Hi Everyone,

I am new to the forum, but have been reading and trying to do MB for about 2 years now.

My husband and I have been married for 3.5 years, together for 5. This is my first marriage, his 2nd. No children from his first marriage,or our marriage.

My "issue" I guess, is a total lack of intimacy in our relationship. In the beginning of our relationship and marriage we were pretty hot and heavy, it was, in my opinion, very fulfilling. We have now not been intimate for 2 years, and I feel like it's destroying me. I have addressed it over and over with my husband and tried to explain to him that this is a true EN for me, and while I do appreciate the other things he does for me and us, they are not making me feel loved.

He is good at the little things, buying me things at the grocery store he knows I like but won't splurge on myself, warms up my car when it's cold out and the like, but it's just not doing it for me. I need affection and romance, and SF, of which I am getting none.

I feel that I am meeting his needs, but he is not really trying to meet mine. His needs center more domestic support. I know for him things like not helping with laundry, or leaving dishes in the sink, and things like that are love busters, so I do my very best to not do those things. I actually do most of our dishes by hand now because he doesn't like them to sit in the dishwasher, I do laundry, I try to grocery shop more efficiently so he doesn't have to go to the store, and so on. I know that he appreciates these things, and I know they make him feel loved.

He also has a need for recreational companionship, although he seems to forget that it's a need for him. Often, if we go out and do something together, even just going to to mall for something we need, and getting some coffee on the way home, he will tell me later that "today was nice". So again, I know this is a need for him, and I know, when he lets me, I am meeting that need.

I'm not sure what is preventing him from meeting my needs. We have talked about it so many times I can't even count them anymore. Every time we talk he tells me he is trying to meet my needs, and he doesn't understand why I don't believe that he loves me. I repeatedly tell him it's not that I "think" he doesn't love me. I know he loves me, but, I don't need to "think it" I need to be able to feel it, and words frankly don't make me feel much at this point. One of the issues I believe, is he doesn't understand how something that is a need for him and makes him feel loved when it's met, can do absolutely nothing for me. He will cleaning the house while I'm at work, go grocery shopping, etc, and think that that should make me feel loved. In reality at this point all it does is make me sad, because he can put so much effort in to the house and what he "thinks" will make me feel good, instead of doing what I tell him I actually need.

Before all the questions are asked... No he is not having an affair. I have access to his phone, phone records, email, computers do not have passwords. I do have some concerns about pornography, although he assures me I'm wrong (which honestly I interpret as a bit of gas lighting on his part). I also have some concern about his testosterone levels, but he will not take any action to have physical issues checked. He claims to me that he will and then just never does...He has also been depressed off and on for the last 2 years. He was on prozac for a while, which I know can cause issues with SD, but, it has been quite a while since he was on it. I would very much like for him to go back to the doctor and get back on some type of AD, as I do still feel he is depressed and think that may also be causing issues with his desire.

I guess I'm just wondering, given he is depressed, and not having an affair, how to effectively address what the lack of intimacy is doing to me? I've tried expressing to him that he is my one and only, I waited a long time to find the man I was going to be with physically and I think that makes is more important to me than many people. I understand that we may have different drives, and that's fine, I can handle intimacy being a little less frequent that I would actually like, but I can't take a total lack...It makes me feel so unloved and undervalued. I didn't get married to live with someone, I got married to have a partner to share every aspect of my life with including intimate relations.

Any thoughts?

Welcome to MB.

What does your husband say when you ask him why he does not have sex with you?

He says that he wants to. I then ask well then why don't we? He says that he is just stressed out over his job all the time, and he doesn't really want to do anything.

He Hates his job with a capital H and he is also very obsessive, so when there is something he see's as stressful, it is allllll he thinks about. I tell him almost daily that it is fine if he hates his job, I have no issue with him changing jobs, I have no issue with us moving so he can get a better job. I am willing to do just about anything he needs to fix his job issue...but...his job cannot be our life. Him hating is job can't control what goes on in our home 24/7.

I have also tried to remind him that the things I am asking him to do to meet my needs, he actually likes too. I know that he likes sex. I know that he likes when he go out and do things together, and I know when we do those things he actually feels better about life in general for a while, but it's like all he can see is he's unhappy about x so nothing else matters, and it is so hard to get him to do the things that I know will help him AND us

Thank you for your reply. What happened in his life when the picture changed from "hot and heavy" to nothing, two years ago?

I'd rule out porn. Doesn't sound like an affair, but could well be porn. What snooping do you have in place?

Honestly? I'm not sure. Nothing has really changed in our situation except that he got depressed. I have the same job and schedule, we are in the same financial situation for the most part. We did start trying to get pregnant for a couple of months a few years back, but honestly before the intimacy disappeared totally it wasn't frequent enough to get pregnant. We only tried a couple of months. He was already unhappy with his job then, although it was a different job in the same field. I truly can't pinpoint anything that has changed except his depression and obsessive tendencies.

Indiegirl, I do think porn may have been a problem that started the lack, but I don't think he is looking at it now. I have a keylogger on our computers, it hasn't caught anything that looks like porn to me. But, I do know that he likes to watch video's on youtube, and I know that if you type in the wrong thing that can lead to porn...
Lets say it is porn, what do I do then? He and I have talked about it, although not in depth or repeatedly, and he insists that he is not looking at porn.

which, btw, I know they all insist they are not looking at porn even when they are...I'm not saying it's not possible, I just don't know what to do even if that's the real problem...

dwm,

How and why did his first marriage end?

Was there a similar issue?

Does your H lie about trivial things?

Gamma

Gamma, no it was not a similar issue. She was mentally ill and emotionally abusive. She used to threaten to divorce him, tell him he was a horrible person and that type of thing. Basically in his opinion he left her before she could leave him. She was in school and repeatedly told him that she would be leaving him when she was done with school and got a job.

um, you know, lie about trivial things? I would say sometimes, yes.

I am in no place to give advice on marriage (I am here for help also), but before I even read to the "testosterone" part of your post, I was thinking "he should have his testosterone checked....

A few years ago our intimacy just fell off. At the time our marriage was not perfect but much better than it is today. I continued to complain and he just couldn't explain it.

Finally he asked the dr (on his own, I had not even thought it could be medical) and sure enough he had VERY low levels. Now he is on it, and our sex life is the only thing that is still good in our marriage.

Just thought I would share, in case it could help.

Thanks JB, I'm very suspicious that it is a real issue for him. I know that his brother takes replacement therapy, and I know his dad had/has ED issues. That is one of the reason I suggested it to him. At the time, he was between jobs and did not have insurance, but he has now had insurance for about 3 months and still hasn't had it checked. Maybe I should gentle float that idea past him again...

dwm,

For all I know your H is a decent person however his behavior raises a red flag.

How do you know you believe about the exW? Is it something your H told you?

The thing is that it is very common for adulterers to rewrite history concerning their marriage to make themselves look like the victim.

I presume you did not get involved with your H until after his divorce was final.

Gamma

Oh no, it's all true about his ex, his whole family has talked to me about it. He didn't rewrite history at all. He takes his share of blame for issues in his first marriage, after a while he basically just gave up on it. the first few years they were married he was in the Navy and aware for 6-7 months at a time, he knows that caused a lot of damage, especially since it was when the marriage was new. But, everything he has told me about her I have heard from his family and friends, not just him, and she was truly mentally ill, I have found old pill bottles that used to contain anti-psychotic to back that up.

Yes, we were not involved until he was divorced.

He is genuinely a good guy, and I think he is trying to make me happy, he just isn't doing it in the way I need him to.
EDIT it's not that he does nothing, I mean he has texted me from work 4 times already this morning to say "kiss" which is our short hand for "I love you" when we can't really type. that does make me feel thought about, and cared for, it's really just the romance that I'm missing. Do we have other issues that come up? Sure we do, but we talk through them and decide together what to do about them.

What is suspicious for me is that he has such a resistance to doing something about this. What young man thinks it's okay not to have sex with his wife for two years, in a 3 year marriage?

You are very upset about this, and your husband is not taking that seriously. That is unacceptable. It is unacceptable for a spouse to ignore ANY complaint that is voiced.

It could be that his depression in itself is causing this problem. Your husband seems to have quite a serious case of depression, and I suggest you get the continuing depression investigated - quite apart from the lack of interest in sex. I think you said that he is already on medication, but it does not seem to be working well.

Then again, the medication itself could be the issue, so for that reason it should be checked.

It could be his testosterone, and that should be checked.

What you must not do is continue to tiptoe around this subject, "gently floating it past him" every now and again. You must not make demands or have angry outbursts, but you DO need to tell your husband clearly that you would like him to go to his doctor and have his problems with depression, medication and lack of interest in sex examined. Keep the issue on the front burner for a month, and do not give up talking about it until an appointment has been booked and kept. If possible, go with him to that.

The issues you raised in your first post, about domestic support etc, really have nothing to do with this need. Sexual fulfilment is an important intimate need in marriage, and nobody has the right to expect that they can be married and simply refuse to work on meeting this need. If your H is effectively ill or disabled, then that's different, but until and unless a doctor says that this the case, your H should wish to have sex with his wife. If he really doesn't, for reasons of pornography or because he won't get his mental or physical issues addressed, you need to separate from him.

Do you spend at least 15 hours per week out of the house, on dates, just you and him? What do you do on your dates?

No we do not spend that much time out of the house, because it is so hard to get him out of the house to do anything.

Sunday for example, H had been saying all week that he wanted to "go for a drive" which means go somewhere walk around, get some coffee etc., which we both enjoy doing. Sunday came and he sat on the couch like a log until I asked him no less then 5 times if we were actually going to go somewhere. We eventually got in the car and drove to a mall we hadn't previously been to, and he didn't really know where it was but he had looked it up on the internet. That tells me he actually was thinking we should go for a drive, he did something about figuring out what/where, but then he couldn't get himself off the couch to do it until I pushed him.
That's what I mean when I say he forgets what makes him feel better about life. He likes to do those things, he wants to do them enough that he puts planning in to it, but unless I push, they don't happen.

Okay, but what is your response to my previous post?

Mine was very embarrassed about the issue at first, like it made him less of a man, but now he won't miss a shot at all. It gives him more energy as well. If he honestly does have a medical issue, then there could be an easy fix that the sexual part of the problem.

I honestly thought mine might be cheating because of his disinterest. He was not, and I immediately saw the difference after going on the injections.

oh sorry didn't see that one. I agree. I need to be more forceful with him taking the steps to figure out what is going on, and I agree with ignoring my complaints is unacceptable.

My concern is this, lets say the real problem is his testosterone level and depression, if I leave, what is going to happen to him? His family will NOT step up and get him help, I have already seen this first hand. They ignore the issues, they pretend that as long as he is going to work, everything is fine and he is just "different" now. I mean, I've heard his mother say as much. I have spent countless phone calls with his mom hearing "he seems fine to me!" from his dad I get "If you need anything let us know" but then they aren't there when I actually need support. and from the whole slew of them I get "he's an adult, I can't force him to do things" all of which I find to be total bs.
I guess I really do believe that his depression is a big part of the problem, and I see depression just like any physical illness. If he had cancer for the last 2 years I would think leaving him because of the lack of meeting my need for SF would be the wrong thing to do.

This too. he is very embarrassed about any physical problem. He had back surgery last year due to a herniated disc, he HATED talking about going to the doctor or the surgery. I mean, hated it to the point I had to tell him it was unacceptable for him to leave me out of the planning because it impacted me too.

Are you saying that you know that his medical issues render him unable to have sex? If so, why have you posted to this forum?

I am saying it is a concern for me, as I did in my first post. Are you saying it's not ok to ask for help in the face of medical issues? I did say in my first post that he has been depressed and I'm concerned about his testosterone level. I'm not sure why that would preclude getting some advise with trying to figure out how to get my emotional needs met. Unless I've missed it, I haven't read anywhere that MB doesn't work when illness is involved.

Just make sure that the medical side is taken care of.
The family is partly right. His IS an adult and you cannot make or force him to do anything. If he is depressed this surely makes it harder on him and you should definitely have him get treatment for that.

Still, it is his obligation to take part in his own healing and when he is able to go to work, he is also able to work on the marriage.

You made the analogy between his medical issues and cancer. I am asking you about the implications of seeing the issue in those terms.

You earlier said that your husband says that he will get help with his medical issues, and then he does not follow through. My posts to you have been trying to get you to insist on his going to the doctor and getting help. Since you have asked him repeatedly to deal with this issue and he hasn't, I suggested that you put the issue on the front burner for a limited time. The point about setting a limit on this (whether a month, or a year) is that you must do something at the end of that time, unless you are willing to continue indefinitely asking him to act. I took it from your post (and perhaps I should not have), that you did not want to go on asking and coaxing, to no effect, for another two years, or longer. I took it from that post that you wanted to force this issue, because you are desperate to get your husband to meet your needs.

If you do want to force the issue, then the only thing you can do at the end of the time is to withdraw from the situation - to call it quits. If you go on living like this, you are not forcing the issue, whereas if you leave, your husband might be woken up into seeking help, and you could reconcile with him. If he does not wake up, you could start a new life. Whatever choice you make - to reconcile when he has successfully dealt with the problem, or to leave him for good, you won't be living like this for another two years, or longer.

If you don't want to withdraw from the situation, you can either simply stop asking for the problem to be dealt with and accept your life as it is, or keep asking for it to be deal with - but as I said, I thought you'd had enough of that after two years.

However, if you see your H, who will not get this issue investigated, and who is therefore making a choice not to get help meet your needs, as analogous to the cancer sufferer who is receiving treatment and who (assuming impotency) has no choice, and who cannot meet your needs, then logically, you will act in the same way as the wife of the cancer sufferer. She will not leave her husband who is unable to meet her needs, and you will not leave yours - even though he is making a choice not to get help.

You are quite right that we do not leave our husbands with cancer, when they cannot meet our needs. We take care of them. If you see your husband as being unable to meet your needs, then take care of him. Do not leave him. Accept that he cannot meet your needs, and accept your life with its limitations, as you would if he had cancer.

You should rule it out first because if it IS porn, it's very damaging. Dr H has said men with a porn habit do ok sexually earlier on in the marriage, then health issues / age mean they dont have energy for both SF and porn. In that situation they will always choose porn because it's quick and easy.

You could address some testosterone issues, see a short term improvement only to have this issue bubble away undiscovered. DO make double, double sure. I'm glad you have a key logger, but you have smelled a rat when he talks about it and I believe your instincts are right (they always are with concerned spouses around here). Get spyware on devices and you should know what he is viewing on YouTube too.



He should know you are all over the situation, won't miss a trick and won't tolerate it and won't allow him time alone on devices.

That may mean password protecting items so he only uses things when you are there or it may mean him having a dumb phone.

MB does not work where one spouse refuses to meet the needs of the other.

The cancer sufferer with ED, or the disabled spouse, can meet the need for sexual fulfilment in other ways, if he is willing. Sexual fulfilment does not have to mean sexual intercourse, as we all know. However, for the impaired spouse, there has to be a recognition that it is his duty to meet his wife's needs in some way if he can. He needs to have a degree of goodwill if he is to explore those other avenues to fulfilment.

Your husband is incapable only to the point that as he has not had this issue thoroughly investigated by a doctor, and in fact, he is not incapable of having this investigated, but instead, he is unwilling. That means that he is, so far, refusing to meet this particular need. He does not accept, with goodwill, that you have a legitimate need that must be met in your marriage.

Now, you have a choice to make about that unwillingness. You are NOT in the same position as the wife whose husband is so impaired that he cannot meet her needs at all, and will never be able to. You are a wife who can ask for much more consideration in her marriage, and she can leave when it is not forthcoming.

You can choose to become a lifelong carer for your husband, who will not seek help for himself, if you wish, but if you make that choice, then you need to accept that this is your life.

As his parents say, he is an adult, and he IS capable of making the choice to seek help, but he will not. You can carry on as you are indefinitely, or you can force the issue. It's up to you.

But in this analogy YOU are the one who has the cancer he is refusing treatment for. He is OK. You are the person withering on the vine with neglect.

Besides I would totally leave someone who refused to get their own medical treatment. Absolutely. "I don't care about your viewpoint / impact of my health on us - I'm happy?" No way.

Men tend to loathe putting energy in non essentials (depression makes that worse!) and you must stress it is. Critical to the future of your marriage. Or he will assume he can just bypass this as a minor complaint.

It's only FAIR to give him a warning. Though you philosophically don't want to leave him, you'll end up doing so - even if you dont want to now.

That's how the love bank works.

Thanks for the thoughts everyone. I am going to bring the issue to the forefront more consistently and see if I can get him to understand the seriousness of the problem, I think you all are right that I have been to passive and not followed up consistently enough to emphasis how much distress it is causing me. I told him this morning that in the next week he needs to schedule an appointment with a Dr. he previously told me would be the one he would go see. He said that he would, I hope this time he actually accomplishes it.
Edit: Indiegirl, I don't think he is "happy" though, I actually think he is very unhappy right now, not about our marriage, but about life in general, and I think why he is being so resistant to treatment is because he is at the place where you are not desperate enough to think "I can't go on like this", but also beyond the place where he can see that everything isn't that bad. I've seen him at this place before. Last time it took him doing nothing but sleeping and working for him to realize it was time to seek treatment despite my constant urging. I'm not excusing his behavior, because I don't understand not fixing what can easily be fixed, but I do think his actually state of mind is what is making him resistant.

Yes. Unfortunately he has to step up and he won't do that if you give him any wiggle room whatsoever.

Seems like you are well versed on MB principles. Have you used the Emotional Needs questionnaire provided here? Have you both read His Needs Her Needs? Considered the accountability program to get on track? MB coaching? Perhaps call the coaching center and get a directive from Steve Harley. Steve is helpful to get a husband on board and might be able to coach your husband out of this withdrawal before your problems increase. You could also write Dr Willsrd Harley on the radio show. Also have you read Dr Harley's article "why women leave men?" It's about men's tendency to be indifferent to their wives emotional needs and how to manage this problem.

Hi graceful, we have both read HNHN, I actually have the EN questionnaire sitting on our table right now. I have most of mine filled out, honestly I could have just told him my needs because after filling it out they are exactly what I thought.

H has not done his yet so I have not given him mine.I told him today as respectfully as I could that I don't want any more "I will...I want to...I promise" from him because they mean nothing at this point. I said it's hard for me to believe that you mean these things after saying it for so long and not doing it. I told him I need him to show me instead of talking. He said he will prove it to me. We shall see.
I think I read that article a while back but I honestly can't remember it so I will give it another look. I will look into the programs too. I gave them a brief look last week but since I hasn't been able tomake a simple phone call, I'm not sure about spending that much money before he shows at least some type of commitment beyond words.

He did comment today that he knows something is still "off" with him regarding his depression and that he needs to do soemtjing about it. So I'm hoping if I keep encouraging he will actually call at least one of the doctors this week.

DWM, I would be expecting that call to happen before he does anything else, before the day is out. When the surgery opens. When you were talking, he could have picked up the phone.

Communicate that you expect the marriage, and this most pressing problem to be more important than anything else.

When he said he was going to prove it, you could easily have asked him when.

Don't fear bearing down on this as long as you avoid lovebusters.

Indiegirl, I agree with you. Unfortunately they are not open the weekends and today is a holiday in the US and they were also not open today.

I didn't ask him when because I know his answer would be when they are open, which I've heard before. Should I ask a question if I already know the answer to it?

I have a question regarding the LB questionnaire. One of the things he does is get irritated when I get upset, like crying upset and I can't tell him right that minute what is wrong. It drives me up the wall because I'm the one who is upset about something and he says things like "I'm not doing this anymore, why won't you tell me what's wrong" over and over again.

I understand he wants to know what the problem is, but, I'm a very emotional person, and I learned along the way that I can't have a conversation when I'm so upset because either I can't think clearly enough to respectfully articulate the issue, or two sometimes it takes me a while to figure out why whatever the issue is upset me so much. I am always willing to talk about it after I've had a minute to get a grip, but sometimes he will push for a good half hour or more and by then I hardly want to see his face let alone have a constructive conversation about an issie.

What would that be considered when he won't let me not basically spill my guts in that instant? An SD? Or a DJ? Or an AO? I could really see it falling I'm to all three of those...?

Just say when you expect it to happen and how does he feel about that.

Some people start out making written complaints and banning the sort of immediate verbal complaints you describe.

I would get him on the online course here with a coach and access to Dr H. If he's behaving like this when you are crying you need someone like him to straighten him out for you.

I don't think he has much empathy for you and that will be the case until you mend some fences, eliminate lbs and meet needs. So have someone help you over the initial bumps.

Thanks for the suggestions indiegirl. We actually have been doing quite a bit of our talking about things through texting, as well as face to face. I've he sometimes seems to understand my point better if he sees it written as opposed to hearing me say it.

Is the course you are talking about the $959.00 course? To be honest, I'm not sure he would use it right. He isn't much for online communication. Basically the only thing he does online is read the new, find recipes and looks at things before we buy them. He doesn't even check is email unless I ask him to, or he is waiting for something specific.

My husband called his doctor this morning and the office phone isn't even ringing...just gives the message "the mailbox of the person you are calling is full and not accepting messages" I called myself to verify this... But, I am encouraged he actually made the call, and keeps texting me that the other line he is trying is busy.

You can possibly check online for their website and get their Contact Us or Schedule An Appointment links and maybe even find an alternate phone number or fax number.

LTL

Thanks LTL, I actually already emailed them, they have a power outage going on that is messing with their phones. Hopefully will be fixed soon. They don't schedule over email so he'll have to call when it's back up.

Did the appointment get made?

This thing where he presses you to "reveal all" is disabling to your relationship. My husband used to do that and eventually I figured out, at least for me it was a trap while we were going through a difficult time. It placed all the 'emotionality' between us or within him on me like I was that 'voice' between us. In other words he was projecting through me if that makes sense.

I stopped buying the bait. Yes, writing might help but like your husband my husband whom was likely depressed at the time would not read my notes. Or at least he'd claim he didn't have a chance.

What worked best for me was to simply say things like, "I'm not ready to discuss that right now and actually set a time when I was ready. Or I would say "I'm not enthusiastic about that." Things like that. But basically you don't want to get backed into a corner with him asking you "what's wrong?" It seems like he is showing care, but in our case at that time it was manipulative and seemed very dark to me. It was using my emotionality against me for his own benefit like a power move. I feel it's like a 'fix' for a depressed person who has disconnected from themselves emotionally and maybe even spiritually. Stay strong. You don't want to enter that dark hole with him. Stay outside and grounded. This will help you both in the long haul.

I had the same issue with my husband hamstringing my efforts. For example the difficulty with follow through. Thing like filling out the EN questionnaire. It's very frustrating and upsetting especially because your own needs are not being met. And because not having your needs met increases your emotionality it's easy to fall into the trap of lecturing or nagging and pursuing. And because your needs are not being met and you have come here and are now more aware of your needs it's doubly hard not to double efforts to engage him. I suppose my point is, you may not be able to engage him for awhile and at this point less might be more and setting up your own healthy boundaries will likely say more.

My husband is really good at remaining an enigma to people that care and want to help. Being married to someone who can shut down like this can be very invalidating and as a result it can appear you are the weaker mate from a mental health perspective. So I hope what I'm at least attempting to convey says something validating about you and the challenge your situation reveals. There are all kinds of hero journeys.

Thank you for your last two posts graceful. The Appt is either the 9th or the 11th, I can't remember honestly but it's in my messages somewhere. Now if he will just make the other appointment that needs made.

My husband actually will read what I write, and respond to me. I still don't always think he understands though. Sometimes I have to say something "I don't think you are reading what I'm saying" to get him to acknowledge my perspective instead of responding with something like "I'm not trying to hurt you" or some dribble like that.

I very much appreciate your perspective, and encouragement. The last two days have been very difficult for me, which really doesn't seem to make sense as he finally made an effort to make an appt.
My husband is quite the enigma at times too, but, on the other hand, sometimes I feel like I can read him like a book. Sometimes it's like, who are you? and what have you done with my husband? and other times I honestly think 'oh, there he is, I knew he was in there somewhere".

You are right about about the emotional aspect, and I have tried what you mentioned regarding saying something like "I'm not ready to discuss this right now" but, usually if I do that, he just stops talking to me all together until I reengage, which is not what I want. I don't want to be "left alone" to cry. I want him to be able to comfort me without me specifically articulating why in the moment, and him trying to badger me in to talking. I don't know, maybe he isn't totally capable of that at this poing.

I'm guessing you can't expect him to "be there for you" when he's disconnected from himself. I hear you in regards to the shutting down business. You feel anxious and off you cycle again to help him understand or show him your neediness. You can't break yourself in half to make him whole.

Well put, that is all exactly true. Thank you.

Hi Everyone, Prisca pointed out I hadn't updated lately. So I thought I should.
It was a long, rough summer for us, the vast majority of things that happened were out of our control, but, Hubby is back on AD's. He then had a bad spell where we had a serious conversation about how the back and forth he was doing with the AD's was really harming us. He agreed to go back to the Dr, which he did, and take them every day, which is he now doing.

He does have some physical issues that are inhibiting his desire for intimacy, we are currently working with a couple Dr's to get this address also.

I'm feeling somewhat better. He's made a commitment to do MB and we actually just started the online program a couple of weeks ago.
Are things perfect? no. But, I feel better in knowing it is a physical issue causing the lack of intimacy, and that he has realized it is truly an issue that needs addressed for our marriage to be successful. I think a big part of it is also the depression, when you have no desire to even get off the couch, which he often tells me he doesn't, I can understand not have a desire for sex.
We have started going out on dates again, although, not the number of hours we should, so we are working on getting up to 15+ hours.

All in all, I feel hopeful for the first time in a long time. I think the online program is the ticket we need to get things going in the right direction. I think at this point we both know what needs done, I'm impressed by some of the steps he has taken on his own, but I think having someone there to prompt us along will help a ton.

Thank you for sharing your story "doesn't"
I'm glad you're making progress. It gives me a little hope too. :-)
Slow is better than divorce.

My world came crashing down on Easter. I discovered 3 hidden cellphones will bills dating back to 2014, cards and notes from another women, that he hardly worked in 2014, that he missed 9 days straight of work early in the year that I had no idea about. I found bottles and bottles of ED pills, so his saying he needed them might be true, but he already had them when we weren't being intimate.
He has been telling me for months he has been working nights at a sister hospital of the one he works at, but he hasn't been getting paid because their payroll is so messed up. While he was at work I started digging and found all this. I confronted him, he came home from "work" in his jeans instead of uniform...I am so devastated, and feel so stupid. I don't know if I can every trust him again.

OH. MY. GOD. I have no advice but just wanted to tell you I am so so sorry (and stunned) to hear this.

Do you want to try to recover the marriage? You don't have children and he has been cheating and gaslighting for most of your marriage.

Read the Exposure 101 thread and come right back. Do you know who he is meeting?

I read exposure and have already started exposing. He doesn't have facebook. I called his mother his brother knows because he stayed there. My while family knows. I don't know if I want to save it or not. Part of me really thinks there is no hope. Part of me really wants to save it. I love him. He has been my best friend for years and it hurts so much

I think I know who he is meeting and her family already knows. They clued me in back in November, but, they sent me a picture of who they thought my h was and it wasn't him and then blocked me. I told my h about it and she said this lady is crazy and sleeps with everyone she works with. It's the same lady.

That is where you should start. I would expose the affair to her family. The onlky thing they know is what was told to them by a liar so they need to know the truth. Did he meet her at work?

Also, just because some people "already know" does not mean you should not expose to them. Especially if you decide you want to save this marriage. There is a difference between them knowing he's having an affair because they've seen or heard of it from him, and knowing you are fighting to save your marriage and asking for their support to help end the affair.

Typically when a BS tells us someone "already knows" [that they didn't tell themselves] it means they know the lies and spin told to them by liars. The point of exposure is get the truth out there.

I know what all of you are saying about exposure is 100% true, but do I even want to try to save this? I waver so much from minute to minute. I love him so much, but his lies are so deep.

You might not choose to save it. And that is fine. But the affair should be exposed. Exposure helps you ALL regardless of what you decide about the future of your marriage. Everyone should know what he did.

If you decide to divorce, you benefit from exposure because it is likely to ruin his affair. That way you are not facing a fogged out man when you negotiate your divorce. And if you do decide to save your marriage the affair will be wrecked and his fantasy ruined, which will make your efforts worthwhile.

Exposing it wide and far helps everyone regardless of your decisions.

Ok thank you I will work on it. This is so horrible.

I know! I am sorry it has turned out like this.

Ugh, this has to be the most painful thing I've ever felt. I feel so broken today.

Sorry, have you completed exposure?

I am working on it, I'm having trouble finding contact means for some people. Do I let the OW know that I know?

I would let her find out via exposure. If you expose to her family and friends, she will find out real quick. When you are done, you might want to give her a call.

ok

How did exposure go? Who did you end up exposing to?

How are you?

exposure went ok. I exposed to both our families, friends and the part of OW's family I could find. he was expectedly furious and on and off mean for a couple weeks. my family is wonderfully supportive, his family is useless and I got a response from no one on OW's side. she is not married so there is no BH to help and he family doesn't seem to care a wit.
I asked him to leave the morning after I found everything.

we talk and I see him several times a week, but I have told him until he gets a new job and provides total transparency I am not willing to live with him. Our conversations are mostly pleasant and none substantive, but I bring up the job and transparency daily.

I am working on getting an apartment, which is proving very hard due to our financial situation, but after that I'm thinking I may be headed to plan B.
He claims a divorce is not what he wants, but is actions don't seem to show that, and as everyone says MB is action oriented. He has read surviving an affair.

in terms of how I'm doing, I'm surviving. I've been to the doc and got some AD's, and I'm just taking it one day at a time.

Where is he living?

Do you know if there has been NC between him and the OW?

When you ask him to get a new job and provide transparency, what is his response?

What family members on OW's side did you expose to?

he is at his dad's. he is still working with her but claims he doesn't "talk" to her. regardless, I consider working with her continued contact and therefore an active affair, which is why I continue to tell him his working there is hurting me horribly.

he has applied to, by my count, 10 jobs in the last week, but this is the first effort I've seen at all. on transparency he says "I know"

her brother, mother and cousins. the only one who has acknowledged anything is the cousin and she is not close to her, but does think it is horrible. I recently found a fb for her exH whom OW has children with, so I will be exposing to him too.

You're correct that working with her is continued contact.

Have you exposed at their workplace?

You need to get into Plan B. His continued affair will make you sick.

I have not exposed at his work and I know I need to.
I'm also working on getting in to plan B.

When will you be exposing to their job?

Have you written the Plan B letter?