well how can it be doubtful if that is the role and plan of God and marriage..how can you list all of these attributes and then deny the reality of it coming to fruition....
I didn't Ark. I said that is the plan. That apart from operating in a marriage as God has designed it, that it is impossible to find this. Those that do follow God and what He has presented to us as the ideal is how we get there. Just look at what I posted..."As a matter of fact, if that were true, that couple would have to be living by what God has laid out for the roles of husbands and wives." See, I did say that those that were living by what God has commanded us to do have the hope of finding this kind of relationship.

isn't that the exact goal that God sets the bar at..
why deny that can exist...which does not mean that the existiance of the goal is perfection...it is a continual work in progress...
I did not deny it...I actually affirmed it. And also said that in ourselves, it is an impossible goal. Husbands are commanded to love their wives as Christ loves the church. We do not have the power to do that, apart from Christ. But I can do all things thru Christ Jesus who strengthens me. Again Ark...please read what I have wrote, as I suspect that you are looking at it from a direction that I did not intend.

sounds elementary to me...tell them the truth....
uphold the marriage in honor.
be proud that you want to spend the day with your wife...

your example sounds like you don't WANT to be with your wife and would RATHER be golfing...
some spouses would RATHER be with their spouse than be golfing....
Sounds elementary to you...okay. But too many, especially men, this is not elementary. God did not put these commands in the Bible because they were unnecessary. What you as a woman believe is elementary may be somethig entirely different to a man. I know I am being very general here, but work with me a second. You know the old saying about men and directions? There is some truth to that. I have yet to meet a woman that will not stop to ask directions if she needs to. But most of us men have spent countless times lost because we refuse to get those directions. Why? Because we are hard headed (dont answer that Pep!!)? it has to do with the way we are built. We were made to be the leader, and a misguided supposition to that is that asking directions is not leading. Of course, once we learn that is not true...we get lost a lot less.

There are differences between men and women. Some things you gals do (and we will get into them in the women's part) seem to be no-duh to us guys. But they are major problems for you. Why? Because you are women and that is how you are built. We are different. God recognizes that and gives us instructions in how to deal with those differences.

Sure, the husband should want to be with his wife. But, let's say I have Super Bowl tickets. Big event. All the guys are going. Gonna be fun. My wife doesnt like footbal, so doesnt want to go. Two days before the Super Bowl, she has a major problem at work. she needs to get it fixed and it will take several days to do so. She needs my help.

Now, the no-duh thing to do is to tell the guys to sell my ticket and help my wife. And a good husband will do that. But to think that didnt hurt, that I wasnt upset by that is folly. where did I WANT to be at that moment? Of course...holding a beer and peanuts on the fifty yard line. But I sacrificed for the need of my wife.

This is the pain I speak of. The disappointments. We as husbands must ALWAYS put the well being of our wives ahead of us. And by the way...the wife has no such role...no such commandments. she is not commanded to love, as you will see in the next section. How wives meet the ENs outlined by Dr. Harly is entirely different then how we meet our wives' needs.

Again, Ark...I think you are misreading what I am saying. Of course, wives give things up all the time for their husbands. And that is disappointing too. But wives are not commanded to do so by God out of love...they are commanded to do so for a different set of reasons as you will see.

My two boys have learned something of this in my house. When we eat, my wife, my MIL and my daughter get served before the guys do. Last piece of cake? Gals get first dibs. They used to look at me like "Why does our sister get treated differently than us?" Answer. Because she is different than you. They are learning valuable lessons on how different men and women are, and what God expects. Thus, I suspect that one dy, they will treat their wives with the love that God expects. And my daughter? I hope and pray she finds a man that she marries that will love her in the same way...and treat her as she is supposed to e treated.

In His arms.