Marriage Builders
Posted By: recurring_pain Desparate...Any Help Is Appreciated - 02/26/12 02:42 PM
Hello everyone,

I'm in need of advice as everyone else on here is. I've been reading through the forum and have gotten some great information but thought I would post my situation and see what kind of feedback I got. I'll try not to make the post too long but I want to give as much information as possible.

Been married for 7 years, have a 2yr old and a 2.5 month old, both girls. My wife and I have known each other for over 11yrs. We get along great. We're best friends, never fight, never verbally abuse each other, never physically abuse each other, nothing like that at all. I know I have issues expressing my emotions as most males do.

Well, about 2 weeks ago my wife and I were sitting on the couch watching tv and she wants to talk. Basically she tells me that she's not happy anymore. Most of it is due to my emotionally neglecting her. I admit that is the truth. She says that she still loves me and still feels that we are best friends but doesn't know if she's still in love with me. She told me she needed some space so she goes to her sister's house which is about a mile away. We both agree that the kids need to stay in the house with me so as not to be "disrupted".
So here I am after she has been gone for about a week and a half. We have talked multiple times and she has basically told me that if she had to decide on what to do right now that she doesn�t know if she wants to try to fix things. I don�t know what to do. She still wants to do stuff together, laugh and talk. She doesn�t really want me to show her any type of affection (holding her hand, touching her back, etc) because she says that she�s uncomfortable with it right now.
So my first of many confused questions is what in the world do I do right now?
Posted By: MelodyLane Re: Desparate...Any Help Is Appreciated - 02/26/12 03:11 PM
lookingforhelp, welcome to Marriage Builders. I am sorry for the reasons that brought you here. It is very likely she is having an affair. Some of the signs of an affair are a) wanting "space", b) emotional detachment c) "Iloveyoubutamnotinlovewithyou." See, the solution to an unhappy marriage is to work to turn it around. Her resistance to doing that indicates she is leaving for another reason, that other reason being another man.

Your first order of business is to find out who she is seeing. Don't ask her, just quietly snoop. Put a GPS on her car, VAR in her car, spyware on her cell phone or a keylogger on her computer. But find out who it is and get the evidence.

When you do that, come back here and we will give you next steps.

Don't ask her about this.
Posted By: alis Re: Desparate...Any Help Is Appreciated - 02/26/12 03:55 PM
I agree there is a potential for affair.

I would also suggest, considering his wife is about 8-9 weeks postpartum, that she may be experiencing postnatal depression and a lack of emotional support from her husband is making it far worse.

I felt the same way as her when I went through my severe postnatal depression and there was no affair or anyone in my life except my husband and female relatives/friends.
Posted By: MelodyLane Re: Desparate...Any Help Is Appreciated - 02/26/12 04:09 PM
alis, the reason this smacks of affair is because she is not looking for solutions. It takes a powerful motivation for a woman to leave her home and her children. She has moved out and left a NEWBORN. When a woman is unhappy, she typically will complain until a solution is found. The fact that she didn't do that tells me there is more to this story.

Wanting "space" when her supposed complaint is emotional neglect makes no sense unless there is an affair.
Posted By: MelodyLane Re: Desparate...Any Help Is Appreciated - 02/26/12 04:13 PM
In other words, a woman who feels neglected will not ask for "space," she will ask for ATTENTION. A woman who is hiding something will ask for "space."
Posted By: alis Re: Desparate...Any Help Is Appreciated - 02/26/12 04:39 PM
MelodyLane,

I don't disagree that there are many red flags here that suggest an affair.

I am just offering an alternative possibility that he should consider, and that would involve speaking with her doctor. Women with postnatal depression (particularly severe) will 'give up' on motherhood, marriage, and life. A rational woman will ask for help and keep trying for a solution - but women with postnatal depression do not necessarily believe in rational paths to solution. Yes, they will abandon a newborn. It's been done.

It's just another avenue to explore. She stated these things at only 6 weeks postpartum which means it could be a possibility.
Posted By: MelodyLane Re: Desparate...Any Help Is Appreciated - 02/26/12 04:46 PM
I understand postpartum women are not "rational," however, that does not explain her desire for "space." That is almost exclusively a sign of an affair. Women don't just up and leave for "space" unless they have someone else lined up. Rational or not, people don't tend to work against their own interests even if they are not employing their powers of reason.

Husbands have a tendency to blame themselves because it gives them a false sense of control. This often serves as a distraction from digging out the real problem. I don't want him to get sidetracked. His first and most urgent step should be a quiet investigation to see if there is an affair going on.
Posted By: MelodyLane Re: Desparate...Any Help Is Appreciated - 02/26/12 04:50 PM
Originally Posted by Dr Bill Harley
"I've seen so many spouses lie about affairs, that when one spouse wants a separation, my best guess is that he or she is having an affair. I'm right almost every time.

Why would anyone need to be alone to sort things out? It makes much more sense to think that being separated makes it easier to be with their lover. Granted, there are many good reasons for a separation, such as physical or extreme mental abuse. But of all those I've seen separate, most have had lovers in the wings."
here
Thanks to all for their responses. As stated in my first post I didn't want to make the post read like a novel so I didn't include every detail. Here are some more details that might help clarify.

I want to address the issue of her abandoning her children first because that's not exactly right. I will have to say that I have asked her and I truely believe that she is not having an affair. Since her sister lives just down the road, my wife takes the 2.5 month old every other night. I keep the 2yr old every night. She comes over every morning to help get everyone ready for school and stays each night until the 2yr old is in bed so everything seems normal for her.

About the potential postpartum issue...I have actually thought about that myself. She had a very bad run with that after our first one was born. This time has not seemed as bad but all this that's happening has made me wonder about that.

She is a VERY emotional person and one of the biggest problems I am having is why she is so hesitant about trying to work this out. She has always been deeply in love with me. I admit that I have been emotionally neglectful of her in the past but I would have never thought she would NOT want to come to me and tell me that she's very unhappy and ask what we can do to fix it. It's like I'm having to pretty much drag her to any kind of "remediation", whether that be talking through the issue or going to marriage counseling to give this another try.
Posted By: MelodyLane Re: Desparate...Any Help Is Appreciated - 02/27/12 01:17 AM
Quote
. I admit that I have been emotionally neglectful of her in the past but I would have never thought she would NOT want to come to me and tell me that she's very unhappy and ask what we can do to fix it.

You have hit on one of the reasons why this is likely an affair. When a woman is unhappy, she complains endlessly until the problem is solved. Your wife is not doing that. A red flag.

I am so sorry but this is likely due to an affair. It may be something else, but in my 11 years on this board, it is an affair 99% of the time. The most obvious reason has to be ruled out - or in - before we can help you move forward with a plan.

I know it is tempting to want to latch onto less plausible explanations, but unfortunately, it is almost always an affair. frown

Please put on your supersleuth cap and get the evidence. Come back here when you have the evidence and we can help with next steps.
MelodyLane,

I will look around a little just to confirm but I still believe she is telling me the truth. She has known from the very beginning how I feel about cheating. I don't want to sound like I'm not taking your opinion seriously but she really isn't the type to do that.

I do agree that there are several signs that may point that way and I am very confused by the lack of desire to fix the issues, but I still trust her and I trust what she tells me until the minute I find out otherwise.

I'll see what information comes next and will keep you posted.

I have gotten her to agree with some counseling to see if that might help us through this. I'm calling a few places tomorrow to try and get something set up.

Again, thanks for all the advice and if anyone else has anything to add please do.
Posted By: MelodyLane Re: Desparate...Any Help Is Appreciated - 02/27/12 03:16 AM
Originally Posted by looking_for_help
MelodyLane,

I will look around a little just to confirm but I still believe she is telling me the truth. She has known from the very beginning how I feel about cheating. I don't want to sound like I'm not taking your opinion seriously but she really isn't the type to do that.
.

Just so you know, very rarely is anyone the "type" to do that. Yet they still have affairs. Her knowing your feelings about cheating would not prevent her from having an affair and the fact that you say you "trust her" is more of an indicator that you haven't really checked. It is too much trust that leads to affairs because the betrayed spouse never checks to see if such trust is truly warranted. The lack of checking allows secret second lives to thrive and grow.

Counseling is not going to be of much help to you at all if there is an affair. frown In fact, counseling is destructive to marriages when there is an affair. My suggestion would be to do a good job of sleuthing and see what she is doing before you take that step. Most counselors do not try to save the marriage, they try to facilitate divorce. So if that is she wants right now, the counselor will validate her.

No one can help you unless you know for sure what is going on here. I am afraid you are in for a big surprise when you check. I truly hope I am wrong. frown
Posted By: sundog Re: Desparate...Any Help Is Appreciated - 02/28/12 06:02 AM
Originally Posted by looking_for_help
I will look around a little just to confirm but I still believe she is telling me the truth. She has known from the very beginning how I feel about cheating. I don't want to sound like I'm not taking your opinion seriously but she really isn't the type to do that.

I came back around to the old forum today after recommending it to a coworker with some marital issues. I have to say, lots of new people, but this quote here is probably one that encapsulates what I recall hearing most from the new members.

Do yourself a favor and snoop anyway. I've heard countless stories here of saintly spouses that would never do something horrible like have an affair. Far too many times the concerned spouse ends up devastated when they find the truth.

My wife went through the same steps as yours before I found her secret email account full of love letters to the other man.

(Hmmm. It's been six years now and I can type that without feeling any hurt... never thought I'd get here.)

Listen to MelodyLane, she's a good one. Good luck.
Posted By: happyheart Re: Desparate...Any Help Is Appreciated - 02/28/12 08:29 AM
If your wife is having an affair or not, it cannot hurt to snoop, can it? Because she has battled with ppd in the past, I suggest that you find out what it going on ASAP. If not an affair, some seriously twisted thinking on her part is going on here.

Please look into her e-mail and phone accounts. If you do not think it is an affair, than you would still want to find out if she is suicidal or something. A normal new mother would never never ever leave her baby in the care of someone else, especially not someone who she thinks is neglectful.

In the mean time, look at the emotional needs and love busters questionaires and see how you can become the ideal husband. Date her! But she is not going to fall in love with you without seeing you. And why would a woman leave her home AND BABY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! just to think??? In what world?????

Many women feel bad after a baby but noone leaves their home and baby for it. She is either having an affair or has a serious brain chemistry problem (I'm saying that as an M.D., not meaning she is dumb or so).

You have to step up for her and your family here. You need to find out what is going on, because this is doing serious damage to the mother child bond. Going further down this path will have permanent effects on your children, especially the baby.

Man up here please. Just because you do not want to believe it, it is your duty as a husband and foremost as a father to make the mother of your baby come home immediately.

What kind of life is that for a baby, where it sees his mother only every other day? The child is only 2,5 months old. Wake up here.

Happyheart
Posted By: Viola Re: Desparate...Any Help Is Appreciated - 02/29/12 05:04 PM
As a mental health professional and a mom who has suffered from it, I have to say this sounds exactly like postpartum depression. Perhaps she had some underlying unhappiness with your marriage, but the PPD has intensified it. Educate yourself on PPD and make sure the kids are safe with her. And everyone quit judging on a mom who "leaves" her baby. PPD makes you do the unthinkable. Maybe she is having an affair, but don't rule anything out. It's not that simple.
Posted By: MelodyLane Re: Desparate...Any Help Is Appreciated - 02/29/12 05:16 PM
Originally Posted by Viola
As a mental health professional and a mom who has suffered from it, I have to say this sounds exactly like postpartum depression. Perhaps she had some underlying unhappiness with your marriage, but the PPD has intensified it. Educate yourself on PPD and make sure the kids are safe with her. And everyone quit judging on a mom who "leaves" her baby. PPD makes you do the unthinkable. Maybe she is having an affair, but don't rule anything out. It's not that simple.

As someone who has been dealing with affairs for years on this forum, it sounds just like an affair. We need to deal with reality and facts here, and FIRST rule out an affair. You need to educate yourself about affairs, Madam, if you intend on posting on a forum that specializes in such.
Posted By: MelodyLane Re: Desparate...Any Help Is Appreciated - 02/29/12 05:36 PM
Viola, I am sure you mean well, but let me explain how your advice is harmful to this poster. The most likely reason for this wife's separation is an affair. 99% of the time, when a wife wants a separation, she has another man lined up. That is just how women are. That has been the case in almost every instance in my 11 years on this forum. On the other hand, we have NEVER had a case where a wife with PPD left to "get space."

Dr Harley, who is a mental health professional, [licensed clinical psychologist with 40 years experience specializing in infidelity] says this about women who separate:

Originally Posted by Dr Bill Harley
"I've seen so many spouses lie about affairs, that when one spouse wants a separation, my best guess is that he or she is having an affair. I'm right almost every time.

Why would anyone need to be alone to sort things out? It makes much more sense to think that being separated makes it easier to be with their lover. Granted, there are many good reasons for a separation, such as physical or extreme mental abuse. But of all those I've seen separate, most have had lovers in the wings."

Common sense would dictate, therefore, that it is imperative to rule out the MOST LIKELY cause. But when you post about unlikely causes like PPD, a spouse who is in DENIAL will latch onto your unlikely explanation as a means of avoidance.

As you can see, he does not WANT to believe this is an affair and is not willing to do the necessary investigation. Your post gives validation to his path of denial and makes it harder for us to persuade him to do the necessary investigation.

As far as "judging" a mother who leaves her children, I think anyone would agree that is out of line unless she is severely mentally ill. And if that is the case, she needs psychiatric help. Women can be held accountable.
Posted By: Viola Re: Desparate...Any Help Is Appreciated - 02/29/12 10:10 PM
********************EDIT********************
Posted By: MBsurvivor Re: Desparate...Any Help Is Appreciated - 02/29/12 10:42 PM
Please help this poster find solutions that are advocated by Dr. Harley. Do not disrupt this thread any more!
Posted By: markos Re: Desparate...Any Help Is Appreciated - 02/29/12 10:47 PM
**edit**

Viola, you have not been attacked, and you were indeed encouraging the original poster to discount the possibility of infidelity, which is very dangerous to posters on this forum, so it was important for MelodyLane to correct any misunderstandings. While it is true that there are some exceptions to every rule, it is a DISTRACTION from posters in need to mention those exceptions when they focus on what they need to do for the majority of cases. Even I can point you to a time when Dr. Harley dealt with such an exception. It is still not relevant here.

Please don't come on as a newcomer spouting advice without some sort of history or credentials. We have a lot of people show up and give their own opinions or stuff they have heard from marriage counselors when the purpose of the forum is to learn and discuss Marriage Builders principles. That's not helpful.
Posted By: SadDude Re: Desparate...Any Help Is Appreciated - 03/01/12 08:03 PM
LFH, you'd be foolish to believe that your spouse isn't the type to have an affair. Sadly, I was foolish & neglectful, too, and discovered the white-hot pain that a 10 yr affair can wreak. At least you have evidence before your eyes...
I strongly recommend you follow Melody's advice, and investigate. Don't be satisfied with your W's answer- the WS will lie to your face- that's the sad reality, trust gets absolutely trampled in these matters.
Ok, so I found out that she had an affair with her ex that consisted of 2 sexual encounters. Long story short about that is that we have come to terms and we are dealing with that.

Here's where we are now. She says that even after all that has happened she has come back to her original reason for leaving...that she doesn't know whether she's still in love with me. She says she still loves me and has a great time when we're together but doesn't have those "deep down" feelings right now.

She says she's confused and doesn't know what to do or feel. She has agreed to go to counseling and see if they can help sort everything out. She has come back home from her sister's house.

I just don't know what I'm supposed to do now. I have been making changes to the things she says bothers her in regards to how I express my feelings and emotions to her. I've been doing many of the things that she has always wanted me to do. She reciprocates those things to a certain extent ONCE I INITIATE them. She very seldom initiates much affection (hugs, kisses, playful texts, etc). I have confronted her a couple times about this and she says that she just feels awkward doing that right now because of her mixed emotions toward me.

Now, I would like to dispel the thoughts that she's still involved in the affair please. I believe that it's over physically. She has told me on a couple occasions when we were talking about it that she still has feelings for him because she was with him all through high school and they were married for a year before we got together. She broke off the affair before I found out and had already decided that it wasn't what she was looking for. So I believe the issue that remains is the original reason why she sat down to talk to me and why she left.

I really need some advice on what I'm supposed to do right now. Am I supposed to continue to make and implement the changes to the way I am toward her or am I supposed to leave her alone to let her think? I'm so lost on what I'm supposed to be doing right now.
Posted By: MelodyLane Re: Desparate...Any Help Is Appreciated - 03/13/12 03:05 PM
Originally Posted by looking_for_help
I really need some advice on what I'm supposed to do right now. Am I supposed to continue to make and implement the changes to the way I am toward her or am I supposed to leave her alone to let her think? I'm so lost on what I'm supposed to be doing right now.

I am sorry you found an affair, lookingforhelp. frown Just know that this can be saved if you take some very specific steps.

The first you do is expose the affair. Expose the affair to her family, your family, the OM's family and the OM's wife, if any. Is the OM married? I would then go to her and DEMAND that she end all contact for life with him. That includes sending him a no contact letter that is written together and mailed by you. I would also suggest that you contact the OM personally - after you have exposed the affair - and tell him he is to never contact your wife again.

Then it will be your job to present a plan of recovery to your wife. Most marriages do not ever recover from infidelity because they don't follow these steps. Go read this post that describes what should happen next: http://forum.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2566602#Post2566602
I'll definitely read the post.

But my main concern right now is how I should act around her knowing how she feels toward me. I don't know what I should be doing.
Posted By: MelodyLane Re: Desparate...Any Help Is Appreciated - 03/13/12 03:20 PM
Originally Posted by looking_for_help
I'll definitely read the post.

But my main concern right now is how I should act around her knowing how she feels toward me. I don't know what I should be doing.

Did you read my post?
Posted By: MelodyLane Re: Desparate...Any Help Is Appreciated - 03/13/12 03:24 PM
She doesn't have feelings for you because she is in a FOG. She is still high on her feelings for the OM. So the way to wave off the fog and motivate her to recover the marriage is to EXPOSE THE AFFAIR and present the program as I outlined it.

Feelings follow ACTIONS, so in order to change her feelings, you must attack the FOG and make it possible for your efforts to have an effect. By keeping the affair a secret, you FUEL the fog which makes it more likely she will resume her affair and makes it LESS likely that she will fall in love with you.

How do you know she has ended contact? Has she moved back home and are you spying on her?

How did you find the affair in the first place?
I did read the post.

The reason I don't think the affair has any bearing on her feelings right now is that the affair happened after she told me she felt this way and that she was leaving in the first place. The affair happened a week or so after.

I know she has ended contact because she has moved back home and I have been keeping tabs on her by calling/texting and talking to her about where she is at all times. She has really not had time or the opportunity to see or talk to him. She has continuously told me that that the feelings and emotions that she's trying to work through now are the same ones that she was feeling before the affair. That's what I'm trying to deal with.

I found the affair because I had a bad feeling that she wasn't telling me something. I started checking her cellphone records and found a phone number. I confronted her about 2 weeks or so ago and she admitted that she had seen him twice and that she had already ended it. She said she made a huge mistake and that was not what she wanted and that she didn't find what she was looking for with him.

Since this was exposed she has told me that as terrible as it is she feels better about it being out in the open. But she is still dealing with how she feels toward me in regards to those "deep down feelings". Any advice for how I need to conduct myself in that regard?
One more side note about the affair.

It was totally by chance that it happened. She had no intentions of contacting him. He contacted her after she went to stay at her sister's house to tell her his grandma had passed away. And we all know where that led from there. The positive note that I've got from this is that she ended it willingly on her own accord before I found out.

After I found out I told her that if she has any desire to work through that part of our troubles, she was to call him or contact him once more to tell him that they are to never talk or cross paths again and if they did she had better tell me right away.

I think this part of our troubles are being dealt with.
Posted By: MelodyLane Re: Desparate...Any Help Is Appreciated - 03/13/12 03:42 PM
Originally Posted by looking_for_help
.

The reason I don't think the affair has any bearing on her feelings right now is that the affair happened after she told me she felt this way and that she was leaving in the first place. The affair happened a week or so after.

The affair has everything to do with her feelings. It is WHY she left in the first place. She is comparing her feelings for you to the fantasy feelings she has for him. You don't understand what you are dealing with.

Quote
I know she has ended contact because she has moved back home and I have been keeping tabs on her by calling/texting and talking to her about where she is at all times. She has really not had time or the opportunity to see or talk to him. She has continuously told me that that the feelings and emotions that she's trying to work through now are the same ones that she was feeling before the affair. That's what I'm trying to deal with.

Calling and talking to her and texting her is NOT keeping tabs on her. Unless you have a better spy system she has plenty of opportunity to speak to him and email him, chat on IM, etc. How are you making sure none of that is happening? What you say here leads me to believe the affair is still active. Are you even spying at all?

Quote
Since this was exposed she has told me that as terrible as it is she feels better about it being out in the open. But she is still dealing with how she feels toward me in regards to those "deep down feelings". Any advice for how I need to conduct myself in that regard?

To whom was the affair exposed?
Posted By: MelodyLane Re: Desparate...Any Help Is Appreciated - 03/13/12 03:45 PM
Originally Posted by looking_for_help
One more side note about the affair.

It was totally by chance that it happened. She had no intentions of contacting him. He contacted her after she went to stay at her sister's house to tell her his grandma had passed away. And we all know where that led from there. The positive note that I've got from this is that she ended it willingly on her own accord before I found out.

This is a lie. The affair was going on long before she moved out. That is WHY she moved out. And I doubt it is over.

Quote
After I found out I told her that if she has any desire to work through that part of our troubles, she was to call him or contact him once more to tell him that they are to never talk or cross paths again and if they did she had better tell me right away.
.

You have no idea what you are doing or how to resolve this and are making disasterous strategic mistakes that are going to lead to the demise of your marriage.
Posted By: MelodyLane Re: Desparate...Any Help Is Appreciated - 03/13/12 03:48 PM
Please accept that you don't have good instincts for this and allow us to help you. You started off by insisting there was no affair because "she is not that type of person" and now you are attempting to use those same foolish instincts to repair your marriage. Your best thinking has screwed up your marriage, my friend.

And if you want to turn this around, you need to start listening. You are making mistakes that will doom your marriage because you don't know what you are doing.
I really don't know what to say right now. I feel like everyone thinks the affair is the root of all this and I do not think that. I know you all have more experience with these things than I do but I still know my wife in certain aspects better than anyone.

I am listening to all advice but everyone keeps keying in on the stupid affair and the root of everything is being neglected because no one seems to think it's important.

I do apologize for getting frustrated but I feel like I am capable of having some rational though in this. Please don't feel like I'm not listening because I am. I found out about the affair because I had some bad vibes and because you convinced me to do some checking. So I know you know what you're talking about.

On the other hand I feel like everyone is telling me that I am ignorant in all my thinking about this and that I can't know what I'm talking about when it comes to some things I have concerns about.

Please accept my apologies and understand that I'm not upset because of the advice I'm getting. I'm upset because I'm not getting answers to my questions. Everyone keeps telling me what to do about the affair and I feel like the affair is being dealt with. Maybe not by the textbook way that MB suggests at the time, but there are multiple issues here that I'm trying to deal with.
Posted By: MelodyLane Re: Desparate...Any Help Is Appreciated - 03/13/12 04:12 PM
Originally Posted by looking_for_help
I really don't know what to say right now. I feel like everyone thinks the affair is the root of all this and I do not think that. I know you all have more experience with these things than I do but I still know my wife in certain aspects better than anyone.

No, you don't. You are the least objective person when it comes to your wife. All one has to do is read this thread to see how blind you are when it comes to your wife. We knew MORE about what your wife was doing than you did and we have never even met her! No one can help you if you won't listen.

Let me know when you get serious. I will be here, but I am not wasting time posting to someone who refuses to listen.
Posted By: MelodyLane Re: Desparate...Any Help Is Appreciated - 03/13/12 04:21 PM
I answered your question here. You just don't like the answer because you don't understand your situation. Your goal is to sweep the affair under the rug, which will prevent you from recovering your marriage.

Originally Posted by MelodyLane
Originally Posted by looking_for_help
I really need some advice on what I'm supposed to do right now. Am I supposed to continue to make and implement the changes to the way I am toward her or am I supposed to leave her alone to let her think? I'm so lost on what I'm supposed to be doing right now.

I am sorry you found an affair, lookingforhelp. frown Just know that this can be saved if you take some very specific steps.

The first you do is expose the affair. Expose the affair to her family, your family, the OM's family and the OM's wife, if any. Is the OM married? I would then go to her and DEMAND that she end all contact for life with him. That includes sending him a no contact letter that is written together and mailed by you. I would also suggest that you contact the OM personally - after you have exposed the affair - and tell him he is to never contact your wife again.

Then it will be your job to present a plan of recovery to your wife. Most marriages do not ever recover from infidelity because they don't follow these steps. Go read this post that describes what should happen next: http://forum.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2566602#Post2566602
Posted By: MelodyLane Re: Desparate...Any Help Is Appreciated - 03/13/12 04:29 PM
Originally Posted by lookingforhelp
I feel like everyone thinks the affair is the root of all this and I do not think that. I know you all have more experience with these things than I do but I still know my wife in certain aspects better than anyone.

This is how well you know your wife:


"I will have to say that I have asked her and I truely believe that she is not having an affair."

"I will look around a little just to confirm but I still believe she is telling me the truth. She has known from the very beginning how I feel about cheating. I don't want to sound like I'm not taking your opinion seriously but she really isn't the type to do that."

"I do agree that there are several signs that may point that way and I am very confused by the lack of desire to fix the issues, but I still trust her and I trust what she tells me until the minute I find out otherwise."

think
I respect you and your advice very much or I wouldn't still be here.

I had a feeling from before I actually started posting here that an affair was possible....I just didn't want to admit that to myself because I love my wife so much. Once I posted, you pushed me to the point of convincing me to check on her to find out what I already suspected.

What I am frustrated about is the fact that I am hearing that everyone thinks there is ZERO chance that I know the least about what I'm doing here and that everyone else knows my wife better than I do. Yes, it's true that you may have been convinced earlier than I was about the affair but only because you have had experience dealing with the circumstances surrounding them, not because you know my wife better. That's what I'm frustrated with.

I know I'm gonna defend her more than anyone but I also believe that I have enough of a handle to know about the reality of the situation. I want to fix my marriage more than anything I have ever encountered but I am not and never have been one for playing games to get anything done. If I ask her about something and tell her that if she doesn't tell me the truth and stick to it I'm out of here with our children, she knows I mean it. I have never been one to play around with stuff like that. I guess if she chooses to go against those wishes of mine then she doesn't want to stay anyway.

I don't really know what you're going to say about that and I will respect anything you do say. I see what you're saying when you say I'm not very objective right now but I do not believe that anyone KNOWS my wife better than I do. I will agree that many people may know and understand the circumstances surrounding her actions better than I do.

I guess my bottom line is that if I lay down how things need to be to her and she chooses to not abide by those wishes then we can never work through this anyway.I have and never will claim to know more about how to deal with everything but I honestly do think that I am not completely blind as to how to do some things here.

Please don't give up on me yet. I may not agree with everything that's being said but I am listening. I have no one to talk to about this.
Posted By: MelodyLane Re: Desparate...Any Help Is Appreciated - 03/13/12 05:15 PM
lfh, please understand that we do know your wife better than you do right now. We have been proven right in that regard. All waywards are the same and this is why they are so easy for us to understand. We have an objective view that you do not possess because you, understandably, have a strong emotional desire to believe her. We don't have such an emotional investment and understand her better than you do.

The problem is that you are focusing on the wrong things because you CHOOSE to believe a liar. Your wife is a liar and her goal is to minimize the effect of the affair, lie about the reasons behind the separation, and blame you for her affair. By accepting her lies, you avoid the real problem, the AFFAIR. You allow her to divert you from the real problem.

But that is ok. It is your marriage to lose, not mine. I have saved my marriage. You can take the advice or leave it. I have a family, career, and a very busy life so I don't have time to try to persuade you to recover your marriage. The best I can do is show you a path that works, and it is up to you to accept or reject it. You are free to disagree and reject the advice of people who have saved their marriages. That is your right!

I wish you the best!
I'm sorry if I offended you.
Posted By: SoPhillyGal Re: Desparate...Any Help Is Appreciated - 03/13/12 05:56 PM
LFH...I really only very limited to offer you in the way of advice. The reason why I say this is not because I did not listen (because I did) to what everyone offered me in the way of advice, but because I did not act upon what advice everyone offered me here. The seasoned posters have heard it all and unfortunately with infidelity it is mostly a cookie-cutter type of behavior. As a BS, I acted and continued to think I knew my BS better than anyone in the world...and when he wasn't involved in the affair, of course I did. However, ten years ago, that person was lost and while I had the chance to get him back...I listened but did not act....and unfortunately, it backfired. MB is the best and most accurate advice you will ever receive and the added extra bonus...it's dealt with true compassion!! All teh best to you...
Posted By: sunnydaze53 Re: Desparate...Any Help Is Appreciated - 03/13/12 07:37 PM
LFH,
I have not been on here in over a year. I actually forgot my password. I only logged on now to give you a brief look into the mind of a wayward.

I had an EA that turned PA. Prior to the PA; however, I was already on my way out of the marriage BECAUSE OF THE EA. The OM and I had plans to meet at a family function as he was a mutual friend of various family members. I figured after that occasion I would then tell my husband that my feeling toward him have changed and this "relationship" just happened after the fact.

My guess is she was already in contact with the ex...maybe not physically but over the internet or phone. After she seperated from you, she felt available to take it to the next level.

I have no doubt you were neglecting your wife and as part of plan A you will work to remedy that situaion; HOWEVER, you must let go of the mindset that that in any way justifies her affair. You must first deal with the affair which is most likely not over. It may have stopped for now but will most likely reignite if it isn't ended properly.

I really can't give you any advice regarding the plans as I was on the other side so listen to the vets. Of course you must not be neglectful but you must also put into place extraordinary precautions to stop this affair or any other that occurs when times are tough. Just calling her and texting is not enough. I spoke to my DH while I was with the OM.

I am signing back out now.

Good luck and God Bless you
Posted By: MelodyLane Re: Desparate...Any Help Is Appreciated - 03/20/12 03:37 PM
Originally Posted by looking_for_help
MelodyLane,

I will look around a little just to confirm but I still believe she is telling me the truth. She has known from the very beginning how I feel about cheating. I don't want to sound like I'm not taking your opinion seriously but she really isn't the type to do that.

I do agree that there are several signs that may point that way and I am very confused by the lack of desire to fix the issues, but I still trust her and I trust what she tells me until the minute I find out otherwise.

Originally Posted by lookingforhelp
I really don't know what to say right now. I feel like everyone thinks the affair is the root of all this and I do not think that. I know you all have more experience with these things than I do but I still know my wife in certain aspects better than anyone.

I hate to point out that we were RIGHT. Are you ready to start working on your marriage now? Or are you going to continue to take your own counsel?
Posted By: alis Re: Desparate...Any Help Is Appreciated - 03/20/12 03:39 PM
How was it dealt with? Tell us exactly what happened and what you/her did about it. What was the timeline? PA/EA? Did you verify? How?

^You cannot just move on to other things without dealing with this properly.
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