Marriage Builders
Posted By: Hoke74 Exposing my secrets - I am the WS - 07/21/18 12:32 PM
Hi

I know that most of you posting here are the betrayed spouse. I am the wayward spouse. I am reading Surviving an Affair.

My affair was exposed last August. My husband saw a fairly innocent message in my phone that I could have denied but I come clean and told him I had met someone. My affair lasted two months. We met physically twice. It became an emotional affair. I ended it after I told my husband but I didn�t end it in my head... I held on to emails and messages and photos and was even stalking my ex lover on line. I also held onto other secrets of other infidelity. I thought what my husband doesn�t know, can�t hurt him.

My husband and I went to couples counselling but she never pushed for full disclosure and at the time my husband was too afraid to ask for fear of what he might hear, so I stayed quiet because I didn't don�t want to hurt him if he wasn�t ready to hear. I was also terrified of telling him all the horrible dirty dark secrets, in case I lost him forever.

I have always loved him so much. Sounds so hypocritical doesn�t it? How can you love someone and still do something so terrible to them? Just like the typical scenarios is the book, we were not fulfilling emotional needs and we had been neglecting our marriage for years. Loneliness, lack of affection, long work hours, working away from home etc. I had pleaded with my husband to work on the marriage with me but at the time, he wasn�t willing. This is not an excuse for me having an affair! I had choices!

Instead of making the strong persons choice to leave my husband. I made the weak persons choice to fulfill my emotional needs elsewhere... of course now I know, you can�t do that, it doesn�t work.

So now we are both in a place where we are sitting in the fence. We are fairly amicable but there is a lot of fear on both sides. We are living together with our son in our family home, but there is no trust. I am still holding onto more secrets which he knows I need to tell him. I have told him that there is more I need to tell him but I am so scared. I feel dirty and ashamed, I feel like I am a slut. I am terrified of full exposure. I don�t want my parents, my children, my friends to know what I have done, I don�t want them to judge me and think that I am such a terrible person. I feel so ashamed.

I have counselling - I have a history of rape and abuse and overwhelming anxiety over shame and guilt.

I am desperate to tell my husband everything because I do want to give our marriage every chance I can for it to not only to survive but to properly thrive.

All I have ever wanted is the marriage described in the book. A secure, loving, affectionate, attentive, happy, fulfilling marriage and I know that to do that, there can be no secrets.

At the moment, my husband can�t tell me if he does want to work in saving the marriage. Should I get absolute confirmation from him that he does want to save the marriage before I fully disclose? I am scared he just wants all the truth so he can use it against me to tell everyone so they hate me.

I am so scared but I need to do the right thing.

Any advice?



Posted By: MelodyLane Re: Exposing my secrets - I am the WS - 07/21/18 12:52 PM
Hello Hoke, welcome to Marriage Builders. You are in the right place if you want the marriage described in the book. But that will never happen unless you tell him the truth and follow these steps. A marriage cannot recover if there is dishonesty. Regardless of whether he wants to stay in the marriage, he deserves the basic facts about your affair. This is information about his life to which he is entitled. It is not all about you. Reading your post, I don't think you are serious about recovery at all. You want a recovered marriage, sure, but you aren't serious about actually doing anything to make that happen. If I can read that in your post, I imagine your H feels the same way.

I suspect he is ambiguous about recovery with you because you have not stepped up here and tried to gain trust. You are still being dishonest with him, so he probably sees this as hopeless. You desperately want to keep the affair a big secret, which is also concerning.

We can help you fix this, but you have to be willing to take some critical first steps and you haven't even done that.

Who is the OM? Is he married? Do you ever see him? How far away does he live?

Posted By: MelodyLane Re: Exposing my secrets - I am the WS - 07/21/18 12:53 PM
Originally Posted by Dr Bill Harley
The plan I recommend for recovery after an affair is very specific. That's because I've found that even small deviations from that plan are usually disastrous. But when it's followed, it always works. The plan has two parts that must be implemented sequentially. The first part of the plan is for the unfaithful spouse to completely separate from the lover and eliminate the conditions that made the affair possible. The second part is for the couple to create a romantic relationship, using my Basic Concepts as a guide.

I'll describe these two parts to you in a little more detail.

The first step, complete separation from the lover and eliminating the conditions that made the affair possible, requires a complete understanding of the affair. All information regarding the affair must be revealed to the betrayed spouse, including the name of the lover, the conditions that made the affair possible (travel, internet, etc.), the details of what took place during the affair, all correspondence, and anything else that would shed light on the tragedy.

This information is important for two reasons: (1) it creates accountability and transparency, making it essentially impossible for the unfaithful spouse to continue the affair or begin a new one unnoticed, and (2) it creates trust for the betrayed spouse, providing evidence that the affair is over and a new one is unlikely to take its place. The nightmares you experience are likely to continue until you have the facts that
will lead to your assurance that your husband can be trusted.

An analysis of the wayward spouse's childhood or emotional state of mind in an effort to discover why he or she would have an affair is distracting and unnecessary. It takes precious time away from finding the real solutions. I know why people have affairs: We are all wired for it. Given certain conditions, we would all do it. Given other conditions, however, none of us would do it. So the goal of the first step is to discover the conditions that made the affair possible and eliminate them.

After the first step is completed, the second step is to create a romantic relationship between you and your husband using my 10 Basic Concepts here
as your guide. While your relationship may be improving, it won't lead to a romantic relationship because you are not being transparent toward each other. Unspoken issues in a marital relationship lead to a superficiality that ruins romance.

Your nightmares are only the tip of the iceberg. They are but a small reflection of the suffering you experienced when you discovered your husband's affair, and the fear you have that the suffering will be repeated. You have no assurance that the affair is over because you don't even know who the other woman is. You are being asked to trust your husband, who has already proven to be untrustworthy. For all you know, he could be working with her, or you could be going to the same church, or she could be
your neighbor. And since he won't discuss the details of how the affair took place, you have no assurance that another affair will not take its place.

Infidelity is not something that can be swept under the rug. While those who have affairs want to forget about it and move on, those who are betrayed must take very specific steps before they can fully recover. In your case, those steps have not been taken, and as a result, your fear persists. I will send you a complimentary copy of my book, "Surviving an Affair," if you send me your address. It will describe these two steps to you and provide you with a roadmap toward full recovery. But the path will require full disclosure of all details.

Best wishes,

Willard F. Harley, Jr.
here
Posted By: MelodyLane Re: Exposing my secrets - I am the WS - 07/21/18 01:00 PM
The purpose of exposure is to shine light on your affair and gain support for your marriage. It is a critical first step towards recovery. I understand it is embarrassing, but it is therapeutic.
Originally Posted by Dr Bill Harley
""The reason for the wide exposure is not to hurt the unfaithful spouse, but rather to end the fantasy. Your husband's secret second life made his affair possible, and the more you can to to make it public, the easier it is for him to see the damage he's doing. Keeping it secret does damage, but few know about it. Making it public helps everyone, including the unfaithful spouse and lover, see the affair for what it really is."

Originally Posted by Dr Harley
"Exposure is very likely to end the affair, lifting the fog that has overcome the unfaithful spouse, helping him or her become truly repentant and willing to put energy and effort into a full marital recovery. In my experience with thousands of couples who struggle with the fallout of infidelity, exposure has been the single most important first step toward recovery. It not only helps end the affair, but it also provides support to the betrayed spouse, giving him or her stamina to hold out for ultimate recovery."

Keeping the affair a secret is not in your best interest or your husbands.

From Surviving an Affair, pg 66-67

The extraordinary precautions do more than end marriage-threatening affairs; they help a couple form the kind of relationship they always wanted.

These recommendations may seem rigid, unnecessarily confining, and even paranoid to those who have not been the victim of infidelity. But people like Sue and Jon, who have suffered unimaginable pain as a result of an affair that spun out of control, can easily see their value. For the inconvenience of following my advice, Sue would have spared herself and Jon the very worst experience of their lives.


Checklist for How Affairs Should End

_____The unfaithful spouse should reveal information about the affair to the betrayed spouse.

_____The unfaithful spouse should make a commitment to the betrayed spouse to never see or talk to the lover OP again.

_____The unfaithful spouse should write a letter to the lover OP ending the relationship and send it with the approval of the betrayed spouse.

_____The unfaithful spouse should take extraordinary precautions to guarantee total separation from the lover OP:

_____Block potential communication with the lover OP (change e-mail address and home and cell phone numbers, and close all social networking accounts; have voice messages and mail monitored by the betrayed spouse).

_____Account for time (betrayed spouse and wayward spouse give each other a twenty-four-hour daily schedule with locations and telephone numbers).

_____Account for money (betrayed spouse and wayward spouse give each other a complete account of all money spent).

_____Spend leisure time together.

_____Change jobs and relocate if necessary.

_____Avoid overnight separation.

_____Allow technical accountability.

_____ Expose affair to family members, clergy, and/or friends.

Posted By: indiegirl Re: Exposing my secrets - I am the WS - 07/21/18 01:28 PM
Originally Posted by Hoke74.
I feel dirty and ashamed, I feel like I am a slut. I am terrified of full exposure.

hug

Oh dear! The feelings you describe are one of the reasons I am such a cheerleader for full exposure. Shame and fear are lying liars. Do not listen to them. Do not let them isolate in you the dark where all burdens are heavy because you carry them alone.

What would you do if you were not afraid?
Posted By: indiegirl Re: Exposing my secrets - I am the WS - 07/21/18 01:40 PM
Originally Posted by Hoke74
At the moment, my husband can�t tell me if he does want to work in saving the marriage. Should I get absolute confirmation from him that he does want to save the marriage before I fully disclose? I am scared he just wants all the truth so he can use it against me to tell everyone so they hate me.

He deserves the truth BEFORE he makes a decision. He gets to weigh up the full facts and decides if he wants to recover from what is accurately described.

If you balk at telling him the truth, you will be making the decision FOR him, ('I will keep you', rather than 'Will you stay') While the latter question is terrifying, the former is only ok to do with pets!

As for his telling people it is his right. Even though the affair has caused you misery too, he is the victim. He would be actively encouraged to do a widespread exposure here. Indeed recovery is impossible without it. As long as he does not use anger/insulting language it will help him.

I honestly think it would help you too.
Posted By: MelodyLane Re: Exposing my secrets - I am the WS - 07/21/18 01:54 PM
Originally Posted by Hoke74
I don�t want my parents, my children, my friends to know what I have done, I don�t want them to judge me and think that I am such a terrible person. I feel so ashamed.

Yes, people do judge. But they also judge you by how you handle it. Most people are very forgiving and supportive when they see a person is truly trying to redeem themselves.
Posted By: SusieQ Re: Exposing my secrets - I am the WS - 07/21/18 05:51 PM
Originally Posted by Hoke74
How can you love someone and still do something so terrible to them? Just like the typical scenarios is the book, we were not fulfilling emotional needs and we had been neglecting our marriage for years. Loneliness, lack of affection, long work hours, working away from home etc. I had pleaded with my husband to work on the marriage with me but at the time, he wasn’t willing.

The reason that you had your affair was that you didn't/don't have appropriate boundaries around the opposite sex.

Plenty of people have unmet needs in marriage and don't have affairs - because they are exercising EPs (extraordinary precautions) in marriage.

Plenty of people are getting their ENs met in marriage and do have affairs - because they are NOT exercising EPs in marriage.

Who is this OM and how did the affair start?

Posted By: SusieQ Re: Exposing my secrets - I am the WS - 07/21/18 05:52 PM
Originally Posted by Hoke74
I know that most of you posting here are the betrayed spouse.

There are plenty of FWS posting here. They are some of our finest posters.
Posted By: SusieQ Re: Exposing my secrets - I am the WS - 07/21/18 05:55 PM
Originally Posted by Hoke74
I am still holding onto more secrets which he knows I need to tell him. I have told him that there is more I need to tell him but I am so scared.

One of the EPs (extraordinary precautions) that must followed in order to protect your marriage is to be 100% open and honest and transparent. Had you been following this one EP alone - the affair likely wouldn't have happened. Affairs and dishonesty go hand in hand.

If you are not willing to abandon your SSL - secret second life - then there is zero chance for recovery.

Posted By: SusieQ Re: Exposing my secrets - I am the WS - 07/21/18 06:05 PM
Originally Posted by Hoke74
I am so scared but I need to do the right thing.

Any advice?
Please understand, one of the most painful aspect of being betrayed is being LIED to.

By continuing to hide aspects of your affair and SSL (secret second life), you are making a BAD situation WORSE. Whenever a WS decides to trickle truth their BS, you are further draining their love for you, it lessens the chances of a successful recovery, and it just creates more suffering for the BS.

Just tell your H everything. Don't leave anything out. And into the future, any time that you feel that you should "hide" something, the opposite is actually true - it is a signal that you should tell your spouse immediately.
Posted By: Hoke74 Re: Exposing my secrets - I am the WS - 07/24/18 01:47 PM
Thank you everyone for your replies. They have been really helpful.

I have now told my husband everything.

I have not had any contact with the OM for just under a year.

I know I now need to give my husband time to work all of this out. The book says not to expose out of anger but from a place of compassion. My husband is justifiably angry and wants revenge.

My husband has exposed me to some of our friends who are supportive to my husband but not supportive in repairing the marriage.

We also want to tell our 9 yo son but are struggling to find the age appropriate words that will explain the hurt and pain I have caused without using words that could �traumatise with thoughts� something our counsellors said is important not to do.


Posted By: indiegirl Re: Exposing my secrets - I am the WS - 07/24/18 04:01 PM
Would your husband come here for support? It may reassure him and we could guide him on appropriate steps, even if he is undecided (most people are).

Originally Posted by Hoke74
. My husband is justifiably angry and wants revenge.

What type of behaviour are we talking about here? You are not expected to put up with angry outbursts or vengeful words.

Originally Posted by Hoke74
.

My husband has exposed me to some of our friends who are supportive to my husband but not supportive in repairing the marriage.

This is an understandable response on their part IF there is no plan in place to protect their friend from future affairs. If your husband is given the plan, and decides to follow it, people are actually going to need to see you follow through with it. Every action will buy you more credibility. Words alone will not do.

The fact that you voluntarily revealed the affair is a better start than most. Take heart that it will take time.
Posted By: SusieQ Re: Exposing my secrets - I am the WS - 07/24/18 04:11 PM
Originally Posted by SusieQ
Who is this OM and how did the affair start?

Could you answer this? Thank you.
Posted By: BrainHurts Re: Exposing my secrets - I am the WS - 07/24/18 04:36 PM
In addition to SusieQ�s question please read this Exposing to Children
Posted By: unwritten Re: Exposing my secrets - I am the WS - 07/24/18 08:17 PM
Originally Posted by SusieQ
Originally Posted by SusieQ
Who is this OM and how did the affair start?

Could you answer this? Thank you.

You said you were also holding back information about �other infidelities.� How many affairs were there, and with who? Are you still in contact with any other AP�s? Did you now come clean about ALL affairs?
Posted By: Hoke74 Re: Exposing my secrets - I am the WS - 07/25/18 12:53 PM
Last June. I started chatting to other married men on the internet. I met three men all of whom were married. I had an affair with one that lasted two months. It ended in August last year. We have not had contact since. I also had a one night stand with a male friend last July.

My husband is a long haul pilot and has his own second life away from home and the family. My husband has never given me evidence/reason to believe he has had an affair but he has in the past lied about going out with the flight crew and he withholds information from me and at times has felt very distant.

Prior to this my husband and I had a one night stand with another woman. This happened 15 years ago.

I realise this is all extremely dysfunctional. I don�t want to feel/behave like this.

I have been absolutely 100% truthful and I have told my husband everything because I want to follow the programme.

I gave my husband all the details about the other man last August. He thought about exposing him to his wife last year but did not. He does not want to expose the man who I had the affair with as he is scared it will give the man a reason to try to contact me again.

I told him about the one night stand with my friend and he did contact him and wanted to seek revenge.

My husband does not think the EPs are all necessary - he feels spending time apart to follow our own pursuits is healthy and necessary.

He says the book should be seen as more of a guideline and this scares me as I am afraid it won�t work unless we follow the EPs. All I have ever wanted is the type of marriage the book guarantees!

I have suggested my husband could come here for support. I have told him that I am here looking for help.

Posted By: indiegirl Re: Exposing my secrets - I am the WS - 07/25/18 03:54 PM
Dr H specifically rejects suggestions that the program can be cherry picked. He says constantly that the plan is an exact recipe and that recovery from just one affair (never mind serial and mutual infidelties) is "a narrow path".

Recovery is well nigh impossible if your husband keeps this job. Even happy and stable marriages don't work long distance and when Dr H was working with the military he tried hard but failed to come up with solutions to the high rate of infidelity. When couples live apart, infidelity follows.

Your husband is experiencing the result of such a lifestyle and instead of grieving and second guessing these choices; he wants time for hobbies?

This is not a typical betrayed spouse reaction. I think you were on the money with your instincts that he has a secret second life which he is no loathe to give up.

At any rate I don't think you have enough capital to persuade him to follow this marriage recovery program because he likes things as they are.

My advice would be to snoop and leave; or simply to leave. If you found evidence of his infidelities that might give you more chance of getting a divorce.
Posted By: BrainHurts Re: Exposing my secrets - I am the WS - 07/25/18 04:30 PM
Have you listened to the radio clips in Traveling Jobs ?
Posted By: unwritten Re: Exposing my secrets - I am the WS - 07/25/18 05:06 PM
In your situation, I would recommend that you both take a polygraph. You can tell your BH that you would like to BOTH take one, to get all of your history on the table so that you can move forward with radical honesty. You can say that after being dishonest like you have been, you want to prove to him that you have told him everything. And you would also like some reassurance that you too know everything.

I agree 100% with Indie that your BH�s reaction is more typical of someone who has their own secrets to conceal and SSL to protect, than that of a usual BS. If that is true, now is the time to get it all out on the table to decide if and how to move forward. Without honesty you can not recover, and without following EPS you can also not recover.

Do any of the OMs love close to you? Are you still in contact with the friend you had the ONS with?
Posted By: BrainHurts Re: Exposing my secrets - I am the WS - 07/25/18 05:17 PM
And do any of the betrayed wives of your OM know?
Posted By: Hoke74 Re: Exposing my secrets - I am the WS - 07/27/18 02:17 PM
Thanks Brainhurts. I will listen to them.

No the OM does not live close or work close. We have no reason to cross paths.

The friend who I had the ONS with does live close but since last August I had no contact with him until this week. I contacted him with my husbands permission after my husband contacted him on FB. My husband wanted to know who knew about the ONS. My husband was thinking the absolute worse. My friend assured me that he had never told anyone. He apologised to my husband. The friend is single and owns his own business. My husband feels there is no advantage in exposing the ONS apart from to embarrass himself.

I do believe my husband and when he says he has not been unfaithful to me. It�s very unfortunate that hasn't always been 100% truthful and sometimes obstructive with information. Every other relationship I have had, my partner has been unfathful. My own father was unfaithful. I know WH says we are all wired to be unfaithful.

I don�t think my husband will follow this path. I�m happy to do it - I want to do it. I think it would really help my insecurities.
Posted By: Hoke74 Re: Exposing my secrets - I am the WS - 07/27/18 02:20 PM
No my husband does not want to expose it to the OM wife. He says he might do one day but not now. He fears it will cause their marriage to break up and that the man might pursue me.

The ONS is a single man.
Posted By: MelodyLane Re: Exposing my secrets - I am the WS - 07/27/18 05:01 PM
Originally Posted by Hoke74
No my husband does not want to expose it to the OM wife. He says he might do one day but not now. He fears it will cause their marriage to break up and that the man might pursue me.

If he doesn't, then you should do it via letter. If their marriage breaks up it will be because the wife makes that choice. That is her right. She is not a pet dog, but a grown woman who has a right to determine her own life.

You don't need to worry about the OM "pursuing" you if you have shut off all avenues of communication. You have a moral obligation to make sure the OM's wife knows the truth so she can protect herself and her children.

I don't see much hope for your marriage if you and your husband won't come here and follow a plan. This looks pretty hopeless as it stands now due to your husbands traveling job. As long as he puts his job before his marriage and is home every night, this will never recover.
Posted By: indiegirl Re: Exposing my secrets - I am the WS - 07/27/18 06:33 PM
Originally Posted by unwritten
In your situation, I would recommend that you both take a polygraph.

I was thinking the same thing. However it is very unlikely that he will agree and the OP is a remorseful wayward. She doesn't currently have the fire, or the evidence, to insist.

Originally Posted by MelodyLane
If he doesn't, then you should do it via letter. If their marriage breaks up it will be because the wife makes that choice. That is her right. She is not a pet dog, but a grown woman who has a right to determine her own life.

Yeah this is not something you get to pass on. As others have said the lie *is* the infidelity. The sex stuff is incidental to the lie. For as long as the lie lives, she is your victim and you stay in limbo. You can reassure her that contact is over and she can make sure of it on her end with this knowledge.




Posted By: Tom2010 Re: Exposing my secrets - I am the WS - 07/28/18 05:12 AM
Unwritten and Indie, and also for Hoke74,

I strongly disagree with both of you. You are assuming, because of so-called behavior, that her husband is living a secret life including an affair or more. There us no good reason to mislead her based on theory or sentiment!! We are only hearing one side. He may have had affairs, but, evidence??

Hoke74, do you have hard evidence that your husband Has engaged in an affair? From what you have said, it seems much more likely that your husband is afraid of any exposure due to revealing to anyone that his wife has strayed. And. he hasn't done anything more than expose to friends, Not both of your families. So it's a strong possibility that he is engaged in a PYA for both you and him due to embarrassment to both you and him. I may be entirely wrong and I accept that.

The fact that he is resisting installing EP's may be due to his need to get to a point that he still wants to save this marriage given your confession. I think most husbands can get the getup to fight an affair to win back their wife, But a wife simply boinking a guy in a ONS hard to accept and usually anathema!. Both of you really need direct consult with the Harleys to learn how to disclose to each other where you each are in honest disclosure Just a guy's perspective, but you need to do a lot more!!

Tom




Posted By: indiegirl Re: Exposing my secrets - I am the WS - 07/28/18 07:56 AM
Originally Posted by Tom2010
I strongly disagree with both of you. You are assuming, because of so-called behavior, that her husband is living a secret life including an affair or more. There us no good reason to mislead her based on theory or sentiment!! We are only hearing one side. He may have had affairs, but, evidence??

The threesome?

As for other affairs; sure we could be wrong.
Posted By: Hoke74 Re: Exposing my secrets - I am the WS - 07/28/18 09:15 AM
I don�t have any evidence and I don�t actually believe he has had an affair. I feel really guilty of accusing him after all I am the one who betrayed him!

I think the problem lies within my own trust issues and insecurities and the fact that he has kept truths hidden from me in the past.

We are both continuing to read the book and we are discussing it.

It may just be that my husband needs time.

He is trying to make arrangements with work that will mean he can spend more time at home. It will mean delaying a promotion for a year or so. I am also going to work less too so I can go away on trips with him.

Putting in the EP�s might at this stage seem like an invasion into his privacy. He might just need so time to get used to the idea. Although he did say he has already been through his emails, looking for and deleting anything from any woman despite knowing he has nothing to hide, which set a few alarm bells ringing. I sincerely hope that if he is keeping any secrets from me, that he does tell me.
I will have the conversation with him one more time.

This has taken it�s toll on him. Maybe he will want to reveal it to the OBS when he feels ready. If he feels it�s not the right thing to do at this moment, I will respect his wishes.






Posted By: indiegirl Re: Exposing my secrets - I am the WS - 07/28/18 10:07 AM
I encourage you to read Dr Harleys articles on trust; basically that blind trust is the worst policy in the world. I would also look at his articles on snooping.

I'm not saying that your husband has definitely cheated; it may be that snooping will totally exonerate him. If so cool. That is what snooping is for!

Equally, it may be that he voluntarily makes his life transparent to you as any betrayed spouse would be encouraged to do. His habit of lying to you may not be covering up anything serious and he may gladly put that aside as part of the programme. His job complicates this but there are other jobs.

But I would think poorly of your logic if you did not suspect him a little. He has sex with a woman in front of you and then leaves on his travelling job....where he definitely won't do that without you present? Even if you were enthusiastic about the threesome and felt in control during...itd have to make you wonder. So don't feel too bad about wanting more transparency and radical honesty. Pushing down your doubts and fears has not worked very well for you and is not encouraged by Dr H.
Posted By: indiegirl Re: Exposing my secrets - I am the WS - 07/28/18 10:13 AM
Snooping:

https://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi8121_snoop.html

Dr Harley on trust:

"(The) problem is that spouses are often led to believe that trust is something you are required to do when you are married. You have to trust your spouse. But trust is not a requirement for marriage; it's a reaction to experience. It grows as each spouse shows himself or herself to be trustworthy.

Trust should begin with a commitment to be thoughtful and honest. Without that commitment, it's foolish to trust your spouse. Then, that commitment must be followed up with thoughtful and honest behavior. By following the Policy of Joint Agreement and the Policy of Radical Honesty consistently, a spouse would eventually prove his or her trustworthiness"
Posted By: MelodyLane Re: Exposing my secrets - I am the WS - 07/28/18 12:54 PM
Originally Posted by Hoke74
I don�t have any evidence and I don�t actually believe he has had an affair. I feel really guilty of accusing him after all I am the one who betrayed him!

I think the problem lies within my own trust issues and insecurities and the fact that he has kept truths hidden from me in the past.

We are both continuing to read the book and we are discussing it.

It may just be that my husband needs time.

He is trying to make arrangements with work that will mean he can spend more time at home. It will mean delaying a promotion for a year or so. I am also going to work less too so I can go away on trips with him.

Putting in the EP�s might at this stage seem like an invasion into his privacy. He might just need so time to get used to the idea. Although he did say he has already been through his emails, looking for and deleting anything from any woman despite knowing he has nothing to hide, which set a few alarm bells ringing. I sincerely hope that if he is keeping any secrets from me, that he does tell me.
I will have the conversation with him one more time.

This has taken it�s toll on him. Maybe he will want to reveal it to the OBS when he feels ready. If he feels it�s not the right thing to do at this moment, I will respect his wishes.

Hoke, first off, it is your job to expose to the OM's wife if your husband won't. After all, it was you who did the crime. It doesn't really matter who tells her but she has a right to know.

Secondly, you shouldn't ask your husband if he is having an affair, you should just snoop and find out. You are married and neither of you have a right to have secrets from the other. You already have evidence he is hiding things from you. People who have nothing to hide, don't hide.

And lastly, your husband needs to find a career that will complement his marriage, not harm it. Taking more trips will never overcome the fact that you are not together every night. You need to be together every night to sustain a marriage. And you certainly need to be together every night to recover your marriage.
Posted By: BrainHurts Re: Exposing my secrets - I am the WS - 07/28/18 04:07 PM
I agree with the others. You need to put spyware on his devices. Will you do this?
Posted By: Hoke74 Re: Exposing my secrets - I am the WS - 07/28/18 09:58 PM
If he has nothing to hide he would agree to me installing spyware in all his devices. Just like I am happy for him to put spyware on mine.

Posted By: MelodyLane Re: Exposing my secrets - I am the WS - 07/29/18 12:07 AM
Originally Posted by Hoke74
If he has nothing to hide he would agree to me installing spyware in all his devices. Just like I am happy for him to put spyware on mine.

Spyware is useless if the person knows about it. If he knows its there, he can work around it.
Posted By: Tom2010 Re: Exposing my secrets - I am the WS - 07/29/18 03:40 AM
Hello indiegirl, and I agree about the 3-way, altho as I understand, it was several years ago. This type of desire acted out Can undermine any future trust in a marriage Unless there has been a lot of honest communication and expressed commitment since then. I haven't been here in awhile, and it just seems there has been a little piling on here in Hoke74's favor because it's easy to assume that that the husband has laid the ground for infidelity in a marriage and that he has never understood real openness and trust.


Tom
Posted By: Tom2010 Re: Exposing my secrets - I am the WS - 07/29/18 04:22 AM
Hoke74,

Let me explain a little about my comment to you - it was meant to cause you to realize that fighting suspected extra-marital sex or lack of closeness with sex, and NOT really communicating in-between Is a disaster for any marriage. I'm not blaming anyone here or taking sides, because we are all human, and in the human condition. Also, it may be a shock to your husband that you have been sexually active outside of your marriage.

I feel at least you want to, and hopefully your husband, want to reconcile to each other. Indiegirl urged you to engage with your husband in radical honesty. That's sort of a fancy term for just being truthful and sincere AND contrite. Let me explain - I am Catholic and I do go to confession. When I go, the value of my confession depends on whether or not I have been honest, sincere and complete, as well as my commitment not to sin again! It isn't easy tho, not knowing the priest or what he may think. The same principle applies to discussing and admitting to infidelity to your spouse. Embarassing yea, but cleaning also yea. I would urge both of you to read more on radical honesty and to keep in mind commitment to your marriage.


Tom




Posted By: living_well Re: Exposing my secrets - I am the WS - 07/29/18 08:09 AM
Originally Posted by MelodyLane
Originally Posted by Hoke74
If he has nothing to hide he would agree to me installing spyware in all his devices. Just like I am happy for him to put spyware on mine.

Spyware is useless if the person knows about it. If he knows its there, he can work around it.

First research what kind of spyware you would like to use. The Operation Investigate forum has some good suggestions. Then you will test by putting it first on your own device to make sure you can do this in a way that is invisible. My personal preference is for keystroke loggers because that way you can see exactly which app is being opened and used and for what.

Then you will offer your husband access to all your devices giving him passwords etc and ask if he can do the same for you.

Once you have his device, quietly install the spyware. You will want to keep checking this until it gets so boring that there is no reason to continue. Remember that there a lot of value in GPS data. You might casually ask why he is late and compare his answer with the data you have. Never reveal your sources by saying that his answer makes no sense.
Posted By: indiegirl Re: Exposing my secrets - I am the WS - 07/29/18 07:48 PM
Originally Posted by Tom2010
it just seems there has been a little piling on here in Hoke74's favor because it's easy to assume that that the husband has laid the ground for infidelity in a marriage

Oh I see the misunderstanding. I completely agree. Nobody caused Hoke's infidelity except for Hoke herself. Our main focus is getting her to pay her husband JC, but there is a complication. She can't do that if he is not home every night and she is entitled to snoop if he is not in case there are reasons he wants to retain the job. Snooping is harmless and caring.

It's not about 'who do we favour' but about the order of getting stuff done.

I agree with Melody Lane that job number one, now that she has exposed herself to her own spouse, is to contact the BW since her husband is not doing exposures.

There is no complication there and paying this lady the JC she owes her is a simple matter.
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