2,

I am with you on the divorce court thing. He will not be given ANOTHER chance...I still can't believe that I have given him this one sometimes. I have told him if I find out that he has even talked to her(unless she calls him or something)...I will see him later.

I have told him that it would not matter that I still loved him, or that we had three children together...I would push my love for him away, and I would know that it is best to get my girls away from a man that makes such careless choices...to me he will have proved that not only am I a worthless piece of trash, to be disgarded, to him...but so are the kids.

It would take me longer than a week to find someone new, though! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> NOt many men want to hook up with a fat chick with three kids <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/shocked.gif" alt="" />....I guess that is something I would have to learn to love with.

I also struggle with the feeling you have described 2...it is like you wrote what I think...however..I still feel the passion there as well. Well, sometimes.

Anyway, yes, I am amazed by a lot of people on this board, Rocked included, that put so much into the marriage, and take on such a huge chunk of the blame/recovery. For me...that is just not going to happen.

Oh well....talk you guys later....

True <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" />

Hmmmmm, 2. By reading your last post it sounds like you might never get over all this. Your statement "Of course it was the passion that brought him to cheat on me...feeling like it had died." scares me to think your husband may have no other choice in his future if you feel: "It is dead on my part for sure now" to step out again. Why would he wish to remain in a marriage where his wife doesn't have passion for him any longer. I'm not a man by no means, but with talk like that, he might be out the door before you.

It surprises me how strong you seem, yet you just can't move forward. You out of all of us seem to have done the greatest works, counseling, retreats, prayer meetings, meeting with your fellow church members and still you are harboring thoughts of "next time", "wanting to meet someone else", "do not feel a passionate love for him", "struggle feeling like I'm in this till I find someone better". If you struggle with this everyday, I must say, you are subconsiously destroying your family already.

I don't know what the answers are. I feel if this is how I felt about my husband, even in the back of my mind, I would have left him.

Talk to someone about how to get the passion back. Men need passion and respect. Not saying you don't either, we all do. And again, the A was not your fault. He was selfish, but perhaps he couldn't come to you and tell you what he needed. Maybe your guard has been up your whole life and possibly it still is. Have you had personal counseling for how you grew up as a child? We choose are partners by mirroring our parents relationships, good and bad. Always trying to correct the bad.

I will say a prayer today for you to find that ol passion again, so you and your husband can start a happy life together. And please get the phrase "struggle feeling like I'm in this till I find someone better", those are Satin's influences. Push him out!

Good morning Guys! Beautiful day in Cali after a freak rain storm yesterday. Still recovering from bronchitis, but feeling better. We have a hot date as a family tonight that I'm looking forward to. Then scrapbooking all day tomorrow! Who-hoo!

Actually Holiday, I'm doing quite well! The fact that I can even look at my husband is a HUGE improvement! We all heal at different rates and in different ways, and I know that I have come a very long way. I still do not feel passion for him, but didn't say I thought it would stay that way forever. It has been a little over 5 months and I think I'm doing well. I have gone through the full grieving process complete with all the feelings of rage, depression, denial, acceptance, etc. I have felt the process has been necessary to move forward. I have not stiffled my feelings of rage, depression, etc. (did I tell you guys about the day I physically assaulted my husband? Didn't hurt him because he is so much bigger than I. Not proud of it, but it was big turning point for us.) Anyway, this is a process. My counselor agrees that moving too quickly in the process and feeling passion and all that now (for me anyway) would not be true to myself. We have moved away from the daily comments and put downs to a place of peace. That is HUGE!

The thoughts I struggle with are normal. Why wouldn't I have thoughts like this after what has happened to me? Am I just supposed to think he's the greatest thing since sliced bread after he lied to me and betrayed me and deceived me for almost a year?! I should think he's crap! And sometimes I do. And sometimes I think he's a great guy who made a huge mistake and needs to be forgiven. It is a battle and I'm fighting it. I will take each and every small victory. Better than none!

Of course I think about what if he did this again. I never thought he would in the first place, so to act like it couldn't happen again would be stupid. If he leaves for whatever reason, lack of passion, doesn't think I'm getting over this fast enough, some other groupie comes along and strokes his ego more than me, he can GO! I am NOT going to fake my feelings for him right now out of fear he'll leave me if I don't. NO WAY! I am who I am. And I am slow to heal from this. I, like him, am getting lots of help in this process, but just like I don't expect him to understand overnight why he did this, he can't expect me overnight to feel all warm and fuzzy toward him. We are getting along. I'll take it and I'm sure he's thrilled with that too now after such a long period of turmoil.

Actually Rocked I could probably get a guy in a few days if I wanted to! True, so could you. I'm not saying I'd marry this dude, but he'd be on my arm, that is for sure!

Anyway, hope you guys have a blessed day!
2

Holiday,

I am sorry...but I TOTALLY disagree with you. Obviously because I feel very similar to 2.

IMHO, you are way too nice to your H. I think when you focus so much on the WS..they get the message that it is ok to do what they did.

My H tells me that I found a right balance between loving him and letting him know all of the consequeces of his actions...but most of the time..I still feel that I am letting him get away with it.

Here is my point...and yes, I tell it to my H...who cares what a man needs...her H screwed up royally...he should be on his knee every single day BEGGING for fogiveness!

I may never get over this...and if my H cannot accept that, then well, he should leave...and let me tell you...if he cheats again...there will be no niceness left from me...I will take everything....THOSE are the consequnces that he will have to live with...THAT is what he needs to see..and feel...until he has accepted that...why should benefit from his own stupidity.

I am sorry for being so hard...but what you were saying made me soo upset...it always does when people..anyone talks about the WS's needs...I just think, you know what...I felt rejected for years..but you didn't see me go out and screw someone else...I still loved my H more than that. I am sorry...but too many people let the WS off WAY too easy!!!! And that makes me very upset.

True

True,

I don't think you read what I meant and I didn't mean it to upset you and hopefully, I didn't upset 2 either. These were my feelings on the subject. I am sorry if you don't agree, but that's a good thing. Different perspectives for different outcomes.

What I am trying to say is I feel we shouldn't live everyday thinking "this will happen again", because as you know, it did for me. I feel if I did that then everything in my life would be "dream like", surreal. The only difference, I think, that may make me feel the way I do, is that my H's A's were PA's and very short lived (a weekend). So I might not have the degree of pain that you both do.

I do agree that if my H was to ever have anything remotely similar to any of this then he's gone and he's got that in his head (by how he talks).

In no way am I "easy" on my WS. I just don't broadcast ulitmatums. He knows it so I don't repeat it. Instead of saying "I'm gonna if you are gonna", ya just do it! Threats are immature to me.

And I don't agree in constant punishment nor constant knee bending requests for forgiveness and I haven't let any of this slip under the rug. I guess my tactics are just different from your's and 2's.

He knows, when I am done, I am done. I won't remain in a marriage where I have to walk on eggshells and cow tow to anyone for any reason. I just love him and my family and believe God keeps me here for a reason.

As for his needs. Yes, we need to consider daily about "his" needs. Young women today continually believe it's a "women's world" when God did not make it that way. His needs are important and so are mine, they are just different from each other. Some women (and friends of mine) walk on their husbands constantly. They have children, gain extra weight and don't do anything to change that. They also grow "attitude" and disrespectful "mouths" and wonder why their husbands no longer wish to pay them attention. Women need relationships more than men do. So in a man's world it's up to the woman to keep the relationship going.

And yes, I do attempt to meet his needs and he still cheated, but I know the A was not about me, it was about his selfishess at the time. I will continue to do what I feel I need to do. And one is not dwelling on the possiblity of something happening again which I may never have control over. Another is to keep God's promise, to love and honor my H, in sickness and in health and an A is a sickness to me.

I know this will really cause a stir in both of you. But, it's just my feelings. How I was raised. How I interpet the Bible's wishes. Hopefully, my H will continue on his path to be a better husband. So far he has shown me just that and with that we live the best we can.

holiday
"Forgiveness is the fragrance the flower sheds on the heel that crushed it."

Live on the next Jerry Springer Show...when Marriage Builder blogs get fiesty! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" />

Rocked you are so funny! How about stopping the jokes and join in on this discussion. What do you think?

Holiday, I agree that WS wandered because they are selfish. I like True, often felt neglected by my H during the A because he wasn't home much..."working" all the time. I was frustrated and lonely and did not seek out an A. He did so because he was weak and spineless.

Yesterday Oprah had on 7 cheating men. Most of them said they were perfectly happy before they began their affairs. They got caught up in being "new" to someone where they felt like "old news" to their spouses. Most of them had their needs met at home and loved their wives. That is what my husband said. He was perfectly happy. A weak moment turned into a lifestyle for a whole year. I did not fail him in anyway. He failed me.

True, I had a discussion with a girlfriend the other day who was saying that the girl should NOT get the title OW because I'm the only woman, she was an intruder. I quickly informed her that I disagreed. That she was the OW given the title by my H who invited her into our marriage and gave her all the things I should have been having. Kind of shut her up quickly. But my point is, I don't hold that much ill will toward the girl. She owed me nothing and that is what she gave me. HE was the one who betrayed me and did not keep his vow to me or God. Why should I go easy on him. I place ALL the blame on my H because she did not have a husband to whom her vow would mean something. She was single and free to do whatever she wanted. NOT HIM.

I don't dwell on whether it will happen again or not. I recognize that it could and have a plan of action, but I don't dwell on it. Like I said, I can now look at my husband after 5 months and can carry on a conversation with him without mentioning it. It is a HUGE step for me, and he knows it. Like True said, if he doesn't like it, he can leave...for real this time, not just an A! I learned from this experience that I will survive (just like the song says!) He also learned what a damn good woman I am and he knows he's lucky to have me. I wouldn't do anything different.

2

Holiday and 2,

I also try not to CONSTANTLY punish my H, and I do not think that you do either 2...you can ask my H if you want, he reads these boards. I am still trying to be a good wife, and I ams still meeting his needs, not because I SHOULD, but because I still love and care for him. And yes, 2, my H said he was perfectly happy in our marriage before the A.
I do not buy all the stuff on this board that a man or woman will stray just because his needs are not being met..sometimes it is just because it is different.

I do not believe that the affair had anything to do with me or the way I act..or my weight..or anything like that..it WAS about him being selfish...and I do not let him ignore that fact. I do not throw it in his face all the time...but heck, if you are trying to teach a child not to do something wrong..you would point out when they have done it. Would you not? And you would try to teach them ways to get around that behavior....and THAT is what I try to do.

I also do not spend everyday dwelling on the fact that it will happen again..heck it is hard enough to deal with the fact that it happened once...why would I want to dwell on the other fact? HOWEVER...I do believe that if I sit there and do not think about it at all, then I am a fool and IT WILL happen again. If you do not have a plan...like 2 said, then you are setting yourself up. Plus, I DO let my H know that that is what will happen...and that I am more positive about that than anything. I may have stayed this time...but you better believe I will not be made a fool of again.

And yes, my blood is boiling over the woman in today's society **it you are spouting off. I think that woman should be equal to their husbands...and I REFUSE to become a second class citizen in my own home. If my H wants his house clean...then he should get off his lazy *ss and clean it. I wil do my share..but he better be prepared to his. I do not want a man who thinks that he holds a more Godly spot, either...to believe that it is a man's world is just ignorance and old fashioned religious brainwashing. Even Jesus Christ embraced women in a time that they were treated very poorly..it is sad that the church as a whole is going back to "the old way".

2, I know you disagree with me on this issue as well, so I do not expect the support on that..but I am sorry ladies...I WILL NOT be some submissive little wench who lets their husband do whatever he wants OR say he is the man..so his decision is final. That to me is just foolish. My life is not his...and his life is not mine.

Also 2, I have to say that I DO think you have come a long way...You sound much better, and sound like you have healed much...keep it up.


Yeah, Rocked...I notice that you never get involved in these heated discussions...scared????

True

Okay, Okay...
I was not saying either of you are doing these things. Just when you post your thoughts I react on them too.

And who said anything about being submissive? I hope you don't think me foolish for staying.

I believe in treating my husband like a man, not a child (although what he did was childish). And vice visa for a man who's wife has cheated, like a woman. They are not children, they are/were selfish adults.

I do not believe we are equal to men, never will be. We weren't made to be by the Bible. And no, it does not give a man the right to cheat etc nor to treat women poorly.

But, like 2 stated about the cheating men on Oprah, I feel if he is not made to feel special, then he will not treat you special and may feel the need to "feel new" with someone else. This goes for WW too.

True, you stated "I felt rejected for years..but you didn't see me go out and screw someone else...". Did you tell your H this or did you think he could read your mind? I think this is all about communcation as it always ends up being.

I know as time goes by for all of us our guard will go down. I know this because if you were to continue on with all of the the tough feelings your marriage may not last past next year.

I ask you, do you want your spouse to be in the marriage, since the A, because they love and want to be with you? or because you've gave them an ultimatum and scared the ...t? out of them to stay with you? I prefer my H to want to be with me because of me.

This is not a battle between us. Aren't these are just thoughts amongst us?

And what is wrong with keeping a clean house for myself and my family? Or to keep in shape and look nice for your spouse and yourself? It's not brainwashing nor the church's "old way", it's respect.

And Rocked, I think you're scared too! Nana booboo .

Peace,
holiday <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/pfft.gif" alt="" />

oh my the <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/pfft.gif" alt="" /> was for Rocked...

I lost this once...so if it posts twice..please ignore one.

Holiday,

First...you are right..it is just a difference of opinion, and I also just react on what others say.

Secondly, I do not treat my H like a child. I know he is not one. I do not even feel like what he did was "childish". Selfish, yes..but not childish. I was just using that as an example...oviously that did not come across to you. However, I do think we can teach each other things. In fact I have learned quite a lot from my H and I feel like he has learned much from me...I think THAT is a good thing. I am very greatful for the teaching that goes on between us.

Thirdly, yes, I DO want my H to stay b/c he loves me and WANTS to stay...who wouldn't? I do not feel like I am scaring the **it out of him or giving him an ultimatum, but I do want him to see that love is not enough of a reason to stay with him when he can disrespect me in such a way. I want him to stay because I am a strong woman not just because he thinks that he "got away" with something. I want him to see that our relationship has changed greatly and STILL stay, because he values this new relationship just as much as the old one( hopefully more).

And FYI, my H loves that I am this way. He does not want a submissive, I will do whatever you want, wife. He saw his mother treated in that disrepectful way growing up and is glad that I do not let him treat me in that way. Plus, neither of us wants our daughters to get that idea. I want my daughters to see that women ARE equal to men. It saddens me that religion is used to place a superiority over other people..whether it be men over women..or any other aspect of our culture. I am a Christian, but I know that the Christ that I love would not want people to feel that way.

I am not tough on my H..even though you seem to think that I am. I do give him MUCH more affection that I did before, I am reach out to him..I try to be a good wife. However I do this not because I SHOULD do these things, but because I love this man and do not want to live my life without him.

As for believing you are a fool...yes, I believe that we are all fools for staying..but love does make us foolish...and that is not necessarily a bad thing.

Also, you ask if I told my husband about feeling rejected...yes, I did. He was just lost in his own feelings. See, I do not believe that all affairs are caused by lack of emotional needs being met. We were/are very good friends..we were/are very close and loving...all needs were being met. His affair occured because she could give him the one thing I could not...experience with another woman. There is not one thing in my marriage that I could have done that would have changed that. He just regretted not being "manly" with many partners.

As for cleaning the house and staying in shape...you are right..except that should be out of respect for yourself..not your H. There is nothing wrong in taking pride in the way that you take care of your household... I just think that my H should take as much pride in it and take as much responsibilty for it as I do(especially if I am also working).

My H has read this thread...he feels that I am justified in what I say...and in the end, that is all that matters to me. If he and are in tune with one another, and we are showing our children what a good marriage should look like...then I am doing things right. If you feel that you are in tune with your H and are teaching your children...then who cares what I think.

True

Exactly...for the most part.

Only we can't be equal. We are too different men and women.
I did not mean men were above women only that we each deserve different kinds of respect.

His love motivates her respect; her respect motivates his love.

We too teach our son and daughter how to treat the opposite sex. I don't want either of my children to show disrespect to their partners in their future. We have also taught them that people are not infailable and we all make mistakes.
Young girls today (my daughter included) have a strong sense of being their own person. But she is still a woman, emotionally vunerable to this world. It's chemical and no teaching will take that away from her.

Have you read the book Love and Respect by Dr Emerson Eggerichs? This is where I am coming from. It is a Christian based book and has alot to offer. It helps to speak to each other as spouses in a nicer language. I should have said this is where I meant "some" young woman of today. (I wasn't meaning anyone personally.) They are not giving men the respect necessary and then expect to be treated kindly. (This also comes from my working years in the criminal justice system with wife and husband abusers.)

God made woman stronger emotionally and men stronger physically. That is why we will never be equal. Not that one is "above" or better than the other.

I am glad your H read all this and feels you are justified in what you say. I don't think he would have said otherwise at this point in time. Meaning he cares deeply for you.

No one is perfect. We all think differently, that's what makes us all so amazing.

It is so hard in these posts to convey my heart. I am sorry if this comes across as finger pointing as that was not my intention. And too, if you feel that you are in tune with your H and are teaching your children...then who cares what I think.

holiday

Holiday,

I am glad we agree on so many things...you are right..it does not matter what we think about each others views...

However, one line stuck out more than any other.

"I am glad your H read all this and feels you are justified in what you say. I don't think he would have said otherwise at this point in time. Meaning he cares deeply for you."

You are sooooo off in this line, I don't even know where to start. My H MOST certainly would tell me if he felt that I was wrong. Until November...and since Dec.... we are COMPLETELY honest with each other. He did critique what I wrote..and believe it or not..I changed some things that he thought were off. I listen to him and DO respect what he has to say...and I KNOW that he feels the same, as he is sitting right here..and was upset by that line as well. In fact, he read it first...and commented on it.

Also, I hope with your "no one is perfect" line was not implying that my way of thinking is flawed...it may not match your own...but I do not believe it is flawed either.

Anyway...it was a heated discussion...and I guess we will have to agree to disagree on the women in society issue...and I guess on ways to treat your H as a WS as well.

True

That line did stick out. I don't understand why you felt the need to include your H as "justifying" what you were posting. I thought you were fine all by yourself. I sometimes get defensive at a "two" against one confrontation. I have a girlfriend who needs to run everything she says by her husband first to see if she is "right" or not when we have deep discussions and it at times rubs me the wrong way.

If it sounded like a dig (and it kinda was a dig to your dig) I should have been more Christian like in my reply, and for that I am sorry.

And no one is perfect has no implication to your way of thinking as being flawed. Or to you (as I have said previously) to be taken personally. These are just thoughts and opinions.

I am an older lady who has been through this twice now and was hopefully, trying to shed a "different" perspective on long term marriages/relationships. Pros and cons.

Friends?

holiday

I'm not scared. I just have been so busy that I didn't have time to process 4 different opinions and reply to all. I will jump in soon and give you my 2 cents worth. Well, with some of your opinions and comments you're going to get more like $2.00 worth.

One things for sure, we've all been hurt and it's affected us to varying degrees. Add to the mix our religious understandings...AND MISUNDERSTANDINGS...as well as social upbringing and this is what you get. A blog gone wild! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />

Until early next week...

My plan was to re-read this blog, jot down some notes and then post my reply. Well, after about an hour of reading and a full steno pad page of notes (your comments and my notations) I'm more convinced than before that we are all different people with different experiences, views and beliefs. And if I was to reply to every comment you ladies made that urked me or went against my beliefs it would take me 3 days. I don't have that much time. If you want more from me you'll have to contact me privately.

My comments/replies in bullet point fashion:
1.LOVE: There's a difference betw "feelings" (passion) and "commitment" (decision). I believe our commitment should be intact. The feelings will come.
2.DWELLING: Yes, protect yourself from being made a fool of again, but invest the majority of your emotional energy in the present and future. What you 'think' will determine how you 'feel', which will influence how you 'act.'
3.EQUALITY: Yes, God made men and women different in some ways (physically, emotionally to some degree), but He did not create man to dominate woman, or woman to be like a slave to man. No where in the Bible does it say this is a "Man's World"! If you are of the position that the Bible is Truth to live by...then look it up yourself and read Ephesians 5:21-33. You'll see that marriage is a reciprocal relationship. NOTICE...verse 21 says, "Submit to ONE ANOTHER out of reverence for Christ. Going one step further, verse 25 actually puts the heavier command upon the man..."to love your wife, just as Christ loved the church and gave himself up for her...". Being submissive DOES NOT mean obeying every cow-tow demand of an egotist husband. If a H truly loves his wife to the point he is willing to sacrifice even his own life for her, then she in reciprocal fashion will desire to give herself to him b/c his only desire and purpose is for her best interest and good.
4.THE CHURCH: The Church as a whole is NOT a woman bashing, old-time male dominated "Good ol' Boys Club". If you have a problem with the Church on other issues let those issues be known but don't use this blog or topic to make pot shots.
5.MARRIAGE: More Bible...when we come together in the holy bond of marriage, "the two become one flesh". We are not our own anymore. It's 1+1=1, not 1+1=2.
6.ACTIONS: I'm amazed at how your actions say something different than the fire of your written words. True, I know you love your H and are trying hard to make things work. And he is too. Stay on that track and you'll see continued progress. 2, Your H has done all but back flips at halftime of a Lakers game to get your marriage back on track. Be grateful and keep him around. Holiday, your patience with a man who twice had an A is amazing to all of us. May God bless you.
7.ME: I appreciate the friendship and support you all have shown me over the last 6 months. Thank you for caring. And knowing that True's H reads this post I say to him..."I care for you and your marriage and pray for you too. We may never meet or even see "eye-to-eye" on things but the patience and second chance your wife has shown you is not to be taken for granted. Love her sacrificially and you'll find she'll be eager to go the extra mile with you."

Rocked,

You are right in the fact that after rereading the posts on this thread, we are all very unique people..with a wide range of ideas.

I will not comment on your religious views, as I know that you are far more advanced in that matter than I...but I am sorry to hear that you think I was taking a "pot shot" at the church. I was expressing my opinion from my experience, research into the subject, and other people's views(that I very much admire) then directly relating back into our conversation. Do not worry...I will not make that mistake again...as, I said before, I know I do not have the expertise that you and the others seem to have.

As for my actions being different than what I say...yes they are. I find that often I say who cares about the whiney WS...but yet I WANT my H to whine, cry, share when he is depressed and feeling hopless.....basically just share all his feelings(even if he tells me he misses the OW(which he hasn't))...I guess I hold him to a higher standard than other WS. Hypocritical yes...but I love him. I don't even know the other WS. Plus, I feel like what it boils down to is that I WANT to act this way(forgiving, loving, patient, passionate, respectful), and not be told that I SHOULD act this way for whatever reason. He doesn't deserve the kindness I show him...no WS does in my mind..yet, I offer it to him anyway b/c of the love I feel towards him AND the committment that I made to him and my daughters.

My H said an amazing thing to me the other night after Holiday and I "fought" on Friday. He said that it is sad that we are all BS and that we are all dealing with this pain in our own way...yet here we are arguing about what is the right way...whose way is better, when we should be sharing our hurt, and expereinces, and even joys that we share with our spouses. I have to say I married a very smart man. He may have messed up..but yes he is a very smart guy...which is why I let him read these posts, and tell me what he thinks...and why I tell you guys what he thinks <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Anyway, as I said before, you will not hear more about this from me.

Have a very good day.

True <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Whew! I go away for a few days and look what happens! Hi Guys!

Rocked, thanks for posting and sharing your wisdom. Yes, my H has done everything but back flips. And you know what? He SHOULD! We are doing fine because he is trying so hard not just with me, but with his walk with the Lord. That is what I needed. Again, we are all different.

Actually, I have a question for Holiday. I know you said that this is your second time around. I am sorry for that, and of course going through this more than once is all of our greatest fears. I am curious if you could share (for the sake of understanding) if it was different, harder, easier the second time. What happened the first time after you found out? Was there counseling, pastor help, etc?

The reason I ask is because I told my H point blank that this is it. You've screwed up and NOW we are going to get whatever help we need to make sure this doesn't happen again. I know there are no guarentees, but I feel personally, after all the pain this has caused me, that if he did it again, he would be showing me he doesn't love me. I don't feel this way the first time, because he had no way of measuring the devestating affect this would have on me. NOW he knows. So if there is a next time, I'm done. I WILL NOT be like my mother who put up with several affairs until finally at age 52 when she should be getting ready to settle down to a nice peaceful life with her husband, she couldn't take it anymore and divorces after 32 years of marriage. They never sought counseling for any length of time and both have become Christians since the divorce.

Anyway, I really just want to know if there is anything you did different this time from the first time and what are you doing to make sure it doesn't happen again.

I hope you don't think I'm questioning your decision to stay. I've learned in this process that we do what we feel we need to do. Sometimes I'm surprised I'm still here after this first A since I always said it wouldn't be me. I'm really just curious. I don't think we ever addressed that issue before here. If you don't mind shed some insight on me about the first verses second time. Thanks.

Anyway guys, praying for you and love you all!
2

True,
I agree with you that we should be sharing our hurts, healings and joys. We are friends that have been brought together for a common purpose...and it's not to destroy or belittle each other. So, I'll go first...

I feel bad...I dropped the ball on seeing that my 3 children had something ready to give their mother yesterday for Mother's Day. No cards or gifts. Granted they are old enough to have thought of this on their own, but add to the fact that my own Mom was in town and got gifts and cards from other family members right in my wife's presence. Ugh. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" /> I feel like a heel and saw the disappointment on my wife's face. HELP...ANY SUGGESTIONS???

Hello,
First, about yesterday Rocked...it is never to late to run out and buy her flowers. Right now!!! Go!! You can read all this later...
My daughter made me "french toast" her specialty and tonight my son is taking us out to dinner.