Thanks Sapphire. I was thinking this as well. Just not to volunteer it but if asked, then answer in honesty. I am thinking that is actually the way to go in this unusual situation. My MIL would not be offended if I was asked a question and proceeded to give an honest answer and the cloud that would be put over the event would not be able to be blamed on me at that point.

Still open to everyone's opinions here!

Edited to add this: I just came from the doc's office for my weekly weigh in. I lost another 3 lbs! That makes 45!! I'm sooooo excited about that! The infidelity diet I believe one of you posted it was called, well, I am REALLY glad for it at this point LOL. But I'm eating better, exercising more and having a good time with it too.

So I texted to WH that I lost another 3 and all he could say today was "yes, but you're still not back to work". Well, heck. OK I guess not, but I'm losing weight. The problem is I still am not able to be in public without losing it here. I keep trying, the doc keeps playing with meds on me, but it really, really sucks and I just get panic attacks BADLY! Doc is realy trying hard, the IC is working with me....my job is being real trooopers here....I KNOW I have to get back somehow. I just haven't been able to figure out how.

Anyway, wanted to celebrate the weight loss with ya'all.

Cami, congrats on the weight loss! One thing about talking to a WH during Plan A. We say have "NO EXPECTATIONS" and there's a reason for that. Because waywards are wacky and they WILL hurt you. (i.e., the comment about you not being back to work). OTOH, WH may have been telling you something there. Has your not working been an issue for him in the past?

As for the family reunion, absolutely tell people the truth. You can ease the tension a little by saying something like, "yeah, I love him dearly, but I really dislike his girlfriend"... and then say, "Seriously, WH left me for another woman. I still love him and I would appreciate your support for our marriage." Let it be known far and wide what's going on, but not in a vengeful or ugly way.

Princess,

Yes, the not working has become an issue over the past year. It is because I keep having to take time off of work for things and to handle things for BOTH of us and my work allows me to do that. Well, that doesn't help with the income situation, so he gets mad about it...so yes, that is one of the issues and I am working on finding a different job with different days off so that I can work AND do the things we need for me to do (and the things I need to do for ME too). And I didn't really care that he said that by the way, it was just funny. See the reason it struck me funny is, every other week when I have put my stats out to WH, our kids and my best friends for their support on weight loss, he has come back with WAY TO GO or something similar! So all of a sudden he just did this instead and all I could think was Oh brother! But, I KNOW it is an issue and I am working toward remedying that issue. So yes.

But here's the other side of the coin so to speak. We are filing ch 13 bankruptcy. I have dealt with ALL of it MYSELF! He has given me everything that is needed (payroll and records and all that jazz) BUT he has not had to go to attorney as of yet. And he WILL NOT have to go until we appear in court for it. THAT is one of the reasons that I am having a hard time working other than my own mental state. BUT I have had at leaast two appointments per week for the past 6 weeks trying to get this all ready to go.

And yes, that is one issue we have had. MAJOR bills, not enough money to pay them, no resolution in sight. So ch 13 is one issue being resolved with a REASONABLE payment. It is something we talked about the day he left and we have stuck to that to help each other out.

Am I Proud that we are doing this? No, but I have researched and worked with companies and robbed peter to pay paul for so ong that there is no doing it anymore. We just can't together or by ourselves. So it is the solution we will live with on that.

Thought I would put an update here from this afternoon. Why? I'm actually quite bored LOL. But I also thought it was kinda interesting, bordering on a boundaries offense yes, but interesting.

WH and I were talking this afternoon on the phone getting the last minute stuff ready for Ch 13 meeting in the morning. He was very, very tired. I asked what was up.

He said that he had gotten a call and had to go 300 miles last night and back and didn't leave until 11 pm.

I said, oooooh, that sucks! Glad you made it back safe.

He said "yeah, but I never get to bed til midnight anymore. I know you don't want to hear about OW but let's just say this...there is more stress and pressure being put on me than I feel I need or even really want. And I seem to be on the night shift lately cause most of my calls are overnight and I'm just really, really tired, but it's not being understood or accepted as that."

I said "I'm sorry to hear that."

He said, "yeah, well...." Then we went back to the Ch 13 meeting stuff.

Anyway, he confided in me about something and yes, it was borderline...and I will have to put my foot down a little stronger, but he did say that he knows I don't want to hear, but he must have wanted to confide in me too....not sure what this all means, but NO EXPECTATIONS, just found it curious.

Thanks for listening!!

I will tell you what it means, CAKE EATING.

DO NOT let you WH talk to you about OW EVER. Cut him OFF and change the subject. How about, "I can not accept a marriage where you have a girlfriend, would you like a cookie?" THIS should NOT be what you are going to do going forward. You need to put up those boundaries NOW. Your WH will walk all over you and your LB$ will go down quickly.

True. Like I said, I knew it was borderline. If he had not said the statement about OW, I wouldn't really have known the difference and I could have still gotten the concept he was trying to portray to me. At least, I'd like to think I would have. I'm not that dense usually.

I will set that boundary tighter!!!!

Well, went to ch 13 attorney this morning, to IC this afternoon and will head off to a job interview here in a few minutes. Gosh, I hope I get this job. It's nothing big, BUT it's a steady income rather than one based on tips. And I really need that a lot right now. Cross your fingers for me please?!

Talked to WH today for a few minutes too. He was mad that the ch 13 atty needed a few more days to get the ball rolling. I asked what the hurry was and he said that he is anxious to get out of his mother's house. Well, hm, then he should just move here huh? LOL. No I actually did not say that, but I reallly, really wanted to. Maybe I should have said it...hm, don't know. Whatcha think?

Anyway gotta run for interview. Will check back later with ya'all.

Well, I'm back to crying again. I just can't let it just slide by me most of the time. At least I'm good enough not to cry around WH and I had a job interview and I got a second interview! aND I went to the CH 13 meeting and was productive AND I went to the IC and had a good session.

But we just had a small conversation about something he put up on FB. It hurt. And I asked if he regretted our life or our children. The statement was something about making the right choices the first time so you didn't have to regret the ones you made. He said it had nothing to do with our marriage, our children or our seperation. That he has made hundreds of choices in his lifetime and that he didn't want to make a mistake by making a bad choice.

He said that he feels that the seperation was the right choice for him because he is happy. But that it is full of stress and drama. But that he likes his new life simply because he's happy and he's getting exercise and he feels better, he's no longer bored all the time and always has something to do. He doesn't like the drama or the stress but he does like the rest. And he actually called it a seperation rather than something else. He also said earlier that he wanted to move out of his mom's house, but he has been telling me that he was saving up money for the D...and now he's talking about renting an apartment so he can get the he** out of mom's house. Hmmmm, he knows that he wil have to pay for it all and that I will not pay any because I do not want it, so this would be a setback in that for him. Not sure here.

I asked then, is there room for me in that new life? He said he was not going to talk about this right now because he is driving and was almost at the destination, but he said "babe, I don't know anything". Then he said he'd call later again. So I think that me asking him was actually over the line of what I should have done, but it did just slip out....but I won't do that one again. If he calls back, then we can talk more and I will listen to what he says. But I won't say that one again! UGH. And he did say he'd try to call again later too, so that was a reaching out thing to me. So he's just confusing and I'm just stuck here for a few minutes while I commiserate with myself.

So I'm meeting his needs, I really am, but this time it hurt like he** to hear it. I know WS right??....well, that's why I'm here instead of talking to him and crying. LOL.

Cami, you are in Plan A right? What are you doing in Plan A? What have you done for PLan A today?

No relationship talk but you WILL want to talk in a reverse babble way. You will want to tell him that you want a happily recovered marriage. That is PART of PLan A. If he doesn't KNOW what you want, when he sitting alone during your PLan B, he won't know what he has to do and what you need. TELL him what you want.

I am sorry but right now, I don't see a PLan A, I see a Plan DOORMAT.

Plan A, meet needs and avoid LBs.

K Scotland, maybe I'm really confused. Maybe I'm not doing this right. I am supposed to meet his EN to the best of my ability, like listen when he talks and tell him I am commited to putting this marriage back together. That I will not tolerate OW in my life or our M. So I have been trying to do things that reflect this. BUT I got messed up and I know I messed up when I asked about me being in his new life. He wasn't mad, just said he couldn't talk right then though.

Also, I have been attempting to do the things I KNOW he wants me to do in order to meet his EN. But it is difficult without him living here with me. So I try to meet every one of them the best I can while he is at mom's.

So, I should not have discussed the FB comment that hurt me. Got that one, I figured that one out after I had put up this post and thought from now on I'm gonna have to stew over something for a few hours before I decide if I will even address it with him when it comes to stuff like that.

AND I KNOW I shouldn't have asked about me being in his life? I should have said that I wanted to recover the marriage or actually put it a little differently, but said that. Anyway, I KNOW I did those things wrong this time.

I am so scared here that I keep messing up, but he IS recognizing and telling me he sees changes and things I do...so I AM meeting some of them.

*sigh* Maybe I'm a failure at this too and it's soooo important to me NOT to fail at this. I don't know, I just know I keep trying and I don't know why, but messing up seems to be what I do.

Oh and plan A today? I went and handled the Ch 13 meeting so he would not have to take off of work.

I texted to have a great day! I texted when I went into IC to let him know I would not be available for an hour and I talked to him about his day when he was on phone with me after the ch 13 mtg.

I picked up and dusted my living room and I had a job interview for a full time job (which is one of those things he wanted me to get).

I am not trying to beat you down, I am trying to nudge you in the right direction. Plan A is HARD but RECOVER is HARDER. Are you ready?

When your WH talks about his plans to move into his own place, you could say, "Why spend rent on two places when you have a perfectly good place right here."

Reverse babble thread. Have you read it? You need to reverse babble him. Have you read Sickoflimbo's thread? You should. He got really good at reverse babble and most of his Plan A has been done while he was out of the home at training.

You should look up Queeniesadventures and see what she did. She PLan A'd while her WH was out of the house to.

You just need a solid grasp of your WH's ENs and the LBs you commit that you shouldn't be.

Have you read SAA?

I will look up those threads and read.

I have not read SAA and really can't afford to get it so that I can. I haven't worked since July 1 and all Wh gives me is 150 per week. I had to borrow to pay my electric bill from my aunt. So, I really can't afford it.

And I know you're not beatin on me, I'm just feeling pretty down tonight so I may sound worse when I type.

There you go, focus on the positives. When you are changing things about yourself, is it because of things your WH told you about Pre-A? Those are the things you should focus on. The things he complained about after the A began are HIS justifications and his history re-write.

I will give you an example. With my WH, his number one need is most definitely SF. He would always stress about how the frequency wasn't up to snuff. How I didn't seem into it. How I was not open to things. Keep in mind, we were each other's firsts, so we learned together. When the A started, he didn't want SF as much and told me he had a problem with our sexlife. He then even said, "Well, you MUST have been cheating because you weren't getting sex from me that much, so you MUST have been getting it somewhere else." UMMMM NOOOOO. I just didn't have more of a need for SF then what I WAS getting. During my PLan A, I was NOT having SF with WH, so I had to do other things. Some of which I posted about, and some of which, was suggested and I just did it with out posting I'll let the good people who read my thread "get" that.

I also know that my WH has admiration as a TOP need. He liked being able to make me laugh. I didn't laugh much for YEARS. I started to do that again. You know what, he didn't laugh for years either. Someimtes he would tell me about the joking things they did at work and I just thought they were immature. Well, OW didn't. So, I needed to LAUGH and admire WH. Hard to do when all I wanted to do was bash his head in.

I don't want you to feel down, just improve. You CAN do this.

Okay, I get it. I AM doing some things right. That's good. Was beginning to think I was just messing it all up.

I will keep doing the things I know he has complained about prior A. That is no problem, especially since most of them after I have spent time analyzing are true.

I am doing most all of the changes for me by the way. They are things that he pointed out that I decided that I missed or that I discovered through listening to him without him really saying, but implying that he missed. Then I figured out that I missed those things too and couldn't remember how the heck I even got away from them in the first place.

There are some issues with SF, you are right on the money there. So I have been working on that too and letting him know through texts, chat and conversations that this is being worked on as well. He seemed happy about that too.

I am a little miffed right now though. I had texted him a while ago cause we were having some nasty storms here and told him to be careful. Well, he finally texted me back that he's at the movies and hadn't gotten my messagte until just then. Now I wouldn't care about that except that I LOVE to go to the movies and for the past 23 years, every time I have asked to go, I was told it was too expensive and just as easy to wait til it came out on DVD. So that one kinda miffed me a little. Don't tell me you're bored and we never do anything when you always say you don't want to, but then go do it with OW?? I don't know that he was with her, he didn't say that, I'm just figuring that's the way it is.

So here I am today. I have not spoken with WH at all today. I felt that, after last night's conversation and the fact that I was quite miffed for him taking OW to a movie, this was the right thing for the day. I did text him to have a nice day, but that is it.

I DID go out to my aunt's house and tell her and my uncle everything that has been happening with Ch 13 and with WH claiming D was inevitable.

I explained why this concerned me and that I was unable to afford to have an atty on retainer. Then I explained that I needed help. They agree with me not to file. Because it is the wrong thing for me, at this time at least. BUT they did fund the retainer in case WH does go file a do it yourself D. This is because, in this state, a do it yourself does not allow for seperation of debts it just assumes that you have agreed to whatever is going to happen and that is not something I would be comfortable with.

Do it yourself also does not allow for alimony in any form. This is not going to happen either. The WH makes 3 times what I do and we have been married over 20 years! I supported HIM while he was on disability and barely getting anything for 5 years! Nope, I'm not that nice.

Also, they will be taking the house into my trust fund once title begins to transfer. Now WH KNOWS that this house is mine and has agreed to sign off through any lawyer I want on this house. BUT I'm still not comfortable with that either. So they will be taking the house into the trust fund which my uncle is the trustee. He will then have the trust sell the house and purchase the camper that I want. The trust will then own the camper and hold any other proceeds in trust. That way there is NO WAY that WH can touch this house. Period.

I'm getting a little vindictive here but I'm getting mad at things too. I'm still working Plan A, but I'm starting to take precautions in case of plan B or D. It's just that I feel it may be the best thing all around to be prepared. Anyway, the trust is in existence until I'm 60 and has been for a while it is to protect some things from a situation just like this and my parents set it up a long time ago, guess they never trusted WH completely through the years. So that will be quite a while and will protect me for the future.

So I will not file, but I WILL answer if he does file and I WILL take care of myself for the long run.

I am going for a walk tonight! I didn't get to last night. We had some MAJOR storms here and it was 80 mph winds and rain like you wouldn't believe. There's lots of damage in town too, luckily my house was spared. That is a good thing cause I couldn't afford to get myself any help if I had to. One friend's little sister is in a hotel with her son because a tree is on top of her house and there's a huge hole in the roof!

BUT WH did call right after he left the movie theater to ask if I was okay and if everything was alright with the house. I said yes, and he said that he had been worried about me so he just wanted to check in. That was nice of him. I'll take that as a positive at this point. And, just because it made me smile, the movie was cancelled because the power went out! LOL. K. That is mean, I know...but I smiled nonetheless.

I AM NOT telling WH any of what is going on with my aunt and uncle. That is my private business, I would think. But I won't lie to him either. I just am not going to mention it. If he were to ask me a direct question about those things, I may feel obligated to answer him because of radical honesty...can ya'all offer advice there on what is the best course of action in that situtation.

Also, I don't know if I mentioned it or not, but my DD21 is coming to town for this family reunion. Her dad and OW are going camping with friends after the reunion. Well, the friends asked my DD to go with them (not OW, just her BFF asked DD). She told them no. She said she was going with me to the movies and then with her brother the other night. I asked her if she wanted to go with them. Told her it was okay if she wanted to spend time with dad and I know she loves to camp. She said no. She wasn't going to spend time with OW, she did not have any intentions of meeting her for quite a long time if ever and she was not comfortable with her dad doing all of this to me! Go DD!! She said she told him that too.

I'm not giving up in any way, shape or form. Not even if he does file a D. I WILL fight for my M. I will STAND for my M. It's that simple. It's the right thing for me.

Thanks for listening.

OKAY, you seem to be handling things really well. This is much better. Get things done when you feel good enough to do them because that roller coaster ride doesn't stop.

It is funny how the WS starts doing things with the AP that hey wouldn't do with their BS. It is the same here. It has been the same for other BSs too. That shows that they really ARE aliens. They can't keep this up FOREVER, they will start to revert back to their old "habits." See, this is why affairs don't last. The WS and AP are LYING to each other. They aren't being who they really are. And the further they get away from who they are, the worse the fall. Not your concern right now though.

Just Plan A and prepare for Plan B.

Good for your DD21. I am glad that she is standing up for what is right.

Thanks Scotland! I'm so glad that I'm finally feeling a little better today. It's been a long down turn on the roller coaster this week. So to be up for a few hours is good.

I know, I'm SOOOO proud of my DD! She is such a great kid!

Bump (sorry) Just really need to hear from someone, I'm starting to feel really down again, but I just know I'm doing plan A and doing it to the best of my ability.

I am working on myself more today. I went for a three mile walk last night! That was nice. And my DD21 is coming in to town today for the family reunion with her boyfriend. They will be staying here with me and have told WH that they will see him at the reunion but not elsewhere because he is always with OW and that they will not do that. Well, read a couple of posts up and it explains that all.

I'm just feeling down.

Cami, make sure that you explain to your attorney about what you've done regarding the trust and the house. You don't want to be accused of hiding or disposing of marital assets, although I'm pretty sure that house is your separate property.

Sorry you're feeling down today, that's why we describe it as a rollercoaster of emotions. Yay for your DD! That is awesome!

Good for you for taking care of yourself too! That will help alot and it's part of Plan A -- become a better person.

((((Cami))))