Okay got it.

1. I've completed the exposure list. All done.
2. I'm expecting her parents (perhaps sister) to call her today.
3. Got word back from OM's wife that they've had a good cry and decided to work on their marriage. It was all a "fantasy" for him to make himself feel better, but wasn't going to act on it. Ooookay.
4. My wife is cold right now. She's text book, I guess. Because she told me that our marriage was over before getting in touch with OM, she thinks she was entitled to her privacy and did nothing wrong. She also claims that it was all fantasy to feel better but knew it wouldn't go anywhere. She admits to having residual feelings for him, and him for her, but that it's all in the past. That said, we're still over, and now more than that she doesn't want to try the "parenting partnership" where we live in the same house for the kids. If we weren't still in France, she'd be moving out now. She still doesn't want to work on our marriage or get any type of help.

I've maintained throughout that I did this out of love, for her and our kids. I did what needed to be done. Pledged that I want to work to make her happy and rebuild our marriage. But I still get the comment that it's no use, she won't find happiness with me. She's no longer in love and that's that.

You did great, Mac!! The key here is keeping the OM AWAY. Every time he contacts her, you need to be all over that piece of crap. I burst out laughing when that entitled jerk said you should have "called him first." For WHAT? He already knew he was having an affair with a married woman. You owe that dirtbag nothing. NOTHING. How dare he chastise you when he is assaulting your family?

Anyway, keep him at bay and focus now on attracting her back into the marriage. What she is doing now is trying to justify her affair by pretending a) the marriage is over and b) her desire to end the marriage had nothing to do with the affair. Don't argue with her, but just know this is a TACTIC designed to blame you. You still continue on your plan to win her back.

Don't argue with her, just do your best to be the best husband possible. Avoid love busters and look for opportunities to do things with her. Go read wifedivorcing's thread and see how he won his wife back: http://forum.marriagebuilders.com/u...in=170321&Number=2791622#Post2791622


Let her know that you would agree to this plan if there was a commitment to save the marriage, but you are not going to be roommates for the sake of the kids. Having roommate parents is not in your children's best interest because of the tension it would create.

And tell your kids!!!! This affects their lives in every way, and they need to know she is willing to bust up their family for her affair.

Otherwise she will break up their family while telling them that marriage is disposable and they will 'get it over it'.

Even if she leaves (she probably won't) you can tell the kids what's happening to her, that OM (name him) is a danger to the family and that you are fighting to stay with them and win back their mother.

Young children respond very well to this. Often they've been harbouring secret fears and need this sort of guidance.

Currently your wife still thinks it'll be OK and a reunion with OM will happen when the kids are grown.

It can't happen if her children know.

Telling you the marriage was done pre-affair is par for the course of waywards.

Re-read this:

http://forum.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1659680#Post1659680

Good job with following up Mac.

Post the OM to Playerblock.com and use that to expose him more broadly. Cheaterville.com is also great but the website is down right now.

You are correct, the "marriage was over before I got started with OM, this has nothing to do with him" line is VERY textbook, I heard the same thing verbatim.

OMs are terrified of exposure, keep it up. I was thinking about him telling you that you should have called him first...he wanted to keep the secret a secret.

Sidenote, but related: OM in my situation told me when I confronted at his business (and in front of his customers) "this isn't the way to handle this..." and I just shot back at him "you should have thought about that before you started messing with my wife". He then changed the topic to trying to deny the affair, and after I cited facts he changed the topic to "leave now or I call the police". He wanted me gone because I made all of his customers that day disappear pretty much instantly.

Same kinda deal. OM wants this kept under wraps. Find out everything you can about this guy. You need to find every chink in his armor and take advantage of that. I'd work on finding out where he works/what he does for a living, how you can reliably get in contact with his parents by phone, who his immediate family is. All of this can be found online using tools like Spokeo. Unless his family is also trash he doesn't want them to know what he's up to, and you very well may be supporting OMBW's exposure in an important way by reaching out to these people and confirming her story.

Reasoning here is simple...if you can break this up on the OMs end, you kill the affair. Otherwise you have to wait for it to die a natural death, and while the exposure will accelerate that, it could still be months. If OM decides your wife isn't worth the trouble, you don't have to worry about when your wife decides to end the affair...it will already be over.

Hello,

I agree that kids can sense when something is up. We never fight and whenever we've had our "conversations" we were in a room away from kids or they were in bed. But in terms of body language, lack of communications, and occasional tear in the eyes... it's very probable they know something is amiss.

Wife received a call from her parents, followed by sister. That created a cold front I'd never experienced before. I have no idea how their conversation went, I never got feedback from the family, and of course my wife isn't talking. The good news is that there has been no evidence of contact between my wife and OM for two days. I think OM's wife scared him straight-- according to stories she shared with me, it's doubtful he wants to lose that gravy train. I'm rather positive the affair is over, however lingering feelings may still exist. I'm not sure yet what to expect regarding my wife's feelings towards me and our marriage.

If I understand properly what I've read to date on this site, and some of the threads you've recommended, my mission at this point is to avoid any relationship discussions with my wife, avoid lovebusters, work on self-improvement to suit her emotional needs (and my own vision of self-improvement), and do my best to meet all her emotional needs. I say do my best as I'm still not able to touch/kiss/hug her, which was an important aspect for her. Timeline is variable, but for a man I should expect about 6 months, then would have to proceed to plan B.

Mac

I don't think that all relationship talk is to be avoided. You should be willing to talk about ways to create a loving marriage but don't discuss divorce or separation. Don't press the issue though.

Dr.Harley recommends a plan A of up to 2 years for a BH even while an A is active. I don't think you should be thinking about plan B for a very long time. If the affair actually ends you should be dealing with WW being in withdrawal from the A for several weeks. Avoid LBs and meet whatever ENs she will allow.

Well Marriage Builders folks, you've done it.

I came home this evening, less than 2hrs after my last post, and my wife was in a different mood. She had made a nice dinner, opened a bottle of wine, she was nicely dressed, etc. There was some hesitation, but we talked at dinner, mostly around what she did with the kids, etc. Then after dinner she asked to speak with me in another room. Surprise-- she had a lot of time to think things through since yesterday, etc. She doesn't want the kids to be raised in a divorce, etc. She wants to rebuild and play it "day by day". She unfriended the OM from FB, and now knows that he was saying the same things to her sister by text no more than 2 months ago. So that fantasy is over. And my marriage is getting a second chance. I'm over the moon. We hugged it out, but again-- day by day. She is currently busy looking at new homes we could buy (as opposed to rent) when we return home this summer.

There is still much work to be done. But we're on the right path.

Thank you to all those who've taken the time to guide me or share their experiences. This has been invaluable.

Mac

That's really nice, but she needs to get off Facebook altogether, for good.

Great update!

I would advise you to get a copy of "Surviving an Affair" by Dr. Harley if you haven't yet and read through it. It is available on Google Play and Amazon as an ebook so it's convenient to get and a quick read.

You've got a great handle on what Plan A is, now you need to focus on making sure you've got what we refer to as Extraordinary Precautions or "EPs" in place to affair-proof your marriage and ensure that your recovery process from here is rock-solid and leads to the best marriage possible.

Surviving an Affair will explain EPs and the process you and your wife need to focus on to protect yourselves from this situation ever happening again. Your wife should agree to following these EPs with you and to send OM a no-contact letter as described in the book.

Also, keep snooping! You're very early in the process and your wife is very vulnerable right now where being re-contacted by the OM (for example by email or text) could set you back to day 1. Remember trust is earned, do not trust your wife just yet.

Happy for you Mac, I'm sure you feel much better.

What I was trying to say is that it is NOT a great update.

She has SAID a lot of things, but I've seen that done a number of times - including with the OW in my marriage. She promised her husband a lot of things, including never speaking to my H again (after my exposure to her H) because my H had used her. She hated him, she loved her H, she wanted the marriage to work...

...and as I found out 5 years later, she never stopped contacting him at work, and he never stopped happily accepting her calls. I caught this at the point when they were planning to meet again, after 5 years of not having seen each other.

Saying a lot of things and unfriending him on FB means nothing at all. She was addicted to this man, and I doubt that even after all that has transpired, she believes that there is no future for her and him.

If she can contact him through work, she will. Re-friending him on FB takes a second, as does unfriending him again. You should not feel that the affair is over until you have moved, and taken other steps.

Do you know how easy that would be to undo in a moment of weakness?

Facebook accounts need to be deleted, and Facebook needs to be blocked.

You see - if there's no withdrawal, and things turn around within two hours, I doubt it is genuine. I would always suspect a ploy to placate you.

That doesn't mean you act hostile towards her. That means that you press on for all the EPs that Dr H recommends, including moving house (and job, if work was a conduit), and you spy like a demon. Only when she cooperates with all the EPs, and your snooping turn s up nothing after several months, do you begin to believe that she meant what she said.

It takes 2 seconds to friend a person on facebook. She can still see his facebook page and as long as she has facebook, she will be communicating with him and gawking at his page. WE have had many recoveries completely demolished when a WS never withdrew from the OP just because she was gawking at the OP's photos, facebook, etc.

Will she delete Facebook? Change all her contact information? Write a NC letter for you to send?

Ploy.

Shed be going through withdrawal if it were genuine.

Shes been ordered to manage you better.


But you definitely have the A on the ropes.

You have to keep in mind that the that his hitting on the sister will disgust her some day - but very probably not today.

Affair partners don't expect fidelity to each other. This whole time she's been instructed to manage you, prevent his wife finding out so she can remain a bit on the side. She even apologized for not keeping you in line.

Don't apply the logic of faithful couples to affairees.

She's been taught to compete. Be more 'patient and understanding' than his wife. Be more OK with infidelity. The thing with her sister will only spur her on to do better.

It's killing the addiction that's required. Not informing her he is a scumbag - she knows that.

It's like telling a cokehead ' that guys a drug dealer you know'.

The competition is what gives them the rush.

Humm. I understand the skepticism, but I don't share it entirely.

First, need to look at the broader picture-- she's accepted to work on our marriage. That is a big step forward for me. You may believe that's a ploy to keep me docile, and that's fine.
Second, her parents intervention was truly taken at heart. She has a very strong bond with her dad and his word is strong with her. He called her out, told her what OM was really like, and strongly urged her to stay with her husband and kids.
Third, she admitted that she was in a vulnerable state, mad at me, and got caught up in her feelings for an old flame.
Fourth, she admitted that she's disgusted that he used the same lines on her sister. She realizes that he's going through a mid-life crisis of his own and he was using her.
Fifth, we communicated about our problems and promised to keep communication channels open to rebuild our relationship. We're taking it day by day.
Fifth, she unfriended OM. Deleting FB account is silly in my mind (but I get your arguments). Should I take away her cel phone? Home phone? Internet access? There are a thousand ways for her to get in touch with him again easily. She could delete her FB page and open a fake one, him too, and they can continue to chat that way. So I'm not asking for that. In fact, it's easier for me to monitor a known account!!

Remember, I can still monitor her actions online. I don't need to shoot myself in the foot and drive their potential communications underground.

The affair is dead. I'm satisfied with that (but will monitor). I have no doubt she will have some moments of sadness, I gather it's normal. But we still need to work hard on our relationship.

Mac, thats fine as long as you are ok with an on again, off again affair because that is where you are headed. The Facebook page will keep her feelings for the OM triggered. Keep in mind that this is your first rodeo. We have been through this a thousand times and see where you are headed. All avenues of contact have to be eliminated in order to affair proof your marriage. But that is OK if you want to ignore those precautions. IT IS YOUR MARRIAGE and you are the guy who will suffer for it. Thats ok if you want to learn the hard way. We are fine with that.

Here are the extraordinary precautions as written by Dr. Bill Harley, clinical psychologist and author of Surviving an Affair. He has specialized in saving marriages frm infidelity for 40 years. :

From Surviving an Affair, pg 66-67

The extraordinary precautions do more than end marriage-threatening affairs; they help a couple form the kind of relationship they always wanted.

These recommendations may seem rigid, unnecessarily confining, and even paranoid to those who have not been the victim of infidelity. But people like Sue and Jon, who have suffered unimaginable pain as a result of an affair that spun out of control, can easily see their value. For the inconvenience of following my advice, Sue would have spared herself and Jon the very worst experience of their lives.


Checklist for How Affairs Should End

_____The unfaithful spouse should reveal information about the affair to the betrayed spouse.

_____The unfaithful spouse should make a commitment to the betrayed spouse to never see or talk to the lover OP again.

_____The unfaithful spouse should write a letter to the lover OP ending the relationship and send it with the approval of the betrayed spouse.

_____The unfaithful spouse should take extraordinary precautions to guarantee total separation from the lover OP:

_____Block potential communication with the lover OP (change e-mail address and home and cell phone numbers, and close all social networking accounts; have voice messages and mail monitored by the betrayed spouse).

_____Account for time (betrayed spouse and wayward spouse give each other a twenty-four-hour daily schedule with locations and telephone numbers).

_____Account for money (betrayed spouse and wayward spouse give each other a complete account of all money spent).

_____Spend leisure time together.

_____Change jobs and relocate if necessary.

_____Avoid overnight separation.

_____Allow technical accountability.

_____ Expose affair to family members, clergy, and/or friends.