Someone posted this on GQII and I stole it! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/pfft.gif" alt="" />

What Men Need...no ifs, ands or buts!

Thank you for that!

And never forget.... men don't become lost....

Sometimes we don't know where we're at, but we never get lost.

(thus why we don't need to ask for directions)

Wow to Faith!

That article is very powerful - and oh so true! Eerily true! Thank you for posting that. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

FR

Whoa. I found it really creepy.

I find any article that speaks that way about men or about women creepy -- there's a fair bit in it of discussing men as though they are overgrown children or permanently crippled. A whole lot of "if he feels bad for any reason he'll act badly", coupled by a whole lot of suggestions on how to keep the poor dear from feeling bad, but generally skipping over the concept that adulthood = taking care of your own behavior whether you feel bad or not.

That being said, there's some very good information in the article. It's a shame about the creepy aspects.

Honestly, my first reaction upon reading the article was that here was yet another confirmation that I must not really be a man. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/shocked.gif" alt="" />

In my opinion, there are just enough elements of truth woven into "Dr." John Gray's pop-psych to give him enough seeming credibility to make him dangerous.

[color:"blue"]I agree with mineownself which is why i've never been an advocate of "Dr." John Grey. He does it seem as if men are big overgrown overly sensitive dummies and that women should contort themselves to understand them and try not to ruin their over inflated sense of self worth.

Sigh

Actually I think it is everyone's best interest to always be careful of one anothers sensitivities. Little hurts build up and become big pains later. In this respect, Grey's advice does work. I just don't like the way he presents it. Men are not 2 dimensional - they have a feminine side if they allow themselves to be vulnerable.

V.
[/color]

Gnome, are you my long lost cross-gendered lesbian twin brother?.....lol.....

Whenever I hear or see a stereo typical article about men, I can almost always point out what differs me from that article. Of course, most of the time I've done that have been while single or within the confines of an extremely unhealthy marriage.

So I read that one looking for the differences and I found many but I also found something new for and quite interesting. For some odd reason I also found similarities. Could it be because now I'm more self aware? Could it be that now being in the bliss of a healthy marriage that things change? Could it be that now that I've tasted those three things he talked about, now I view them as important and see their revelence? I don't know.

For right now, all I'm saying is that it's interesting....

I'm not the biggest fan of John Gray and consider him pretty much full of it on many things. For example:

"Without appreciation, a person begins to feel inadequate and incapable of giving support."

This is hogwash. When your efforts and qualities aren't appreciated, you don't start felling inadequate, you start becoming resentful. Incapable of giving support? He must be kidding. My ex apprciated nothing I ever did and she got all my support.

Women need these things just as much as men do, though the priority may be a bit different. I think Harley's EM ideas are much better than Gray's idea.

What's eerily true for me about this article is it stresses all the things my STBX said I didn't do for him and MOW did. I didn't appreciate him while he said "MOW shines for me." I didn't accept him as he was and, of course, MOW appreciated everything about him. And finally, I didn't trust him while he said, "MOW has my back!"

He was right. I didn't appreciate him losing his sobriety, being unfaithful, lying to me, and then becoming verbally abusive, kicking in doors, throwing things, knocking me down, chasing me in his car...etc.

I didn't accept him the way he was for the same reasons.

I didn't trust him because he lied and I didn't "have his back" because I wouldn't lie for him to the police and MOW would.

That was kind of vent, but seriously, the article seems true, maybe not the whole story, but true as far as it goes from the men I've known and true about how I reacted that might have hurt my relationships. My question is, how to make suggestions and ask for stuff without showing a lack of appreciation and acceptance. I've really felt this was "my part" in the demise of our M. My STBX certainly made his own mistakes, for which he's paying the biggest price, and in hindsight, I don't think I could've done anything to save our M with the alcohol and drugs, not to mention the MOW.

Still, I worry about my tendency to want to "fix" the men I'm with. They express a desire or interest and I want to tell them how to achieve it. Secretly, I want to improve them, partly for their sake, and partly for mine. My last BF didn't have as much education and didn't make as much money - a set up for failure with me offering suggestions about following his dream. Heck it was HIS dream, I was just trying to help him achieve it... But, the reaction was the very same stubbornness described by John Gray.

That's a disrespectful way to treat anyone. If someone wants your suggestions, they'll ask. Have you read the book Love Busters? It might be of some assistance.

I have to agree with mineownself here.I almost felt like I was reading about my WH in the article.Lots of areas that sounded all too familiar and why,partly so,I think he went off and cheated.Warped ideals about love,committment,self worth,expression,communication and respect.

"It is the trusting glimmer in a woman's eye that enchants a man out of his self absorption and inspires him to respond to her needs." Glimmer? How can you tell?? I have to have some glimmer in my eyes AND be responsible for having my needs met by another person? If I don't have glimmer is it over for me? Yes I can meet plenty of my own needs and go without other's but if there is a need to be met by my partner I have to have some glimmer first for the chance.oy. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />

"Most of the time a man doesn't realize the importance of compassion or an apology.It is a woman's responsibility to let a man know what she needs to hear."

That's pretty bad.Men don't know how to say sorry? And now it's my responsibility to say I need an apology? Will I get one with that statement? Does he really suggest we have to ASK for an apology?? Shouldn't a grown man be able to recognize and admit when he is wrong(as do women) and just say it? It sounds like he is describing infantile men.

It just seems to me that articles like these and books too keep perpetuating the ideals of looking elsewhere for value,worth and self esteem and placing importance on other's for what we all need to be building within ourselves.Happiness too.It shouldn't be dependent on other's but whatever positive feelings we get from our SO's/spouses should be icing on the cake,not the foundation.

IMO.

O