Hi,
I'm new to the site and i have only known about it for 1 day and already it has been a major help to me. with everything i have been going thru since i have found out my wife had an affair which resulted in a pregnancy I have felt so alone because i did not want to put that info out to any friends or family until we figured out what we are going to do, but now after finding ths site i feel as if i have someone to confide in to help me thru this.

Let me first start by saying our relationship has been rocky from the start nothing ever went as planned and there were times that i even questioned if and how much i loved her and just before our 1 year anniversary i step out on our marriage but honestly it was not because i was unhappy it was more myself being young and thinking i wasn't ready to settle down and when the opportunity arose i let things get out of hand. My wife Found out about three months later about my affair and we decided to try to work thru it and it has been a long bumpy road but we managed to stay together.

So here is where the plot thickens, about a year and half ago my wife lost her job and has been on unemployment and i told her that now would be a good time for her to complete school since she was getting uneemployment and i told her i would get a second job to cover the bills until she finished. About 4 months ago my wife started going to school and i noticed she was becoming more social with her classmates one female inpeticular and she would go out after class and have a few drinks or sometimes would meet with a few classmates outside of class. Now let me remind you that since my affair neither of us have had much of a social life but we had always talked about needing one so even when there were things that i was uncomfortable with i kept my mouth shut because she seemed happier and that was all i cared about. As time went on i kept noticing that one guy in peticular name kept being brought up and i questioned her about it and she said he was like a brother to her and he was dating one of the girls that she had gotten pretty close to in the class. The entire time that she was in class and starting to go out i knew that something just wasn't right but i had no proof and i questioned her and she said i had nothing to worry about. Finally one day she comes to me and she tells me that one of the nights she was out and had a couple ouf drinks she ends up having sex with the guy from her class's cousin and after talking about all the consequences of what could have happen and realizing that she is late for her time of the month. so i decide to get an at home pregnancy test and sure enought it is positve. well after a couple days she decides she wants to tell the truth and the guy is actually the one from class that i suspected all along their is no cousin and to make matter's worst, it is being said that he purposely got her pregnant because he wants to be with her and he figures that is his was of being tied to her and always having a chance.

So hear i am today seeking advice or just a listening ear i know this is long and probably alot of useless info but again i have been carrying this weight and have had no one to vent to. now we are at the point of trying to figure out what to do, when i assked my my about her getting dressed up to go to class and all of th going out she said that it was because she was trying to get my attention and that she was lonely. and i i will admit that i'm not the most affectionate or emotionally person but sometimes i think she ask for to much and i explained to her that i know i'm not home much but i am working to jobs so that you can go to school. so now we have to figure out do we stay since she wasn't happy before the affair. abortion is pretty much out of the question but tat leaves us with do give him up for adoption or do we try to raise the chld as our own, i believe i could raise this child as my own but when i think about the other guy wanting to be involved especially when i think about him getting her pregnanton purpose and knowing that he would go to such great lengths to be with my wife makes me not want him even in the picture, makes me feel like there is going to be 18 years of headaches and turmoil.

Welcome to MB. I am so sorry for the trouble that brings you here but so glad you found us. First, you need to find a family law attorney and find out YOUR rights in your state. Some states the husband is the presumed father and the OM as zero rights to even ask for a paternity test. Some states are no so protective of marriage and will allow the OM to request a paternity. Next, how do you know this child is not yours?

Ok, now has your WW gone NC (no contact) with the OM? If not she must even if that means dropping out of school. I would strongly recommend you counsel with the Harleys and definitely get Dr. Harley's book "Surviving An Affair".

How does your WW feel about keeping the OM out of the picture and raising this OC as yours?

Look up posts by pops, writer1, and Autumn Day. Your family will be in my prayers.

What does your WW want to do at this point?

Is your WW still seeing the OM?

If you want this affair to end WW must go NC with the OM.
This means she will not just not have OM in her classes anymore. WW can not go to the same college as the OM?

Contact a lawyer about keeping the OM out of your life.

What is the chance that the OC is yours?

Do you know of you wife wants to be pregnant with her BF?
Do you know if she wants to stay married?

Thanks for your support it means a lot to me because i have really been feeling alone and not knowing what to do. I am about 99% sure that the child is not mine because i had a vasectomy about three years ago and the she is about 8 weeks preg and claims the affair was about 8 weeks ago. she hasn't gone NC because her best friend works with him and relays messages periodically to her, and he has called her one night when he had been drinking telling her about how he wanted to be there when the baby was born and how he wanted to be with her.
I am the type of guy that i believe that i could raise this child and love it but, i fear that it would be a constant reminder and also that when we were in disagreement taking it out on the child like for instance when in financial hardtimes telling my wife that things wouldn't be so hard if we weren't taking care of another child or something to that affect or saying to her you need to get your child and i don't want to be like that.
I told my wife that we may have a chance if the OM is not in the picture but she has had children taken from her from a previous relationship so she understands the pain and heartache of having children in the world and not being able to see them, so she is torn between the issue of whether to have him involved or not but i am as well because i keep telling my self let him be involved so we can get the child support because it is not right for him to basically be let off scott free while my family continues to struggle while trying to raise another child but on the other hand i don't want to see, hear or have nothing to do with him.

I believe that she wants to stay together but like i said the problems were there before she had her affair we had already talked about ending the marriage after the holidays if things didn't get any better but after all this she claims that she realizes that things were not as bad as she thought they were. It's not just her either i was not happy either but i wasn't unhappy i was more content i knew things were not great but but at the same time i didn't think they were bad either.
W claims that she is not seeing OM and that it was just a one time thing and that was it but i am very skeptical of that. she says she has had NC other than the one day that he called and her friend who works with the guy will call her and say "he wanted me to tell you something do you want to know what he said" she is no longer in class and but his job is about 10 mins from the house and my father is his mailman. I have thought about using my job to transfer but then i feel like i would be running and why should i have to change jobs and move to a new town.
Their is a chance that the OC could be mine but it is a very slim chance, i had a vasectomy 3 years ago, i have not ruled out the fact that they can mess up. the doctor told her they have had 4 vasectomy babies this year so there is always the possibility it's just not likely. That would be a whole new issue if it turned out to be mine then she would try to flip the situation around and talk about me not being supportive and whatever else during the pregnancy and the baby being mine.
I think that i have been doing very well maintaining my composure because i have wanted to lose my cool and take it out on her and go after him to but i know that will not solve anything, although it would make me feel a whole lot better

I have a couple of questions. How long have you and your wife been married? Do the two of you have any children together?

Your situation has a lot of similarities to my own. My H and I are raising my OC (other child). We have NC (No Contact) with the OM. He is not part of my OC's life. He doesn't pay CS (child support). She is 13 mos. old and he has never seen her. He lives 3000 miles away, so that has worked to our advantage. My H also had a vasectomy - 11 years ago - so we know the baby isn't his. I also met the OM in school.

Situation like this can work, but you and your WW (wayward wife) need to decide together what you want to do. Does your WW want to stay and work on the M? Is she willing to go completely NC? NC is imperative to healing a M, even if an OC is involved. I too struggled with guilt thinking that I had to keep the OM in my OC's life. We have been completely NC for only 2 mos. now, but things are going much better in my M now that the OM is out of the picture.

My H and I consider my OC to be OUR daughter. There is no resentment. We do not think of her as a "constant reminder" of what has happened. She is a person in her own right, and we love her for that. My H considers her his daughter. He was there throughout my pregnancy. He went to my ultrasounds. He cut the cord when she was born. His name is on the birth certificate. She is his in every way except for the DNA.

It can be done, but first, you and your WW need to commit to making your M work and deciding what it is that you really want.

My WW and i have been together for 5 years and we have two boys together ages 5 and 3. My WW has told me that it was a big mistake and that she had been out with some friends from school and had a couple of drinks and that this guy from her class kinda of took advantage of the situation. In some ways I believe her story because her ethinicity is very uncommon and the guy that ended up getting her pregnant is from the same ethnic group and they are always encouraged to be with someone of their own race i guess so their race will never die off. i know that sounds really crazy but it's true. so that is why i believe that he purposely got her pregnant. I'm not sure how atimate he is about being involved with the OC but i know right now he is saying that he wants to see the child and be with her. I have never seen or spoken to OM out of fear of losing my temper and doing something i might regret later in life. The other issue that i'm dealing with is the fact that we were already having problems to begin with so now i'm thinking well let's just go ahead and end it. On the other hand i do not belive the grass is going to be greener on the other side, I know that i'm not happy now but I also know that i will not be happy if i leave either

NOH,

Sounds like you have no children in common with this woman, so you have don't have to consider the best interests of YOUR children as they are all HERS. If this is correct why stay.

NJ

Most people are already having problems in their M when an A occurs. I would venture to say that very few happy, content people have A's. You have a couple of good reasons to work on your M and so does your WW - and that would be your two boys.

What state do you live in? The paternity laws differ from state to state, so depending on where you live, the OM may have different rights. In my state (CA) the OM really didn't have any rights. He could have sued for a paternity test, but it may or may not have been granted. Here, the H is considered the legal father of any child born into the M, so my H had all legal rights to the baby. In our case, the OM didn't want legal rights anyway, so that wasn't really a problem. You may want to contact a family law attorney and research the paternity laws in your state to see where you stand.

Is your WW still going to school with the OM? Is she willing to establish NC? Has she expressed a desire to stay and work on the M and raise this child with you?

NJ: He said they have two boys together.

Your WW and OM go to the same college. This can not be done any more. You need your WW to have NC with the OM.

Recieving CS will only keep OM involved with your live's and maybe in between your WW's leg's.

Why risk a restart of the affair and the OM knocking up WW for a second time.

If you go for child support you may wind up with having shared custody.

Also you may think it cowardly to run away by moving. It has nothing to do with you being afraid of OM, but to realize that their won't be NC if you and WW live close to OM.

Why risk a restart of the affair and the OM knocking up WW for a second time.

Not if he castrates this guy

NJ

newjersey

"Not if he castrates this guy"

Get real this BH does not need to do anything to get sued, jail time, risk injury.

Can we at least attempt to remain helpful here?

I live in NC and i have done a little research to find out if he has any rights but i haven't spoken to an attorney yet. My WW is no longer in school but is close friends with a girl that works with the guy and he sometimes tries to relay messages through her but i believe that she has not had C with OM. She has expressed a desire to stay and fix things but my issue is that things were already bad and have been for a while so i keep asking myself is it time to let go. I feel like this may be the straw that will break the camels back.

To Theroad and NewJersey,

I have definetly considered going and taking out my agression on this guy and believe me it would make me feel 100 times better but i know that it would not solve anything in the long run. I have considered moving but like i said why should i have to give up my friends and family and switch jobs. I am still trying to figure out what to do each day it's something new like the other night we got into to a pretty big argument because WW feels like she is being ignored and not getting enough attention but i look at it like i might not be all cuddled up with you but atleast i am here in the bed with you when i could be out at the bar or something. WW also complains about me working to much but i really don't think that i do, i mean yeah i probably work 60-70 hrs a week but i am home everynight at a decent time and i think about all the truck drivers that are gone for weeks or soldiers that are gone for months and feel like she really should not be complaining because it could be worst. I think are biggest issue is that we are not on the same page in several aspects where i see things one way she sees them another. hopefully it will all work out but i guess we will see

�WW is no longer in school but is close friends with a girl that works with the guy and he sometimes tries to relay messages through her but i believe that she has not had C with OM.�

WW is still in contact because this friend is the source of contact. Whether WW is pumping F for OM info, or the push is by the F to pass along info.

So you do not have a WW that is in NC.

�I have considered moving but like i said why should i have to give up my friends and family and switch jobs.�

I think you need IC for your denial issues or your need to have your reading comprehension skills evaluated.

NC is needed for ever. WW is pregnant by the OM. It is bad enough for a WW to lose her addiction for the OM.

You have been told that with the OM living close by will impede healing from this affair, and living close to the OM will make it easier for the chances of the affair restarting.

OM knocked up your WW once.

Why refuse to move and make it easier for the OM to get at her again a few years down the road from now?

Your putting your job in front of your marriage makes it seem that you would be better getting divorced.

Not saying you are working too much. But it appears to your WW that she is not getting enough quality time.

So if your are not willing to relocate, cut back hours, what are you willing to do to improve your marriage?

Maybe you were happy, but it is obvious that your WW went to someone else to make her happy.

Also get tested for fertility because sometimes vasectomy's are 100% permanent.

You could get lucky.

The worse thing is the vasec operation didn't hold. Does not mean the OM can't be the dad, but such news will give hope and a shot at coming out on top.

Chance is better than nothing.

And if your not fertile then you can't waste time thinking you have a shot.

You are right i have been trying to be the nice guy and i told her that she didn't have to stop talking to her friend and I should have, when i told her i do not want her talking to her she does seem to get defensive and say that she has nothing to do with an of it, but she has cut back contact quite a bit since all this.

You bring up a good point about what am i doing in all this to help rebuild my marriage and i thought i was doing more than i actually was but in my mind by me staying and still providing for my family and not emotionally abusing her no matter what thoughts were going through my head when i think about her with another man or see her sitting there pregnant with another man's baby. I know that it is going to take a lot of effort on my part but its hard when i get stressed out and think about all this and it makes me want to just give up. But like i said before, it is little things she does that make it hard to show and express my love for her. For instance I feel like if i just worked 14 hour day then i should not have to come home and fix myself something to eat and give the kids a bath and do whatever else while she sits on the couch and watches T.V. and the only thing that she has done that day is go to one class and pick the kids up from daycare. I know that this probably sounds really shallow or like i am some type of womanizer but i am really not all i am getting at is that i feel like i am carrying a lot more of load than she is and it has been that way for a while. Please no one take this the wrong way because i have no problem cooking, cleaning or raising the kids but i would like to feel like there is a balance.

I have considered moving and i have not ruled it out yet but starting over in a new town were you don't know anyone or anything is tough, giving it could be a good thing but yet still tough. Another reason I do not want to give up my job is because i have a lot of flexibility and if for any reason i need time off i am able to take it, not only that but i make my own schedule so if she has to work,i can work around her schedul or if one of the kids have something come up i can take that day off. She has asked me if i would be interested in going back in to the Army so we can move away and i thought about it but i was like what's going to happen if i get sent to war. I know that we have been needing some time away and i told her that when had just few extra dollars we would run away for the weekend but that is the problem we have been in a financial hole for about 6months that just seems to keep getting deeper and deeper and adding to our problems.

is your w truely remorseful about her actions or just making noise because she feels trapped?

you mentioned the unique ethninicity of your w and om along with his wanting to preserve the race. what is your w's view on this? is it something that may cause her to seek continued C with om?

your w's "bf" working with om and relaying messages is not a friend at all if your w truely wants to repair your M.

a visit to a good family law attorney to find out what your legal rights are for your state should be high on your priority list

with the economic environment of today i would suggest against giving up any job. expecially a secure one as yours seems to be.

also if your w was unhappy with the amount of quality time because of your work hours how much would she have should you return to the service and be deployed? not a well thought out suggestion imho.

dude i hear what you are saying about feeling the household work load does not seem equal. i also hear you saying that you are not hearing your w's complaints about the m.

sounds like some sound marital counseling is in order. if you can't afford on ethen see if you can get help thru your church.

i get your confusion about cutting your loses. but let's make this perfectly clear. staying and rebuilding this M will not be easy. if you want easy...........cut and run

I think that the problem is that with so much other difficult stuff in life i always thought that marriage or being with someone you love would be the easy part. I always thought that after dealing with the stress of the world you are so suppose to be able to come home and be at peace and escape the trials and tribulations of the day, but lately it seems like i would rather be at work. I just want peace it seems she is never happy either we are arguing and fighting or she is whining and complaining.

On top of everything else we are on different pages when it comes to raising the kids and that frustrates me and causes conflict. But you are right it's not going to be easy to rebuild, i guess just with everything else in life being so hard i am just wanting to take the easy way out.

IMO, this isn't a remotely realistic view of M. M's, all of them, take work, and a lot of it. I know that fairy tales have a lot princes and princesses riding off into the sunset on the back of a white horse to live "happily ever after," but I'm afraid that's about the only place where that happens. Maybe your problem is that you don't have a particularly realistic idea of what M is all about.

I do and understand what you are saying about marriages taking work but should i feel like i'm carrying dead weight or that my other half who is suppose to be my Partner is against me and it's like we are not on the same team.

After reading your response it makes me wonder if, being with someone is so hard what is the point, I understand there will be differences of opinion and I'm not even looking for the happily ever after i'm just looking to be content and to feel like the person i chose to spend the rest of my life with is on my side, I want to feel like it is Us VS. the world not me Vs her Vs the world.

NNE,
You repeatedly say how different you and WW are and how your whole M has been a struggle. How old are you and WW? I agree with previous comment that both of you need MC. You both have very different perspectives on what it takes to make a M. And the condition of your M over the years has caused a lot of damage. You both have not met each other's needs. You both have become resentful and emotionally detached. I don't think either one of you are equipped to make any decisions about your M. You need to get through all the damage you both caused in order to understand if there is any hope for a relationship and a M. I found MC through my church. Harley offers phone consultations (the info is on this site somewhere.) The problem NNE is that if you don't face this conflict now, you're bound to have problems with your next relationship too.

Gg

I agree and we have discussed marriage counseling but like i have said we are so finacially strapped with everything now that we can not afford it. We completed a little bit of counseling after my A but that was because i was in the Army and it was paid for and we have both know that we need it.

I am 25 but i consider myself to be pretty mature for my age and you are right i guess i have these expectations in my mind of how i think a marriage should be or at least how i want mine to be. In my mind i don't think that i am asking for much just little simple things or at least i think they are, but i guess i could be wrong.

i want to thank you for serving our country.

now, neither you or your w have put much effort into your M for some time now. both your love banks are open. my suggestion is that you BOTH read "His Needs/Her Needs" and talk about whether you each feel it is possible to meet each others EN's.

Absolutely Pops!!

Your and your wife's love banks sound like they are on zero. One of the best ways to fill them up is to do as Dr. Harley suggests and spend 15 hours together per week, doing things together, like when you dated. Interacting, little surprise notes expressing good things to and about each other. I was the BS, my FWH started leaving short love notes with my favorite candy in my car at work. Sometimes a stuffed animal, sometimes just a note showing he thought about me and stopped by. He wanted to save our M. You can't sit on your justification that you didn't leave to fix it all. It frequently falls to the BS to force the recovery to move along. Your WW is pregnant, guilty, and you haven't changed any of the things she was missing when she went looking for affection elsewhere. You are never home, you are tired when you get there. (Not criticizing, just looking)
If you want things to change, you have to change them. The good news is that you may then see reciprocal changes in WW as you make changes that create Love Bank deposits for her
Start reading

Wise words from Fledthestate.

Have to tried them out yet?

Ned,

You remind me so much of myself early in my marriage. Do not keep taking all of the load and let her gradually become a selfish spoiled child. I did that. It is the only thing I really regret from my marriage is that my xWW became such a child that she still acts that way today.

I haven't tried them but i will start and you guys are right and we both know it we have talked about date night but it's hard because we do not really have any friends or family to watch the kids and so we have to pay a babysitter plus the expense of going out and it seems that everytime we go out we get in a argument because she thinks i'm looking at someone or I get irritated by her driving it's always something and it ends up being a bad night.

Oh yeah i forgot to mention that OM showed up at kids daycare wanting to talk to her she told me to just drive off because she didn't want us to get into a confrontation in front of the kids school, He is saying that he wants to be in the childs life and he wants to be at the hospital when the child is born. I was pretty pissed but was able to maintain my composure I told her to contact him and tell him he was not going to be in the delivery room and he is to not contact her again and when the baby is born we will have a paternity test done and if the child is indeed his then we will deal with visitations or whatever at that point. He wasn't happy but i think he got the point but we will see what happens

r your kids in daycare? if so maybe you can work a deal with one of teh other daycare moms to trade off babysitting.

if not be inventive. get the kids in bed early, rent a special movie and pick up some chinese food. then snuggle up by a fire (if you have a fireplace) and have an in home date

my w used to get ticked cause she said i was always looking at someone also. YOU have to make a concentrated effort to keep your eyes forward whether she is right or not.

funny you should mention your w's driving. my w has never had/been in an accident and had only 1 ticket (in 1976) in 40 years behind the wheel. true. but we have talked and i have told her she is an aggressive driver. which she adamantly denies.

then last week we were going somewhere with our 14 yo dd and dd says out of the blue, and i quote "mom you're an angry driver". i almost fell out the door but kept my mouth shut.

what i do is sit down, buckle up and take a nap until we reach our destination.

about om showing up and telling what he wants. i think he's lucky you didn't beat his head in with a bat. did that dips#!t ever think that what you wanted was for him not to bang your w?

all the more reason to GET A CONSULTATION WITH A LAWYER

DO IT

I see alot of my relationship in you, everything you have said i am going through. My W is the same way she is a very aggressive driver but she has only had one speeding ticket and has been driving for about 10 years. The issue of looking at people cannot be fixed it doesn't matter what i look at i still get accused and i tell her even when i do look at people of the opposite sex i see them the same way as i see people of the same sex i mean it's not like i am undressing them with my eyes or anything, i'm just being aware of my surroundings.

My W and i did actually rent a movie the other day and i have changed my schedule at work to where i am not working as late but that also means i am not able to put in as many hours so it will probably affect us financially in the long run but i just about give up trying to make it financially because i can not do it alone and i feel as if she is working against me. I have started to make plans for us to go out to eat or do something together on my next day off while the kids are still in school, we may go to the movies or maybe just out to lunch.

About the OM you are right he is extremely lucky he didn''t get his A$$ handed to him cuz i was pretty furious the only thing that has kept me cool is not wanting to do anything to cause me to lose my job and mess up my record. OM is already a felon so i don't think it really matters to him he is stuck with a bad job and is probably not going very far in life anyway.

I have seen that happening in my life over the years and the most childish thing that i have noticed is that when my W doesn't get her way she throws a tantrum like a child in there terrible twos but on an adult size scale. Each time she does it i know i should handle it the way you would a child and ignore it but i end up giving in everytime because of not wanting to deal with the drama. I remember one time i said i was leaving and she said no and ended up slashing all 4 tires on my truck so i couldn't leave. which pissed me off because then not only could i not leave but we also had to take money that we didn't have and go buy 4 new tires. why, all because she was not getting her way

OM man keeps breaking NC with my WW what should i do now i am hesitant to contact him myself out of fear of losing my cool and doing something i might regret later. I don't think i have the strength for this our trust levels are below zero everytime her phone rings, or when i go work or whenever she leaves the house i question what she tells me. I just don't know what to do anymore.

The other thing is i don't know if it is obvious that i am having problems at home or if it is just the fact that i never paid attention to them before but it seems like since things have gone south at home i have had several woman trying to get my attention. I am not interested in any of them but i find myself talking to them more than i would have in the past.

NNOH

Get WW a new cell number, block OM from all phones, get new emails and block emails from OM.

And, a very important "and" Seek out a lawyer, being WW is pregnant, to run it by the lawyer first, to get a RO against the OM.

Just had a convorsation with my wife and she told me that she wants to keep OM involved she doesn't think that we should carry all the financial burden ourself and that the OM will create alot of drama if he is excluded from childs life. She has had a child taken away from her from a previous relationship and she claims that she knows what it feels like to have a child in the world and not be able to see it and she doesn't want to put anyone thru the pain that she has felt. This being the case i do not know if I want to put up with it I believe we could make it and i am willing to raise this child as my own but i do not know i if i want to have to deal with him being in the picture. This whole thing makes me want to just say F*** it and leave but i keep thinking about my to little ones that are so innocent and i think in a world with so much drama and chaos that i want to provide them a safe and stable home enviroment but i don't see that happening either way. I'm just a little stressed and i feel it is taking a toll on me physically and mentally. God Bless the creators of this site because if i didn't have this outlet then there is no telling where i would be right now.

NNED,

Have you seen a lawyer?? If not do so. You may not want to have a paternity test taken. If you don't OM cannot claim the child is his. IN many states he cannot force a paternity test. You need to also speak to attorney about your chances of getting custody.

Some think they can handle OM and H at the same time as children but very few are successful. Pop's was, but the person whose story you should read is Writer1's. She finally found out how much contact was costing her marriage.

Get good advice, protect yourself, and your children and have a heart to heart with your W about how you feel. If you are willing to rear this child, OM should be OUT of the picture. If she is so worried about OM, then you have to question her dedication to you even more than you are doing.

Please think about this.

God Bless,

JL

"Just had a convorsation with my wife and she told me that she wants to keep OM involved she doesn't think that we should carry all the financial burden ourself and that the OM will create alot of drama if he is excluded from childs life."

This is bad keeping OM in your lives. Tell WW no way.

As to "pops"

He said at first financial considerations pushed him to go after OM for CS. Which then pushed OM to go for and get partial custody.

Years later he has said that for him and his WW having ongoing contact with the OM was not worth the money.

"""""""""He said at first financial considerations pushed him to go after OM for CS. Which then pushed OM to go for and get partial custody.

Years later he has said that for him and his WW having ongoing contact with the OM was not worth the money"""""""""


true on many fronts. although i do see the benefits of children knowing the bio father and having a relationship with them. in these situations i now feel it best to keep him away if possible.

this is not because of anger or resentment on my part but because it has been so stressful on FH.

her om has taken her to court 17 x's in the last 6 yrs. now he isn't paying his cs and the cs services told her he lied about his place of employment so they can't find his employer to garnish his cs payments.

in general he is a pain in the a$$

your om seems like he will be much like FH's if given 1/2 a chance.

it would definately raise RED flags if my w was so concerned about om's feelings. my gut tells me this is just her way of keeping contact with him

you have heard it from several here and i will say it again

SEE AN ATTORNEY find out what the laws are for your state.

if YOU are not going to do the leg work to protect yourself then it may be better to cut and run. BUT you still need to SEE AN ATTORNEY so you can get all the facts about gaining custody of YOUR littles

So here's the deal about three days ago my wife say's the OM followed her and they got in to a big argument about the baby and her not wanting to be with him and whatever else so she leaves and says she goes home and dwells on everything then decides to go up to his house and confront him about stalking her, calling her and sending text messages all the time. when she goes to his house she said they got in to another argument and the he throws her down on the ground and she slaps him he throws some kind of yard statue at him and she slashes the tires on a car in the driveway she tries to leave and tells him she is going to call police and put him in jail so he grabs his phone and calls the police and turns it around on her. so this is her side of the story. Later that night i was able to get his phone number and i talked to him and he tells me his side of the story which goes like this. He tells me that they have been messing around for about 4-5 months atleast 2-3 times a week and he said she had been telling him that we were splitting up and that she didn't love me anymore. he admitted to following us around but he said that was because she was telling him that we were unhappy so he would pop up places we would be and then send her messages saying that we did not look unhappy. When i questioned him about the day that all that occured he told me he never followed her he said he was at home sleep and she called him several times and he did not answer he say she showed up a his house and sent him a text saying she was outside and as not going to leave until he came out (he showed me this text in his phone) he claims he came out and told her they were over he moved on because she was telling him one thing but doing another he then claims that she slaps him and tells him he will not every see this baby and tries to go in to the house to see who he was there with, when he would not let her in she then goes down to the driveway picks up the yard ornament starts hitting his new girlfriends car and slashes the tire he said he went to go call the police and she tried to jump in the car and leave and he tried to stop her. that is his side.

My wife calls me at work and tells me what had happened so i leave work and go down to the magistrates office to take out warrants for him hitting her when we get there they say we hae to talk to the officer first and so we go down the street to the police station they contact the officer and she tells us to meet her back at the magistrates office. when we get there the officer, OM and his new GF are already there taking out warrants on my wife. After finishing up with the officer he proceeds to leave and comes back and approaches me and tells me that my wife has been lying to me and i was like prove it and he starts telling me about things that i had suspected already that she had told me something different we ended up getting into a argument and the officer broke it up and made him leave. My wife ended up getting arrested because he took out the warrants first but she was able to sighn right out. After that she wanted to go the hospital because he had threw her down and she said she was having some pain in her stomach, while in the hospital i was ablr to get his phone number out of her phone and i called him and i asked him how long they had been messing around he told me he also told me that she would tell me that she was taking one of the girls in the class home to buy some time and they would me up at the park. he told me that she had his number listed under the girl which she said she had gotten close to during the class so they could talk and text and i would think she was actually talking to her. he told me that the girl that she claims to have meet in the class and gotten so close to was never even in the class but was actually a long time friend of his, then he said if i didn't believe any of this that i could call her and talk to her which i did and she told me about times that my wife meet up with him at her house and would bring him a plate of dinner that she could at our house that she would claim to be taking to the female friend. She also told me that she had taken three pregnancy test at her house a couple of days before ever telling me. when she told me that she never knew she was pregnant which i did not believe i think that her becoming pregnant is what forced her to tell me about the affair.

my biggest dilema is that i feel like i am being decieved when i confronted my wife with some of the information she told me they were all lies and that he is just saying this stuff to get us to split up and i believe that could be true but there is just so much stuff that is just not adding up to me and i don't know who to believe or what to do. If it was truly a drunken one night stand i could accept it and could work on getting passed it, I was even willing to stay and work it out and raise this OC as my own but now after hearing some of this it has raised alot of questions and i don't believe i can get passed it if she had a connection and actually was contemplating being with him and then later realized that she was making a mistake. I can not get over this knowing that while i was out working 2 jobs 15 hour days so that she can go to school she was somewhere laid up with another man.

I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but I seriously doubt that this was only a one-night stand. The fact that her story doesn't add up proves that.

That being said, many M's on here have been recovered that went far beyond a one night stand. It can be done, but R will never happen while your WW is still seeing the OM. If NC hasn't occurred, it's pretty difficult to move forward. It seem like this A is still ongoing, at least on your WW's part. She still seems to have feelings for the OM, and she's angry because he doesn't want to have anything to do with her. The OC was probably her attempt to keep OM in her life, and it doesn't seem to be working, so she's getting desperate.

I hope she comes to her senses soon. She seems to be putting herself and the baby into some very unsafe circumstances.

""""he throws her down on the ground and she slaps him he throws some kind of yard statue at him and she slashes the tires on a car in the driveway """"""

""""""""he then claims that she slaps him and tells him he will not every see this baby and tries to go in to the house to see who he was there with, when he would not let her in she then goes down to the driveway picks up the yard ornament starts hitting his new girlfriends car and slashes the tire
"""""""""

your post is choke full of things that i could highlite on why you need to SEE AN ATTORNEY.

but the above is screaming at me. DUDE why would you want to continue with someone who has such anger issues. again i don't offer this as simple cut and run advice but you need an attorney's advice and you need to give SERIOUS consideration about calling this marriage quits

I have finally decided to be done with this after much deliberation. you all are right i have known in my heart what to do but i have been trying to hold on but i can't do it any longer. After all that transpired the other day i just can't do it.

The morning after everything happened i ended up sleeping in and when i woke up i noticed that my phone had been moved and when i started looking thru it i noticed a phone call from OM and when i asked my wife what was going on she said that when she woke up my phone was beeping because the battery was about to die so she took it to plug it up and there was a call from an unknown number and when she answered it no one said anything but she said that she she knew it was him so she sent a text to him as if it were from me and after reading the text there are alot of things that just sit uneasy with me about it. The text read as follows...

"I was sitting here talking to my wife. Thanks for the info but you and your friends were not truthful about everything. You pursued my wife even though she told you she was married. D(my wife)could not have started coming to your friends house in june because my kids did not start school until the end of august. I read all the messages you have sent being verbally abusive. She has told you repeatedly to leave her alone in the messages you would not except that and she did not know what to do. I have known for a while you would not let her go, she has told me for a few months now. You have threatened and hit her it is in the messages. she said it was all a game about the attention that is why she did not leave cuz she did not want to be with you really. She told you over and over to go home and you would not. You told the police she came to your house to start trouble because of the girl, she did not know that girl was even there when she headed over there so i know that is not true. You tried to make it out as if she was jealous of that girl i know that is not true that girl is not beautiful like my wife and she does not get bothered by girls who do not measure up to her. I want this nonsense to end, stay away from my wife and family, she doesn't love or did she ever love you she played a game. She has been so happy and relaxed the last few days now that you are gone. Enough is enough."

Please analyze this and give me your opinion.

This is the text that she sent to him after claiming he called but didnt say anything after receiving this message he called my phone and she answered and told him to never call this phone again because it was in her name and she would take out charges on him for harassment. After i woke up and found all this out and reading the message i kinda took it as her telling him they were over and she was not jealous of his new GF. I wanted to call and see what he had to say or what his reason for calling after receiving the message was and my wife made sure to point out the fact that after receiving a message saying leave my family alone and do not contact us the first thing he does is turn around and call she was like i told you he was trying to start stuff and keep things going. I refrained from calling him because i don't know who is telling the truth and who is not but it was like faith or something because that night while at work i just so happen to run into the girl who my wife was suppose to be such good friends and she told me that OM called her that morning and told her about the text said he woke up to this long text that was written as if it were from me but he said it really didn't sound like something a guy would write. After talking with her for a while and she even called her boyfriend and her roomate and they all said that they were a couple and together quite often, Now i undersand that this group of people all hang out together and they could be telling lies but it just seems unlikely to me that all these people would say one thing and my wife say another. After talking with her for about 45mins tell her to have him call me and he does and i speak with him for several mins and he tells me things that only my wife could have told him and when I confronted her with these thing she says that some of it's stuff she told her friend who had to tell him and other stuff is just lies that are made up.

I am jsut so tired of not knowing what is the truth i want to believe my wife but everything is pointing in the other direction and i told her to come clean and tell me the truth but in my heart and in my stomach i know that what she is telling me is not the whole truth. I do not believe everything they are telling me it's just that their story seems more plausible than hers and i can not move forward with this not knowing the truth.

Have you asked your W to take a polygraph? That would certainly get to the bottom of things. Many times, the wayward comes clean about everything before they even take the poly, since they know the truth is about to come out anyways.

You need to get to the bottom of this and figure out what's going on. I'm almost positive this was way more than a ONS.

yeah she came clean and said that they hooked up like 5 times after class but she said she was scared to tell me because she didn't want to lose me. He is saying they have been together several days a week for a couple of months.

That is why i just give up i keep digging but i figure it is just time to let it go i don't know who is lying and who is not but i told her to tell me the truth to begin with and she lied and now i can't believe what she is saying now and OM has a pretty good story that makes sense

I'm sorry you're going through this. From what I understand of your situation, the OM's story does seem to make more sense than your WW's. She's lied about so many things that it would probably be difficult to trust anything she says at this point, and he doesn't have much reason to lie to you.

I think the bigger problem right now is that your WW is going to extraordinary lengths to keep OM in the picture. She's seems to be feeding off the drama of all of this. If she were serious about working on your M, she would commit to NC with OM and stop texting him and going over to his house and causing all sorts of problems. Have you asked her if she is willing to write a NC letter and not ever see/speak to OM again?

I guess the only reason I can see for you even considering staying and trying to work things out is because of your two boys. Obviously, if your WW continues with all of this self-destructive behavior, this isn't a good situation for them though.

I agree and that is why i just decided to give up. I feel bad for not believing my wife but there is to many unanswered questions. She keeps trying to bring up the fact that when i cheated on her 4 years ago that she stayed with me and i owe it to her to atleast give her a chance to make things right. I feel as if it is pointless because i have no love for her, whether it be just because i am pissed off and hurt or what but i can't bring myself to do it. Part of me keeps wanting to but then the other part is telling me to stay strong and walk away everytime we have had problems i always give in and say ok maybe things will gt better but i think i am strong enough to walk away this time

i understand the part about wanting to know how many times. if you are like me once was bad but after that whether it was 2,5,199 it didn't matter, she still went back for more knowing how wrong it was.

i agree with writer that your w is feeding off of all this drama. and she is causing much of this because she is still in the fog of om.

i also think he is playing the same game of trying to keep her hanging on

get to an attorney and find out what the family law says in your state. it may help you with deciding which road you need to take

This reminds me so much of the beginning of then end of my wifes affair.

Why do you feal bad for not beliving a liar?

I am going to go ahead and tell you right now.
If you don't think your wife will eventually agree to total NC with OM and total NC for OC with OM
(Untill she is an adult)
Then if I where you, I would bail.

"She keeps trying to bring up the fact that when i cheated on her 4 years ago that she stayed with me and i owe it to her to atleast give her a chance to make things right"

But you didn't bring an OC home. Your WW is.

True, but he certainly could have. He did the same deed. It doesn't make it any better just because he didn't get the OW pregnant. An A is an A. The OC isn't the problem, the A itself is.

It may not make the affair better to not have produced an OC, but it deffinatly makes recovery for the BS far, far easier.

The possability of recovery for a BH/WW drops sharply when the WW has an OC from the affair. Even more so than a BW/WH situation.

Most WW's wont give up the child, and most men can't live every day with there wifes affair trophy. No matter how innocent the OC is.

Gack: Do you really think of your OC, whom you are I believe raising as your own child, as your WW's "Affair Trophy?" That's pretty sad. If my H had that attitude toward our child, I doubt seriously that we would be together today.

Only about 1% of the time. Only when I am trigered by somthing inconsiderate my wife does or says involving the child. And then, that sudden flash of anger is directed at my wife, not the child.

She does not say or do these things deliberatly, she just doesn't think first.

But most men are not that way, they see the OC as there wifes affair trophy and cannot get past thinking that way, now they cant, and go directly to Plan-D. That is there right, I do not blame them for it and infact support any man who chooses that rout 100%.


No, sad is having an affair and breaking your promis to your spouce and God. Even worse is being stupid enough to not take precoustions to prevent creating an OC from that un-holy union.

Do not look down or juge me for a momantary thought that flashes through my head and the emotions that go with it.

Trust me, it has and will cross his mind to.

Gack, I won't judge you if you'll stop speaking for my H. I think I know him better than you, and I don't think he has ever thought of our child in that way. We've had a lot of honest conversations about this, and the love that he feels for her is quite evident.

True, most men probably wouldn't be able to accept an OC into their lives. If this is the case, then D is the best option for all concerned. But if you're going to stay and raise this child as your own, then you should be fully committed to that. No child deserves to be raised by someone who resents them and views them as an "Affair Trophy." And I am not talking about your situation here specifically, Gack. I am talking in general.

I have actually experienced the process of R from my H's long term A, and I can assure you that it was anything but easy. An OC does indeed present certain complications in the R process, but no A is ever easy to R from. I've read enough stories on this site to see the depth of sorrow, betrayal, and pain that an A can cause, with or without an OC. I don't think you should minimize that pain by saying those R's were "far, far easier" than your own. No one can know another's pain.

Yes, A's are sad, stupid, selfish, and horrible. On my part, I have acknowledged everything that I did that was wrong. But I will not wallow in past mistakes and spend the rest of my life gnashing my teeth because of something I cannot change and cannot take back. I can only move forward from today. That's all any of us can do. I'm very fortunate to have a H who forgives me. He considers himself fortunate in return for the same reason. We have both made mistakes. We are not perfect. But we are trying every day to be better, and I think that's what counts.

Gack, I hope things work out for you and your W and your LO.

Not true UNLESS the WH is willing to go NC completely with both OC and OW and even then believe me the utter agony of knowing your H's DNA is "out there" is still a tough thing to recover from. In my case I get the distinct "pleasure" of having the wh*re in my life forever because of OC. You OTOH get to raise a beautiful child without interference from the interloper that gave the child his DNA. YOU get to be the dad, I am only the stepparent. It sucks lemons all the way around my friends.

Writer1
I know you may not mean it this way, but it sure does sound like your standing on a soapbox preaching to me and telling me I am unfit to be a father to OC becouse of latent resentment I direct towards my wife.

Even if your not specificaly directing it to me.

I do not know if I can ever fully forgive my wife, but I am trying. It is her I hold the resentment for, she is the one who caused me pain. We are still very early in the recovery phase, and I am firmly in the "Anger" portion of recovery and probably will be for a long time.

Unlike you claim your husband was, I was not OK with my wifes affair. Those 5 months where the most painfull experiance of my life. I have lost my father, and my brother, both there deaths combined, hurt no where near as bad as my wifes betrayal.

I have taken on a great responsability that I did not have to, one that I am certain I will not be rewarded for, and I make sure that the child recives nothing but love from me.

So please re read what I posted above, and really think about just how lucky YOU are to have a husband that still loves you.

Untill she is told the truth...
Then I may also become just the step parent.

My biggest fear is hearing the following sentance in about 16yrs.

""I don't have to do what you say, Your not even my real Dad! I HATE YOU!!""

THIS!

Gack, if you have loved her and raised her as your own DD...she won't mean it. YOU are her dad in every sense of the word and possibly even more so when she learns the truth. You will be the man to walk her down the aisle some day. Trust me, I know many who were raised by men that were not bio dads but were still the REAL dad. My own son who is now 26...he barely speaks to bio dad. He realized one day who really raised him was my H.

Gack, I said that to my stepdad once. I'm teary just remembering it.

He IS my REAL dad. He was the one who took me to the doc, who went to my ballet performances, who was there when I won the 500 free.

Where was my bio dad? He opted out because life was too hard.

You do those things and tell ME you aren't a REAL dad?

Once your child is grown, he/she will KNOW this...especially when it comes they have their own offspring.

Then they will be glad for the blessing that you are.

I know I am very lucky. And I never said that my H was okay with my A. Of course he wasn't okay with it. I can't imagine that anyone would be okay with something like that.

I think it was perhaps easier for my H to forgive me however, since he understood what it was like to be a wayward, just how thick that fog could get. He had already walked many miles in my shoes, so I think he was able to look at the situation from both sides and better understand it.

Forgiveness takes time. It took me many years to forgive my H for the utter h*ll he put me through for 10 years. My anger seemed endless as well. I just hope that you don't allow your anger to drive you away from your W in the way that I allowed mine to take me away from my H. I was so distrustful of him after he finally came clean about his A that I distanced myself so much from him that I eventually had an A as well. That doesn't excuse my behavior in any way, but I had simply gotten to the point where I didn't feel any connection with him at all. In fact, we were so distant, that I truly didn't think he would care that much about my A. I thought he'd been wanting a way out for years and now I was giving him one. I do not want this to sound like a justification, but when your H is constantly telling you to go on eHarmony and find someone else (as mine was prior to my A) it really is kind of difficult to feel wanted and loved. The fact that my H didn't run after my A and stayed and fought instead surprised me more than anything. In those months after my A, I finally saw a H who was acting like he truly cared and wanted to be with me. I had been waiting for that for 14 years. Were there other more productive ways that we could have reached that point. Yes, of course there were. And I wish we had. But we're here now and we got here the way that we did and that's all I have to work with.

I do not feel you are unfit to be a father to your OC. I am in no position to judge your fitness as a parent. But I do not believe that you will go unrewarded for your actions. You have a child who thinks of you as his/her father - sorry, I don't know if your OC is a boy or girl. Every time that beautiful little face smiles up at you, think of that as your reward. Every milestone you get to be there for - those first steps, first words, first day of school. Those are your rewards. You will be this child's father in every sense of the word except for DNA. That child will love you unconditionally and will know (if you plan on telling him/her about the A) that you chose to be his/her father. Hopefully, you will also have a WW who, if she doesn't already, realizes how lucky she is to have you in her life and will appreciate what you have done.

Teenagers will say a lot of hurtful things they do not mean. But trust me, if you are there for her and love her as your own, she will know in her heart that you really are her father. My H was raised by a step-father and he considers him his dad in every sense of the word. You will never be a step-parent to your daughter because she will never know any other father except for you. You will hold that place in her heart, not the OM.

"one that I am certain I will not be rewarded for"

You will be rewarded for it, every time she snuggles with you, every time you wipe her tears, every time you and her have a tickle fight, when you teach her to hit the baseball.

You will have so many rewards that you won't be able to count them.

The flip side of that is that just like happen when people get M'ed that already have children, if your wife is not giving you equal parenting and authority because of her guilt or what she thinks you might be thinking ( this isn't clear......

is the 1% of the time occurring, as you are resolving the issues of the A? is it over issues that she brings the OC into? or that you do?
you are early into this. I would not expect issues to not still arise that go back to the A, it effects all our actions, but it becomes less and less frequent. This little girl will be yours, she is now, but your still healing. The little girl doesn't know any different, only the grown ups

Fled

just wanted to jump in here and say fled you are so right about the rewards he will reap.

gack i think you are wrong about the "affair trophy". i never thought of grace in that way.

yeah you may be right that things occur that flash us back every now and then but the oc is never the object or scapegoat for those flashbacks.

if they take you there about your oc then you may want to have a deep look into your own heart

i have no idea about any percentages of divorce when the op is a ww with an oc vs a wh with an oc. no idea of whether more bsh's walk or stay when the ww brings home an oc.

from my experiences here and other sites like it for the past 9 years i would say that i have actually been witness to more bh's staying and raising their oc's then running.

here's another thought. once i made the bond with oc, even when fullhouse (fh) and i were on really rocky ground in our recovery i never gave d a serious consideration because i would never walk out of her life the same as i would never walk out on my com.

I don't understand the question.

And that is why you where able to deal with it, most men can't. What I experiance are breif flashes from trigers. These negative thoughts are always directed towards my wife, never the child.

But they may be about her, or rather how she came to exist.
(Would you like an example?)

Also, like I said, we are early into recovery, and I am still very angry.

�Most WW's wont give up the child, and most men can't live every day with there wifes affair trophy.�

No matter how it�s sliced the OC is the evidence that the OM got in, got out, got a married woman pregnant, and the BH gets to raise the OC so he can keep his WW and COM.

��My biggest fear is hearing the following sentence in about 16yrs.
""I don't have to do what you say, Your not even my real Dad! I HATE YOU!!""��

�Teenagers will say a lot of hurtful things they do not mean. But trust me, if you are there for her and love her as your own, she will know in her heart that you really are her father.�

If his WW did not have an OC this BH would never have to live for 16 years dreading this day may happen. And, even though his OC may not really mean it and will later regret saying it, the pain felt by the BH hearing it will not be unfelt when the regret is realized by the OC.

�He did the same deed. It doesn't make it any better just because he didn't get the OW pregnant. An A is an A. The OC isn't the problem,�

No this BH did not do the same deed. He did not bring home an OC for his W to raise. His WW does not have to live in fear of hearing: I don't have to do what you say, Your not even my real Mom! I HATE YOU!! His WW does not have to face the stigma of her raising the OW affair trophy.

So, his A wasn't as serious of an offense because he got lucky and didn't knock up the OW? Would you like to tell everyone on this site who is dealing with an A that didn't produce an OC that their situation isn't really that bad, since at least there was no OC involved?

Do you even have any experience dealing with the OC situation? Is there an OC in your life?

An affair is an affair.

An affair with an OC is an affair with an OC.

They are not the same.

The process of recovery has been changed.

An Affair with an OC is much more then did the WS have SF with a OP, what type, when, how often, etc...

TR, you didn't answer my question. Do you have any experience dealing with an OC situation?

I appreciate all thie responses this is really helpful but if you go back and read some of my previous post i was willing to accept the A and work through it and even after finding out about the Pregnancy i was still willing to accept that but after finding out about the lies and deciet that is the part that hurts more than anything and the part that i do not know if i can get over. The thought of me working two jobs two support her so she could go to school why she was laid up with some other man really pisses me off and disgust me. Also thinking about her actually having a connection with the OM and thinking that she was considering leaving me until things went sour between the two of them. I know in my heart that she is still lying to me even though she says that she is telling the truth, I believe that the affair is over but the details of the affair have not come to the surface. If it was a one night stand or even a week long fling that is one thing but if she was with OM for several months and considering destroying our family to be with him how can i find it in myself to take her back after that.

I must say I agree with Gack, i know that i could love this OC because i believe that children are innocent but i also know that when something occurs that stems from OC i can see myself getting angry and taking it out on my wife. I already have two stepsons in which i have to deal with from this woman and i already know that the time is coming near that i will hear that dreaded statement " I don't have to listen to you, you are not my real dad" it just seems like it has always been something with this woman and if i continue in this relationship it will always be something.

I would like to stay and try to work things out for my COM but i know that the hurt will continue on until we finally decide to end it so i feel like it's better to hurt them now and start rebuilding there lives rather than continue on with the fighting and arguing for several more years just to end up in the same place down the road.

I even think that if she would have just came clean from the get go and told me that she had been seeing OM for a while and she thought she wanted to be with him and then she realized that she was making a mistake that i could have taken her back and been willing to rebuild but again the fact that she did not tell the truth from the begining and still continues to lie today i just can't do it!!!

I don't have much time right now, but I must say, Nned, that I have yet to see an A that didn't involve a great deal of lying and deceit. Your WW is still lying because she is still having contact with the OM and is still deep in the fog. Until she is willing to go completely NC and really work on your M, she is going to continue doing things that hurt you.

It really is up to you if you stay or go. But, the hurt doesn't have to continue on forever. No one in their right mind would stay in a situation like that. It also isn't the definition of a recovered M. It doesn't have to be that way. If you and your WW both commit to working on your M and recovering from this A, things could be different, but only if you both want them to be.

Oh, and my H raised 3 step-children, all of them teenagers/adults now, and never once did either of us allow them to play the "you're not my real dad, so I don't have to listen to you" card.

Writer,
You are right about that and i believe that she has went no contact but that is only because she knows that i am on the edge of leaving i feel that if i said things were ok and that we would try to work it out then she would still be in contact. I kinda understand her still lying about what happen i gave her the opportunity to come clean and she didn't and she continues to lie about things she is trying to tell me that he was abusing her mentally and physically and that is why she continued contact with him even after the A because she was scared and did not want him to do anything crazy so she would talk to him to keep him calm, I mean really a may be naive but i'm not stupid. Alot of the things she tells me sound kinda farfetched but if she is telling the truth i do not believe her because she put herself in the situations to not be believed, for instance OM tells me they were meeting up at this peticular girls house several times a week and during the time of the A i remember her going to this girls house several times a week but she is saying that she was never over there with him. I mean it is possible he could be lying but again like i said she put herself in the predicament to not be believed.

Did she write a NC letter? Do you have access to her email, accounts, phone record, etc.? Have you exposed the A to everyone you know? Have you taken all of the steps recommended to end the A?

Kinda but not really, i guess it is partially because of the embarassment you know i thought if we were going to work it out and stay together it would be easier if no one knew and we just raise the child as mine and no one knows what really happen, plus the few people that do know about everything think i'm crazy for even still being with her at all. So i know that it would add that much more stress if i had people in my ear telling me i must be stupid for staying. I am so confused and and lost right now, i know that i no longer want to be with her but i can't bring myself to leave, but not because of her but because of my two COM

You should read up on some of the principles on this site, specifically Plan A and exposing an A.

NNEED,

What is your W's plan for rebuilding the marriage? What is her plan to help you deal with what she has done?

If she does not have a plan, you can plan on her not being of much use in rebuilding the marriage. In fact, I would guess you assessment that you would be better off without her is correct.

You have offered no evidence that she has done anything but say "sorry", if she did that. If that is the case, proceed with D. here is my thinking.

This poor OC does not need to be in the middle of a marriage where the H has so much resentment that he can hardly deal with the childs mother. This child does not to see a marriage where the H rages or withdraws, which is what you are going to do if you carry the resentment with you. You WILL have deep resentment unless your W has a plan for working on this marriage, and making you a major part of it, and I don't mean just supply the pay checks.

I would tell you that no matter what you "feel", you need to look at her actions and as well as her words. Are they matching up? Is she doing things to make you feel that she isn't just using you?

Look at the data NNEED, and the data will tell you what to do.

God Bless,

JL

I just want to make sure this is about you and your BH/WH. I have never had an affair.

No, It's just not as bad.
It's like comparing a plane crash that kills 5 and injures 7 with a plane crash that kills all 200 on board and 5 people on the ground. Both are tragedies, but one is worse.

They just are not the same.

A WW will lie untill they are no longer wayward. That takes N.C. and time for the fog to clear.

But if you cant take it, then you cant take it and should consider Plan-D. I support you either way.

Just remember the data you are getting from a fogy WW that still has contact with OM is corrupt. And any plan you get from a still fogy WW will be complete poppycock anyway.

Gack: I was actually referring to NNED. He actually admitted to having an A several years ago, prior to his W's A. I was in no way referring to you or your situation.

I disagree with the your assertion that an A that does not involve an OC is not as bad as one that does. Try to explain to the families of those 5 people killed in your plane crash that the tragedy wasn't that bad, since only 5 people were killed. To the families of those 5, that would still be the most tragic thing imaginable. Their pain would be no less severe at the loss of their loved-one.

Yes, an a with an OC is different, but the pain caused by an A is just as great with no OC involved. Trust me, I've been there.

I did not think so, I just wanted to make sure.

You keep saying "Not that bad"
You are the only person saying that. An affair is a horrable terrible painfull thing. But an affair with an OC is worse, especially when it comes to recovery.

Unless I missed somthing, no you have not.

Your H had an affair years ago, but he did not produce an OC.
(Or am I confused)

So why are you so certain that an affair with an OC is not any harder from the BS's standpaint, especially when it comes to recovery, than a standard affair?

To me, it sounds like you are trying to alleviate some of your guilt from your affair that did produce an O.C. by making it no worse than a standard affair.

I'm sory, as a B.S. raising a O.C. i can tell you, when it comes to recovery an O.C. makes things much harder, and more painfull for the BS.

>makes things much harder, and more painfull for the BS.


I would say the same. It is not insurmountable, and FOR ME it's had a full measure of blessings, but it is SO hard.

I guess that just hasn't been my experience. My H and I have talked about this at length, and in our situation, the pain he experienced didn't seem to be much worse than my own. Different, yes, but not worse. But maybe my situation was unique, in that my H's A lasted for 10 years. I was aware of his feelings for much of that time, and having to live with the knowledge that my H was in love with someone else for that long was extremely painful. I endured years of him talking to her on the phone, emailing her, leaving our family to go rescue her every time she got into another domestic spat with her H, having to listen to countless confessions from my H every time something they did crossed the line (because he didn't think being in an EA was all that wrong and only felt guilty about things when they got physical). No, my H didn't have an OC with his OW (though I had my questions about this a few times), so I don't know what that feels like. I do, however, know what my own feelings were like during those 10 years, and sometimes, it feels like people are trying to minimize that by saying it wasn't as "hard" as what my H had to deal with during my A. It wasn't the SAME, no, but I disagree that it wasn't as HARD.

The strange thing is, my H now tends to focus on the blessing that came into our lives because of my A, and that is our little daughter. She has brought an immeasurable amount of joy and happiness to our household. He has said many times that he simply couldn't imagine our lives now without her, and I feel the same.

Gack, the thing is, you have no idea what recovering a M after an A without an OC is like, because you've never done it. My H and I have experienced it both ways, and with or without an OC, I can guarantee you that R is a rocky and very difficult journey. I think our M is actually in a much better place now than it was in the years after the end of my H's A, because we did nothing to repair our M then. We had nothing like MB to guide us, and we made all kinds of mistakes. Finding this site actually allowed us to reach a place that I never thought we could reach, so maybe that's why the R after my A seems to be going so much more smoothly than what happened during/after my H's A.

Well what can I say, your experience is different than mine.

Unlike your husband, I have no guilt from a previous affair. I have been loyal to my wife since before we where married.

I'm sorry, I just think you are wrong. Maybe not in your specific case where there are affairs by both parties and a long term affair by the non bio before the OC.

But in a single affair situation with an OC (which is the norm) I think you are wrong, and most seem to agree with me.

Gack, I just don't want to minimize anyone's pain. I've read so many stories on this site, some that involved an OC and many that did not, and the pain felt by the BS seems very deep in either of these situations. It's very difficult, and not terribly productive, to attempt to quantify another person's pain and suffering.

I will agree that an OC adds a complicating factor to the R of a M, but I agree with Dealan-De that it is not an insurmountable one.

Writer1,

Yes, an a with an OC is different, but the pain caused by an A is just as great with no OC involved. Trust me, I've been there.

I agree that in your case your H's affair softens the blow of having an OC. You seem a bit insensitive to what he is going through because in Gacks case, he must........

live with a constant reminder of the OMs' DNA,

risk other people commenting on the appearance of the child,

Either lie about the childs true parentage or admit he was a cuckold to the world. Possibly having to lie to his own family members who think OC is his. The kind of choices nobody should ever have to make.

Risk the OM having a change of heart and trying to re-enter the childs life.

I was an OC myself similar to Gacks OC, and my Mother ended up trying to commit suicide and in a mental hospital. I doubt the divorce would have happened had it been a simple affair, my First Legal father had a really hard time with it.

God Bless
NJ

NJ: That's just what I'm talking about. "Simple Affair?" That really does minimize the experience. There is nothing simple about any A, and many people are unable to overcome the pain of an A, with or without an OC, and end up D'd.

Sorry. I don't agree with this. I think an affair that produces a child is much more painful than one that doesn't. Of course, we are talking degrees of pain because they are both horrible.

But recovery becomes much more difficult for the BS with an OC. Much more. The OW cannot disappear out of the BS life when the affair is over. The OC creates a connection to the OW and the recovered family forever. If there is not shared custody and CS, then there is at least CS. That effects the BS for 18 years. And while the OC deserves the money, it can have a profound and monthly effect on the BS and the family as it is drawn out of the bank account.

Plus, the emotional toll and extra child of your H's running around takes on a person. Much harder to get past than just the affair. What about the ladies who were hoping to have their H's first child? That's gone forever. And if they are able to recover the marriage, that can be a constant sore spot........even if they have moved on in their life. What about the women who have not been able to have a child? Now, OW has taken that role as provider of offspring for the H. Much harder than just the affair.

How about the trauma it causes the WH? While both he and OW are the source of the problem and caused it for themselves and others. The internal conflict is tremendous, if the man cares at all about the OC. The pull between OW/OC and BW/COM is painful at best, since there isn't a pain free solution and the guilt is huge. Much more than just an affair. Now, the COM and OC's lives are dramatically affected by the affair and decisions after.

How about the drama that many OW continue to cause in the life of the BS/FWH? Its a rarity that this does not happen and I think it is just about only those OW who are married and stay with their H's. Single OW.......drama and games through OC, if their is shared custody.

Both affairs with OC and without OC are devastating. But I don't think you can compare the two in terms of long term fallout and pain. Not even close, IMHO. It has been suggested that it takes 2-5 years to get past an affair. With an OC, I think you are looking at the 4-5 year recovery time frame. An OC may not be an insurmountable obstacle, but it puts that idea to an extreme test.

And at least for me, I have forgiven my H and gotten past the affair. But because of the OC and the extra pain and drama, I will never get "over" it.

JMO.

Well said, Lbelle. Writer, hon, I think your H makes it look much easier than it is for most people. Having an OC makes my life complicated to the max. It tore my H's loyalties in two and kept in the A much longer. It tore my children apart to know he had a child with OW. It leaves me helping to raise the OC with my H along WITH my enemy, the OW. NOBODY wins when there is an OC in the situation.

LBelle: I think there is difference in our perspectives and experiences. In my case, the OM is not part of our lives at all. My H doesn't have to deal with ongoing contact with the OM. OM is not on our OC's birth certificate, does not pay CS, has never seen our OC and has no desire to be a part of her life at all. I think Gack's situation is similar, but I'm not sure.

In our case, my H is the father of our OC in every way except for the DNA. He doesn't have to share our daughter with the OM.

I think when the OC results from an A between a WH and OW, it's more likely that the OW will go after CS and try to keep the WH in her life. I agree that, in the case of a FWH who has an OC with his OW and there is contact or CS, the R is much more complicated. I've already agreed that R is much more complicated with an OC in general. The financial obligations of having to pay CS alone are a constant reminder and a constant drain on the BW and COM. And, if there is contact and the OW must remain a part of the FWH's life, I am sure that adds immensely to the complications and pain that has to be endured by the BS.

An A hurts, period. It is the most painful thing most people will ever have to endure. I think the difference between an A that involves an OC and one that does not occurs primarily in the R phase, and there, I completely agree, the complications of an OC can be immense.

I think, for me, all of this started because NNED kind of glossed over his own A. I found myself wondering what he and his W did to recover their M after his A? I haven't really seen him talk much about his own A or the pain it certainly must have caused his now WW or what he did after his A to rebuild his M. I'm guessing they didn't do much to R their M or they would be much less likely to be here.