Need some interpretation help.

I had a date Sat. night with someone who I've met very recently. [He is very respected by the couple that introduced me to him btw] We enjoyed a game of bowling and afterwards went and got something to eat. [one more piece of info, he's just been divorced 1 month]

My original intent was to not invite the guy in after the date to keep the date very casual. However, I was back home shortly after 10, the evening had went very well, friendly, talking, no flirtation, so I thought, maybe it would be nice to continue talking and invited him in.

The talking continued and all was well.
After about an hour, he asked me if he could move closer to me, and at that point I got very nervous. I wasn't feeling that he or I felt any romantic type feelings and it caught me off guard, and I then said to him, I would rather you didn't.
I tried to explain myself, and I feel like I did a miserable job at that! I'm interested in dating, but when I have went out [3X now] I feel numb to the guys. I have no rushes of feelings.
I would say it's safe to say, I hurt his feelings, and I'm not expecting a return call.

So, my question is....
Was I sending a mixed signal by inviting him in my home? Was I giving the impression I wanted more to happen?
Obviously, this event has been weighing on my mind and I'm feeling bad about it.

Thanks,
Karona

I read "no feelings" to be the wall you are putting up to protect yourself.
I don't know about inviting him back to your house. If you explained it was just for conversation, well, who knows.

Thanks Newly!

I think to a point, it's self protection mode.
What I'm looking for in the dating world, is a friends first type relationship. Enjoying time together, and learning. I don't understand the rush to get to the good stuff. To me, the good stuff comes after mutual ground/attraction has been achieved. [and I want to take time with that step]

That leads me to believe, I'm either mature or out touch with reality.

To clarify, I didn't explain to him I was inviting him in for conversation, it was an assumed on my end because the evening had been casual and was pleasant. For me, it was a continuation. I guess this is where I need to learn more about communication!

K!

Hi Karona,

If you haven't been out with this man before,the first thought that came to my mind was yes you did invite him in too soon.To me,invitation into the home,your home,is more intimate.It means you trust him anough to enter your world a bit more.So,perhaps he did get mixed signals.

For me,I know that if I date again it will take several dates,at some other destination,for me to see if I would feel secure enough for a man to enter into my safe place,my sanctuary,my home.Until I am sure about that he is not going to know where I live in case he turns out to be a creep.I also have two daughters like you and want to protect them.

Also,if it was a first date,I wouldn't expect too mnay feelings up front either.It takes time to get to know someone more.Asking to sit closer to you was maybe a bit forward on his part.Maybe he was rushing things a little.I would feel uncomfortable about that too.

Anyway,I have been reading everyone's trials and tribulations here with great interest as I look toward my own future post D.I hope one day things will feel a little more comfortable for you in the dating scene.

May I ask,what do your DD's think about you dating now?

O

Thanks O-G!

Hindsite is an awesome thing. The only problem with it is, you learn AFTER the mistake.

My error was, I honestly felt we were on the same page. He wasn't forward at all, a gentleman. It was nice conversation, I honestly didn't feel flirtation on either side.

I had the same intentions you have. I even talked this over with family and a friend before this date and stated my intent. The date seemed on a friendly level, and I had not one clue that I was being misleading.
That tells me I have learning to do.

You are wise to read up here before jumping in. I didn't date much when I was young, I was the steady boyfriend type. So, this is new to me.

As far as my girls, they are 15&11. My oldest very much wants me to date and would love it if I would get married, and tomorrow wouldn't be too soon.
My youngest is more guarded with the whole thing. She doesn't have a problem with dating, but she will be tough on a guy that comes into my life.

Good luck with your D process. How much longer until it's final?

Thanks!
Karona

I need to add a couple facts that were not mentioned in the beginning......

This was not my first official meet with this guy.
I was introduced to him at a game where we sat near each other and had small conversation. I went to another game, where we again sat near each other, and had general conversation. At that game, he asked if he could call me, and I said yes.

We met for lunch [drove separately] later that week.

This date came a week after our lunch meet.
We live very close to each other. We were both already aware of the location of each other's homes. [I drive by his house daily. It's on a main street and I live off of that street]

K

Hi Karona-

I don't know if you sent mixed signals or not. What I notice however is that you are very guarded at this time. You are putting up your walls to protect yourself. Don't ignore this. Take things at your own pace and don't let anyone influence you otherwise. Continue to be open and upfront and go from there.

Wish I had better advice, but my mind as well as a lot of other stuff is totally drained at the moment. I really wish we were closer.

Take care and God bless!

K

Hi Karona,

I don't really know if you sent the "wrong signal" but it was what first popped into my head.It seems that for some people,you give them an inch and they take a mile.It was good that you knew him beforehand.I wasn't sure.

I think it will still be several dates for me to think about bringing a man to my home.My girls(11 & 14) are "sheltered" and have not seen the end of the D yet so have a while to go to even think about Mom dating.My girls aren't even remotely interested in that with boys( thank heavens!).It's been us girls for a long time and I worry that they may feel upset at me being with anyone else other than their Dad since we were a very loving,happy family before my WH's A.

It has crossed my mind not to date until they are out of HS but then,I get a little sad at that thought too.I'd like to have a man in my life and I feel like I have a lot to offer but I don't want my girls to be unhappy,they are my priority and I have heard horror stories about "Step" people.I guess I will deal with it all when the time comes.

Anyway,this past Fall things took a real ugly turn for the worse regarding our D and we each hired our own repsective Lawyers because Mediation broke down.It was a nightmare.But we are back on track thankfully and hope to be officially done by the end of next month and just wait for the papers to get through the courts.

Well,it's Monday now so I am waiting to see if this gentleman calls you or not.Would you like to see him again?

O

I am also a wall person.
Don't write it off yet, and you can get his view from your mutual friends.
I want friends first too.
I also finally got out my relationship books - now I just need to read them.
I saw a psychic last week who said I'm meet my lifemate this year, so I better get cracking. The best news I heard from this lady was that my X is OK with my kids. He's verbally abusive to me, but not to them. He's just tactless with my emotional one. So very good news for me that my DD's are OK.

Take your time but know what you want.

I was just thinking that computer dating may have its benefits.
You can talk to people, on the computer, by phone or email, and never really have to meet them. So, walls can be kept in place for quite a while.

And Karona, where is it you live again that there are so many eligible guys to date? I didn't think NW PA was that populated, but I may need to change my thinking.

Thanks girls!

I know none of know each other, and it makes it hard to post our respective questions, and for us to honestly say how things may or may not be.

What I want to be known is, I'm not a flirtatious person or forward or anything of the like.

I'm really struggling with this date situation today. I think mainly because I may have made him feel bad, and not only that, the fact that I didn't realize what a vulnerable position I put myself in.
I feel if I could say anything positive about myself, it would be that I almost always make good judgement and have good common sense. However, I let myself down this time and it really bothers me. Huh, can you imagine if he would have put his arm around me, or worse kissed me? That might have sent me to the cave forever!

So yes Still, you are right. I am being guarded. I don't know if it's, if I don't see pontential, I'm not even going down that path or if its more than that. That I'm so afraid of someone hurting me that I won't let a guy close to me. I'm counting on you all to keep me in check!
Hey Still, I could use you just as much as your saying you could use me. These times are not easy!

OG~
Again, I was exactly where you are with this whole thing. This is not typical behavior for me. I tend to always think things thru, before acting. That's how safe I felt about what I did. I think that's why I'm being so hard on myself.
I feel like I put him and I in a bad position, and it doesn't feel too good.

So, our girls are very close in age. My oldest just turned 15 in Dec. and I'm a couple yrs older than you. Lots in common! My girls also are not interested in boys. Well, my oldest claims she would like to have a boyfriend, but she is not even close to boy crazy. Youngest could care less.
It has also been my girls and I type of situation. The end of Feb first of March my x will have been gone 3 yrs. But, even while married, it was the girls and I for the most part because he worked so much. I know where your coming from on that.
It's hard to say how your girls will react. I did date a guy [sooner than I should have, another lesson learned] and I never ever showed anything physical towards him in front of my girls. In my mind, I was respecting my girls because of their father and them seeing me with someone else, but, it was also a mistake because they didn't realize we were anything more than friends. In their innocent minds, we were all equal friends. My youngest even said to me after it ended, "XX acted like he liked you better than us". It's really hard and a fine line to walk.
I hope things will finish up for you next month. It's an awful wish, as none of us wished for our marriages to end in divorce. But, when it comes down to the end, its a wish to put it behind you so you can finally move on, and pick up the pieces and rebuild.
I wish you the best!

And Newly,
I would have never told on myself, but since you brought it up, I will join in.
After the break up with bf I went twice. I know I'm taught not to do these things, but I needed hope, a glimmer of hope that there is life waiting for me out there in this sleepy place I live. [IT's crazy! Some of the stuff they say hits scary close and the other stuff you have to laugh at]

So, yeah, I was told the same. 2006 was going to be my year. And this guy is someone I know, and we are going to have this terrific life. My youngest is hard on guys, but 'this' guy will have a way with her and they will get along........and my oldest prays for me to meet someone [honest to goodness, she does bless her heart]
I hope your's was correct as far as your girls go. I would say it must be, otherwise I would think you would hear it from them.

I'm convinced friends first is the best method! It has to be. Afterall, that's who you want to be with, your friend.

So yes, it's Monday and NO, I have not heard from him.
I'm okay with things not working out. I didn't have my heart set on him and I didn't have a big rush of feelings. The only thing I'm struggling with is feeling bad about the whole situation.

Thanks all! I do appreciate your support more than you know.
Karona

Newly, I will tell you, BUT I better not hear you laughing down here.
WestVirginia, and NO, there are NOT a lot of guys here.
Well, not ones that I would consider anyway.

Men are not plentiful around here! IT's a small town and for the most part very much family.

Maybe when I recover from this one, I will venture back to the cyber guys, or, maybe not!

K!

So it must be SR who lives in NWPA.

Did you see the movie "walk the line"? There was a part in the movie where June Carter Cash was in a store in Wheeling, WV buying a fishing pole. A woman walked up to her and said "her parents were such good people, but she was divorced". Like she was dirt. I know that part stuck to me because I think most of us are done thinking we are like dirt, and are actually glad for our divorces and the people we have become.

And WV has gotten too much press lately. I hope they don't continue to get the same type. I can't imagine what those people (and families) go through for that profession.

You are so right about WV Newly.
I haven't lived here forever, but the miners and families I have met are the most honest people, and hard working.

It's been pretty sad. The first mining tragedy was only 30 mi from me. There was a guy and extended family in church, he made it out [obviously, there were many there that day]It was an emotional service because of this guy and his family that day, and remembering his friends and co-workers.

I do want to see that movie, but have not yet.
I have heard it's excellent. I like Reese a lot to begin with!
Divorce plays a major role on the ole self esteem, no doubt about it!

K.

I have to agree with newly Karona, you seem to have a wealth of available gentlemen in your area. Many more than I am anticipating in Northern WI I might add.

I have never tried the internet thing. Although it provides a safety net of sorts and allows you to screne and progress at your own pace, I also worry it is misleading as people can make themselves out to be anyone they want and I have seen friends get hooked in by the fake people only to be hurt by the real thing.

Keep us posted if he calls. This whole dating this is probably tough for him too, so you really don't know what he is thinking or will do.

Hang in there. You are doing great!

Take care and God bless!

K

I'm not avoiding you hun, just not sure what to say. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Although we're not exactly sure what you said to him, explaining yourself when the wall went up is the best thing, if you're concerned about salvaging a relationship. If you're not concerned about seeing him again, don't worry about it. (not trying to be mean) But it sounds like you ARE concerned. If you don't hear from him in a few days, maybe he is a little confused - by being new to the dating thing - and you might give him a buzz and invite him for coffee. Perhaps you can put things back on a friendly playing field. Keeping things on a "friend" level is comfortable for YOU, and best for him, being so new out of his divorce.

hugs,
Faith1

Oh, I find that so funny Still.
You'll just have to trust me on this one.

I have tinkered with the dating site before. But, I was stupid in that too. I didn't want to be seen, so I made myself invisible, or, just put myself out there, but wouldn't let them see my pic.
I still like the idea of being found on my own right kind of thing, instead of the search.

How are you feeling Still? Anymore communication on your end?

K.

I didn't think that for a minute Faith.

I did not have my heart set on this guy, so, I am fine with it not working out.
I wish I would have just said, I not ready for that, and left it at that. Sometimes when I try to explain myself, I dig a deep hole!

I did TM him yesterday AM, thanking him for the evening, had a nice time kind of thing, but he didn't reply. Now, that would be assuming he got the message and all.

I need to let it go, and learn from it.

Thanks Faith!
Karona

Hi karona,

Here is my interpretation of your date. Otherwise known as my 2 cents. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />



You could very well have been his first date after his divorce. He probably has no idea what he is doing signal wise either.



You wanted more conversation, the top EN of most women. This is much better done at first over the phone and through e-mails. I would not "date" anyone until there has been weeks of phone calls.



Interesting request, not a kiss just closer. Yep he ain't got a clue what you want or how to read you. Because you two have not conversed enough. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" />


Yes



Yes, that's why he asked if he could move closer.

A little advice for what it's worth. Before you "date" again. Make sure there is enough conversation over the phone/through e-mail so you have an idea who the other person is. I think you'll find you won't be so "num" to your feelings.

I guess, Karona, you already know my opinion. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

I'd just add: even if you conversed enough before 1st date, then you invited him in that very first date... it'd be the same...
It is not about 'mixed signals' so much as we think; it's a kind of 'male rules'... to show off their 'manhood'...
'What would you think if they don't show a normal wish for intimacy? Are they men enough?'
And this might have nothing to do with your mixed signals nor their special wish 'to sit closer'...
Just men... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
Not to forget some women's rules too... for many, many of them 'no' means 'yes'...
So, they don't know who they deal with, the same as we don't...

In general. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

{{{{Karona}}}}, No advice here. I don't have much dating experience either and can easily see myself in the same kind of situation. I read here mostly to hear other people's experiences hopefully to avoid a few mistakes if/when I begin dating again.

I've always put up a wall at first and then ended up rushing forward too fast. Sounds like the slow, patient build-a-friendship-first approach is probably best. I sure hope I do better next time around than I have in the past!

Have you heard anything from your mutual friends?

Well - my take on this is going to be a little different. (How many are surprised at that?) <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" />

Previous to the date - Karona had obviously sought the advice of the people she knows and who respect this man. That information makes the sitch much different than a "general" date. I know that my friends would never knowingly steer me wrong and I believe the same is true for K. If they weren't darn sure about the character of this man - I feel they would've shared this info with K. I get the impression that K did not have her guard up due mostly to input from their mutual friends.

Finishing the date at 10PM is a bit early (even for those of us 40+!) and she admitted that the date had gone well so far. With all of this in mind - I do not see anything wrong with inviting the man in for some conversation. I've kept up with K for quite a while on here and she has a good head on her shoulders. She sensed no bad vibes and simply desired to get to know him a bit more.

Although I think it's a good thing that he asked about "getting closer", and didn't just go for it - I do think his request and desire was a bit premature and that he rushed it a bit. Let's face it - most of us are long past the "get what we can - as soon as we can" phase. (Note that I said "most of us..."!) <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

And when he did ask - K made a very good decision and did it respectfully IMHO.

So to answer your questions Karona:



Based on your explanation of the date and the circumstances surrounding it - I don't think so. I would not have considered the invitation as you "opening the door" to anything physical. But I've been accused of being a little slow in the "she's flirting with you" department too! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

W/o being there - it's hard to say. No matter though - I would not have expected and/or desired "more to happen" on the first date so it's really a moot point to me.

I sense that you're beating yourself up a little over this and hope you stop! All of us have to relearn to trust - not only for those we go out with, but also for our friends. If it had been 2AM and you'd been drinking and hanging all over each other all night; then yes - I'd say you were "guilty"; however that's not the impression I got from your description.

I feel your instincts are good and the situation proved this to be true. Nothing happened, you probably learned from this and perhaps your date did as well. It will be interesting to see how this plays out. I'll bet he contacts you again within a week and all becomes well. Let us know! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

FR

My take is pretty similar. Fresh out of divorce, this guy finds himself in a situation where, regardless of what he wants, there are certain vague, unspoken, inconsistent rules involved - rules which for all he knows may have changed from when he kind of sort of knew them before.

He's invited in to a woman's house after a date. Is this an invitation of a deeper sort? If it is, and he doesn't indicate some sort of interest, will she be offended? Will she write him off? Or, if it isn't that kind of invitation, and he does indicate some interest...well that would sure be embarrassing. What to do...

If I had to guess, I'd suppose that he's kicking himself at having misinterpreted matters, and not thinking about whether you, Karona, gave off "mixed signals" or not. Confusion and misinterpretation are built into this stupid, silly game called "dating." No one can get the signals right, but everyone thinks they ought to anyway.

Thanks All!

Yes BH, conversation is HIGH on this females list. I'm really "trying" to learn as much as I can. Talking to men is not something I'm skilled or comfortable with. It's a confidence thing for me. Thanks for the tips!

B2M~ You know, I do feel for the decent guys out there dating. I feel as bad for this guy as I do for myself. Being that he waited until almost the time he left to ask this question tells me, he may have been trying to get the courage to ask, and I shot him down. I really don't like making someone feel bad, but not so bad that it becomes at my expense. The good guys have it tough!

LT~ OHH, for me, it's going to have to be [I will borrow a phrase I heard and liked] "crippled snail slow". My wall is up so high and thick right now, slow is the only way it's going to happen. And for me, friends first is essential.

And FR, how is it that you "seem" to know me so well?
"I sense that you're beating yourself up a little over this and hope you stop! All of us have to relearn to trust - not only for those we go out with, but also for our friends. If it had been 2AM and you'd been drinking and hanging all over each other all night; then yes - I'd say you were "guilty"; however that's not the impression I got from your description."
Okay, I will try to put this puppy to rest!
Yes, I do need to learn to trust again. I believe I am capable of trusting, but it will need to be shown to me thru actions. Kind of sad, but true.
There was no drinking, no hanging, he was very much a gentleman throughout the evening!

Gnome~I had thought about the same thing. I know guys have a narrow line to walk, and I'm sure he felt some kind of pressure from 20+ yrs ago, that's what happened. I've also thought about him beating himself up over this, but I can about promise, no more than I have on myself!

I've learned a lot from one date, Amazing!
I think I'll see what time Panera closes so "next" [which maybe will be in another 6mos] time, I have a plan!

Thank you all for your kindness and thoughts. I appreciate it very much.

Karona

GDP:
Isn't this really all about communication? I'm thinking that if we (both men & woman) simply asked what the intent really is; then all this guessing/second-guessing, etc. would not be necessary.




Karona:
Good Lord Girl! I could never "seem to know you so well"! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Who said I was talking about him? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

FR

GDP:
Isn't this really all about communication? I'm thinking that if we (both men & woman) simply asked what the intent really is; then all this guessing/second-guessing, etc. would not be necessary.[/quote]



So, should I have asked him what he was going to do?


[/quote]Who said I was talking about him? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />[/quote]




There was no hanging or groping on my end either! I must have forgot to mention that! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/shocked.gif" alt="" />

K.

You would think so, wouldn't you. But I'm not so sure.

What was it that Algy said in "The Importance of Being Earnest"? Something like "The essence of romance is uncertainty."

It appears to me that the amount of romance in a relationship is often measured by the degree of angst it brings. Every word and action and gesture is scrutinized for its potential significance, and the suspense of never knowing quite where you stand with the other person keeps the excitement alive.

Just imagine what would happen if we ditched the system of inconsistent "signals" so rife with their multiple interpretations, and switched to forthright talk about what we were thinking and feeling about each other and about our relationship. A lot of the drama in the relationship would go away!

Nah, all the guessing and second-guessing is absolutely necessary, because otherwise we'd...well...we'd probably just end up as friends. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />

So I'm curious K, did you hear back from that guy?

Thinking of you <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
DW

AH, NO!
He has never called.

BUT---I did call him-last night. It has bothered me ever since last Sat. I felt as though I put him in a bad spot and I wanted a chance to explain myself.

He seemed glad that I called him. I think he felt bad about it, and he said he thought I didn't enjoy myself. [but what enjoying the evening has to do, with slipping in romantic gestures I'm not sure. I'm in no rush to rush any thing]
SO, he may call again at some point, possibly. We agreed that if we did go again, it would be on a friend level.

It was funny, he said, okay, so, we would go as friends. If the day comes when "K" grabs me and kisses me, then I'll know you're ready for more. To that I said, That would be about it! [I have no intent on doing that btw]

Thanks DW!
K!

Well good K! All's well that ends well, no?

I agree, but I think his ego may have been a bit bruised.

So glad you feel better about things now.....

Hugs
DW

And if this is how it ends, I find it a much better ending than the way it stood previously.

Perhaps his ego did take a hit, and I wish the situation would have never come up. But, it did, I have learned.

Karona