Hi need advice. I�m not attracted to my wife anymore. It�s not just an attraction issue, it�s a emotional well being.

Before I met my wife I was attracted to shapes though I have a preference like most all of us do. When we met I feel in love with the companionship we had with one another.

After we got married I got to know her more (I know imagine that) but there were things that bothered me. Not just annoying habits but her persona. She acts like a man, she use a deep voice when she�s speaking in public, and hunched over when she walks, ...but probably the worst things is her general attitude toward things around her.

She often disregards problems and issues as a fault not of her own. For example when the newly appointed president was elected she was have breakdown because she did not believe he would be a good president. She got so angry and upset that I did want to be around her. She then got angry because I didn�t want to be around her. Then I told the honest reason. She was getting upset on something that was out of her control, and I didn�t want to be around her because she couldn�t control her anger.

She instead put the reaponbility on me because I didn�t want to be around her and didn�t want to take any responsibility for her actions.

Side note: she says honestly and openness is one thing she wants most

The attitude has turned me off, skipping longer story I�m at the point of being emotional dead to her. If she did come back home I would be fine. We like roommates now.

Which leads to say I�m not physically attracted to her. Yes she�s over weight and she�s says she goes to the gym and had a trainer (which I�m paying for) but she�ll come home and eat Mac and cheese, burgers, pizza, cake, and drinks.

All the physical qualities of her I can deal with but it�s only dwarfed by the emotional intelligence and attitude of my wife.

She is not abusive but she is neglectful and responsible.

Should I stay?

Hi Jdreaux, welcome to Marriage Builders. A few questions. Are you married? How long? Any children? Have either of you had any affairs? Any alcohol or drug addictions?


Has she moved out? If so, why did she move out and where did she go?

Yes we�ve been married 1.5 years. No children. No affiars. No addictions. I meant to say �if she did not come home I would be fine. We are like roommates now.� So we do live together, she hasn�t moved out

Gotcha. We have had situations like this come to the forum and the solution is to fall back in love again. Read this thread; Dr Harley even weighs in at one point: here

I did not see Dr. Harley�s commits on that thread anywhere. Please point me where. I do see ETW dilemma. But my wife doesn�t not meet any of my emotional needs and I have expressed to her about my attraction to her.

We have seen 2 counselors 3 pastors and she will not pick up a book like Harley�s to work with me.

Did you read the whole thread? One of Dr. Harley�s comment is on page 3 of the thread.

The solution is to learn the program and sell it to her. A "counselor" or a "pastor" does not have a plan. We have a plan here. I would start with Dr Harley's book, Fall in Love, Stay in Love and sell it to her. If you need help, you can contact Dr Harley at his radio show by sending him an email at mbradio@marriagebuilders.com. He will help you for free.

Jdreaux,
Post #2706386, if you haven't changed the number of posts per page (i.e. if it is 10 per page) then it would be on the second page.
Dr. Harly's username is in RED
So it should jump out when scrolling through the thread.
I think that although ETW's situation is a lack of physical attraction first, that the MB concepts will help you.

Here are a couple of links on conversation - I am open to being corrected, but it might be good to start here - try modelling what you are looking for in a conversation.


http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi3315_conv.html

http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi5056_qa.html

If your wife is dwelling on situations that are beyond her circle of control, could you turn these into hypothetical discussions only - "Honey, we didn't cause the current president to be elected, and yes, I agree with you that he isn't good for this country" (I am assuming here based on the tone - my apologies if I read that wrong) "but we have to find a way to make the best of it, every time a new president is elected some of the people are unhappy, we can suffer from that, or figure out how to continue growing. How would you like to tackle this?"

I may be optimistic, but this seems like a great way to investigate and pull info, use the friends of good conversation here. Explore.

Good luck.

Please do think it�s the physical attraction part.I�ve dated models, fitness athletes and other physically beautiful women.

The issue is her... persona... how she acts and carries herself. I�ve addressed the issues. When we go out on a date she�ll put both elbows on the table, she�ll hold on to the utensil like a scoop, put her head directly over the plate, and then eat it while talking or with her mouth open. It�s how she acts is unattractive.

I�ve memtioned small things like that before and big things; meaning if we could change the big things the small things won�t matter. But, when I mention something she will cry and say �I can�t do anything right for you.� So I have to concentrate on building her back up but she won�t change the habit.

***Please don�t think it�s...**

Nope, I wasn't thinking it was physical - in fact I commented that it seemed the opposite.

So, can you build on the positives, and is it fair to say that what you see as negatives are "Annoying Habits"?
Also, I am guessing, from your last description that these are her normal mannerisms, were these displayed before your marriage? How did you feel about this then? What has changed?


http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi3403_annoy.html

http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi5053a_qa.html

http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi5053b_qa.html

Yes, they are annoying habits.

In the beginning the manners were fine. I think it was the normal �let me impress you phase.� I noticed a few instantes but I passed them off as everybody has bad habits. Then we got married and comfortable.

Background: we waited until getting married to have sex. The sex has turned me off (that�s a whole other issue) but the this issue is getting to the bedroom. I see all these bad habits and mannerisms and I get turned off.

A better way is to stop talking about politics entirely. My H hates politics - I love it - so I never speak of it to him. This is why I suggested that Jdreax learn the program and SELL IT to her. She won't stop these lovebusters until she is open to changing her behavior. She needs a motivation to do so. That motivation comes from him selling it to her.

SELL HER on the program. Motivate her to want to change her behavior but do it in a loving and respectful way. That starts with you.

ML,
Yes that would be better, and a better example.
Thank you

Once my husband and I were sold on this program and the concept of eliminating lovebusters to make ourselves the most attractive, our habits changed. We each took charge of our lovebusters and eliminated them.

At the end of every date, we asked each other "was I very pleasant tonight?" We were open to hearing when we weren't so we could make those changes. Now, we don't even ask because have trained ourselves to be as attractive as possible to each other.

Another critical step is to make sure you are spending at least 15 hours a week out on dates. You cannot sustain the love in a marriage on less. Most couples neglect their marriages and then wonder why they fall out of love.

Here�s another good read and listen to the radio clips in here. The Critical Importance of Undivided Attention

I have prayed and thought on it. What is the ways you all have to sale this to the other spouse ?

The way I sold it to my husband was to a) learn the program, b) find ways it would benefit my spouse and c) sell him on those features and benefits. I became willing to change my bad behavior if it meant I would reap those benefits. People buy into things that benefit them personally. In my case, my husbands benefit was to have a great marriage where we were both in love. He also liked the policy of joint agreement because I was in the habit of making independent decisions.

This program will benefit you both immensely and once you explain to her, she will be able to see the benefit. But if you try to use it as a way to FIX her, she won't buy it.

That book, Fall in Love, Stay in Love, gives you a complete overview of the program. There are also free videos in the "Start here first" thread stickied at the top of this forum. You can get a free app and listen to the Marriage Builders show for free every day. It will really help you understand.

When should a man know to separate from his wife ?

He should know that he did everything he possibly could to get her to fall back in love with him.

Are you listening to the Marriage Builders Radio show so you can find out how to do that?

Have you written to Dr. Harley?

What are you doing to try to persuade your wife to follow the Marriage Builders program?

I listen to Marriage Builders Radio

I have not written Dr. Harley

Ive found it difficult to persuade my wife, that�s why I�m here.

Please don�t presume she fell out of love for me. What if I fell out of love for her?

Threads combined. Please stick to one thread.

Either way, the fix starts with you following the program to get her to fall back in love with you, so that she will be motivated to meet your emotional needs so you can fall back in love with her.

Why haven't you written to Dr. Harley? Why are you leaving important stones unturned? This is a great way to get help learning how to persuade and motivate your wife.

Have you eliminated the contrast effect?

Typically the woman falls out of love first. She then stops meeting her H needs because she has no motivation to do that, or to avoid lovebusters. Often she maintains a friendship but shes not doing much else. So then he falls out of love with her too. Often, he believes he's the first to lose that feeling. I've heard Dr Harley correct that idea for a lot of male callers.

I'm interested in what you think happened when she stopped behaving the way you liked and subjected you to annoying habits. Do you think there's a chance she could be more 'comfortable' than besotted? That makes being alluring too much of a hassle. Or do you think something else happened?

Markos, I assume Dr. Harley very busy.. I want you to believe that I�ve turned over many stones.

I do not know what contrast effect is.

Honestly indiegirl I don�t think she knows much about men, what they like, and why they do what they do. When we got married things fell apart with laziness, and lack of experience, and a sheltered conservative upbringing. I�m the only male that has been in a relationship with over three months.

Why would you assume that when you can hear for yourself on the radio show that he and Joyce help people every day?

I'm watching a man at church lose his marriage. I begged him to send Dr. Harley an email last year and talk to him. Guy passed up a chance to get free help from the best marriage counselor on the planet. Now his wife is divorcing him. They have lots of children.

Here are two articles that explain the contrast effect:
http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi5069_qa.html
http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi8122_Pornography.html

You need your wife to stop the love buster of angry outbursts.

You'll need to learn how to complain about this love buster, correctly.

Again, I recommend you contact Dr. Harley and ask for some help. "How do I complain to my wife about her angry outbursts?"

Here's an article Dr. Harley has written on this subject for men:

http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi8111_quit3.html

She knew enough to catch you in the first place. I'm curious about what made her laziness AFTER this. A woman in love is highly motivated to keep doing what has worked in the past. Why did she stop? You think it was simply being married?



Why is that a problem?!!

I have emailed mbradio but I have not gotten a reply.

We both got married at 35 & 36 years old, we have no children. We waited until getting married to have sex. She has no sexual partners in the past and I�ve had 3. According to Dr. Harley, from listen to mbradio, it�s difficult for us because we married later in age and it�s hard for us to adjust than a younger couple. I admit our church hasn�t done a very good job with pre marital counseling.

Before getting married I noticed a few things I was caustious of but as we all heard couple aren�t perfect. After getting married it was one annoying habit after another. I wanted to address it with her but every time I brought something up it seemed to her that I was trying to fix her.

So, I poured myself and love into her. I gave and gave. She was happy I thought I was doing the right thing by sacrificing myself and dropping my expectations and setting aside my needs. Then, it finally hit me. I broke down. My needs weren�t being met. I couldn�t take any more. I broke down crying one morning right in front of her. The night before I discussed getting on medication to help me.

See, three weeks after being married i had to asked her if we could see a marriage counselor. When I brought up she didn�t want to look at me. She said while out the window at nothing in particular �we don�t need to see a counselor, we just need to make it though this.� I didn�t like what I heard but I knew I had to keep asking for it.

Since we got married I was able to sleep over 4 hours. 5 hours were my good nights. It was nothing to see 2 to 3 hours of sleep. I brought up the medication idea. She said if I thought it would help I should. The next morning I broke down at breakfast before work. I called in sick. Went to the doctor and was give medicine for sleep, and anxiety/depression.

I took 4 months before we would go to a counselor. I believe she did more harm then good. We often left angry and fighting. She asked me to leave once but I didnt. I knew if I left I would never go back.

I tried going to a church recovery group. She didn�t like me going. It thought that It looked bad for me to go because I made it looked like we had a bad marriage. She even made a commit once that she was jealous of her brother and sister in law for having a better relationship even though they lived together before getting married.

At one point I got so depressed I called the suicide hotline. I�ve had two anxiety attacks.

She believed I was mentally ill. I even took test from licensed people that came up negative for anxiety disorder, depression, PTSD, schzenphrneia(sp), and bipolar disorder.

I went though all that for my marriage, and it�s not all of it. She hasn�t apologized, she hasn�t asked what can I do. She has even lifted a book on marriage. She hasn�t even suggested we have a problem in our marriage because as she admitted about a week ago �it hard me to admit and deal with problems I have.� She makes no effort to put something forward for change. Every idea and suggestion to work on our marriage gets wiped clean in her mind every morning.

I haven�t done everything but I�m tired. I�ve been running to find something, the key ingredient, a missing link, the epiphany. I�m laying in the shoulder of the road gasping for air and gripping my chest.

How long ago did you write the Harleys? Have you tried again? Also, notify the MODS so they can let Dr. Harley know that you�ve been trying to get a hold of them.

Complaints are always tricky. If you grew up in a family where everyone yelled to get their way or where nobody confronted problems, this is a skill you need to learn.

The secret is always to make the complaint be about you and your feelings so that your spouse does not feel you are educating her. Once someone feels they are being educated, they switch off.

- Find a neutral time to set out your complaint. Never in the heat of the moment but when you are both calm and peaceful. Maybe at the end of dinner or maybe first thing in the morning when you wake. Perhaps on a long beautiful walk.

- Introduce the subject by asking if you can make a complaint.

- Be strategic, one complaint and make it an important one. Be sure to praise any efforts made by your spouse to address the issue.

- Express your complaint only in terms of how it affects you. So if (for instance) you do not want your wife leaving clothes on the floor, you might say 'it bothers me when you leave your clothes on the floor because a tidy bedroom makes me feel calm and peaceful'.

- If your spouse wants to talk more about it, you can propose solutions together. Suppose she says that her closet is too small. That would be a problem that you could happily solve together, depositing love units in the process.

- If nothing changes, you can make the complaint one more time. Then you may have to follow the link Marcos posted and separate. That is why it is so important to be selective in the subject you chose for your complaint. It needs to be something that really matters to you.

I�ve been trying to work on the Love Buster questionarie but I�m having difficultly understanding what exactly caused me to loose love for my wife. I believe it�s resentment from the past (previously mentioned).

I feel I can�t move forward unless she acknowledges and understands what I went through. What I�ve been doing to try to help our marriage. The past is what makes me so mad, it�s built resentment. Do I tell her this? And brings it over the top she doesn�t take any responsibility for what�s she�s done.

Stop trying to educate her. Nobody wants to be educated. Why would she take responsibility for something you chose to do? She never forced you to sacrifice.

Try something like this:

"I now understand what I have been doing wrong. My sacrificing has caused my giver to collapse of exhaustion and now my taker is in full blown recovery mode. I know you never asked me to sacrifice and I take full responsibility for the present situation which was entirely of my doing. It was misguided of me to believe that this would help my marriage. Would you be able to help me get my giver and my taker back into balance so that we can return to joy?"

If she then asks how she can help, you could ask her to support and encourage you to make complaints. If she does not want to read the books, drop the subject. You might be able to revisit that later when love has returned or you can just use use MB principals. She will soon notice!

I have said something like that to her living well, but it has been addressed on her end.She simple chooses not to address it.

You misinterpret what I mean by taking responsibility. She doesn�t say to me or herself �what can I do to strengthen this marriage?�

Jdreaux, I would re-send your email and even email the mods and ask them to send it. It might be going to their spam box.

Did you read this?

So when you told her you had taking ownership of your own decision to sacrifice and that you had got yourself into that mess all alone, she just stared at you in silence?

I'm having a hard time believing that.

Well we are married, so we are in the mess together. When I said that I made mistakes, and listed some to her which included having to give. Then I mentioned I want us to do better at our marriage, I told her I need to know what she needed me do. In turn I asked her for things I needed from her. We discussed and had a plan. The next and following week she seemed to forget the plan. I kept up with what she needed me to do. But then came love buster and then another. I kept up still. But it�s tiring. She won�t take the ownership that I need her help.

I agree that you need to stop trying to educate her. Your efforts to do so will only result in further lovebusting. To the extent that the suggestions given here are, in fact, still efforts to educate her, I would not do that. Rather, you need to try to understand her perspective. I doubt she thinks you have sacrificed. More likely, she thinks you are nitpicking and tedious, and welcomed the refrain from this behavior that your �sacrifice� represented.

It would be great to here your wife�s perspective.

Please explain to me how I am educating her. I do not see what I�m doing and how I�m doing this.

Here you go:


I recommend you skip that intro, it is not attractive to a reluctant spouse.


There was no 'having to give'. You decided to go that route. Do you even know what her top emotional needs are? She may not even want the things you are doing for her.


Drop the 'us'. YOU want to do better at your marriage. What she wants is up to her.


Why are you back on that again? She must be going nuts.


That was because she was not actually committed to the plan in the first place. I bet this was stuff you told her to do and she agreed because she was fed up with discussing it. Then, because she was not genuinely enthusiastic, she quietly dropped the plan. Negotiating needs to wait until your marriage is far stronger than it is now.


So?


Love busters will quickly undo any deposits. You must eliminate your love busters entirely and make complaints the proper way about hers.


Why should she take ownership of something she did not do? Stop beating her up!

Because you expect her to do an equal share. You behave as though you know what is right, and she doesn't.

This kind of attitude is galling to a reluctant spouse and insuferably self-righteous. If she wanted to play an equal part, she would suggest it herself and follow through with it.

You may feel justified and within the bounds of reason, but you are lecturing her on what she should do "because we are married", even if her sense of duty agreed with you, her heart won't- can't.

It's exactly this attitude "when you are married to me I can assume you are tied to me" that kills any sense of fun or romance.

You will get much better results by focusing on being confident, flirtatious, twinkly, patient, relaxed, solicitious, jokey. Goodness, any style at all besides having dry, dutiful relationship conversations. People in successful relationships don't have them at all! Negotiations are brief, pleasant and fun. They stop at the first sign of reluctance without any finger wagging and in any case they must wait until everyone involved is loved up and motivated.

Living well and indie girl that did not explain how I educate her. We were actually discussing Dr. Harley�s principles. I know it�s all semantics on your end and i understand how people on another computer screen can misunderstand.

You should be understanding and listen first. Ask questions, translate late what they are saying. People pour themselves out, exposed, vulnerable, and in crisis on this forum. Berating people, and shaming them is no way to talk to people.

Thank you for your time

Do you converse with your wife in the same manner as you just did in this post? If so, you have just answered your own question.

Successful relationships are not achieved by telling others what to do. The only person you will be able to effect this way is yourself. Nobody else is going to listen.

This is why I told you to make an effort to understand your wife�s perspective. If you understand where she is coming from, there is hope of finding common ground. You achieve nothing by painting her as the bad guy.

Please help me. I need more educating on this matter. As long as you are discussing Dr Harleys principles I have no problem with being lectured to. It's for my own good. Really.



Sorry JD I couldn't help myself....its affectionate teasing I promise.