friends,

Sorry for the long post...
I have been going through a devastating time with my partner of 5 years. We aren�t married but have been in a serious relationship and living together with the intention of marrying early next year. I really wouldn�t put myself through if she wasn�t someone super special.

I found out two months ago that she had been hanging out with a work colleague and that has turned into an A with some serious infatuation involved as he is a handsome, successful guy.
Irrespective of the fact that she made the mistake of cheating on me she always considers that I am her best friend and was waiting for me to ask me to marry her until the A. Even now, when she is in need of advice I�m the first one she calls. She has openly told the OP that I am her best friend but not much else.
We have no intimacy issues even now and at night we sleep in each other�s arms despite what is going on.

I was getting my life together with my new business and I have a day job that involves long hours and she was getting neglected and this was partly the reason she started hanging out with friends. I have since made amends by delegating responsibility so I can spend time with her. We never had any fights or conflicts till the A surfaced.

She is really ashamed of her mistake and has told me that if she could undo that one invitation for coffee she would do it.

The OP doesn�t know she is in a relationship and she is starting to drop hints to him in the hope that he will leave her as he is one of those �men of integrity� types. She is unsure how to tell him the whole truth and a big part of her is unsure if she wants to let him go. He is mostly in the darkness about me. He might also leave the country within 10 months due to a work transfer.

I asked her to sever contact but she said she cannot abruptly do it as she can�t face seeing him at work. She said if I can�t bear to give her time to sort out herself then she would rather let me go than to watch me suffer with the grief this is causing. However, she doesn�t want me to leave her as she is also in love with me(and I am sure I meet a big chunk of her ENs.)

She has asked me for some time until June to see where the other relationship is headed. We are going on a 2 week holiday together.

I have been in Plan A since Feb and willing to wait it out till we return from holiday in June to move to Plan B. I have been making the mistake of trying to reason with her until I read yesterday that she had the foggy mind of a drunk...Obviously this was causing us both to end up frustrated and in tears. Our love bank is low at this point.

I�ve switched gears now and just sticking to the carrot of Plan A and not trying to reasoning with her. Last night she was txting him and I diverted my mind. I am reading and following the MB concepts and forum posts and really trying to hush the taker in me for the short term.

I know that we are not married and the easiest thing for me would be to dump her. I am past that stage of thinking and really want to forgive her and do what it takes to make this monster something we can look back in pride as having conquered. In my younger days I myself was a wayward partner so am not pretending to be a saint. I have since realized that cheating is not for me and have been faithful for the past 5 years.

My questions are...

Am I doing what I should be doing to carry out Plan A on track?
Should I expose her to the OP in full detail? What should I say to him? Should I call or send him an email?

Do I expose her immediately or after June?

Anything else I should be doing that I�m not?

Appreciate all the advice I can receive...

Thanks for listening. Appreciate it.

Mark

Welcome to MB.

I would edit out your real name.

Dating is the interview for marriage. She failed her interview. Is this really the woman you want to Marry?

She isn't willing to cut ties with this man. That should be a huge red flag for you.

Please read.

Choosing the Right One to Marry
Living Together Before Marriage #1
Living Together Before Marriage #2

Another good one.

Buyers, Renters and Freeloaders

Thanks for replying. That is my stage name

Yes she has failed the interview but there really is no guarantee that if I date another and get married that I will not be cheated on.

Its a risk I am willing to take and a chance I am willing to give to her cause I value what she brings to my life otherwise.

I truly believe she is filled with remorse for her inconsiderate act but she is currently unable to detach as the drug is still having an effect on her so to speak...

Just to add some more background information, I was in the middle of a painful divorce due to an abusive ex-wife. It took 6 years for the divorce to come through and last month I was divorced. Been separated from the ex for 6 years. Where i come from divorces are a slow process and if one party decides to make life miserable in court for the other they can. This was the case.

This obviously added to the problem of my gf waiting for me wondering if I will ever be available again. She wants to have a family and kids.

Oh I thought Mark was your real name.

Actually, if you find a partner that is a buyer and you live an interdependent lifestyle, with complete transparency where there's no chance of a secret second life (SSL).A partner who has boundaries and lives by EPs. Where an affair would be impossible to maintain. Then yes, you could live without an affair happening.

So you were still married? So she doesn't have a problem with being a renter?

How old are the both of you?

Did you read this?

I have been separated for 6 years and the divorce proceedings were on. My current gf has been my friend for a long time. She knew what happened in my marriage. At that time she had her own bf. Eventually that relationshup ended and both being single, we fell in love with each other. This was 5 years ago.

Since then she has never once given me the idea that she was a freeloader or a renter always was a buyer.

She has always treated me like her husband. She never asks for a penny from me and was as faithful as they come. She is also in a responsible senior management position at work.

This momentary lapse of reason happened possibly cause she got tired of waiting and now she has lost her mind to infatuation.

No excuses. What she did was wrong period.

Shes just trying to find her way at the moment. She told me she has no courage to tell the OP. She is hoping he'll dump her so she can wake up.

Weird...whats she smoking?

I really would like the OP to have an idea of whats going on.

The guy hasnt a clue. Should I write an honest email to him?

I am 38 and shes 34.

yes

Hi Inflames, I am sorry you are in this predicament. Your gf is a renter by definition. She is only along for the ride until something better comes along. As she told you, she wants to try out this relationship to see where it takes her. That is a renters mentality. A buyer is someone who demonstrates her commitment by getting married. Living together is not the same as being married; it is closer to a dating arrangement.

Did you leave your wife for this woman?

Freeloader is unwilling to put much effort into the care of his or her partner in a romantic relationship. He or she does only what comes naturally and expects only what comes naturally. It's like a person who tries to live in a house without paying rent or doing anything to improve it unless the person is in the mood to do so.

Renter is willing to provide limited care as long as it's in his or her best interest. The romantic relationship is considered tentative, so the care is viewed as short-term. It's like a person who rents a house and is willing to stay as long as the conditions seem fair, or until he or she finds something better. The person is willing to pay reasonable rent and keep the house clean but is not willing to make repairs or improvements. It's the landlord's job to keep the place attractive enough for the renter to stay and continue paying rent.

Buyer is willing to demonstrate an extraordinary sense of care by making permanent changes in his or her own behavior and lifestyle to make the romantic relationship mutually fulfilling. Solutions to problems are long-term solutions and must work well for both partners because the romantic relationship is viewed as exclusive and permanent. It's like a person who buys a house for life with a willingness to make repairs that accommodate changing needs, painting the walls, installing new carper, replacing the roof, and even doing some remodeling so that it can be comfortable and useful.

Thanks ML.
I can agree with the renter definition when I put things into its current perspective.

My wife and I separated due to a lot of conflict. She was suffering from something that closely resembled a bi polar disorder but would not admit it or seek help. I tried saving the marriage for over 5 years but when she started getting violent I knew it was time to move on and move out. Additionally I had a very controlling mother in law who was over ruling my authority in the home via my wife.
When the Mother in Law was around there was no need for google search.

The gf just txtd me asking me to pray for her to get out of this mess.

Do not believe a word she says.
She is in the FOG.

she will tell you something different...every other day.

Yes! Thank God for MB that I know this.

What is peoples opinion on exposing her to the OP?

Don't youll think he needs to know that he is also in the same predicament as me. I feel a bit sorry for the other guy. (is this normal?)

This should also level the playing field and perhaps she will face a tsunami from him which possibly will give her a rude awakening from la la land?

You have a girlfriend of 5 years yet you've been divorced for 1 month. Understand that a woman with BOUNDARIES (ie. a woman who protects her relationships from cheating) would never, in a million years, date a man who has been married for their entire 5 year relationship.

Clean up your side of the street and then look for a woman with boundaries.

I'm not sure what you're saying here. Do you mean you are willing to settle for the crumbs of a potential adulterer as opposed to facing the unknown? Do you understand that you are facing a lifetime of 'unknown' - never knowing when this will happen again?

If I step on someone's shoe while I'm getting off the bus and don't apologize, I am being inconsiderate. This is a little more significant than just being 'inconsiderate'. See my question, above. Well, then, you have your answer. The good news is that you know that your intended is willing to bail on you for a moment's pleasure. If you're okay with that, then proceed.

Just that I have been a FWH myself and I have committed to being truthful to her and proud to now be a faithful man of 5 years...

I cant totally write her off saying that there is absolutely no hope of change when I myself was in her shoes 5 years ago?





my ex wife moved to our country of origin after we separated. I�ve been legally separated (via a court order) for 6 years. Each time I have a court appearance I take a plane ride. It�s been hell. I�ve finally got my divorce so I am cleaned up. It�s my gf that is wavering now sadly. If she hadn�t lost hope in me ever getting out of my mess we would�ve been talking of marriage and children now.
This is a huge red flag agreed but how can I be the one to cast the first stone?

I would suggest your whole idea of boundaries in relationships needs to change. The fact that a single woman tried to help you out of your divorce mess was a red flag enough. A self-respecting woman would not "stand by her man" while he was still married to another woman, regardless of where the ex-wife was. A woman with boundaries and respect for marriage would either walk away when she found out, or said "call me when you're divorced". This is the kind of woman who does not respect marriage. So, are you really surprised that she is willing to cheat as well?

You don't need to "cast stones", you need to start examining why you are making poor choices in a partner.

And thank your lucky stars that you weren't married to her with children. Do you think that she would not have had an affair? The SAA forum rarely contains married couples without children. Your mess would've been much worse.

This is not really a discussion forum so much as a discussion of MB concepts and how it applies to successful marriages. Are you interested in MB concepts? Because of the many basic concepts, the unwritten (yet obvious) one, is that you don't date when you are married. No excuses.

For one, consider that when you date when married, you are choosing a poor quality partner if they don't care you are married.

She had nothing to do with the divorce Alis. She was only a friend who knew what was going on much like the many other friends in the know.

I mentioned that the divorce was initiated a long time ago. It took 5-6 years to come through. It not easy to live alone and not have a companion.
What really irks me is we never had any other issues except this one. Everything else in the way we conduct ourselves is as per the POJA and we didnt even know anything about MB concepts then.


I am glad this has come up before I got married surely. I will just have to make a call on her sincerity if she repents of her sin the right way and Im not going to wait it out for her for much longer.

Does anyone think that the other guy should be told?

Are you interested in learning about MB concepts?

Part of the reason that MB does not recommend dating while separated is (aside from the obvious, that you are still married) because it distracts you from healing and learning how to conduct yourself in future relationships. How to make the right choices in a partner and for future marriage.

You never had issues aside from you being a married man living with another woman, and her cheating on you with another man. Sir, this is like complaining the Titanic was perfect aside from a scratch in the side and a bit of water coming in.

You aren't seeing the glaring issues here and are focused on getting an apology from a girl who didn't respect fidelity in the first place.

If you use MB concepts, you can find that future wife who will be honest and loyal, or, you can try and turn this girl into something she never was. But you aren't going to attract a faithful loyal wife if you do not respect or honour those same concepts yourself.

If you still disagree with this, then I don't know what to say, because it would not follow MB thinking.

Thats good Alis. Im new here...barely 2 weeks of reading. Im slowly digesting all the concepts and it has helped me immensely improve my thinking.

I am reading almost daily to the point that work is getting delayed but I cant focus on my job anyway while my mind is troubled. So Im really hoping and praying that sanity returns to my life irrespective of the outcome of this relationship.

I would love for her to turnaround like I once did and we could build a MB thinking + Word of God life but at this point I will just stay in a short Plan A cause I believe that everyone deserves a chance. Perhaps I am an idiot

She may be The Titanic .... and her "turn around" will not happen in time to avoid striking the iceberg.

Shes already hit the iceberg.

Its a matter of whether shell get onto a raft before it leaves.

I totally get your feelings regarding your gf. We all have good qualities and we have some bad. That's being human. I'm in a struggle myself with my sig others "bad side." His great qualities are being shadowed by his ugly side.

I'm not new to MB as I hung out on just found out forum about ten years ago. (WOW, that long ago) and my ex had cheated on me. It was something that could not be fixed. I learned that we all have needs . And when needs are not met, they are sought.

When marriages end, it's very dangerous to jump back into a relationship right away. Doesn't matter how long the two of you were separated because there was some type of communication involved. Now what is more dangerous is that the two of you knew each other and I am sure she felt neglected as maybe she wanted to jump in a take the role of your ex wife. Once that wasn't happening, you're right, she took to someone that paid attention to her. Most definitely what she did was an act of selfishness and wrong.

What bothers me is that she's not being proactive in your approach to cutting your hours down to meet her needs. I feel that she doesn't want to come off as a B*tch to the other guy and that is exactly why she's acting this way,saving her own face as well as her job. She's toying him a long while you're on the sidelines.

By you contacting this OM, is just gonna make it worse. TRUST ME. It's not worth it.

Because the two of you are still living together, you two committed to each other. It's the step before the vows. Luckily the two of you aren't married, so if it were me, and the other guy was around, I'd find another place to live until she figures it out.

BELIEVE ME, I feel your pain right now. Fortunately, I don't live with my sig other of 4 years. He wants me in his life but I sometimes feel he just wants me IN his life. Make sense? I have an ex wife to contend with (fortunately not all the time) and my Sig other doesn't get boundaries. That is where you need to come in and set. Yes, plan A does work and it takes a lot of strength and I feel humiliation to get back on track. If this woman is worth a fight, then you might have to let go for awhile.