Hi everyone, I'm a new user here and figured I'd try to get some advice on our situation. My wife and I have been together for 13 years, married for 10 this coming September. We've always been best friends, and I think that has always been the foundation of our relationship. But, over the past 5 years or so, we have had financial issues that resulted in a bankruptcy along with a repossessed vehicle, and many other problems with bills and such. Neither of us have ever been very affectionate people, but it never really seemed to matter. We just had "something" that we thought didn't need to be questioned. We have 2 beautiful children, 7 year old boy and a 5 year old girl.
I've done some selfish things in the past few years that we have argued about, but I never realized each time that it was truly hurting her. We would argue, and I would think she would get over it. These things were buying stuff when we really didn't have the money. I realize now that these actions were completely wrong. I just didn't think it was that big of a deal at the time. Now, she says it just reached a breaking point and she doesn't know if it can be fixed. She has lost feelings for me, but does still love me. She says she just feels like friends now, and hates being here in the house, but doesn't know what to do and doesn't want to hurt the kids. She said she woke up one day and decided she didn't want to live like this anymore. That she'd given us her all for so long, and felt that I was giving nothing in return. She is right, I was taking things for granted, assuming that this "something" we had would just always be there. I didn't realize that a long, happy marriage does take work. Now, she's taking a lot of time for herself and she said it makes her happy. She's had her problems with depression and anxiety, she was diagnosed with a nervous disease 12 years ago but is currently in remission. This has affected her a lot, but I was always there for her no matter what, at least I thought I was. Recently, she said she's been very stressed out with the kids, work, and what has happened to our relationship. She's been having a lot of panic attacks and taking Ativan to control it. We had some issues early on in our marriage and separated for a little over a year, but reconciled. In the past few months I've been doing all I can to show her that I have realized what I've done and she means the world to me. She's told me to relax because it freaking her out, because it's just not me. I think continuing to do these things has even pushed her away more. She said right not, she just wants to focus on the kids to make sure they aren't affected by our problems. I don't know what to do, and I don't want to lose her. Her and the kids are my world.
Now, she's taking a lot of time for herself and she said it makes her happy.
Hi HMSI, welcome to Marriage Builders. Yes, this can be saved if you follow this program. And we can get you started. But first, can you elaborate on the above comment. WHAT does this mean exactly when you say she is taking time for herself? Doing WHAT?
She's been going out with friends, going to the beach. A few months ago, she and her sister took a vacation to Florida. At that point, she was in contact everyday talking about what they were doing, saying that she missed me, asking how things were going at home and with the kids. Her sister recently bought a new house, so she's been spending a lot of time there helping with things. Her sister was always there for us when we were moving, so she feels like she owes it to her sister, and I agree. I've been doing what I can do also (cutting her lawn, helping install things in the house, etc). She said she feels like she lost herself over time, since she's done nothing but give and give to keep our family afloat for so long. And now, she's trying to find herself again and be happy.
I wasn't sure how much detail to include in my original posts, so I figured I would answer any questions as they were asked.
She is having an affair.
Why do you think that? I'm very close to one of her friends that she's been spending a lot of time with. I've talked to her about what's going on with us, and she told me that they have just been hanging out, talking.
I have asked my wife if there is someone else, and she has told me there isn't.
Why do you think that? I'm very close to one of her friends that she's been spending a lot of time with. I've talked to her about what's going on with us, and she told me that they have just been hanging out, talking.
I have asked my wife if there is someone else, and she has told me there isn't.
Of course she won't tell you and I imagine her friend is helping her cover this up. What you should do is RULE IT OUT. Don't ask her, but quietly investigate and I predict you will find she is having an affair.
The fact that she is leading this completely independent, single lifestyle at the expense of your marriage while demonizing you is a dead giveaway. I am amazed that you are going along with such destructive behavior and that is part of the problem. Your complicity is a big problem.
I would not ask her about your suspicions, but quietly do some sleuthing. Put a GPS on her car, keylogger on her computer, flexispy on her phone. Check her phone bill, email, everything and see if you can find out who it is.
Now, she says it just reached a breaking point and she doesn't know if it can be fixed. She has lost feelings for me, but does still love me. She says she just feels like friends now, and hates being here in the house, but doesn't know what to do and doesn't want to hurt the kids. She said she woke up one day and decided she didn't want to live like this anymore. That she'd given us her all for so long, and felt that I was giving nothing in return
This is how she has justified her affair in her mind: "I have given and given..." This is CLASSIC. A wayward wife will typically manufacture grievances going back YEARS to justify her affair. She will portray herself as the victim and her H as the oppressor who kept her down and robbed her of her happiness. Therefore she is ENTITLED in her mind. And your wife very much has that CLASSIC wayward wife entitled, victim mentality. I see she has effectively guilted you into going along with it while she cats around to "find herself." [and abandons her husband and children in the process]
I can't start spying on her, because we've always had a trust and I honestly believe she would tell me if it got to that point. I've been friends with her friend long before my wife met her. We've always had a good relationship. I completely trust her also. My wife has always been honest and open about stuff like that. I can see what she means when she said she's given, and given, and has lost herself. She always has been our family's foundation, and I took it for granted for too long. I can completely understand why she feels this way, and I don't blame her for it.
I can't start spying on her, because we've always had a trust and I honestly believe she would tell me if it got to that point. I've been friends with her friend long before my wife met her. We've always had a good relationship. I completely trust her also.
This is part of your problem. Because of your unwarranted "trust" she is permitted to carry on an affair unimpeded. You are losing your wife because of your "trust." Your wife is likely having an affair that could easily be stopped if you uncovered it and killed it. By not snooping, you are forfeiting any chance you have at saving your marriage because of some silly notions you have about trust.
You can save your marriage, but you can't if you don't do anything to dig out the REAL problem. Your wife would NOT tell you if she was having an affair, Sir. THEY NEVER DO.
Well, I hate to sound this way, but I didn't join this forum to find out if my wife is having an affair. I was hoping for some stories and advice on what other folks have done in these types of situations, and what I could be doing to help save my marriage.
Well, I hate to sound this way, but I didn't join this forum to find out if my wife is having an affair. I was hoping for some stories and advice on what other folks have done in these types of situations, and what I could be doing to help save my marriage.
You joined the forum to get help saving your marriage, right? I am teling you what to do to save your marriage, Sir. Your wife is very likely having an affair and if you don't dig it out, you will lose your wife
because the affair is the source of your problem. You cannot solve your marriage problems unless you address the REAL PROBLEM.
Affairs thrive on secrecy so while you delude yourself, your wife's affair is thriving and growing. It will thrive and grow until you stop it or until she leaves you for an OM. <----that is where you are headed.
You can easily prove me wrong by doing a little investigation. I don't mind being proved WRONG.
That is exactly what you are getting.
None of us wanted to find out that our spouses were playing away, it hurts and boy it hurts big time.
If you follow the suggestions and check out the truth, then thats one thing but to blindly assert that this isn't the case????
Trust but verify.......
If she isn't playing away, having an affair, then there are still lots of things you can do, but non really work when or if she is cake eating.
Otherwise you become the best enabler on here, and sorry pal, thats my title.....5 years of enabling.
what do you have to loose?.................
What do you have to gain?.................
When we have sat and talked about things, she has cried a lot while we're talking about what has happened and how it got to this point. So, that makes me think there is still feeling there for her, and she's very sad that this has happened. It's not like she's being completely cold and un-emotional. I just don't know how far to push.
When we have sat and talked about things, she has cried a lot while we're talking about what has happened and how it got to this point. So, that makes me think there is still feeling there for her, and she's very sad that this has happened. It's not like she's being completely cold and un-emotional. I just don't know how far to push.
I would not "push" her at all. I would SNOOP and find out who the man is and then come back here. I am so sorry.
Well, we have a family plan phone bill, and everything on that seems normal. Nothing on her computer out of the ordinary.
Well, we have a family plan phone bill, and everything on that seems normal. Nothing on her computer out of the ordinary.
Folks who are cheating typically erase emails, etc, so I wouldn't expect you to find much there. Another common tactic is to get another cell phone and use it exclusively for the affair. One way you could find out, perhaps is to put a GPS on her car and tail her the next time she goes out with her friends.
If she uses the computer much, you could install a keylogger to see what she is going. There are several mentioned over on the Operation Investigate forum. I think there is even a free one mentioned.
Well, I hate to sound this way, but I didn't join this forum to find out if my wife is having an affair. I was hoping for some stories and advice on what other folks have done in these types of situations, and what I could be doing to help save my marriage.
In some ways, my wife and I were in a similar-type situation, maybe not quite as bad as yours. We also had always been best friends. We were very wrapped up in life, though -- in our respective jobs, in raising our kids, in volunteering in our church -- and so it ended up that we were spending lots of time apart, even though everything looked fine on the surface. We almost never argued or fought about anything.
How we handled it was, when one day my wife voiced some apprehension that she didn't like me spending so much time with a woman who was one of the singers along with me on our church's music team, I told her there was nothing to worry about. After all, it was just about the music. And she trusted me, because after all, I had been a good man & a faithful husband for over 16 years of marriage.
And I happened to have been, at that very time, about 3 weeks into an emotional affair with that woman.
My wife trusted me. My word was good enough for her, because I had always been as good as my word.
Had been.
Had she snooped, had she compared notes with the other woman's husband, had she trusted me less, then maybe she could've stopped my affair before it became physical. But although I tried half-heartedly for a couple of weeks to cool it, by then I was too hooked & too selfish, and it became a full-blown physical affair.
We have since saved our marriage & made it better than before, but wish it could've happened without the full-blown heartbreak that I caused in the interim.
Look: I'm not gonna say that I know your wife is having an affair, because I can't know for certain. But I'm not in position to find out. You are. And the behavior you describe is consistent with women who have affairs. (The woman with whom I had the affair was married, too, so I also saw that side of things, sorry to say.)
As far as what you could be doing to save your marriage, check the yellow box on the right-hand side of this website and read up on the concepts of "emotional needs" and "undivided attention." The time for undivided attention is when you meet each other's most important emotional needs. But it'll be pretty darned impossible for you to apply the very good principles here if the limted time that you have available to spend with one another is being spent apart, with her off on separate vacations & leading an independent life. That's gotta stop, whether she's in an affair or not.
As far as trust is concerned? Not trusting is not going to kill your marriage. My wife almost assuredly has less than complete trust in me (on account of what I did), but she has something better: She's a lot closer to actually knowing that I'm on the level with her. And she's no longer prone to denial of the sort that people get into when they tell themselves "My spouse would certainly never have an affair."
HelpMeSaveIt....great name. You are here asking for help and that is a good thing! Welcome to Marriage Builders!
Now, can your marriage be saved? Absolutely!
Will it? that depends.
IF your wife is having an affair, then the answer is no, NOT UNTIL it is exposed and stopped dead in it's tracks, and then it's an uphill battle for many. lots of info on it and plenty of folks here that will help you both thru it.
IF she is NOT having an affair, count your lucky stars as it will be easier to turn your marriage around.
By the way, an 'affair' is not JUST physical affairs. Emotional, online affairs, both are just as damaging to a marriage as physical affairs are.
YOU are the only one who can find out. It takes snooping, digging, and accepting the outcome, regardless of what it is. Many folks fight that snooping until they are blue in the face, just to find out all along, it's right under their noses. Accept its a possibility UNTIL proved otherwise.
The key, is PROVEN.
I'd LOVE to see you prove MelodyLane wrong! We all would. She's got something of a track record with her nose for sniffing these out. Listen to her, and prove her wrong!
Snoop. Deeply. And do NOT tell your wife you are, because if she is having one, and you tell her? She will deny it, and take it underground, making it FAR harder to find.
Your marriage can survive her anger, it can NOT survive an ongoing affair.
ps...if you have doubts about what others say? Read the starting posts or page on the threads over under Surviving an Affair.....
...advice on what other folks have done in these types of situations, and what I could be doing to help save my marriage.
I have seen many stories like yours and these always end up with the discovery of the affair.
One
example. (Affair will be revealed by help of VAR on 4th page.)
A quote from the founder of the Marriagebuilders:
I've seen so many spouses lie about affairs, that when one spouse wants a separation, my best guess is that he or she is having an affair. I'm right almost every time.
Why would anyone need to be alone to sort things out? It makes much more sense to think that being separated makes it easier to be with their lover. Granted, there are many good reasons for a separation, such as physical or extreme mental abuse. But of all those I've seen separate, most have had lovers in the wings.
Full article
here.
Look, I understand your hesitance, noone wants to be cheated on and rather wants to consider this possibility as the last one, next to impossible. But sad truth is that affairs are extremely common (60-80% of marriages are affected by it) and to trust your spouse without verification ise very unwise.
Well, last night I noticed she wasn't wearing her ring. I asked her where it is, and she said she just forgot to put it on. I'm pretty sure something is going on with someone else, but I just don't have the heart or the energy to pursue it.
She said our relationship has always been so amazing because of the trust and the fact that we are best friends. Is she doesn't feel any of that anymore and can do something like this to us, then I figure, what's the point?
One of my best friends (female) suggested I just stop talking to her all together, since she's been talking about needing nothing from me and needing space. She said let her figure out what's going on in her head. She really feels that she's going through some type of midlife crisis. She's stopped talking to her good friends that she used to talk to almost everyday.
She also mentioned that my wife seems to be going through the same motions that her mother has done for years. Shutting people out and going into some type of depression mode.
Last night, she came home from work and said she was going upstairs to clean out all the old stuff in our room. She stayed up there most of the night. I went swimming with the kids and played with them most of the night. Got them ready for bed and we sat and watched a movie. Around 9pm, my wife came down and sat on the other couch behind her laptop.
When I went up to bed, there was an old Valentine's Day card that she had gotten for me laying on my side of the bed. At one point, while she was up there cleaning, she had junk piled all over the bed. She eventually cleaned all that stuff up and made the bed. Why would she have left that single card there?
We got up this morning, and I didn't say a word to her. She didn't say anything back either. I got the kids up and ready for the babysitter and we both just left for work our separate ways.
One of my best friends (female) suggested I just stop talking to her all together, since she's been talking about needing nothing from me and needing space. She said let her figure out what's going on in her head. She really feels that she's going through some type of midlife crisis. She's stopped talking to her good friends that she used to talk to almost everyday.
What is her experience with saving marriages? What are her credentials in this field? What is her plan for you to save your marriage?
Were you interested in saving your marriage? Can we help you, Sir?
Yes, I want to save my marriage.
If you do, then the first step is to snoop and find out what she is doing. Find out as much as you can without giving yourself away. Don't ask her, just quietly find out who it is, his marital status, etc and then come back here. We can help you with next steps.
I would most definitely talk to her and be as pleasant as possible. Don't agree to any destructive ideas like giving her "space" or moving out, divorce, separation, anything. We can help you turn this around, Helpmesaveit. I want to give you hope, my friend.
She told me this morning that there is someone else, but it didn't start until after our problems. She said she's sorry and she can't make herself feel a certain way. She said she's moving downstairs until we get things sorted out with the kids and financially, then she's moving out. I'm completely devastated right now. I can't believe this has come to this.
She told me this morning that there is someone else, but it didn't start until after our problems. She said she's sorry and she can't make herself feel a certain way. She said she's moving downstairs until we get things sorted out with the kids and financially, then she's moving out. I'm completely devastated right now. I can't believe this has come to this.
I am so sorry.
Ok, so she is having an affair. Who is the OM? You need to know everything about him.
She told me this morning that there is someone else, but it didn't start until after our problems. She said she's sorry and she can't make herself feel a certain way.
Help, I know you are devastated, but this is FAR from over. We have turned around worse cases than this. So please don't give up hope.
The way to save your marriage is to kill her affair. The way to kill her affair is to expose it to everyone in a strategic and methodical way. We can help you do this in the most effective way. Just find out who it is, if he is married, and then we can help you with next steps.
Also, make sure she understands that she is committing adultery and you won't stand for it. DEMAND that she end her affair. Her "feelings" do not justify adultery. Is it ok if your child shoplifts or shoots up heroin just because he "feels" like it? Of course not.
Let her know in no uncertain terms that you will not stand for her ADULTERY and she must end her affair. [use the words adultery and affair]
p.s. I would click on notify and ask the mods to move this thread to the Surviving an Affair forum.
I've found out who he is and he is not married.
How do you think she communicates with the OM? Via computer? At work? A hidden cell phone? Will she tell you who the OM is? Have you asked?
I've found out who he is and he is not married.
What do you know about him? And who told you this?
I've found out who he is and he is not married.
What do you know about him? And who told you this?
ok, find out if he is married and what he does. Where does he live, work? What do you know about him?
Do you know his name? If so, look him up on facebook right now and copy and paste all his facebook contacts into a WORD doc. Can you go do that?
Help, I know you are devastated, but you have work to do right now. You have a marriage and your children's family to save. If you focus on solving this problem, I promise you feel much better.
Did you ask the mods to move this to Surviving an Affair?
You need to find out on your own if he is married. Don't rely on what your wife says.
I know his name and got his facebook friends. Now what?
I know his name and got his facebook friends. Now what?
Is he married? Where did she meet him?
What I would do is plan a massive exposure. Affairs thrive on secrecy so exposure is ruinous. Exposure should be done all on the same in order to get the most impact.. The more people who know about the affair, the more opportunity for some one to get through to her.
Make up a list of exposure targets and calmly start calling and emailing them. Ask them all to use their influence to persuade them to end the affair. You should also send out private messages to the OM's Facebook friends and ask for their help. (we have a sample letter) if this is a workplace affair, then human resources should be notified.
Here are good exposure targets:
1. Her parents, your parents, the OMs parents
2. Close friends and siblings
3. The OM's wife
4. Your children
5 OMs Facebook friends
6 the workplace
The same can be said about telling children about an affair. My experience with the positive outcomes of hundreds of families where an affair has been exposed to children has led me to encourage a betrayed spouse not to fear such exposure. In fact, to mislead children, giving other false explanations as to why their parents are not getting along, causes children to be very confused. When they finally discover the truth, it sets an example to children that dishonesty is sometimes acceptable, making them the judge of when that might occur.
An affair is an attack on children as well as the betrayed spouse. And it's true that children are deeply affected by this form of irresponsible behavior. But it's the act of infidelity that causes children to suffer, not the exposure of it. Facts point us toward solutions. Illusion leads us astray. That's true for children as well as adults.
How old are you and your WW?
A few things:
Breathe. You�ve just suffered one of the greatest blows to a person�s security, emotions, safety, and feelings that anyone can go through. The emotional response to infidelity is the same as rape.
So, what do you need to do now?
Stay calm, for one. Don�t make any rash decisions. You need to come here for advice. We�ve been in your shoes and some of us have saved our marriages, some of us haven�t, but we all have the advantage of hindsight to give you guidance on the path to follow.
You need to snoop. You�ve started doing so, but you�re only scratching the surface. You have confirmation that she�s having an affair, but you need to get some more info.
So you know who he is. Find out if he is indeed married or not and/or has a girlfriend. It�s very common for OM to have someone else in the picture.
You need to be in evidence gathering mode right now.
The next and most important step to saving your marriage is the hardest to do, especially for betrayed husbands for some reason. You must expose the affair to anyone and everyone who can influence your marriage. That means you expose it to family, close friends, and especially to everyone on his side of the equation. Expose him as a man who goes after married women.
You must do this without warning. Any warning will backfire on you big time.
Exposure will make her furious. She�ll convince you it�s over for sure. Well, we�ve heard it all before. Exposure brings the affair out of the shadows and into the light.
Finally, make it 100% clear to your WW that divorce will not be a pretty path to follow. Let her know that you will fight for everything, down to the last fork in the house. Tell her that if she goes down the path of divorce that you will ask for sole physical and legal custody of the kids and for spousal support.
Will you get it? Not likely. But defogging her involves making her see that there are consequences to going down that path.
95% of your battle is psychological. It involves defogging her and doing that requires that you upset her by doing things that disrupt her affair and make divorce hard.
I say this to you as a man who DIDN�T follow the advice given here and paid for it big time. I thought I knew better. I thought my situation was unique. It wasn�t. It was very typical.
Follow our advice and you stand a chance to save your marriage. Choose your own path and we can guarantee that you�ll fail. Take it from someone who was in your shoes and thought he knew better.
She told me it's mostly due to my sexual problems. I've never been able to last that long in bed. A few years ago we began introducing vibrators and such into our sex, so that she would be satisfied. I new at times, she was disappointed when I would ejaculate quickly, but I never realized how much it was hurting her until about 2 months ago, when we talked about it. She began crying as she told me about how it made her feel. At that moment, I woke up and decided to seek medical advice.
She said it is too little too late. That it went on for so long, and she tried for so long, that now the hurt is too deep for her. And that it was selfish that it took me so long to take action seeking out help.
Help, are you ready to get to work saving your marriage? We are here and ready to help you get to work!
p.s. And I would not pay any mind to her fogbabble. All that you posted is nothing more than the crazy babble of a wayward wife who is high on an affair and is looking for justification.
It is no more meaningful than the ramblings of a falling down drunk.
So, instead of focusing on meaningless fogbabble, I would try and stay focused on your plan to save your marriage. Are you interested?
I can second the fogbabble, because seriously just insert issue du jour for yours and they all sound the same.
She said it is too little too late. That it went on for so long, and she tried for so long, that now the hurt is too deep for her. And that it was selfish that it took me so long to take action seeking out help.
It could have been worse and she still had other choices than to cheat. Thus, it was her CHOICE to have an affair. Which makes her 100% responsible for her destructive behaviour.
It is hard, I know from personal experience, but do not listen anything she says right know. BSs are somehow very receptive to unfair justifications WSs gives and are very easily allured to believe that their affair is somehow our fault. It absolutelly isn't. I mean, it really is stupid to choose an affair for solving problems in marriage, isn't it?
I'm just not sure it's worth the effort now. She's completely adamant about ending it. We don't even look at each other, talk, nothing. I'm just so angry right now, it's making me sick. I don't think I'd be able to get past this, even if she suddenly had a change of heart and wanted things back.
We have 2 beautiful children, 7 year old boy and a 5 year old girl.
Well if nothing else then these two are counting on you to make WISE decisions. And I think it would be very wise to take advice from people who have been in your situation. Do not rely on your emotions, specially on this raw situation.
You can have your marriage back and your kids' collapsed world restored but you have to follow the plan presented here.
We have been right until now, haven't we? So, please trust us a little bit more.
HMSI, you are not sure it's worth the effort now for one reason.
YOU DID NOT LISTEN to the vets here. You have to either decide YES and saving this marriage or..NO and ending it.
IF you choose YES...
For those BS's living with, or are past victims of, WS's and especially with serial cheaters ...pay special attention to what I am about to write.
Listen to the vets here, do what they tell you to do, when they say to do it!
They know what they are talking about. If after giving it all you have, your marriage does not survive, stay here to recover yourself! There is much valuable information here for you!
Remember, you have the RIGHT TO SAY NO to staying with your WS. If it is a 'serial cheater' don't stop, just run, that's just my advice, not MB advice.
When they say EXPOSE � Expose! Far and wide, leave no one standing without knowing what is going on! They frequent the local convenience store for coffee every morning?? Expose there too, believe me, I used to be one of those clerks years ago, I would have watched your back! Blow the tops off their affairs!
When they say go NC with your WS, DO IT!!!You will heal faster, stress less, and have a clear head for the next battle coming. Get an IM.
THE WS IS NOT YOUR FRIEND!!!
TRUTH for the children! I can not stress enough, tell your kids the TRUTH about what is going on with your marriage! Don't fall into the trap I put myself in!!!
Do NOT Isolate yourself! Find some good friends that have your back, find support groups, find whatever you can to keep from being isolated! After I had to stop working, my friends all dwindled away, most of them refused to come visit because he made them feel so very welcome. The depression of mine I'm sure did not help. The last friend I had locally, moved away from the area yesterday. I have tons of online friends however.
LISTEN TO THE VETS! They have seen it, been there, done it, they KNOW.
When your life gets calm, don't get complacent and comfortable! The other shoe WILL drop. Jump in first and drop it on them!!! I have had the shoe, the other shoe, the BOMB all dropped on me. (Yes, I'm a slow learner it seems). While standing on the tracks whistling Dixie after putting the pieces of me back together again, I got slammed between two speeding freight trains. I stood up yet again, but I can hear the bombers heading to Pearl Harbor making a detour my way. I could be mistaken and that sound might just be the Karma bus aiming for him. I can always hope right? (A friend told me I needed to work on my description of pain...how am I doing?)
I came back to MB in March, after my stbwxh told me he was filing papers for the divorce. I knew it was coming, but hearing it? I was filled with an intense anger at that moment, and needed to discover where I went wrong that lead me to that day in my life. I have learned a lot over these months, and for that I am grateful. I highly doubt I will ever have a chance to put what I'm learning to use in another marriage, but it's helpful in many other ways.
I first found MB in 2002 and HAD I stayed then to work on ME, I would not be typing this tonight, facing the choices I have at this time in my life, all of which suck royally. Yet, I'm happier today than I have been in most of my life and looking forward to tomorrow!
HMSI, I've skimmed back over this thread. You really need to listen and do what the vets are saying. You have got to expose this affair, and to do that, you need to know some information.
Which you will have to SNOOP for. Asking your WW is not going to give you the truth!
Are you ready to save this? Your kids need you to give it your best shot.
My wife and I had a HUGE blowout today. I was yelling my thoughts, feelings, and concerns. She broke down crying and actually telling me how she REALLY felt about our marriage and relationship. We definitely got a lot of things out in the open. It seemed like the first time since our problems started, that walls actually broke down and true emotion started pouring out from her. It felt like a first real step toward some sort of closure.
My wife and I had a HUGE blowout today. I was yelling my thoughts, feelings, and concerns. She broke down crying and actually telling me how she REALLY felt about our marriage and relationship. We definitely got a lot of things out in the open. It seemed like the first time since our problems started, that walls actually broke down and true emotion started pouring out from her. It felt like a first real step toward some sort of closure.
This is only meaningful if she agrees to end her affair. "Closure" of what exactly? Her adultery?
Keep in mind that your wife is about as fogged out as a falling down drunk right now because she is high on an affair. Her "true feelings" are fogbabble, justifications and excuses. I am sure it was all about how horrible you are and how you are to blame for her adultery, and blah, blah, blah, blah, right? Just like a crack head or a falling down drunk who blames all their bad behavior on others, an adulterer blames her bad behavior on others.
But............there is no excuse for adultery.
And this is all meaningless unless she agreed to end her affair. Did she?
She said it was a one time event, and it hasn't happened since. She didn't blame anything on me. I've had some sexual issues for years, that I never realized were affecting her in such a deep way.
When we had finally really talked about the sexual issues a few months ago, it really snapped a switch in my brain. I decided then and there, after seeing the tears in her eyes, that I was finally take the necessary steps to fixing my problem.
I also freaked out and got scared, so I became overly affection and lovey dovey at the time. She had told me many times to relax, that I wasn't being me and it was freaking her out. But, I kept doing it because I was freaked out.
We had another, calmer conversation over dinner and afterwards. We talked about a lot of issues that we both have had with our marriage over the past few years. We talked about some things we could do, things we never noticed before, when things seem to be going stale and boring. We've both felt it at times.
She said she talked to her mom today about us, and her mom mentioned marriage and/or sex counseling.
The conversation ended well, with a little chuckle from both of us. I left it at that. I didn't feel the need to keep pushing the conversation at that point. It ended naturally, and it felt refreshing.
You are being gaslighted. It was not a one time event. That is a lie. She has been involved in an affair. What she is doing now is putting you off her path so she can go further underground.
Who is the OM and is he married?
Does this mean she is ending her affair and calling off the divorce?
Have to agree on the "one time event". Gaslighting for sure. The odds are extremely high it wasn't just a one time thing.
You absolutely must expose the affair to the OM's wife. No negotiating on that.
As far as your special problem goes (Don't read if it's TMI for any other posters):
There are techniques for you to do that help that issue. Focusing on her pleasure and not yours helps. Really make it about her.
That, and whenever you feel you're getting close, pause. Stop moving and doing anything. Pull out if necessary and pause until the feeling goes away. You'll see that if you stop yourself once or twice that you'll be able to continue and enjoy the moment without worrying anymore and you'll have full control over when you decide it's time.
But this "excuse" of hers is nothing more than that: It's an excuse to find something wrong about you.
Trust me again. The most minute things from years ago that were long since forgotten are used by WW'es to torment their BH's.
I'm not trying to make excuses, but this problem of mine has been going on for years. And, since I was always worrying about it, the passion really was missing from our love making. I just wasn't "into" it as much as I should have been, because all I did was worry if I'd be able to satisfy her.
Helpmesaveit, I believe you about this problem. But you have a much more pressing problem. It is her affair. And you are going to lose your marriage if you don't address this affair. Focusing on your past marital problems is like focusing on the peeling paint in the girls bathroom on the sinking TITANIC.
Your ship is sinking and you are wringing your hands about the price of tea in China. That is cute and all, but you need to wake up and STOP the ship from sinking or you won't have a ship.
Now, is the OM married and has your wife agreed to end her affair. Is she willing to work on the marriage?
I'm not trying to make excuses, but this problem of mine has been going on for years.
To be very blunt...
...Your "sexual problem" doesn't sound like a problem that can be solved with masturbation to ejaculation about two hours before the event, and perhaps 1/2 pill of 25mg Viagra an hour before the event. Yes, BT,DT. Guys usually take a bit longer the second time around, and the Viagra will help take your mind off the worry that you might not be able to "get it up" when ready.
I agree with the other poster though. WW's tend to hold a "file of transgressions" against their poor BH that goes back years, and they will tend to use it as a means of deflection. "Oh, I wouldn't have had to go to OM if my BH didn't have sexual issues. It's his fault I had to look elsewhere!".
Well, I hate to say it, but it's over. She said she is done and is moving out. She said there's no love left in her for me, but she'll always love me as a friend. She is completely cold and emotion-less. She also said there's nothing left for counseling. She's happy and is having fun now, which she said she hasn't been for the past 5 years. She's also been neglecting the kids for the past month or so.
I'm going to start calling lawyers today.
Well, I hate to say it, but it's over. She said she is done and is moving out. She said there's no love left in her for me, but she'll always love me as a friend. She is completely cold and emotion-less. She also said there's nothing left for counseling. She's happy and is having fun now, which she said she hasn't been for the past 5 years. She's also been neglecting the kids for the past month or so.
I'm going to start calling lawyers today.
Did you want to try and save your marriage? Help, you continually get sidetracked by her agenda. You can make it if you will focus on the plan I gave you. There are no guarantees but there is a strong chance you can save this if you will follow a PLAN and stop getting sidetracked by your wifes fogbabble.
Are you ready to get to work?
Too many people give up way too soon. Help, listen to Mel; it is still possible to save this marriage if you follow a plan. In the process, even if the marriage doesn't recover....you can recover personally and knowing that you tried your best.
It just doesn't seem worth it. People now know that she has been seeing another guy and no one seems to care. I told her last night when she got home from work that I was going out, and she just replied "ok". Later in the night, she started posting things on her Facebook profile that seemed very passive aggressive and angry. Then, this morning, she just seemed very angry and slammed the door pretty hard on the way out. She says she's fallen out of love with me, she's told her friends the same and that she's made up her mind that it's over.
If you do one thing today, put a HIDDEN GPS on your wife's vehicle.
*** LINK *** to GPS thread
It just doesn't seem worth it. People now know that she has been seeing another guy and no one seems to care. I told her last night when she got home from work that I was going out, and she just replied "ok". Later in the night, she started posting things on her Facebook profile that seemed very passive aggressive and angry. Then, this morning, she just seemed very angry and slammed the door pretty hard on the way out. She says she's fallen out of love with me, she's told her friends the same and that she's made up her mind that it's over.
Let us know if you have any interest in saving your marriage. We will be here.
We talked again last night for a bit, and she told me a few other issues that always bothered her about our relationship. We spoke about counseling, and she said she would think about it.
HelpMeSaveIt - I just wanted to chime in about counseling, because you'll get a variety of opinions on that topic. If she's not willing to take any active steps as a part or result of counseling, it's doomed to failure regardless how good the counselor is. Also, what's your desired outcome of the counseling? What's hers? Ask yourself those questions. My WW and I went to weekly sessions for about three months and it was useful to get things out on the table and have a 'safe' place to discuss our relationship. I found that part really useful and theraputic for me. However, where I got frustrated was that she wasn't willing to take any ACTIVE steps to work on the relationship. I kept trying it from different angles and it didn't work. Well, I found out over time that it appears the OM was still in the picture. This was pretty much confirmed after she moved out via logger. So, here I am, she's been gone about a month and I'm about to go into plan B.
Do yourself a favor, ask yourself what you want to achieve in counseling.
We talked again last night for a bit, and she told me a few other issues that always bothered her about our relationship. We spoke about counseling, and she said she would think about it.
Hopefully she says no to counseling because it would be a waste of time and will probably be destructive to your marriage. Marriage counselors don't have the slightest idea how to save marriages and even less understanding of the dynamics of adultery. They cause more harm than good and are often little more than divorce faciliators. They actually have a higher divorce rate than the general population and are destructive to marriages.
This is going nowhere unless you take active steps to break up the affair, Help.
I understand what the next step is supposed to be. Most of the family is aware of her new relationship with this other guy, but no one seems to really care about it. She seems genuinely happier now than she's been in a long time. She hasn't been home much to see the kids. She was out all weekend and came home around 10 last night. Saw the kids for about 10 minutes, was super nice to them. Kissed them goodnight, told them she loved them, and went to bed. She truly does seem happier now, so I don't know what I should do. We aren't talking at all. That's because I'm basically ignoring her. If I were to talk to her, she would talk back like everything is fine.
HMSI, there are so many parallels in your story and mine that I just had to pipe up.
Some of the posters who've been advising you through your thread are the best this board has to offer. They not only know Dr. Harley's principles inside and out, but they've also "been there, done that, and got the t-shirt!"
My reason for posting to you is to inform you that, like me, you have let your wife turn everything around on you and made you feel like everything is your fault. My WW did exactly the same thing, and said many of the same things yours has.
Here's the key to your recovery: DON'T BELIEVE A WORD OF IT! Wayward spouses have a way of magnifying every little flaw or perceived slight in such a way -- because it allows them to justify their abhorrent behavior.
The advice I was given was this: I may have had a 50% responsibility in the problems in my marriage, but my WW holds 100% responsibility in having an affair!
It's now your choice whether you want to recover your marriage or not. No one will blame you if you don't. If you do, the folks here at MB will give you the best advice -- based on 40 years of clinical experience -- you can find. If you do not, then it is still important that YOU recover. Do you understand me?
No matter which way this goes, if you do not recover yourself, you will be scarred and crippled for the rest of your life. And your kids deserve better than that!
Well, I just got the D bomb this morning. She said she's just too bitter about things and it's over. I might think things can be fixed, but they can't.
Well, I just got the D bomb this morning. She said she's just too bitter about things and it's over. I might think things can be fixed, but they can't.
Help, when are you actually going to
do something to save your marriage?
What can I do? Everyone knows about the other man, and no one seems to care.
What can I do? Everyone knows about the other man, and no one seems to care.
Thats nice that your wife has a new "relationship." How cute and winsome.
Now, do you want to do anything to save your marriage? ARe you willing to do ANYTHING? Let us know when *YOU* get serious.
Helpmesaveit, I am reposting what you need to do in case you ever get serious about saving your marriage.
I know his name and got his facebook friends. Now what?
Is he married? Where did she meet him?
What I would do is plan a massive exposure. Affairs thrive on secrecy so exposure is ruinous. Exposure should be done all on the same in order to get the most impact.. The more people who know about the affair, the more opportunity for some one to get through to her.
Make up a list of exposure targets and calmly start calling and emailing them. Ask them all to use their influence to persuade them to end the affair. You should also send out private messages to the OM's Facebook friends and ask for their help. (we have a sample letter) if this is a workplace affair, then human resources should be notified.
Here are good exposure targets:
1. Her parents, your parents, the OMs parents
2. Close friends and siblings
3. The OM's wife
4. Your children
5 OMs Facebook friends
6 the workplace
She hasn't been home much to see the kids. She was out all weekend and came home around 10 last night.
We aren't talking at all. That's because I'm basically ignoring her.
What kind of husband does NOTHING while his wife cats around all weekend like an alley cat in heat pursuing her adulterous affair? A husband who does not care! Thats who!
Your complacence clearly conveys the attitude of someone WHO DOES NOT CARE. If you don't care, could you at least be bothered to lift a finger for the sake of your kids? They have NO ONE standing up for their family and defending their interests. NO ONE. Their mother is in an addictive affair and has lost her mind. And what does their father do?
NOTHING. Would it be too much trouble to ask you to do get up and do something, Sir? Your kids have NO ONE defending their interests right now.
Well, it happened. Everyone knows about it now. She's freaking out about all the things that I've done to justify what she's done. Trying to make me out to be the horrible one who caused her to do this.
Well, it happened. Everyone knows about it now. She's freaking out about all the things that I've done to justify what she's done. Trying to make me out to be the horrible one who caused her to do this.
Who did you tell?
Family and friends. She is just saying "Oh well, busted. At least it's all out in the open now. We have been over for years, we just didn't realize it." She then began to delete a bunch of what were her close friends from Facebook, and starting to talk trash about them. To be honest, it does feel like this is truly what she wants, but just didn't know how to go about ending our marriage to be with this guy. Instead, she just used the "I don't have feelings for you anymore, and I'm so sorry about that" line to justify being with this other guy. She is a completely different person than the person I've known and loved for the past 13 years. All she does is bring up bad things about our marriage, and how she knows I wasn't happy too.
Her family completely backs her on this decision. They say that she should do whatever makes her happy, everything else will work out in the end.
One important point I haven't mentioned is that she did this about 6 months after we got married in 2001. We didn't have kids yet, so she just took off to Florida for about a year and a half. Then, one day she showed up at my doorstep apologizing for what she had done. She was 3 months pregnant with an old boyfriend's kid. It took me a while to accept that, but eventually, when the boy was about 6 months old, I was able to accept it. From that point on, everything seemed great and I've been raising that boy like he's mine.
To be honest, it does feel like this is truly what she wants, but just didn't know how to go about ending our marriage to be with this guy. Instead, she just used the "I don't have feelings for you anymore, and I'm so sorry about that" line to justify being with this other guy. She is a completely different person than the person I've known and loved for the past 13 years. All she does is bring up bad things about our marriage, and how she knows I wasn't happy too.
Were you interested in saving your marriage? Or are you just going right to divorce? Let me know when you are interested, otherwise I won't waste my time trying to help you save your marriage. I don't see any interest here. And that is ok. It is your right to just give up. You are not required to try and save your marriage.
Yes, I would love to save my marriage. There's nothing I want more. It's just that her heart is not into it anymore, so what can I do about that. If she doesn't love me anymore and isn't happy, and hasn't been happy for years, what am I to do about that? I have feelings for her that she no longer has for me.
Yes, I would love to save my marriage. There's nothing I want more. It's just that her heart is not into it anymore, so what can I do about that. If she doesn't love me anymore and isn't happy, and hasn't been happy for years, what am I to do about that? I have feelings for her that she no longer has for me.
We understand that she is not in love with you and has no feelings for you. WE ALREADY KNOW THIS. That is because of her affair. EVERY WAYWARD is not in love anymore and has no feelings for their spouse. We know this.
Now, look around you at all the recovered marriages on this forum. Their wayward spouses said the same things. They saved their marriages.
So why don't you want to save your marriage?
I want to save it. There's nothing else in this world, besides my kids, that I want more. Everyone knows about the affair now, and no one seems to care. Her family backs her, it doesn't matter to her what my family thinks.
Not only am I up against this affair, but I'm also up against past issues that she keeps bringing up. Horrible sex, money issues, trust issues, lying about stupid little things, not showing her how much I appreciated her, taking her love for granted. The list just keeps going in her mind. And now, she's surrounded herself with a group of friends, including her sister who is 12 years younger than her and has already been through a marriage and several bad relationships, who completely accept what she's doing and seem to be encouraging it. Those that have been her real, true friends for years, she's completely shut them out of her life.
Not only am I up against this affair, but I'm also up against past issues that she keeps bringing up. Horrible sex, money issues, trust issues, lying about stupid little things, not showing her how much I appreciated her, taking her love for granted. The list just keeps going in her mind
This is just the norm, they ALL do this. The first thing you have to do is STOP listening to this fogbabble. Your wife has the mentality of a falling down drunk. Just as with a falling down drunk, your wife is trying very hard to blame her affair on YOU. In order to blame YOU for her affair, she needs to MANUFACTURE GRIEVANCES to justify her affair. Do you see the game?
Every adulterer rewrites history so they can blame their spouse for their affair. This is the standard routine we see here every day.
As far as her family knowing, WHO told them and WHAT were they told?
WHO is the OM?? And have you exposed to his family? What about your children? Have your children been told of the affair?
Those that have been her real, true friends for years, she's completely shut them out of her life.
Has the affair been exposed to them BY YOU? Did you tell them and WHAT did you tell them? I need to know EXACTLY what you have said to EVERYONE about her affair.
I've told her "true friends" about it. Where she met him, where he lives, etc. She has told her family about it. I'm not telling the kids, I've just told them that mommy and daddy can't be together right now.
I've told her "true friends" about it. Where she met him, where he lives, etc. She has told her family about it. I'm not telling the kids, I've just told them that mommy and daddy can't be together right now.
The reason her family is likely supporting her is that she has been allowed to lie and spin the story. "Hubby and I have decided to divorce because I am so unhappy and by the way, I have met someone new!!"
How old are your kids? If they over age 4, they can understand the concept of adultery and should not be lied to. Lying to them to help whitewash her adultery is to enable her affair. It helps no one and only causes your kids to be confused. You are teaching them that when married adults have "problems" they get divorced. That is not the kind of lesson you want to send to kids.
Do you know the OM's parents? Who is this guy? Can you find him on facebook? Is he single? What does he do?
He is in the process of getting divorced from a woman who left him. He's an auto mechanic and also a singer in a band. She met him about 3 months ago at a concert she went to with some friends. She actually told me to call him and asked if I wanted to meet him after I exposed it.
He is in the process of getting divorced from a woman who left him. He's an auto mechanic and also a singer in a band. She met him about 3 months ago at a concert she went to with some friends. She actually told me to call him and asked if I wanted to meet him after I exposed it.
"Process of gettting divorced" means MARRIED. Does he have a facebook page? Do you know where he lives? Do you have his home phone #? I would get all this information and call his house but disguise your # using *67 and see if a woman answers. Do this when your wife is out with him. If a woman answers, ask if it is OM's wife and if so, tell her all about the affair.
Help, I can give you a strategy for exposure if you want it, but I am not going to waste my time if you aren't going to use it or do this right.
Are you willing to do a nuclear exposure? That is the only hope I see for your marriage.
I know where he lives, and she has been staying at his house. His wife is not living there.
ok, let me know if you want to save this, otherwise, I won't waste my breath.
What do you suggest I do next? Everyone knows she's now with this guy. She's already going through the steps to get a divorce final.
I left Thursday. I had the kids for the weekend while she was "away".
I left Thursday. I had the kids for the weekend while she was "away".
1. go home and move right back into your own bed. Stop abandoning your family
2. expose the affair wide and far. Stop telling me that "people know" and sit down and make up a list of her family members and close friends. CALL THEM ALL. Tell them about her adultery and tell them you are trying to save your marriage. ASK THEM TO USE THEIR INFLUENCE TO PERSUADE YOUR WIFE TO END HER AFFAIR.
3. ON THE SAME DAY go to the OM's facebook page and copy all of his facebook friends into a WORD doc. Prioritize them with the most important people at the top and work down, STARTING WITH HIS PARENTS. Send them a private message via facebook. [we have a template] space the PM's 60 minutes apart so you don't get shut down for flooding
4. sit down any kids over the age of 4 and tell them about their mothers affair. Encourage them to discuss it with their mother.
5. tell your wife you will not cooperate with any divorce schemes and if she files, you will countersue on grounds of adultery and have the OM hauled into court. Tell her you will be going for full possession of the house and primary custody because she is an unfit parent.
6. visit the OM face to face and tell this loser that you will fight for your marriage. Tell him there is no future for him because he will be eternally hated by your children for breaking up their family
Can you do all this?
I know where he lives, and she has been staying at his house. His wife is not living there.
FIND the OM's wife and call her. Tell her about the affair and ask her to assist you in saving your marriage. It is very likely their marriage has been busted up by his affair with your wife.
I don't think that I could do all these things. As sad as I am about this, I want her to come back to me because she wants to and is in love with me. Not because I've done all those things.
I don't want to get caught up in court battles, and lots of family members hating me.
I don't think that I could do all these things. As sad as I am about this, I want her to come back to me because she wants to and is in love with me. Not because I've done all those things.
The above things are designed to get her back. Those are the methods we use here to save our marriages. Exposure is your best weapon against the affair. I had a feeling you wouldn't be willing to be do anything. But thats ok, it is your marriage to lose.
I will leave you with Dr. Harley's words about what it takes to save a marriage:
"Exposure is very likely to end the affair, lifting the fog that has overcome the unfaithful spouse, helping him or her become truly repentant and willing to put energy and effort into a full marital recovery. In my experience with thousands of couples who struggle with the fallout of infidelity, exposure has been the single most important first step toward recovery. It not only helps end the affair, but it also provides support to the betrayed spouse, giving him or her stamina to hold out for ultimate recovery."
Well, how many have gone through this process, and what is the success rate? How many have ended up worse than before? Before she even met this guy, since I know exactly when and where she met him, she was saying that things were basically over.
And, now she knows everything I've been doing (checking internet history, phone bill, etc) to find stuff out. Now, she's calling me a "psycho stalker" and telling me that this stuff is illegal and invasion of privacy.
Let me put it this way, almost every one of us in recovered marriages did so by exposing the affair. I have never known of ONE that ended up "worse than before" because how can you end up "worse than before" when you are headed to divorce?
Before she even met this guy, since I know exactly when and where she met him, she was saying that things were basically over.
No, you don't know when and where. You only know what lies she has told you. And it doesn't matter that she says things are "basically over," it makes no difference. Most do say that.
As it is now you are headed to divorce. You have nothing to lose and everything to GAIN.
HelpmeSavIT
Your W is right on track with the Wayward speak. You would be well advised to follow the plan that Melody has laid out for you. This in not a guarantee but, gives you the best chance of saving your marriage if you want.
Of course she is going to call you names because she does not want this to be exposed. If you expose without evidence then she can say you have lost your mind. However with EVIDENCE you can prove what you say. Of course they don't want any fuss.
So as Melody Lane says it is your marriage to loose. However this plan give you your BEST chance. If you want it to be easy and expect her to come back all lovey dovey if you follow her instructions and enable her affair your chances of recovery are greatly reduced. Good Luck
Help, I will tell you something else about MB. Even if your marriage doesn't survive your WW's A, YOU WILL SURVIVE AND THRIVE by using these principles. What you need to do is listen to ML and DO WHATEVER YOU CAN TO SAVE YOUR MARRIAGE AND YOUR SELF RESPECT.
Don't worry about what other people think about what you are doing. Everything that ML is suggesting to you is the RIGHT thing to do.
It IS hard work, and you are going to have to do this for the long haul.
As long as OM is in the picture, your WW won't want to come home to you. BUST UP THIS AFFAIR AND GO AT EM WITH GUNS BLAZING. Man up and fight this affair. Do what's right.
Well, she started blowing her top yesterday. The affair has been exposed to everyone. She began deleting most of her friends from Facebook, changed her name back to her maiden name. She told me to "rot in hell!" She also said not to come to the house unless I call first, and she is there. If not, she will have the locks changed. She said she already has divorce papers, and I just need to sign them. She hates me know and can't stand the thought of me, she's happy I left because the air is much thinner now. Even her sister, whom she is very close with, said she doesn't understand what is going on with my STBXW. She said she knows how much I've always loved her and knows I would do anything for her, but feels there's no going back at this point. Her sister told me "Now that this has happened a second time, maybe it's time to just move on, and she has and always will look up to me as her brother."
I'm honestly not sure what I want to do now. This is definitely not the woman that I was is love with for 13 years.
That sounds great! Except I would most definitely not leave your home. Why should you leave? You have done nothing wrong? If she wants someone to leave, SHE can leave. So, go home!
If she starts ranting at you, then tell her you are sure sorry she is upset, and ask her if she would like a potato chip.
Don't fight, don't cry and don't allow her to drag you into a fight.
Did you allow her to run you out of your home?
Read this thread:
Men, do not leave your home!
. The affair has been exposed to everyone.
When you say "everyone" do you mean EVERYONE? Who? Are there any others left? Because if you are not finished, I would finish up NOW. Get your money's worth out her anger.
And keep up the good work!!
And, now she knows everything I've been doing (checking internet history, phone bill, etc) to find stuff out. Now, she's calling me a "psycho stalker" and telling me that this stuff is illegal and invasion of privacy.
Do you have a keylogger on her computer? You need to have a better way of snooping on her. Some good keyloggers would be spectorpro or eblaster [this one sends you an email report so you don't have to access the computer again]. You can get it at spectorsoft.com
But, it's almost like this isn't an affair anymore. She's decided she wants a divorce, says she has the papers, and has moved on to a new relationship. Why should I stay to fight a losing battle? It just makes me sick to my stomach being there.
But, it's almost like this isn't an affair anymore. She's decided she wants a divorce, says she has the papers, and has moved on to a new relationship. Why should I stay to fight a losing battle? It just makes me sick to my stomach being there.
Are you French? Because I have never seen someone who wanted to surrender so badly. If you don't want to fight for your marriage, that is fine. Just give up and don't waste our time.
But, if you want to save your marriage like we have, you are going to have to man up and fight for your marriage. you have to do some work here and stop running every time you run into some conflict. You are at WAR, Sir, and unless you want to fight, you are going to lose.
The problem is the affair and if you want to save your marriage, you are going to have to stop rushing to surrender to the OM and MAN UP. We did not save our marriages by running from the first sign of conflict and you won't either.
If you want your marriage, then get your [censored] back home, Sir. Stop being a wimp. Your wife needs someone to fight for the marriage. Your children need their father so now is the worst time for you to abandon them.
Help,
You remind me of my FBH. Twelve years ago he surrendered to my OM and the evil cr@p I pulled without a fight. To this day we BOTH regret our actions. I've been in a miserable affairage for ten years. He has never remarried and barely dated. We've both had to file bankruptcy. Our two kids have been shuttled back and forth between our houses. Son is depressed. Daughter has an eating disorder. It is all my fault but FBH could have saved us ALL. Will you do this FOR yourself, your wife, and your kids? It would be completely understandable if you are unwilling. You do have POWER in this situation that you don't seem to comprehend.
Help,
You remind me of my FBH. Twelve years ago he surrendered to my OM and the evil cr@p I pulled without a fight. To this day we BOTH regret our actions. I've been in a miserable affairage for ten years. He has never remarried and barely dated. We've both had to file bankruptcy. Our two kids have been shuttled back and forth between our houses. Son is depressed. Daughter has an eating disorder. It is all my fault but FBH could have saved us ALL. Will you do this FOR yourself, your wife, and your kids? It would be completely understandable if you are unwilling. You do have POWER in this situation that you don't seem to comprehend.
And what do you think you would've done if he stayed? You're still with the man you had the affair with. When my wife does speak rationally, she does bring up a lot of valid points about why our relationship has fallen apart. She knows it doesn't justify her going and finding someone else. But, it does bring up a good point about the low level that our marriage is at and why her feelings for me have changed.
Her feelings WON'T change while she is still involved with the man who was meeting her most important EN's better than you were.
You need to get him out of the picture, let her mind clear, show her that YOU can be that man. And not let her make major life decisions that affect your entire family based on her FEELINGS which will CHANGE!
And you need to STOP listening to her. She has an agenda. Everything she says to you is flavored with that agenda -- to get divorced and run off with OM.
You might actually agree with some of her justifications. But that doesn't mean that you jump onboard with her plan to tear apart your marriage and family.
Geez...do you really want help to save your marriage??
So what do I do? Tell her to stop it with the other guy? So she can sit home with me, when she says she's been miserable and unhappy for a very long time?
I do want to save my marriage, but she's already decided that it's not what she wants. So, how do I force her to stay in it when she doesn't want it?
Her feelings WON'T change while she is still involved with the man who was meeting her most important EN's better than you were.
You need to get him out of the picture, let her mind clear show her that YOU can be that man. And not let her make major life decisions that affect your entire family based on her FEELINGS which will CHANGE!
And you need to STOP listening to her. She has an agenda. Everything she says to you is flavored with that agenda -- to get divorced and run off with OM.
You might actually agree with some of her justifications. But that doesn't mean that you jump onboard with her plan to tear apart your marriage and family.
Yep.
Oh geez HMSI -- do you believe everything she says?
Have you read ANY other threads here about how COMMON she is?
She's not saying anything special. All waywards think they aren't "in-love" with their spouse anymore.
Yes. You tell her to stop her affair. And you tell everyone you know to tell her to stop her affair. And you tell OM to stay away. And you tell everyone OM knows to tell him to stay away from HMSI's wife.
And you SHOW her that you can be the guy. The one she CHOSE to marry. The one she's chosen to be married to all these year.
The one she fell in love with. Be that guy.
Are you really going to just let her fall into that cesspool of lies and deceit? Are you just going to give up? Doesn't sound like you *really* love her all that much....
And what do you think you would've done if he stayed? You're still with the man you had the affair with. When my wife does speak rationally, she does bring up a lot of valid points about why our relationship has fallen apart. She knows it doesn't justify her going and finding someone else. But, it does bring up a good point about the low level that our marriage is at and why her feelings for me have changed.
Yes, we already knew your marriage was rocky, you are not telling us anything new. The solution is to run off the OM so you can turn your marriage around. But you won't be able to do that if you refuse to stop surrendering your marriage and your children to the OM.
Do you think you could put down that white flag long enough to try and save this?
So what do I do? Tell her to stop it with the other guy? So she can sit home with me, when she says she's been miserable and unhappy for a very long time?
I do want to save my marriage, but she's already decided that it's not what she wants. So, how do I force her to stay in it when she doesn't want it?
You expose the affair and run off the OM, that is how. You raise holy unmitigated hell in the affair. Run him off and then you will have a chance.
Stop being a wimp and MAN UP.
All my close friends keep telling me to just let it go. This is the second time she's done this. I deserve better than her. She did it before, she's doing it now, so what makes you think she won't do it again in the future.
hey....YOU came HERE looking for help saving your marriage.
if you just want to convince us that you should give up -- hey, go RIGHT AHEAD.
This is a proven system that turns around marriages affected by infidelity. Use it. Or don't. Its your call.
I know I came here. And originally, I wasn't aware of the infidelity. I thought we were just having problems and she wasn't sure how she felt about us anymore. It's obviously well beyond that now. She says she wasn't happy, is sorry, but wound up going elsewhere for that happiness, and that our marriage is over and wants a divorce. Yes, it's not over for me, because my feelings for her haven't changed, except that I'm angry that she's done this.
Help, you are wasting so much time here. Instead of making plans to save your marriage, you are wringing your hands and making posts about fogbabble. WE don't care about any of that, nor will it help you save your marriage.
Is it possible for you to put aside your emotions and work on a plan? If you can put aside your emotions and follow a plan, there is hope. But if you can't follow a plan you are probably not going to make it.
WILL you follow a plan?
All my close friends keep telling me to just let it go. This is the second time she's done this. I deserve better than her. She did it before, she's doing it now, so what makes you think she won't do it again in the future.
Then by all means, GIVE UP. If your friends want you to give it up, then do that and stop wasting our time. We thought you wanted to save your marriage.
Help,
You remind me of my FBH. Twelve years ago he surrendered to my OM and the evil cr@p I pulled without a fight. To this day we BOTH regret our actions. I've been in a miserable affairage for ten years. He has never remarried and barely dated. We've both had to file bankruptcy. Our two kids have been shuttled back and forth between our houses. Son is depressed. Daughter has an eating disorder. It is all my fault but FBH could have saved us ALL. Will you do this FOR yourself, your wife, and your kids? It would be completely understandable if you are unwilling. You do have POWER in this situation that you don't seem to comprehend.
And your here now because your OM/WH is having an affair on you?
You had an honorable man and broke him, and damaged your two kids.
Why stay with the OM/WH now. They cheat with you they cheat on you.
How can you let you and your BH's kids live under the OM's roof?
The OM that help destroyed their family.
The OM that helped damage these kids.
When are you going to realize what posion the OM is and remove them from your families life?
When are going to make amends to them and how will you do it?
Help, you are wasting so much time here. Instead of making plans to save your marriage, you are wringing your hands and making posts about fogbabble. WE don't care about any of that, nor will it help you save your marriage.
Is it possible for you to put aside your emotions and work on a plan? If you can put aside your emotions and follow a plan, there is hope. But if you can't follow a plan you are probably not going to make it.
WILL you follow a plan?
What is the plan?
I left Thursday. I had the kids for the weekend while she was "away".
1. go home and move right back into your own bed. Stop abandoning your family
2. expose the affair wide and far. Stop telling me that "people know" and sit down and make up a list of her family members and close friends. CALL THEM ALL. Tell them about her adultery and tell them you are trying to save your marriage. ASK THEM TO USE THEIR INFLUENCE TO PERSUADE YOUR WIFE TO END HER AFFAIR.
3. ON THE SAME DAY go to the OM's facebook page and copy all of his facebook friends into a WORD doc. Prioritize them with the most important people at the top and work down, STARTING WITH HIS PARENTS. Send them a private message via facebook. [we have a template] space the PM's 60 minutes apart so you don't get shut down for flooding
4. sit down any kids over the age of 4 and tell them about their mothers affair. Encourage them to discuss it with their mother.
5. tell your wife you will not cooperate with any divorce schemes and if she files, you will countersue on grounds of adultery and have the OM hauled into court. Tell her you will be going for full possession of the house and primary custody because she is an unfit parent.
6. visit the OM face to face and tell this loser that you will fight for your marriage. Tell him there is no future for him because he will be eternally hated by your children for breaking up their family
Can you do all this?
Let me know when each and every thing on that list has been done. Then I will give you next steps. But I am not going to re-type a plan over and over that you are going to ignore.
I think I've decided to move on. She's completely consumed with this guy. She doesn't even show any interest in our kids anymore. They keep saying they want to live with me, and I'm spending a lot of time with them. Again, everyone knows what she's done, my family, her family, friends, his friends and family. No one appears to be concerned. I just get "She says she hasn't been happy, and now she is." Well, I'm tired of fighting for someone who doesn't care about me anymore. The kids want to be with me, which is all I care about at this point. Yes, I'm sad that she's decided to walk away from a 13 year commitment, but I deserve better than her at this point.
Maybe some day she'll regret what she's done, then she can live in her own misery. But, I can't live like this anymore.
So, I've been posting some things on Facebook about her and what she's done. Just quotes about infidelity, broken promises, things like that. We have a lot of mutual friends on Facebook. Now she's getting very angry, telling me "I hope you're enjoying trashing me on Facebook, I can't believe you'd do this to someone who you claimed to have love so much. Why can't you just let it go and leave me alone?"
Arrrgghhh!!!!! (Banging head on desk)
Are you trying your best to do things the wrong way?
Exposure, when done right, is NOT vindictive. You do it all at once and you don't trash your spouse. You simply tell those who may have some influence that your wife is having an affair, you love her very much and will fight for the marriage, and that you could use their help in influencing her to end the affair.
That's it! You don't drag it out over days and weeks, you don't reveal sordid details and try to get people to take sides, you don't try to humiliate her.
What you have done is trashing her and vindictive. Melody told you to send personal messages to friends on facebook, NOT post it all over your wall where everyone can read it. You don't rub it in her face by repeatedly posting disparaging comments.
We can't help you if you refuse to listen. I have made numerous posts to you and you just refuse to do anything to save your marriage. I can't force you to do things.
All you have done by posting bullcrap on facebook is tick her off for absolutely no good reason. It does nothing to help your situation.
I haven't been "trashing" her. The few posts I've put up have been about marriage and commitment. I haven't put up things like "She is a b***h!" or anything like that. If anything, she has been putting worse things up on her facebook about me. Posts talking about how horrible the past has been, and how wonderful her future looks. And youtube videos of songs about people being stuck in horrible relationships and someone comes along and sweeps them out of it and treats them like a princess.
Because you refused to do anything we advised, your wife is perfectly free to present her affair in a very positive, shining light. She has been allowed - BY YOU - to gloss over her filthy affair by telling people "helpmesaveit and I have decided to move on and end our marriage. We have been miserable for years so it is the best thing. In the meantime I have a man I luuuuurve. He is my soulmate." squeak!
Now when you object you just look bitter and "can't move on."
THIS IS WHAT HAPPENS WHEN YOU ALLOW THE WW TO CONTROL THE STORY.
If you had taken the advice here and exposed the affair like we said, you may have killed the affair by now with the help of social pressure. At the very least, your cheating wife would not be so flagrantly flaunting her affair in your face.
We tried and tried to help you but you took NONE of our advice.
I have a feeling my wife may be having thoughts of reconciling things. She was emailing and texting me throughout the weekend asking why I had to get so many people involved when the problems started. She is saying she feels that too many people are involved now and know what happened, so we probably couldn't reconcile, even if we wanted to. She asked if I wanted to go with her to our son's hockey game Tuesday night.
The few close friends I've spoken to about things said that I'd be and idiot if I took her back. My parents have said she's never welcome in their home ever again, no matter what.
What am I to do if she is feeling regretful and wants to try to fix things?