as if he is my soul mate - the one I have been looking for all my life.The hard part is that H is a good man who loves me dearly and takes good care of me. Sadly, I never will and probably never did love him the way I love OM. But if what everyone on this forum says is true - I should give up OM and try to work things out with H. It is easy to enjoy the company of someone who can afford to spend time with us to have fun %60 per cent of the time.They don't have to put up with our mood swings because there is no other responsibility in the relationship, but to have fun.Of course, our spouses aren't given a chance to have fun because we look at them through a light dimmed by the cares of daily living then accuse them of being no fun. PS It's easy to TALK about the future...DEEP LOVE will make the future happen......tangent intended... [Linked Image from marriagebuilders.com]

[Linked Image from marriagebuilders.com]

------------------ Love hurts no one.[This message has been edited by AGoodPhrend (edited August 24, 2000).][This message has been edited by AGoodPhrend (edited August 24, 2000).]

saf,You ask very good questions. Now some obvious answers. First, you must tell your H about the affair even if you decide to divorce. Look on the bright side, if you tell him and he divorces you, then you get your OM. Right? On the other hand the OM is romancing a married woman, and has very little respect for the institution of marriage. So that should match your commitment to marriage well. [Linked Image from marriagebuilders.com]

saf, at the very minimum you need to tell your H what you are doing and have done. You might be greatly surprised by his response. He just may love you more than you ever imagined and if he does he will help you through withdrawal as many other H's here have done and as many other W's here have done.As for the future with your OM, the odds are very low that you will marry him and the marriage will be successful. The debate as to the extact number has occured here, but the published numbers suggest that you have a small chance of marrying (less than 20% I think) and then the marriage as between (20% and 10% of succeeding). Overall about a 4% chance. How is that for good odds?As for your OM being your soulmate, well I encourage you to look at NSR's welcome thread in "Just Found Out" and then look under common sayings by WS. You will find that just about all of the WS found their "soulmate" during the affair, yet so few succeed in marriage to them, wonder why?The reason is that the problems you are having in your marriage are yours not your H's and they will be carried over to a new relationship unless corrected. You have done nothing to correct those problems in your marriage or yourself, so the odds stand as stated.I am being a little blunt here saf, but I am in a hurry, and we see your story so many times on this board. So please do yourself a hugh favor, try working on your marriage, try to examine yourself and learn. Then if you decide to divorce your H, you will at least improved yourself for your next relationship.Which will in all likelyhood not be with the OM, your "soulmate". He will have found some other marriage to pillage.Please think and at least talk with your H.God Bless,JL

Dear Good PhrendI too believe that if our love is strong enough we will be together no matter what. How will I know if things would be different with him than they are with H? How will I ever find out if I stay with H? And how can I find happiness with H, when I am so deeply in love with OM?

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Just Learning: [B]saf,Just learning,You advice, although blunt, is very to the point and is probably some of the best advice I have received from this forum.H does know about the affair. But he does not know the true extent of my feelings for the OM. So I don't know that I could turn to him during withdrawal. Still, he is willing to stay in the marriage despite the fact that I have cheated on him and that in itsef says alot. But he is not willing to discuss the issues or go to counselling, so I have little hope that the issues will be resolved. So without any true hope for the future of my marriage and with no true support, how do I let go of a man I love? Even if it is the right thing to do.

saf,Your H won't go to counseling right now nor can he discuss the issues probably for a very simple reason. He is deeply hurt and feels he didn't have the affair why should he be the one changing. This is all very normal.What you don't realize is that the Harley approach is not widely appreciated. However, you can start this by examining your issues with your H. Not in a confrontational manner, but working on why you felt that the bounds of marriage didn't bind you. What you need from a marriage. Are you in counseling right now? If so continue, if not think about it. Also you need to tell your H the depths of this affair, that you are seriously thinking of leaving him. Tell why you are telling him this? Are you telling him to hurt him? Are you telling him in hopes that somehow the marriage can be better? Are you telling him to assuage you guilt? Could be all of them or just one or two, or others.saf, be honest with your H. Right now I suspect any request from you for him to change seems like blackmail. "I know you love me, but I am leaving unless you do what I want the way I want it."You may not intend this but it probably sounds like that. So think about how you should approach this. You see while you say you have found your "soulmate" and are so in love with OM, you are here. Why?I would speculate it is becaue you do love your H and you know that you are wrong. But the attraction of the forbidden fruit is strong. You are so worried that some how you will be short changed, if you try and make your marriage work. You don't see much coming from your H. But if you really try to make your marriage work and give up OM, I will guarentee on thing for sure, you will have much more respect for yourself for the rest of your life. And in addition, your marriage might turn into the marriage you want. [Linked Image from marriagebuilders.com]

What a deal! Self respect and a good marriage too. Think about it.However, I would ask you, have you sat back and tried to see what your H is seeing in you. Do you suppose he is as discouraged right now as you are? Perhaps that is where you start with your H. You are discouraged about this marriage and right now so is he. Ask him to help you and you try to help him.I know this is tough and you haven't given up OM. Finally saf, ask your H to come here. The people here will try to help both of you.The hard thing here is your are asking for help while also really not wanting the help. You are confused and we cannot help you with that. At some point you are going to have to trust yourself and God to do the right thing and then let go of OM. I know it is a leap of faith, but many people have built better marriages after such a leap.Please keep posting and thinking. I believe you know where you need to go and I hope you gain the strength to do it.God Bless,JL

JLI too hope that I will find the strength to do the right thing. However, I am still not convinced that the right thing for me would be to stay with H. He is a good, good man but he will never be OM and he will never give me what OM gives me. Thats who he is. I either have to accept him that way and live with it, or I must leave. What's more, he is unwilling to talk to me (or to a counselor) about all the issues, so I have little hope that they will be resolved. I am going to counseling on my own but this alone will not save my marriage. Thats something we both need to do. As for telling H about my feelings for OM - I know this will hurt him immensely and quite frankly I dont see the point. Whether ot not H and I work it out, he does not deserve to be hurt any more than is necessary. I dont want H to come to this forum because he will undoubtedly realize that I am here and I am afraid of him finding out my true feelings. But I admit that this forum has been extremely beneficial for me. It has been almost 7 months now since the A started and for the first time, I feel like I have true support and some one giving me real, and meaningful advice. So JL, thank you for that, and keep the advice coming. It may be a bitter pill for me to swallow, but it is the once source of strength and support I have to hang on to. Regards Saf

saf,Is OM married?

saf,It is the chicken and egg problem isn't it? Your H is not going to discuss issues of his failings while your are deeply in love with OM and you want some assurance that things will be better if you drop OM. Now that is unfair to expect, especially since he probably knows there is more and you are lying to him if not directly, then by omission.So here is the problem. You know you what you are doing is wrong. You say you don't want to hurt your H further, but somehow think that just divorcing him will not hurt him further. You think that somehow he should turn around, without any effort from you and without the knowledge that you possess from this site.Do you see what the problem is. You give him no credit, say you don't want him to be hurt further, but are proceeding to do just that, but while he is completely defenseless. You have withdrawn from your H for 7 months or longer, probably not met many of his needs, and made him the bad guy (can't change, won't change, not good enough, etc). You had to do this of course to justify your affair and your attraction to OM.So here is the test, are you willing to file for divorce tomorrow and walk away from your H with no financial support, nothing but what you brought to the marriage? Are you confident enough in the OM, to do that? He is only meeting a few of your needs now, how will he do with all of them. Especially, the commitment need, since you know how he values the institution of marriage.How confident are you of OM?You aren't! I know that and you know that. You know this has been a wonderful interlude, with your H taking care of all of the problems and most needs, while OM gets to have the fun of taking care of your sexual and emotional needs as a "soulmate". Man, that is the good life. Don't mess with it saf, you have it made and so does he. Don't suppose that he expects you to get a nice financial settlement from the divorce do you?I am not being silly here. If OM is that good and can make you deliriously happy for the rest of your life, go for it, but be willing to leave everything from your previous life, including the money, cars, house, etc.saf, your H can change and interestingly if you were honest with him, you then would be willing to allow him the help that you yourself have been seeking here. But you won't allow him that help or even the knowledge of it, because "he would find out and it would hurt him." saf, I know my words aren't going to change your mind over night, if at all. I also know that you do "love" OM and you don't "love" your H. But you made the choice to allow OM to love you and for you to love him. You made the choice to draw away from H and seek affection and sex elsewhere. You can decide to reverse it but it will be tough.I will repeat what I said before. If you have the courage, you will for sure gain your self-respect back, you may get your marriage back and a better marriage. However, if you really try and only get your self-respect you will be a winner, no matter if your "soulmate" waits for you or moves on to another woman, probably married.You can tell I have little respect for men who date married women and I am neither a betrayed or betraying spouse. But I was a batchelor for a long time, into my 30's and I know there were plenty of guys who really liked dating married women because it was safe, and if she was well off or her H was, they might end up nicely set up. I know this because I knew them and we talked all of the time about it. I am proud of a few things in my life and one of them is that I never knowingly dated a married woman.I tell you this so you know where my perspective is coming from. Keep thinking and posting saf. It will help you reach your decision. I know it is a tough one, but it will become easier if you are honest with your H.God Bless,JL

saf, My girlfriend said exactly the same thing as you did. "I have never met anyone who knew me like he did and vise versa" She told me that she has never loved someone like she did the OM. My question to my girlfriend was what does LOVE mean to you and she could not tell me other than the this feeling she had at that time. After couple of months she tells me the feeling she had for the OM was actually "infatuation" and sometimes it is hard to distinguish between LOVE and infatuation. Ask yourself this, how do you know if you love someone in 7 months. Give me a break!!! Has the OM ever seen you when you were sick, in a bad mood, or at your worst. Or have you ever seen the OM at his worst. Trust me it looks great on the surface but true love require good, bad, ugly and most of all, time. It is easy to be the perfect person when both of you are not committed. I have been on both sides of the fence. When I cheated on my exwife with OW for about 10 months, I thought I found the perfect soulmate and so did she. In my eyes she was perfect, everthing she did was perfect, every touch she made my heart skip a beat, every word she said was like angels singing. Every sexual encounters was so magical that I never wanted to stop. There was not even one second in a day whenI did not even think about her. I could not go through a day without seeing the OW. She was my soulmate, so I thought. Of course I had to make a decision as to leave my W at that time or go on my way with OW. I made the worst decision of my life, I went with OW. After about 3 months into the relationship of seeing each other everyday brought on the true picture of what OW was all about. Unless you spend every waking hours with the other person there is no commitment. Anyhow, OW was nothing like how I knew her. I saw her in a totally different way. I am not telling you to make any decision based on what I am saying but what I am saying is nothing different than all other WS's experiences. Now I am dealing with my girlfriend having EA/PA with the OM. And trust me it is thousand times harder to deal with this when you are at the receiving end of the affair. Now I finally realize the pain my exwife went through and I would never do this to anyone. The experience taught me to understand the tremendous turmoil the BS is going through. I can't even describe how I am feeling now other than totally betrayed and helpless. So please read the post wisely and learn from others who went through this otherwise all this would be waste of my time. If I can save one marriage or relationship, all this is worth it. Take care and GOD bless...

Hi, Honey. I'm sorry for what you're going through. I know how hard this is for you.You're getting some good advice here. Listen to it. You probably don't know me...I don't post a whole lot anymore...just stop by to check on friends, but your post drew me, so here I am.June 28, 1999 my wonderful husband came to me and said he wasn't "in love" with me anymore, although he loved me, meaning cared for me deeply. I was devastated. I had no idea what was to come.Within a week, he told me about PT. Here are the words I heard for the next month."She makes me feel wonderful." "I finally really know what true love is." "We seem to "fit", to belong together, like I never could imagine." "We were never like this....we never should have married. I have never loved you as I do her." "We were a mistake from the beginning...she is truly my soulmate...the one that was meant for me." "I'm sorry, but I've never felt such happiness with anyone...I have to be with her."I could go on and on...he had fallen "in love". There's no doubt about that. I would never dismiss those feelings or say that they were not real...they are the SAME feelings he had had for me so many years ago and for a long time afterward. They are the same feelings that many of us have for others during our lives. They are real. And he was suffering terribly for the decisions and choices that he was making...but, because of these feelings for her, he felt he was doing the right thing.On August 5th, he moved out...Sept 1, in with her. He stood by his original statements and planned for a divorce as soon as he could afford it. They planned a marriage, saw a lawyer about his adopting her wee one, opened joint bank accounts. He rarely saw me or our daughter, hardly ever called. I had just lost my father, but even that didn't compare to the pain I was experiencing now.A lot happened over the next six months, with him standing by his decision to get a divorce. However.....It's August 2000 now, and we've been recovering for more than six months. Funny thing about being "in love".....it doesn't always last...in fact, rarely does, but can be replaced by a deeper, more mature and lasting love. That's what lasts. That what we still had and what never really existed for him and PT. Now, the NICE thing about that mature and lasting love....from IT you CAN restore that "in love" feeling! Am I confusing you? I do sometimes. When "in love" dies and is not replaced by real love, it's gone. If real love exists, you can always rekindle the "in love" feelings. You've already been told that you don't stand much of a chance for a future with the OM. But you have a husband who has proven, simply by staying with the knowledge of your affair, that he has real love for you, love that is persevering in spite of his pain...pain, Honey, that you cannot even imagine. I know you are suffering too. I watched my husband as he went through the same thing. We've talked and I've seen what he's gone through once he found out that he made bad choices, choices he now wishes he had never made. I have hurt and cried for him as well.But......we are wonderful. The man who said all those things to me just a year ago, now says he is madly "in love" with me, I am his reason for living, he loves coming home to me. He now says he loved me "even when I didn't remember I did." I understand. We are taking this life, this marriage and cherishing it for the blessing that it truly is. If you've heard of me at all, you'll know that I've asked for no repentance, simply for our best efforts for the rest of our lives to keep this wonderful marriage alive and thriving. We BOTH are truly happy now....I'm sorry that your husband is not in a place that he can help you right now. From the other side of the fence, mine wasn't either. But Plan A, the four rules and self-growth WILL allow you to survive the withdrawal once you truly begin it, and turn this marriage around into one in which you find all the happiness that you deserve. It begins with a decision. That's all. That's the beginning of all the hard work and all the rewards that work can bring.YOU can gently lead your husband to that place..but only once you've healed and learned and begun the journey yourself. He doesn't have to help, you can change his reactions, you can guide without saying a word. That's a long time from now, should you choose to take that path....you have much healing to do within first.There are many people here, betrayed and waywards alike, who either know or understand your pain and suffering and how difficult this time is for you. This board has been the strength for many of us, no matter which side of the fence you sit on....they will be here for you.Take care. I wish you and your h all the happiness you both deserve. I do believe that you can find it with each other, once the curtain of infidelity has lifted. But it takes time, patience, perseverance. And I know you are strong enough to do it. It begins with a decision....one that will affect the lives of many people.I wish you luck and love.Love and prayers,Lori

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Just Learning: [B]saf,JLYour words have left me with much to think about.Maybe I will e-mail the link to this site to H.......Thanks for the advive. God knows I need it. Please continue to post replies.Saf

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Devastation: [B]saf,Dear DevastationFirstly, I find true comfort in what you are saying. Maybe this is my one chance to learn from others' mistakes. Secondly, the OM is married. However, during the course of the A, he separated from his wife and they are currently going through a divorce. He did not leave her to be with me. He left her because they married when they were both very young and have grown apart. He knows that this does not mean that I will leave H and he has placed no demands or pressures on me.As for trusting OM, I know he is able to meet most if not all of my emotional needs. Whereas H is not able to meet all of them. These passed months have been a very trying time for me because on top of this, I have had to deal with some major career decisions. I was at my lowest point of all time and even contemplated suicide. OM was there to support me, pick me up and carry me through the emotional storm. H shared very little part in the whole ordeal and brushed my problems aside as unimportant. So, do I think OM would be there for me in times of need. Yes, I do. I have no doubts about his emotional committment to me.Still, your comments about the nice divorce settlement have got me thinking. OM would have a lot to gain if I divorced H and took up with him. I don't think this is his motivation - but at least its got me thinking that there are some things about him that I still need to understand.One more thing, H says he is "bored" with my body and although he is only in his early 30's he has no sex drive. Our love making is therefore very limited and extremely unfulfilling. Is this normal? This started way before the A and has only gotten worse. Will staying with H mean committing myself to a life without sex? If so, I would not be surprised if there was another OM in the future.

LoriYour message has brought tears to my eyes and I marvel that I can find so much comfort from my new found "friends" in this forum. It seems that everyone here is giving the same advice - mostly from past experiences. And it is becoming clearer to me what it is I need to do.So to you and to everone else out there...what is the first step? And how do I deal with the emotional turmoil which I know is ahead? Maybe your H can shead some light on how I should proceed and what I need to do to remain strong and not fall apart alltogether.Thanks you for your kind words and support. Saf

saf,OK, your OM is not available for running away with now, as he is still married but getting a divorce because they married too young. So this kind, compassionate, caring, and extremely understanding man, cannot figure out how to make his marriage work. OH, saf, the more you say, the more I have my doubts. So your are on the rebound because you feel rejected by your H, and he is on the rebound because he married too young and I'm sure his W, doesn't understand him either.Are you getting an idea of why, marrying OM and having it work has such a low success rate? I sure hope so.Now for your complaints about sex drive and what your H says. No you shouldn't be condemned to a life with no or little sex. Your H in his 30's should not be suffering from this situation. But job stress can produce it as can major depression. So can an affair on his part, to be completely honest here. Is it possible that the attempts to get pregnant, have gotten to him? So many things saf, men are as fragil as women in many things, please remember that.You do have issues to figure out saf, no one is saying you should be condemned to a life of misery. What is claimed here is that marriages can be rebuilt and revitalized so that both spouses (I guess that is the plural, sounds like the plural of Moose, [Linked Image from marriagebuilders.com]

)have a very good marriage and one they want. That is the goal. It isn't to throw stones or say that all marriages must work, but that many considered DOA, are in fact salavagable.Have you read of Lostva's posts. You should! She has posted to you and let me tell you she is the pro with Plan A and really looking at marriages. Listen to her and read what she has done. There are men who have recovered their marriage after W had a baby from the OM, there are women who have after H has fathered a child with OW.saf, I will repeat. You need to be honest with your H. Honest about your indecision. And honest about your feelings. If you are and he still wants to try and recover the marriage, then tell him what I and others are telling you. It can be done, it doesn't require changes in the basic person, but changes in perspective. It is not a thing, where one person loses all face with the other.It is about the two of your deciding that you would like to be married and in love again. You are not wrong for wanting to be loved and in love. Where you have been wrong so far is with whom you should be.So talk to H, don't threaten him, don't Love Bust him. But talk with him as one friend to another. A friend who is searching for the right solution, the correct solution, and the good solution. You might find he would like to help solve your problem and his as well.Keep reading and posting, saf.God Bless,JL

Lori,You are soo good at this. [Linked Image from marriagebuilders.com]

You have done it again with your post. Help this lady figure out what to do and how to do it. Good to have you back, I can go get work done know. [Linked Image from marriagebuilders.com]

Take Care,JL

safLet me start off by saying that I, like you, am a betrayer. When I read your first post a cold chill went down my back and I though to myself, the OW that I was involved could have written this. First of all let me put this thought right out in front. If you marry the OM will it ba a success? It may, but the chances are very slim. I have thought about this and the ONE nagging thing that kept coming back to me was, If she ran around with me, she could run around on me. Could I ever trust her if we were married? NO!You have see the OM at his very best. Answer this question: What are five reasons that you fell in love with your H? Now ask what are five reasons you fell in love with OM. Be honest with yourself and compare them. I bet you will see that they are almost the same. How will you feel about the OM five years from now? Probably the same as you do your H right now, however there will be one difference. Will you trust a man that got involved with a married woman? Harsh advice but REALITY.Talk to your H and be honest about what happened and how you feel. Tell him the reason you are talking to him about this. One thing for sure, you are here because you still love your H and you have this feeling in the back of your mind that what you are doing is wrong. The love you have for the OM is powerful and strong. You will probably have a love for him forever now that you have chosen this path. This is going to be a hard decision for you to make, but I just wanted to point out a few things from someone that has stood in your shoes.......fs

JL....you guys are doing much better than I can, but...you know me, if I pop on, I've got to put in my 2 cents!! (or, considering how much I talk, maybe that's a dollar!) [Linked Image from marriagebuilders.com]

Ok, Sweetie, so now you know what you have to do. Don't let anyone kid you, this is HARD! Robert didn't do it...he didn't take the road you are choosing. He left us, tried to give it a shot with PT and wound up losing so much in the process. As you do, he felt that she had been there for him during one of the worst times of his life...we had suffered a number of tragedies and they affected Robert tremendously. He was certain of her emotional committment. There are reasons that she was "there for him", but they weren't lasting ones. And, he discovered, reasons I wasn't, partially b/c he wasn't open to my being there becasue someone else had turned his head. He lost a lot...within himself. Not me! I'm a stubborn little thing...but he could have...in time, I suppose. He found that life with PT was exactly as you've been told it could be...he found that, once reality set in, it WAS me that he was meant to be with. He suffered so very much. I have so much respect for him for that decision to come home and work with me. And we're both very glad he did.Honey, you don't have to go through what he did, but your battles will be hard as well. Withdrawal is the toughest thing that you have ever done...no one here is gonna lie to you about that. It's also probably the most worthwhile and I know you'll be so proud of yourself once you get through it. We're very proud of you for undertaking it.So.....I'll bow to my wayward friends on this one....they can better prepare you for what's to come. But you asked how you can start and that's simple. All of us who've been in this mess know.....time for that decision. Decide you will break it off with OM and never see or talk with him again. Write that letter and stick by your guns. Decide you CAN get through this pain and you will stay the course, no matter what. Decide you will be honest with your husband and ask for his help in this. I warn you, you may not get it right now. He may not be able to see past his pain enough to help. That's ok. You have us. And you have strength. You CAN do this, though it will hurt. But speaking as someone who's hurt more than I ever thought I could take.....it'll be ok, I promise. You'll live and grow through this and the rewards will be tremendous!A little note here.....rarely is only one partner unhappy in the marriage...even though sometimes neither or them recognize it. (And you would be AMAZED how many times you read here, from the betrayed "I should have been the one to have the affair!") If enough was missing out of this marriage for you to look elsewhere, the same could very well be true for your husband, without either of you realizing it. That could, with a number of other reasons, have a great deal to do with his waning sex drive! Unhappiness, even MILD depression can have such an effect. Restore yourself and then work on restoring your marriage....you will most likely be pleasantly surprised.You'll get to working on your marriage soon enough. For now, make that decision, resolve to stick by it when you don't think you can go on another moment (trust me, that time will come, but you CAN DO IT!). Try NOT to lovebust with your h while you work through this....that's about as much as anyone can ask right now. That's enough.Listen to JL, listen to Firestorm. Once the General Questions I is back on line, you'll find lots of posts from waywards going through withdrawal....and succeeding! Check the read-only posts...Read those from Arik, formally 2 soulmates. Some of them are not pleasant and you'll find us giving him a "kick in the pants" from time to time. But through his posts you will see a bit of what you are going to go through. And, I might add, I just received an e-mail from Arik and Nicole not long ago....they are rebuilding and happy and Arik truly knows that he is where he is meant to be. A long haul, but worth it!Check in read-only for posts from Suse and DuncanMac. Suse WAS where you are and they've been recovering beautifully for a long, long time! You'll learn a lot from them.Check for Kat1, Roofman, Freedom, Lonestar and Petunia. If the posts haven't been deleted (alas, some have, like Kat's camping story, one of my all-time favorites), you'll learn of struggles and hear stories of hope. Things that will help you get through this. There are lots of things on this board right now. You'll see Sir Hurts Alot's last post here. You get some idea from his "goodbye" post, but there are so many others of his that you can learn from...even though he was the betrayed. When you feel alone, just turn here. Look what you have, hundreds of caring people who have shared the most difficult part of their lives....many of whom have kept sharing just to let you know that there IS hope, that life can be good again!As you have already seen, you will find love here. You will also find friends, and honesty....when you want it the least and need it the most! Use us to cry, to vent, to share the good and bad....that's what everyone's here for. But expect true friendship, the kind that doesn't pull punches and tells you exactly what's going on...even when it hurts a bit. From personal experience, we all need it from time to time.I'm very proud of you. You're doing a good thing. I believe that you're a very good person and that you have what it takes to do this. Let's get through that withdrawal, OK? Then we'll work on restoring your marriage. Surprisingly enough, Plan A works for waywards as it does for the betrayed...and it CAN work. The time will come.Good luck, Hon. You're not in this alone. Just hang in there and be strong. You and your husband deserve such happiness, happiness that can last the rest of your lives....and it's possible. I promise it is.Love and prayers,Lori[This message has been edited by lostva (edited August 25, 2000).]

Okay, I know I'm a pathetic romantic...believe in marriage vows...together *forever*...for better, for worse...but here goes:Please, please, please consider what everybody is saying here...My H also thought he found his soulmate after only knowing OW for 3 short months. He/OW had convinced each other that they were meant to be together. OW was secretly planning to leave her H for my H. And, all signs point to the fact that my H was ready to *jump ship* as well.H told OW many mean things about me and our relationship <ugh>. He told OW that I forced him to marry me; that he felt stuck w/me because we had kids; that he never felt for me what he had for her; that he couldn't stand listening to me in the evenings and *tuned* me out; that when he couldn't sleep at night he would put his arms around me and pretend I was OW <holy cow...that one hurt bad!>; that he wanted to have a baby with her...AND I could go on and on and on and on........All of that took place approximately 10 months ago. What's happening now? Well, affair was discovered by all parties involved. My H would not leave me for OW <shock, surprise, NO WAY...YES WAY!>. OW apparently felt used/humiliated by my H and immediately began repairing her own marriage with her H. My H and I continue to heal and rebuild our marriage.H is now telling me that he was confused, mixed up, going through MLC, was only *in love* with how OW made him feel about himself and not with OW, realized that this OW was just like any other woman--what made her appealing (in the first place) was the fact that she made herself available and he found that very flattering.And now I'll plead my case for the OM's family. You say that you are not the cause of his marriage woes, but how could you not be contributing to them? How can he make a wise decision with you at his side...ready to say the things he WANTS to hear...and him only HEARING what you are saying. His WIFE HAS A VOICE TOO--but, her voice means next to nothing with you in the shadows. He can't/won't/doesn't want to hear her when he has YOU to listen too. I imagine he wants to *rescue* you from your horrible H...he wants to be your knight in shining armor. Ironically, I NEEDED MY H TO RESCUE ME. I NEEDED/WANTED THIS BEAUTIFUL MAN--MY HUSBAND--TO BE MY KNIGHT IN SHINING ARMOR!!! Unfortunately, somewhere along the 17 years of my marriage, my *princess* dress became tattered, my golden locks were cut short to avoid baby spit-up, and my glass slippers were replaced with more convenient sneekers to keep up with the many trips up/down the dungeon stairs on the way to the washer/dryer...Did I feel threatened by OW? Yes and no. Yes, because I felt I could NEVER compete with a woman who was 10 years my junior with no children in tow to "tie her down"...after all, her princess dress, golden locks, and glass slippers were still intact for god's sake!!!! But NO, because I honestly don't believe in *fairy tale* endings. Awesome marriages, *perfect* love, great two-somes don't just *happen*...there is no magic wand....they take years of shared hard work, heartaches, joys, disappointments, to meld into *ONE*. Would I have been OK without my H? Sure. I'm positive that there would have been another *soulmate* out there for me too--they're not ALL "reserved" for wayward spouses...are they????. No, couldn't be! Besides, even if I did find my new *prince charming* I know that eventually, somewhere down the road, I'd kiss this new *prince* only to discover that he's just another *man* I happened to fall in love with once upon a time...plain and simple.In the meantime, I continue to kiss my *frog* hoping he'll turn back into MY PRINCE CHARMING [Linked Image from marriagebuilders.com]

.Dear saf: Please follow the advice on this board. Give your marriage a *true* chance...and allow OM the opportunity to do the same for his marriage.Peace, ~Marie[This message has been edited by ohmy_marie (edited August 25, 2000).]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by saf: Dear Good PhrendI too believe that if our love is strong enough we will be together no matter what. How will I know if things would be different with him than they are with H? How will I ever find out if I stay with H? And how can I find happiness with H, when I am so deeply in love with OM? Saf, Here is excerpt of my question on this board: Are you willing to fight to save your marriage? -------------------------------------------- Many couples have beat the odds of getting out of a troublesome marriage and finding happiness. On the other hand, some have found themselves in worse predicaments.If I can gamble leaving my marriage, why not gamble in my marriage? At least, I will be certain of one thing, and that's how I feel about my husband--I do love him.I have just decided to be brutally honest with myself. Since I have made that decision, I feel like a burden has been lifted off my heart. --------------------------------------------- Doesn't true love inspire us to sacrifice our comfort zones to pursue its benefits of security and happiness? ------------------ Love hurts no one.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Just Learning: [B]saf,JL,I am too afraid to be totally honest with H. He does know that I had an A, but he has no idea of the extent of the affair or worse still, that I am still seeing the OM. I fear what his reaction might me and I don't wnat to ruin any little chance I might have of rebuilding our marriage. Still, I cant seem to keep away from the OM. This is where I really need the advice. I think maybe I'll submit another posting on this forum and see if there are any good suggestions out there...

[QUOTE]Originally posted by firestorm: [B]safFirestormAt last, another BS! I was starting to think there were none on this Forum. Firestorm, I deduce from your post that your relationship with the other women is over. Did you make this decision? Or was it "forced" on you? How has your spouse handled the situation? And do you still think and long to be with the OW? These are all the questions that run through my mind. I am afraid that if I give up OM, I will never be truly happy in my marriage because I will always wonder about "what if". Yes, it has crossed my mind about him cheating on ME. But then again, he could say the same thing about me. If we decide to be together we can't bear grudges about mistakes in the past. Just the same as if I stayed with H, we can't bear grudges about mistakes in the past.So,.. five reasons why I fell in love with H.1. I admire him 2. He is good to me (in the material sense) 3. We have the same family values 4. His intelligence 5. His is respected by manyFive reasons I fell in love with OM:1. I can be myself with him - no pretences 2. He makes me feel speacial, loved, cared for 3. I can talk to him about anything and everything 4. He makes me laugh 5. The way he looks at me is filled with love 6. We have the same family values and life values 7. He'd make a great father 8. He'd be a partner, an equal - someone I can share with and not be subordinate to.So Firestorm, who do you think I should be with?

Lori,As usual, you posting brought tears to my eyes. The more time goes on the more I know what it is I need to do (despite my last reply to Firestorm).Still, I cannot bring myself to write that letter. I cannot face not seeing or speaking to the OM. My heart wont let me do it. But I also know that the longer I continue to see him the more jeapordy I place on my marriage. Please help me, please help me to do what I need to do. I will read the posts as you suggested but I know that it may be some time before I am ready to take that leap of faith. Is that OK??

MarieMy problem is not in knowing what I need to do but in actually implementing it. I think OM will divorce his wife regardless of me. I dont deny that our affair was the counduit for their divorce, but I think he will leave her reagrdless of me. And knowing this makes it all the harder...

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by saf: Please help me, please help me to do what I need to do. I will read the posts as you suggested but I know that it may be some time before I am ready to take that leap of faith. Is that OK?? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>SAF - only your husband can answer that last question. Only he will know how much time, faith, love and patience he has. I know, because I too am a betrayer, and due to my own actions and my reluctance to do what is "right", my H has finally said he wants a divorce. My head (along with everyone else in this forum) tells me what is right - get rid of the OM and turn back to my H. My heart screams to run to the OM every chance I get. That's what I have done, and I'm losing my H because of it.I won't repeat my story - see Smallsteps4now's posts if you want the gory details. I have been unable to take that so-called "leap of faith" because I don't have the strength (and/or the desire?) to. I love my H very much, and I abhor the idea of divorce. I am still hopeful (even after everything) that I will be able to get to the place where I CAN make that leap of faith, and hope that it's not too late. But for me, time is running out. For my H, my indecision IS a decision and he wants out. I don't blame him. The small steps that I take, the fun times we have, are all erased with one mistake and dozens of love-busters on both of our parts. Call me stubborn or crazy or just plain stupid, but I can't make a life-altering decision unless I am completely ready to do it - for MYSELF. If I turn to my H out of guilt or duty or obligation, or because I don't want to hurt him anymore, I believe I will resent him and/or myself for "making" me give up the OM, someone I love very much. I realize that by not giving up the OM, I am hurting my marriage more every day. My H can't understand how I can say I love him and don't want a divorce, and then turn around and still have the OM. What looks like a case of having my cake and eating it too is, in reality, my inability to let go of either one of them. NOT THE SAME THING!!! I know that each day that goes by is another day of life I'm wasting. My health has suffered, my H's health has suffered, both of our jobs have been in jeopardy - if this is cake, I don't want any more of it ever!!! One of the things I have realized is that my H is not the "victim". He was betrayed, but our marriage is the victim. We both have time, energy and love invested, and we both hurt and end up losing if it doesn't work. I have beat myself up more times than you can count for doing this to him. There is nothing anyone can say to me that I haven't said a million times to myself. But this web site, Plan A/Plan B, whatever - is all about making the spouse a stronger, better person so the marriage can be better. I finally realized (duh) that *I* need to be a stronger, better person before I can move forward, with ANYONE. If that means I'm selfish, so be it.Ok - what started out as a reply to SAF turned out to be me rambling... [Linked Image from marriagebuilders.com]

I tell my H that I don't want a divorce, but I am not 100% ready to commit back to our marriage, not in the state of mind/heart I'm in right now. SAF - by waiting, you will get to the point I have reached, and it sucks. Your H may be patient and understanding and loving and forgiving enough to give you time and space to work through all of this, but I wouldn't be surprised if you are "forced" to make the move before you are "ready" to. Because he WILL reach his limit, and you will have to sink or swim.I don't have any sage advice or words of wisdom - I know what you're feeling and I understand how helpless you really are. I have to agree with some of the others who have said that your future with the OM looks pretty grim. No matter that he's divorced/divorcing. You can't say that the relationship that you two have had did not affect his marriage. We all know that can't be true. In my case, the OM isn't married, so it's only one family that's involved. But it's MY family, and it hurts like hell.lost_in_love

Hello LIL,Glad to see you posting after your trip. You say you cannot make a decision, but you are making a decision. As you said, Life goes on and your failure to make a decision or leap of faith is a decision whether you want it or not, precisely because life does go on.You and I have talked, just as I have talked with saf. There is really nothing I can say to you, but you really have no idea yet how much pain your have inflicted on your H. Yet, from reading his post, he doesn't want to divorce you, just feels you are driving him to do so. You see your unwillingness to make a decision means you have decided.You have decided you cannot trust your H. You are unwilling to make the leap of "faith" to try and rebuild. Despite the fact that OM is single and if he truely loved you, he would let you try and rebuild, you don't trust him either do you? You know if you go and try and rebuild he will leave you and find someone else.Yet, your H has been there through the duplicity of you moving out, while already having plans to meet OM, you lying to H about affair, and now going to meet him and end the relation. Obviously that isn't why you went to meet OM. Are you leaving your H any room? Room to allow you to get off the fence. No, you are not leaving him any are you? You are forcing him into this divorce with your continual lies. LIL, if you want more time and room to straighten yourself out, do something. Talk with you H, give him some reason to think that if you ask for time to make a decision that you will use the time for that purpose. That he isn't just roadkill in your grand plan to find "true" love. In short give him something, that he can hang his hat on and trust, not the lies and disrespect you have been feeding him.IF you do that, you may find he will give you the time you say you need to make a decision. Otherwise, all he knows is you lie to him, you disrespect him, and you leave him whenever you want. Kind of hard to hang on when you are doing that to him.Please think about this LIL, your odds of a successful marriage to OM are no better than the ones I stated to saf. Please read some of her most recent threads.God Bless,JL

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by Just Learning: Are you leaving your H any room? Room to allow you to get off the fence. No, you are not leaving him any are you? You are forcing him into this divorce with your continual lies. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>JL - for what it's worth, there are no "continual lies". When my H confronted me about the OM, I admitted it. I have opened myself up and given my H total honesty - especially in the last few weeks. In fact, he has been the one lying to me over the last week. I don't judge him, blame him or pretend to not understand. He's hurting and angry and doesn't deserve what I'm putting him through.But - I am not "forcing" him into a divorce. I am not a cruel person, and I'm not playing some sort of game. I am trying to be completely honest with my H (and the OM) about my feelings, and if they are not what he deserves or wants to hear, I'm sorry. I can only say what I think or feel - I don't have a grand plan for what will happen. I have told him that I do not want to divorce. I still love him, and will not deny that for any reason. We have some major trust issues - because of the A on my part and because of some decisions my H has made. He has "committed" some pretty major.... LB... I guess you would call them. Were they a result of my A? Probably so... but they are LB just the same. He hates what I have done, but there are things he has done that I hate, too. Nobody is innocent in this. I do realize the pain he is in - not only do I see it when I look at him, hear it in his voice, but I FEEL it. Anyone who thinks a WS doesn't hurt for what they have done to the BS is crazy. Granted, a WS will never understand what the BS goes through, but that goes both ways. If my loving him and telling my H that I do not want a divorce is forcing him into it, I guess I can't understand that kind of logic. From what I have read, most of the BS on here would give their eye teeth for a little honesty from the WS. Why does it mean so little that I can say I love him and don't want to lose him? Never mind - I don't need the answer. [Linked Image from marriagebuilders.com]

lost_in_love

saf,(sigh...) You have gotten some very wise, kind, and gently delivered advice from some of the best around here. I'm going to be a little more harsh. I don't want to drive you away, I just want to "wake you up".While you may be caught up in the freshness of your "love" for OM, to us oldtimers here at MB we have heard your story countless times, to the point where it is nauseating in its familiarity. "we didn't mean to fall in love, it just happened" "we are true soulmates" "I've never loved anyone like this" "I can't imagine him/.her not in my life" blah, blah, blah... <barf, gag, barf!>Once somebody comes here they usually fall into one of a couple different categories. You seem to be falling into the "fence-sitter" category. * You haven't been completely honest with your H. Which means he hasn't been given a chance to fight for you. You have hurt him badly, but not as much as you are going to. Besides the fact that you are being unfaithful to him, you are being unfairly critical of him too - how can he compare to OM? It helps assuage your guilt if everything your H says is idiotic and everything OM says is brilliant.* You can't imagine giving up the OM. You are both intoxicated by the feelings you have developed for each other. you are LITERALLY addicted to a drug - dopamine or endorphines or whatever that chemical is that is released when you are in love.So here you sit on the fence. Too afraid to tell your H the truth. Too addicted to stop doing what you know is immoral.You say you can't decide? YOU ARE DECIDING, but you are doing it in the most cowardly way possible. You are going to let your marriage die of neglect so you can satisfy your drug problem with the least guilt possible. You haven't got the guts to commit all the way to anything. How sad.Truly you have a terrible dilemma. Now that you have so much emotional capital invested in OM you would have to commit what amounts to emotional suicide to end your relationship. Few people have the nerve to do it (search for Jill's posts for an example of someone who did)saf, it is not a pretty picture. There is no path you can take now that will not be filled with fear, risk, and regret. One path may seem easier, but there are costs for going down that path.Is your mind TRULY open to the possibility that you can fall back in love with your H? And that you can forget about OM? If not then do your H a favor and don't drag him though your half-hearted attempts to save your marriage. As long as you maintain the escape route of the OM, you will not be able to focus 100% of your efforts on fixing your marriage.I don't hate you. My heart bleeds for you and your H. I have been (am in) your H's position, so maybe some of my bitterness comes through. I'm sorry.When you were growing up did you ever think of yourself as an adulterer? Do you think of yourself that way now? You will carry this for the rest of your life. Change course, do what is honorable and give your marriage another chance - a REAL chance. That can only happen if you give up OM. There is no other way.------------------ But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control. Galatians 5:22-23

LIL,You said never mind to your last question. Does that mean you know the answer, or that when asking the question, you realize that the answer is evident.Perhaps I misunderstood something, but I was under the impression that you were going to meet OM to break it off. Certainly, SS4N, thought so. It obviously wasn't so.Please don't take offense at this, but why do you think telling your H that you love him, comforts him? Or that you don't want a divorce now, when you are claiming deep love for OM? I will try to explain this one more time. You see I believe what you are saying. I believe that you love your H and I believe you don't want a divorce. My comments to you were to suggest that your H may be a little short on the belief thing right now.If that is true, I believe you need to do something that will allow him to hang on to the marriage a bit longer. Right now he feels like a cockhold, which he is. He feels you completely disrespect him, which from the sounds of your response you do. You are currently very conflicted, and I am sure he has done some LBing since he found out, but I am sure he hasn't done any since he found this site [Linked Image from marriagebuilders.com]

right????

He is looking for someway to hang on and retain some small amount of respect for himself. How is he going to do this? Can you offer something, that gives him that much to hang on to? Not you saying you love him, he knows that your use of the word and his are very different right now. What can you DO, that would allow him that?That is what I am asking. As I said before, I do believe you do love him, more than you even realize right now. I do believe that you don't want a divorce, right now. So the question is how can you avoid what you don't want, a divorce.Please think about this, because you have complete control of this situation. Your H has none at this point. All he can do is leave or be left, but he cannot do anything about that which you are avoiding.So if you need more time, think about what it is that you can do, to get this time.Is this clearer to you? I hope so.God Bless,JL

Saf,Based on your last reply to firestorm, it seems like you are struggling w/the subordinate role that you play in your marriage. Perhaps, you fell in love w/your husband because your respected him and what he “represented.” But now, you have come to learn that you need more, way more and have found that in OM. Your reasons for falling in love w/OM scream, “he is attentive to and accepts ME and we/I don’t have to pretend”. Am I getting warm here?I believe, however, that your H is quite capable of meeting your needs, but at the same time, you have to give some also. Your H didn’t perpetuate your subordinate role on his own. You, be it consciously or unconsciously, bought into it also. Now, HE needs to realize that, the roles are working for you in your marriage anymore. You want to be treated special and respected and w/more intimacy, etc. I’m wondering about your H and his status/background. From the brief descriptions you’ve provided, it sounds like he is in a position of power, be it “expert” power, or position power, or birth order, or whatever. I believe that some people, who are placed in positions of power, sometimes don’t know how to turn it off. And I’m not speaking of “abusive” power, just the “I have to lead not be led”. If he is respected by you and many others as you state, he may fear failure as he has so many people “counting” on and looking to him to lead them. I would venture to guess that he has “failed” at little and therefore, does not know HOW to fix this emotionally-laden situation. But, really, how many of us here knew how to fix our situations?Give H a chance to change. Right now, the “soup is too hot” to expect much from him, but give him a chance to make small steps in the right direction. And if the pretences bother you, don’t buy into them. If that means, skipping engagements w/him or whatever, then do so until you are comfortable w/that scene again.Finally, I think you know that you marriage stands no chance w/you still seeing OM. You opened your heart to let OM in, give H the same chance.Prayers to you saf Enlightened

Things to consider about the OP: 1) they knowingly messed around with a married person. 2) why did they choose someone unavailable? 3) how do they speak of their other relationships...this is how they speak of you when you are not around. 4) how did those relationships end...this is your likely future. 5) what baggage are they carrying, especially from # 3 & 4?And just one of those anecdotal incidents, my H & I are solidly recovering now, but the man I was seeing last winter/spring (H & I separated as he was suffering from his affair) told me I was "the one" he'd been waiting all his life for. The last time I saw him was the first week in May, he got married July 7. Sure explains those "business" trips to Montana when his cell phone was off. {sigh}. saf--if you want to leave your marriage, leave it, but do not count on the OM being there. The smartest advice I almost took [Linked Image from marriagebuilders.com]

was to take a break from the OM for 2 weeks. No contact, no phones, email, nothing. Concentrate on your marriage for that brief time. If the OM contacts you, he is not respecting your wishes...and never will. If he is decent and intends to be honorable, he'll wait 2 weeks. Even a soulmate can do that. ESPECIALLY a soulmate can do that, because they want what is right for the other at the expense of themselves. I've been on all sides of infidelity, it's all painful, but your husband has some really wonderful qualities if he is willing to work through this with you.You can get over the OM, if you choose to.

saf,Sorry I missed responding to one of your posts. You don't want to tell H the extent of the affair for fear of ruining the little chance that exists that the marriage can be saved. I understand you fear and in fact it makes me glad. [Linked Image from marriagebuilders.com]

It means to me you realize you do love your H, but you are into this thing very very deep. This is causing you to cover up feelings, remember only the bad things of the marriage and have little hope for your marriage. All very understandable. People have to do this or go crazy because they are so confused and torn.However, let me point something out to you. The odds of your rebuilding your marriage and making it better are much higher than you having a successful marriage to OM. You have much more to hope for in trying to rebuild than you do creating a new marriage with OM.The reasons are numerous and many people can provide more than I can.I just want to tell you, that if your H loves you, you can (I won't use the word rebuild) build a marriage that is better than what you had. It can happen SAF it really can, but it will take honesty on your part. I know this is so hard to see, but it is true.Hang in there and keep posting. You will see what many of us are saying as time moves on. The OM will have his own issues and they will come out soon. His divorce will add many aspects to his personality, that you are not aware of yet. Further, you will have to deal with the fact that you broke up that marriage and those childrens family.Sorry, but there is no doubt about that. So much is to come and no matter what you do it will be painful. However, if you do try and make your marriage work, I believe you will see that that path will offer you the best chance to be happy.It will take time, SAF.God Bless,JL

safI mostly lurk here now. I am the betrayed in my marriage. I discovered my ex's affair on Christmas Day 1998. She was convinced she had found her 'soul mate'. She pursued him relentlessly. She moved out of the house in Aug 98 and filed for divorce almost immediately. Unfortunately, the OM was already living with another woman. Some soulmate huh?The questions Lori asked are very good ones to consider. In addition, I would ask you if you have children and what impact you think this is going to have on them? In the 18 months following the discovery of the affair, our 16 year old sone was arrested and our 13 year old son failed 7th grade. My 16 year old son doesn't want to live with his mother. He understands it is because of her actions his family was torn to pieces.Tom[This message has been edited by ZAPFT (edited August 28, 2000).]

i was in the same boat as saf...how can i give him up? om and i had a 2.5 year affair..and i would describe our relationship exactly as you have...soulmates! in april he left his wife, but wanted to remain friends with her because of their 13 yr old son and because they are both faculty in the same dept. he was sure the son would want to be with him since he had practically raised him with no interest from her. he was wrong. the son wanted to stay in the big house with the pool, and turned on his father for "ruining" everything. the guilt got to him, and he couldn't leave his son. i hadn't made up my mind to leave h because, just like yours, he is a caring, loving husband...but after 22years the flame had died. so anyway, om's son made the decision for us really, we had to give our families a second chance. it has been very rough for me, i miss om terribly. but it IS getting better. we said goodbye on may 31 and haven't spoken since. i gave him harley's info on how to end an affair and we've stuck to it. i have my days, and whenever it gets particularly bad i come here to remind myself that we never really stood a chance. outside of the romance we had nothing in common at all. i'm convinced now that it wouldn't have lasted and i would have missed my husband. my husband and i have a lot of history...happy times. this is the first real problem we've had. i still haven't told h yet...i can't get up the nerve to hurt him like that. but i know i need to come clean with him. om told his wife about me, and they are working on their relationship. she did send me a vicious email, but that is to be expected. i feel really bad for her pain. what a mistake i made.

Dear lost in loveYour words echo my exact feelings! In kind of an eerie way. I too know that the "right" thing to do would be to give up the other man and work it out with H. I too know that I cannot give my marriage an honest shot while I am still seeing the OM. But my heart aches and longs to be with the OM. Its not that I am unhappy with H. Its just that I am NOT HAPPY. I am so afraid of the same things as you. That if I gove up the OM, I will always resent H and that I will never find happiness there. But if I leave and go to OM, then I will resent HIM!! This "eat your cake and eat it scenario" is not fun for me either! I tell myself that if I dont make this decision, it will be made for me. Either OM will get tired of waiting for me to leave H, or H will give up on the marriage. Either way, I dont have to choose, because I dont know that I have the strength in me to make that choice. Either way, I loose something good. I am also not totally committed to my marriage and part of that is because of H's inability to meet my emotional needs and reluctance to go to counseling. I need to be sure that we can sort it all out and that I will be truly happy with him (as opposed to just being content). Then and only then can I commit to my marriage and give up the other man. But it is true that each say that I spend with the OM, the worse our marriage gets. So to you and any other betrayers out there. How can you be sure that the OM is the WRONG choice? And if you do decide to go for Plan A, what are the repercussions? I need to know what to expect on a physical, emotional and spiritual basis. Lost in love, now that your H has asked for divorce, do you feel this has all been a mistake, are you now ready to leave OM? Or are you looking forward to a life with OM?

2sad4wordsYour pain is very evident in what you say. I AM sitting on the fence. But thanks to MB it is becoming clearer to me what it is I need to do. I am just not sure how to do it....

Dear EnlightenedVery WARM!!!! Thats exactly how things are with me and H. But if I give up OM and give him the cjance to change, how can I know that he will change? How can I know that I will find the same comfort and ease with H as I do with OM? After all, I have not had that up till now.

LorThe OM and I have tried to break it off several times, but invariably, one of us gives in and calls. I admit that a 2 week "break" seems a lot easier to swallow than a life time one. But how do I stick to it?

Dear ZAPFT and JLFortunately, neither myself nor the OM have children, so our situation is not further complicated. Still, it does not make it any easier to choose between the 2 men.

JillMy heart aches with you. I cannot imagine being without OM as long as you have. But lucky for you, the decision was made for you. You just have to deal with it. It is making this decision that is tormenting me. Dont you ever wonder that maybe one day you we be together again? I dont know that I could let go of that. I dont know that I have the strength (or desire) to let go of him!

You say: <<But how do I stick to it?>>You aren't honestly telling me you have no self-will or discipline, are you?saf--I know I'm probably coming off harsh. I'm not the sweetie the other Lori (lostva) is. Among the reasons I was involved with another man was because my H stayed on the fence for nearly 2 years and I gave up on the 7th separation. I went on with my own life, served divorce papers and truly did not care that he had a personal epiphany where he wanted the marriage and our family back together. Since I had been in Plan A for 18 months and on the MB boards for over a year, this unsettled some folk here, but although few knew the whole story, I still received support, as did my H for the weeks he was a poster. My H was in a place where the relatinship with his OW was over. And I was disappearing fast.Neither your H or OM may be in your future if you equivocate long enough. At some point, you have to lose one of them. There is not a plan where you get both. Read the Divorced/Divorcing board if you don't believe me.It took my H 4 months to bring me back to wanting the marriage. 4 months. Where he knew I had a "special friend" [Linked Image from marriagebuilders.com]

And I had been so PRO our marriage. I am completely his wife again, but, I can tell you that trusting him with my heart yet again as the betrayed spouse-turned WS was one of the hardest things I ever had to do. And it hasn't been easy for my husband either. I hurt him...and understand the feeling of the fence...I didn't know the OM got married until he'd been married 5 weeks, but by that time I had chosen my marriage, yet I was still shocked. But fortunately I had also gone to Mexico with my H [Linked Image from marriagebuilders.com]

for another honeymoon and knew when I put on my wedding rings again that it meant as much as the first time.So when I say you just do it, that is what I mean. You capture your thoughts, you put the OM out of your mind. First moment by moment, then step by step, day by day, week by week and soon it's been MONTHS. And then, you look at the husband God granted you and you love him with all your heart. You realize he always was the one. My H says all through the bad times, even when he said he didn't love me, he did, he has always loved me.And then you go on to make the marriage healthy, where you meet each other's needs, protect and care for each other, spend 15 hours a week together, agree to Policy of Joint Agreement, and are honest when the day isn't so great and honest when it is.But first, the fresh hurting has to stop.------------------ Lor "Let love be genuine...hold fast to what is good; love one another." Rom 12:9-10

Saf,Thought I was pretty close  Now, what you are asking is “where are my gaurantees?” You have a history w/H and therefore , based on this history, have “low” expectations of his ability to meet your needs. W/OM, you have no history and therefore, your “outlook” w/him appears much more “rosy” BUT, like most of us here dealing w/infidelity, you probably NEVER imagined you would be in this situation. I’m sure you didn’t PLAN to have an affair, but you are now enthralled in one. In the same vain, your H may have never PLANNED to meet your emotional needs as you require, BUT he too, may surprise YOU by doing exactly what you need.To stay w/a WS requires a leap of faith on the betrayed’s part. The BS has to not only deal w/the betrayal, but also work toward “fixing” what was wrong KNOWING that another could very well be lurking ready to “save” their spouse @ the first “wrong” move. That is a huge challenge for the BS. I would say the BS has a much harder job than the OP. The playing field is not level. Remember that.As for your choice, it too will require a leap of faith, whichever way you go. Are you equipped w/the tools to deal w/a new marriage? If the answer is yes, then you are then also equipped to deal w/your marriage to your H. The tools are essentially the same. If not, consider thoroughly, how green the grass really is over there. You could be going from the frying pan to the fire.Think long and hard. Enlightened

saf,yes, i do think about the future and sometimes wish that there was still a chance, i really love OM and miss him so much. but if we were together i don't know how long it would last. he has much more in common intellectually with his wife - although he claims she gives him no emotional support. my h and i share a lot of interests, we are runners, we like to camp, and cook. all of these things are of no interest to om, he doesn't like to exercise, can't camp because of his back, and has so many food issues/alergies. om is also on medication for depression. i am very outgoing. i don't know how i fell in love with him, (he had been my boss before the A started, and i was helping him through a depressive state - he had told me he was suicidal)...he is very romantic, sweet, and kind....but what would happen when our flame went out? i really miss our conversations and the way he made me feel, but it wouldn't have lasted. although, three months ago i would have argued against that. saf, look at the things that make you happy, do you have more in common with h or om outside of the emotional needs? i think you can work on those easier than the other things i mentioned. look at the big picture, compare what you have to lose with what you have to gain. we tried splitting up many times as well, it just doesn't work, you both have to make a commitment to go for it, or end it. it's an addiction. good luck. jill

safI know you face a tough decision. Love is the most powerful emotion there is. I asked you to list the reasons that you fell in love with your H and the reasons you fell in love with the OM just to see how they compared to my situation and to make you think. The OW in my life could have written the reasons herself. She told me basically the same thing. I have to be truthful here. The OW was in love with me, but my feelings for her were different. I did not love her like she loved me and I am beginning to see that. My W fould out about my affair last September and I confessed everything to her. After D day, I made a few contacts with OW because I wanted to see if she was OK. She never told her H about our affair and her marriage suffered for that. About one month after D day, I called her and told her that it was over and that I did not want any more contact with her. SHe went into depression not to long after that. She did make several attempts to contact me by leaving messages on my answering service asking me to call her. It was always just to ask me a question. I never returned her calls.Then shortly after July fourth, she called me and I answered (mistake). She needed my help to find out who had been sending her very dirty e-mail. I am very good with computers and she knew I could easily trace who was sending her these messages, although they were from a generic account. She was truthful about the e-mail and I fould out who it was (to my suprise). Anyway, during all of this she began to talk to me about her problems, that is how everything started the last time. Her and her H were not getting along at all. She began to get involved again but I kept wanting to distance myself and have finally done that. My W knows I made contact with OW and of course that has damaged our recovery. I did not want to get emotionally involved with her again, but I know she started to get the same feelings back for me. She was still attached to our relationship even though we had no contact with each other for a long time. I had moved on with my life and put the affair behind me. She never let go. Everything you said you feel for the other man, she said the same to me. She wanted to be with me and it killed her love for her H. My W is who I wanted to be with and still do. The main reason, I know that she would never do to me what I did to her. This is the reason I could never fall in love with the OW. I DID NOT TRUST HER, EVER. As I told you before, true love will always prevail. Look in the mirror and ask yourself this: Who loves me the most, my H or the OM? Be honest with your answer. You fell in love with your H for REAL reasons, you fell in love with the OM for reasons of fantasy. Look at your answers and you will see that. You ask me if I ever think about the OW, yes I do. But, I think about my W also and I know that she is my one true love. THe OW made me feel good. My W makes me feel loved, safe, and secure.I am sorry I have not gotten back to you sooner, but I have not had much time to read here the past couple of days. I hope I have helped in some way. Anything that you want to ask me, feel free to do so. My best wishes to you....fs.

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>I need to be sure that we can sort it all out and that I will be truly happy with him (as opposed to just being content). Then and only then can I commit to my marriage and give up the other man.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Sorta like the chicken & the egg. You won't be able to commit to your marriage until you give up the om, but you won't give up om until you're sure the marriage wil work.Wanna guarantee? Won't get one. However, using the MB techniques is one of the surest ways to succeed. Then even if the marriage does not work, you will have learned what you need to succeed in other relationships. You will also learn WHY a relationship which began as an affair will NOT work.------------------ Prayers & God Bless! Chris For relationship info check out <A HREF="http://www.pcisys.net/~chriscal1/resources.html" TARGET=_blank>Marriage & Relationship Resources</A>

Sitting here reading this is like reading some of my own emotions.. Jill, you asked who they have more in common with..the OM of H..I've been thinking about this in my relationships..H and I don't know..I mean..sure h and I have our kids in common, but he's not here to spend time w/ them and when he has been here he hasn't spent time w/ them..he's taken our problems out on them..he'll go lock himself outside in the shed and watch his tv..they go out to talk to him..and he yells at them to get out..and pushes them away..he is so used to his time alone because he is gone so much. (like I said in other posts he's been gone 7 out of 9 years, and 1 of those we actually lived together for the year..and we didn't get along..the rest of that time has been weekends and vacations, that he has taken off work) So I really can't say what we have in common because I really don't know..on vacations..we have been to the beach where I went and laid out..and relaxed while he took care of the kids..(kinda like a break for me cause I am a stay home mom and was w/ one of them 24/7 for the past 9 years until I went back to college this past year) Or we'd go to his mom's and he'd take off w/ his brother.. or we'd go to a family function on my side and he'd watch the kids while I visited w/ my family..or he'd be drinking w/ the men.. So for 9 years...it's been like we've lived seperate lives but legally married so we couldn't be free to go on and do anything else..So I sit here and really wonder..WHY am I still here?? other than I don't have to work, I can go to college..not worry about daycare for my kids because I am home when they get home..but other than that..I don't know why I stay..and I don't know why he wants to stay married..(I guess for financial reasons..he has a home base so he can get his money to work out of town, if he didn't have a home address here he wouldn't get that, so he doesn't want to have to pay child support here, and have a place on the road..and another place he just goes to once a month) Is all I see is how it's benefitting him... And thats not a marriage..so why do I stay?? I could get a job..and go it alone..I guess it's just a fear of actually doing it..as far as OM..I don't know what all we have in common either..other than our love of conversation. We can talk about anything.. (as I have tried to do over the years w/ h and still try, with no response) I heard yesterday of a company here that is hiring.. I think I'll go next week and put in an application..even for part-time so I can finish these classes..and see how it goes.. And I have two applications sitting here I need to finish filling out..I don't know if OM will be in my future..and if he's not I am okay w/ that too, I'd miss our conversations..and how he makes me laugh, just like I'd miss that in my female friends if they weren't apart of my life anymore..when I'm down they give me a hug.. and encourage me..when we've gone out to do something and we say see ya later..we hug and give each other a kiss on the cheek..I do that w/ my both the OM and the female friends..the sexual aspect of the relationship w/ OM is not there so it's not something I'd miss...

delete [This message has been edited by Trapped Mom (edited March 20, 2001).]