While I genuinely sympathize with your situation, I think the two of you should be ashamed of yourselves for your respective conduct in front of your children. Shame on you. You are trying to score points against each other at your children's expense. Shame. You should be sheltering the children from this not exposing them to it.

My apologies if you are offended by my post.

TTBM

I understand what you are saying about them fighing in front of the kids. But how many of us have gotten caught up in the heat of an argument and not take in consideration the children being there?

I know to much even when you try to walk away and your spouse follows you and the kids can still hear you arguing.

In a perfect world most adults wouldn't argue in front of the children, but this isn't a perfect world. MT3B looked horrified when she seen herself in front of the children. It is an extremly hard situation to be in.

I'm not directing this to anyone, just a vent. If you have never walked in M23B shoes, not to judge! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> I dont think its scoring brownie points w/ their children. Kids do grow up and form their own veiws on what, and how they feel about the situation. Its so hard to run a home, work on saving your M and deal w/ a WS that is in the fog land. And then almost NEVER having the right time and right place to bring up your feelings. Granted before the children is not good, sometimes the little ones "sneak" around the corner. I know my D, I talk to her and give her the approperate age answers for her questions. As far as sheltering, I dont agree, I beleive being honest w/ your children is the best way to be. Oh and me and my H took our conversations out to the garage and still walked in w/her ears to the door. In a situation that shouldn't be happening in the first place and some as BS had no idea was happening, emotions do come into play and sometimes you do have to get it out. If you have never lived this, you dont know!
<img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" /> Sunny D

I've never posted to M23B or on this forum, but I watched Dr. Phil today. I agree about not fighting in front of the kids. And I do know how hard it is. My ex was very good at pushing buttons and trying to get me to argue in front of my kids. He was also very good at physically abusing me in front of my kids. KIDS ARE NOT THAT RESILIENT!!! My children are more than likely scarred forever because of things like that! 2 of my children are on medication for depression and behavior disorders. The oldest one is 15 and has been smoking, tried smoking pot, took my car without permission and ran away. And when you talk to him about it, it all comes back to all of the fighting and abuse from his father. It does have a lasting affect on them!! Please M23B, and D23B also, stop all of the arguing in front of the children. Take Dr. Phil's suggestion about the red light! Lots of hope and prayers for you guys!

Mitzi <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

M23B,

I am definately not hear to judge you for any of your actions. I can not I am in the same position and have done some of the exact same things that you have including arguing in front of the children. It does not make it right and my kids are much younger, but it does happen. Now what you must do is be sure that it doesn't happen anymore. You can't erase the past, but you can direct your future habits at least. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

I am SOOOOOOOOOO PROUDDDDDDD OF YOUUUUUUUUU!!! You are bringing our situations out in the open. I think it took a lot of courage on his part to come on the show as well.

My H said some terrible things to me in anger as well even much worse than ED's. I was in such agreeance with you, dr. phil and the audience until I was shouting at the TV ( and I was at work)!! I have decided to D my H for the very reasons that Dr. Phil gave Ed today on his checklist for repairing the M. I told my H those things that (my Pastor, Dr. Harley, and now Dr. Phil)were on the checklist and his very vocal response was " No woman is going to check me, and when I suggested that I deal with OW's calls etc, he told me that was "his business"!! <img border="0" alt="[Teary]" title="" src="graemlins/teary.gif" /> So in essence it meant that he was unwilling to do what it took to get the trust back and the M on track.

Today affirmed for me that I am making the right NO ONLY decision for me and my kids. He has done nothing and continues to do nothing so I must move on. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> AND I AM OKAY WITH MOVING ON!

I knew exactly how you felt when you said that Ed was not going to involve you that closely with OW/OC. It hurts I know, but I am here with you, WE ALL ARE!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Continuing to have you in my prayers,

JT

M23B,

I saw you on Dr. Phil and thought, I wish she could know about the Marriage Builders Forum for people like us! I am so glad that you already know and are here and being supported.

Hugs to you for your courage and best of luck to you and your family.

--an oldie that doesn't get here very often.

HELLO to everyone that knows me!

<small>[ November 19, 2004, 01:45 AM: Message edited by: happy_girl ]</small>

Mom 23Boys,

Saw the show yesterday, hope Dr. Phil get thru to Dad soon b4 u get fed up & give up.

Hugs & prayers 2 u!

"B"

I DON'T KNOW NEICY, LIVING THROUGH IT AND I SWEAR HER H SOUNDS JUST LIKE MINE. I DON'T THINK IT MIGHT BE FOR THE BEST. OKAY - OKAY DON'T JUMP DOWN MY THROAT I'M ENTITLED TO MY OPINIONS.

I JUST FEEL SOMEWHERE DEEP DOWN ED DOESN'T REALLY REALIZE THE EFFECTS OF HIS BEHAVIOR ON ANYONE IN HIS LIFE. I AM PRAYING FOR THE BEST FOR YOU WHATEVER THAT MAY BE, JUST UNSURE OF HOW DEVOTED ED IS OR WILL EVER BE?

JT <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

JT (giggle) we know your passion - quit shouting! KIDDING! Love you. Know it's hard either way.

Just wanted to post that Orchid just posted a MOST wonderful response to Mom on the GQII board that you all might like to read. Same title - or just about.

- Kimmy

Oh Lord! KIMMY!!!! I just looked at the MB photo album and saw Dealan-De...I thought, GAWLLY, that girl sure does look like KIMMY! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> couldn't figure out why Dealan-De was posting to me! DUH <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> You go girl...btw, I have MY Phone back now...8119!!!

Well, shoot! I called Ed's phone this am, but didn't leave a msg. I wonder if he knows it was me??? I'd called you on your phone when he had it before I knew you'd switched, and introduced myself...is he mad at me for DJing at him the other day?

Not that it matters. An elephant's faithful, one hundred percent...and so are girlfriends.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by tough to be me:
<strong> While I genuinely sympathize with your situation, I think the two of you should be ashamed of yourselves for your respective conduct in front of your children. Shame on you. You are trying to score points against each other at your children's expense. Shame. You should be sheltering the children from this not exposing them to it.

My apologies if you are offended by my post. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I don't think they did it purposly. I know with stbxh we'd be in a totally different room and the kids would walk in and we were so in grossed in our fight we'd not notice them until one spoke up. I think they know they should not do it and I bet they are working on that now. I don't know a parent alive who has not done it one time or another.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> I know with stbxh we'd be in a totally different room and the kids would walk in and we were so in grossed in our fight we'd not notice them until one spoke up. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Boy, is THAT the truth!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

They can show up in one second....unless you happen to be calling them!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Nerlycrzy:
<strong> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> I know with stbxh we'd be in a totally different room and the kids would walk in and we were so in grossed in our fight we'd not notice them until one spoke up. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Boy, is THAT the truth!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

They can show up in one second....unless you happen to be calling them!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">AND THAT IS TRUTH TOO!!!!!!!!!!!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Once or twice maybe...but your kids shouldn't know what the "name" of the OW is. That is a sure sign of the kids being involved too much.

Even when my kids were smaller, they knew mom and dad fought. But as for the details, most of it they had no idea. Before you start in about how much I would know about what they know.....my oldest is 20 and my other is 14. I have a very open relationship with both of them and the topic has come up. Believe me...neither one of them has a problem with "slamming" me if I get memories wrong. LOL!

ent