(((((((((((CL)))))))))))))

You are not alone.

I'm here. And yeah, I'm gonna point out how you're hurting yourself.

Some help, huh?

"nothing i say or do matters."

Why do you lie to yourself? Everything you say and do ripples...everywhere. You matter. You're significant. Where's your payoff in choosing to believe this?

You PICKED HER UP? I'm sorry...I don't get this...I thought this was a big nono now...she's choosing to do stuff...you don't have to do what is automatic for you. No picking up or dropping off...no use of the car at all...you are driving your life, knowing you're separate and equal, and she's fully capable of her own transportation.

Period.

You cannot manage people...stop attempting to manage her. Hand back her words, her actions directly...her choices.

"I'm going to a ball game today."

"I hear you're continuing your adultery, is that correct?"

Don't hope for little or no drama...only ensure you are not creating it...which you might, and I validate that, because drama is our attempt to express ourselves when we believe we're not getting through...when our feelings are not being felt by our audience...that's the goal. Stop having that goal.

Choose to believe she will crash and burn with all of her own feelings she's avoiding...escaping from. That's a truth, isn't it, CL? Do you believe?

You got support and confirmation from your FIL...however, he holds himself powerless, blameless, and says his xW has issues. Know people's truth a little bit better...do not look to FIL to solve anything...only contribute what he can, that you are supported and loved, and people are hurting with you...know your pain...feel it...which lessens the need for the drama. You're heard. You're felt.

You really are, CL...Believe this.

Another week went by...where's the quit deed? Where's the packing of boxes? You're still being her driver...you're a long way from getting out of the way of her consequences...can you focus on that for now?

And OP's wife...your wife and daughter got in your way that day...how about since? What can you do to expose to her?

Spreading truth, not marshalling allies...release yourself from response-based choices, CL. Re-align yourself. Breathe, stretch, cuddle DD, know you are not battling a beast...understand how important this is...care about what you tell yourself...it is more important than anything you could tell WW.

In your corner,

LA

CL, let the chips fall where they may. To some extent, you're still trying to shield your WW from the consequences of her terribly bad choices. Don't do that. She's an adult, she has to deal with what she's done.

Like LA says, YOU just be your own man. You're not responsible for this mess. You're responsible for being the finest man and father you can be. That's all you can do and it's all God asks of you.

Thanks guys - yes this is evident - i am my own person - seperate and OK ...and today i am completely finished. her father showed up early - i wasn't home - i was out running around with D - i have no idea what he said to her - wife was pissed. she told me he came in talking about custody and who gets what...(i don't know if i believe this after my FIL's conversation with mebut whatever) she said if i wanted it to get ugly - well here i had it. Her motivation was never to hurt me - but now her motivations have changed. then she got right on the phone with op. i said we are married and this is family and they have a right to know? didn't she think he would wonder why she was sleeping in the guest room??? she said he should be shaking in his boots if he even attempts to say anything to her.

he then said to me while she was out of the room...he thought he should probably not say anything to her - he thought it would make things worse.

now i am afraid i have shot myself in the foot. i know what he was like during his divorce and thankfully he lives 1000's of miles away - (he was close today because of a trip he was on and wanted to drive by and see us.)

she can't touch d - i have confirmed this time and time again with attorney - she can try - but will have a tough time.
the house may be a little tougher. but she won't have a job to pay the mortgage - so i suspect i should be ok.

my folks told me my old house is still on the market - why don't i just bring d and live there....little to no payment until i can get myself back on my feet - and buy another house. my pride tells me no - especially after all that happened with them - but this seems like a practical possibility - they can help watch the baby - and i can save some freakin $$$.

i have never been through anything like this - this is truly HORRIBLE

You felt culpable...correct your thinking. You shared truth with your FIL. He made his choices. Stop all the judgment...you missed awesome listen and repeat opportunities today in your confrontation.

You are caught up in her truth...stay in yours. Not the technicalities...know that she believed she didn't intend to hurt you...and now she does. Won't feel a bit different, CL...because her intent was to get what she wanted.

Stand next to her when she calls OP and say calmly and firmly...do not talk to your affair partner in our home. Do not talk to your affair partner in our home.

I know you're hurting, filled with righteous anger and frustration...you are facing that you cannot only not control your beloved, but she has shut out all your influence...which we do have, when allowed.

Know this is you comprehending how vulnerable you are in the world...so limited...and find that balance of power...you have your choice. You can listen and repeat back...use the hopper on your head...not bank on FIL or anyone to change your WW...it will only count when she changes and comes out of the fog.

We know it is horrible for you...please know my prayer is for you not to be horrible to yourself...

LA

FIL - went to bed...i just went downstairs for some water - and she is on the phone with him now. i told her - to stop in my house - she laughed - she said no.

i will not be horrible to myself anymore - i want her away from me - and D. she has no intentions of stopping this. i think i just fueled her fire.

You told her stop...if you stand there, right next to her, saying, "Your affair is wrecking our family. Your affair partner is wrecking our family. Your choices are destructive and you are choosing to do all of this...do not choose to talk to him in our house."

Rinse. Repeat.

Of course, this would work wonders on me...I can't be on the phone and have someone else talking right next to me...

Probably just me.

Begin packing her boxes...grab trash bags. Do it while she is on the phone. You can remove the mattress from the spare room, even.

You CAN'T fuel her fire...anymore than you can put it out. Live truly, CL.

I'm so sorry. I may be giving you horrible advice. I see the speaking while she's committing the act as a boundary enforcement on your marriage.

Calm, firm, true...love yourself, center and breathe.

She isn't laughing at you...she isn't really laughing. She is acting her image to OM..and that's all she is to him, an image.

LA

i don' think i can pack her boxes with FIL in house - i am staying with D - no trust any of them...when they leave tomorrow. i will get the boxes out...and start packing. i want her out of my life.

I was thinking FIL packing boxes with you.

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Document tonight in your journal, please.

You're not alone. You're not wrong. You're human. Thank you for sharing your self with us.

LA

Unbelievable.

Land-line or mobile phone? If land-line, do you have an extension off of it? If so pick up the extension and join the conversation. Or put it on speakerphone, top volume (if the extension has that feature). Or call the telephone company, see if they offer selective call acceptance and block the OM's number. ******, cancel the service. Anything until she gets the point that she can't use your phone in your house to make private calls to the OM like that.

sorry to drop off last night - my battery died on my computer. all calls are made from her mobile...she DOES NOT CARE WHAT SHE DOES.

FIL would not help with boxes...unfortunately.

this morning during breakfast D in front of FIL asked if mama was going out and if she was going to come home. W is going to a baseball game with her work friends - and D gets upset by her non presence. FIL did not say a word...but his eyes got wide.

then as they were leaving he said to W you need to get it together for this one and pointed at d. then he said its important - get your check list in order and work it out.

her eyes rolled so far back in her head - it was amazing. she then turned her back and said to him - you'll be there for me if i need you right? he said of course. i love you both...and then he kissed the baby and left.

i am canceling her cell phone service asap.

I am no longer trying to shape her actions...i can't - she is incredibly selfish and cruel. when i said my words have no meaning - i meant in stopping her cruelty. now - i must shield d and myself from her cruelty - her bold faced disrespect - her poor choices and horrible actions. i was trying to break through the fog - but it is impossible.

Krusht said she thought this was thicker then just A fog...i think this is a correct assumption. lots of other stuff going on here....

the shut-off happends within minutes of the cancel order

now cancel the home phone as well ... use your own cell for all your calls

she just told me she wants to go out and do something fun today???? Is she crazy - i told her i was going to the grocery store that was it. she said she was home today - i retorted - your not her 99% of the time so we have grown quite accustomed to life without her....she said she was home now and we should do something?

do something if she pays...

ask her if she is offering to foot the cost of today's entertainment

let us know her response

Pep

i just asked her she had in mind....she said we have errands to run so she guesses just the grocery store and clothes for D. I said well if it is simply errands i am happy to do this myself.(not rudely) she chimed in - that she doesn't feel like smiling in public today...she doesn't feel like faking it. i said fine - i will get d clothes and the groceries myself...again not rude - but she is trying to pick a fight....what is good is that i honestly don't have anything left in me to anymore.

taking D with me...though

Your name was on the service, and she was using it to defy you and call the OM? Unbelievable.

Do you have any joint finances? You may want to seriously consider protecting those as well. Joint a/cs, credit cards, etc.

CL,

If your WW was influenced by her father's parting words, then her changing her plans to include family is what she thought he meant.

It isn't.

You can say to her, "I don't want to have you around me or DD...you are hurting us."

Taking care of DD is ending her affair. Make that clear. Not just a little attention, two days out of 30.

Firm and true, CL...you're informing her of your truth. Steady as she goes.

LA

weeks ago - i seperated our finances - we have just one joint checking account now...no access to other accounts. she never pays any attention to this kind of stuff.

i actually did say this to her - about not wanting to be around her (D too) because she was doing too much damage. firm and true. i said i love to be with d...and where i go she goes and that ww is never here - and just because she is home today - means very little to me...so if it is only errands that are being done - then d and i are quite happy to do that ourselves.
and then we went out to the store.

actually noone has influence on her right now except OP - she is very easily lead - i have seen this time and time again with her...