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I have often felt that it would have been a nice gesture for the OW to apologise to the BS. By showing contrition to the wife of the man with whom she was involved, she possibly expressed her willingness to accept responsibility for the EA.
Of course, the H has accepted his responsibility for his affair and his part of it. Why can't the OW also express her responsibility for her part in the affair and her sorrow for the pain inflicted upon the wife? Or, is it that most OW have no sorrow for their behavior and the pain inflicted upon others. Are they only concerned with their own pain, and don't care for any one else?
In most cases, once the H came out of the fog, the H expressed sorrow for his betrayal of his marriage vows. My H has told me so many times how much he regretted his affair and wished he could go back and undo his actions that led to his affair.
If the OW had done the same thing I might see her as more sympathetic. However, since this has never happend, I have no desire to have contact with her, much less her child and my H has made his own choices, no contact. NOt because of my feelings, but because of his feelings.
To me, it would have been especially appropriate if the OW truly wanted the H/F of OC, involved with the OC. Wouldn't this go a long way to helping the BS "get over" the affair? Of course, it goes without saying that the OW would have to mean it and be honestly sorry for attempting to undermine the marriage.

What do the rest of you all think?

Texasgirl

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hello,
I agree with you.

Dawn

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Hey Texasgirl!!

I have always made a big point over how OW never apologized to me. She never even asked H how I took it, etc. She doesn't care how I am, she hates me. Envies me for having H. When people here have asked how it is that BS can forgive the WS but not the other person, I always answer that my H has asked me for forgiveness, the OW never has and I don't believe she ever will.

Not that I care, I feel sorry for her. She is obsessed with my H and will just live in her own sick little world until she gets over it. She has told H that she wants him to see OC etc, but I am sure she doesn't want the OC to see me. Well, I am part of the package since she picked a married man to father her child.

My H has also chosen no contact on his own, but if he did want contact it would definitely make me more accepting of situation, etc if OW was sorry for her part in the whole thing. But she isn't. She actually joked around recently with one of his cousins asking him to ask my H if he would make her a brother or sister for OC. She is one sick cookie...

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This is interesting. Having been betrayed, I didn't want the OW to say anything to me. I didn't care for anything she had to say. If she would have told me she was sorry I would have said "Yeah, I know you are." But that's just me.

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I did apologize to OM's wife. And, just like OM, she lured me into a relationship with her just to get what she wanted. Then when her curiousity was satified and I had made myself vulnerable to her friendship, she dropped me like a hot potato.

Shame on me for being so gullible and believing that good could come out of bad where they are concerned.

They are one screwed up family and as far as I'm concerned they deserve each other. I wish I hadn't let my guard down and invite them into my life. But I did and now I have to get past that.

But I did apologize - don't think it did any good 'cause she still took out revenge on me. But I guess I was being way to naive to think things could have been different.

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This is an interesting topic. How do you truely measure the sincerity of the OP? If she says she's sorry and you don't believe it, then what?

Why should an OW have to show contrition to a BS?

As a personal ammends to the BS I decided to maintain NC with both xMM and his W. For me that's more meaningful than any kind of apology.

This much time later I can honestly say that i'm not sorry for the affair. I'm sorry for the pain that it caused. I'm sorry that I contacted her, I think that it was cruel and unthinking on my part to confess. But apology-I don't think that I could honestly do that.

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I have forgiven the exOW… but she has never apologized.

My forgiveness of her was not based on her. It was based on me and where I was in my recovery…

It was my choice to forgive… it did not come from anything she said… or any act that she did.

H as left exOW and I standing alone, in the parking lot of the grocery store where the exchanges take place, while he takes Lil Bit in the store to the service counter for a sucker…
I have often wondered what she would say if I just turned to her and said, “I forgive you.”

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TG,
I agree with you. Interesting post.

I got an apology (which felt good), but it ending up meaningless, XOW saying all kinds of horrid things, revealing more about A, and generally having tantrums. Yuck.

KS, TG basically answered your question when she asked:

"Why can't the OW also express her responsibility and her sorrow for the pain inflicted upon the wife?"

Also, in cases where the OW knew the W, (or must deal with W in sharing OC!), does familiarity, even "friendship" NOT make a difference?
----------------------------------------
I was told recently that even the pagan early Egyptians believed that the human heart was weighed against a feather upon death... Someday we will all answer for our actions AND intentions by One Who Knows.

Prayers,
J, in recovery 4y and glad <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

<small>[ November 19, 2002, 10:17 AM: Message edited by: Jenny ]</small>

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H's exOW has apologized to me--twice and both times felt good. The second time came on this mother's day and I didn't know how to respond. The apology felt good, but I don't want to get drawn into a friendship with this woman who tried her very best to dismantle my life. We do speak occasionally on the phone. She and I just chat about our kids and what they are doing. It is just mommy chatter.

Mr. J worries that I will tell her too much, talk about his suffering and guilt. I told him I would never betray his confidence and certainly not to her. I also told him he is welcome to listen in to any conversation I have with her or if he wishes I will refrain from speaking to her. Since we are doing visitation, I feel it is best that we can be civil or even cordial, but not overly friendly.

MJ

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On one of the few times I talked to ex-ow on the phone, I told her I forgave her and she replied and I quote," I neither asked for nor do I need your forgiveness". That was enough (among other things) to convince me I was dealing with something that wasn't beneficial to my marriage recovery and was one of the deciding factors in NC on my part, but Mr."T" already decided that he wasn't going to be part of the child's life before the child was born.

She told me that me and my children mean shyte to her and that she's madly in love with my H and won't let him go. That's kind of hard to do the "let's get along for the children's sake" if she didn't give a hoot about mine...

Ah well, she's happy now...married (finally) and moving on....and Mr."T" and I are moving on...guess that's about it for us...

Twiisty

If she ever apologized to me, I would be gracious about it...what more could I say or do? I got my H, my soulmate and a more comitted Hubby now...how can I not be thankful? I would probably want to throw something in about being without, but then, what's the use?

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</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Texasgirl:
<strong>...is it that most OW have no sorrow for their behavior and the pain inflicted upon others. Are they only concerned with their own pain, and don't care for any one else?</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">IMO YES... OW's "own pain" being: single parenting & the shame that goes with it, (if they are willing to admit it); letting down family--expectations & such; financial struggles even with CS...

I also think that until an xOW becomes a wife will she fully understand the impact of her actions toward the BS. Even then, if she is not the type of person to apologize for her wrongs, then you can't really say for sure? You know how some people's life theme is "make no apologies" and stand behind your decisions (even if they are WRONG).

Infidelity is a very selfish act. I apologized to BS but only in my prayers. I think the BS in my case feels kind of like nocontact4us and twiisty as far as:

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">twiisty said:
<strong>
I got my H, my soulmate and a more comitted Hubby now...how can I not be thankful?</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">You see, they are still married today, and I know that his career has proven to be highly successful and they are rolling in dough! This was my prayer for them from the beginning, that they would prosper and that my request for CS would never be a huge financial burden. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Texasgirl:
<strong>...Wouldn't this go a long way to helping the BS "get over" the affair? Of course, it goes without saying that the OW would have to mean it and be honestly sorry for attempting to undermine the marriage.

What do the rest of you all think?
</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I had one opportunity to apologize, but it caught me so off guard and I was surprised. When OC was 10, they both took OC to dinner. OC knew BS was coming but didn't tell me. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> Not that OC was keeping a secret, but it was not in OCs mind to mention to me... I think her reason for coming was in relation to how BS's here describe having curiosity about OW/OC. She was composed, we were both polite to each other. I had OC at the door ready to go and that was it. UNTIL... she asked to use my bathroom.

Thinking back, perhaps she went in there to react to seeing me in private... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> I often wonder what went through her mind in there... We were very different from each other. I was not his type, in other words... I think he just was trying someone different? That seems to be a characteristic of "serial cheater," always craving someone different...

I was still self-absorbed at that moment tho, feeling embarrassed instead of trying to reach out to the BS. I felt embarrassed because I knew she was his wife and I meant nothing to him. I just ended up pregnant by him. We were not in love nor was I trying to be. I just knew I was not in her class of people. This is how I felt at that moment, but you know, it was still very selfish of me--only thinking of myself!

duh... How self-absorbed can a person GET??? Sheesh! I know I've "been there..." God help me to think, think, THINK of others more than myself!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Embarrassed]" src="images/icons/blush.gif" />

<small>[ November 19, 2002, 11:52 AM: Message edited by: BINthereDUNthat ]</small>

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I say the healing and contrition and yes, reconciliation should go all the way around.

To answer the topic question, no, my xow has not apologized. This is evern after I sent her a letter explaining to her that I felt she was partially responsible for my hurt.

She quite conveniently explained all of her reasons for thinkink what she was doing was o.k, but never accepted that she had enough knowlede about my H (marital status) to make a better choice than what she did.

I would like for her to apologize, but that may never happen.
Interestingly, how many of you bs have asked your ws to apologize for bringing someone in their lives that didn't belong?
This mess, afterall, was created by two selfish people.
Also, I feel like my xow owes my H and apology. As a self-described server of God, she was expected to help my H see that his choices were gonna cause God, himself and those he loved tremendous grief. But her need to be a significant other superceded that Christian responsibility to my H. (I know, it's a stretch if she hasn't even said sorry to me yet).

I've forgiven her, but the fact that she obviously doesn't accept her responsibility is enough to keep me judging her....not for the act, but for how she's reacted to the situation thus far.
Good Topic....
so, any wss apologizing??????

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Feel like I need to clarify my post.

when i say bs apologizing, I mean to the xop. think of the apiritual healing that could go on personally for both of them.

my H flat out told lies...the kind that mm tell. I'm leaving my w...let's get together....she treats me poorly, the whole one-sided plea.

Yeah, full-grown people should know better than to believe a person who is CURRENTLY not keeping an important committment, but....

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you raise an interesting point Matthew. My xMM came to my house in August to apologize to me. And he did.

He apologized for the lies that he told, for involving my in this very messy situation. He apologized for being moody and dismissive of my feelings and he thanked me for supporting him when he went to rehab.

He then proceeded to provide me with all kinds of information about his penis. Including, but not limited to, the fact that he had just had a vascetomy (sp?) <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> TMI!

Looking back it's very clear to me that we could never have an honest relationship. He is not capable of honesty. There are things about him that I miss, but i'm happy to be done with the MM phase of my life.

Interestingly enough - I don't think he's ever apologized to his W.

<small>[ November 19, 2002, 12:02 PM: Message edited by: Katie Scarlett ]</small>

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</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Matthew6:14,15:
<strong>Feel like I need to clarify my post.

when i say bs apologizing, I mean to the xop. think of the apiritual healing that could go on personally for both of them...
</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Hi Matthew,
Did you mean WS apologize to the xOP? If so, I know the MM/WS in my case would never do such a thing. He is one of those who firmly believes in "making no apologies..." at least up until now... I pray that he would have a change of heart and maybe feel more apologetic toward OC. (?) Ya never know?? Obviously he apologized to his wife and things are going well for them and that's what should really matter to them. Incidentally, my OC is now the age I was when I got pregnant by the MM! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> Time flies when you're having fun and even when you're not! We have to find a way to enjoy our lives in spite of all this chaos and drama. We don't have to let it sink in too deep. God has a way of working all things to our good when we trust Him for sustenance.

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Oh and for the record I accepted and appreciated his apology. Even if it was just a ploy to get into my pants.

I knew what I signed up for when I got with him. I held no illusions. Still don't.

More than anything I had to forgive myself for my own willingness to continue such a dysfunctional relationship.

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Hi BTDT,

Thanks for clarifying my clarification <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> Yes, I meant WS apologizing to xow/m.

KS,
Yuck...I'm not even sure how you remembered his apology after such a disgusting attempt at inappropriate dialogue.

What a shame. He wasted an opportunity to clear his conscious (sp?).

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</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Katie Scarlett:
<strong>...More than anything I had to forgive myself for my own willingness to continue such a dysfunctional relationship.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Yeeeaaaahhhh.... Good for you! That's so important. We have to ask ourselves this question when in unhealthy relationships--you know--what is so unhealthy about me that I would remain in such an unhealthy relationship???

I'm proud of you KS. This is the only time I will say it so enjoy it! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> (just teasing you...)

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BTDT wrote:
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> We have to find a way to enjoy our lives in spite of all this chaos and drama. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">

I have to say, truer words have never been spoken...I'm trying to find a way to enjoy my life in spite of all this. I am slowly coming back to God (Whom I was mad at for a loooonnngggg time!---I miss HIM!) I would love to have just a day where I don't look at "mini-me" and say to myself, "15 more years and no more CS payments..."

I want to move on. I will move on. Thanks for the reminder that we do, indeed need to find some joy in the day.

Hugs,
Twiisty
Miss hearing from ya BTDT...I'll have to drop you a line sometime.... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

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KS and BTDT,

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Also, I feel like my xow owes my H and apology. As a self-described server of God, she was expected to help my H see that his choices were gonna cause God, himself and those he loved tremendous grief. But her need to be a significant other superceded that Christian responsibility to my H. (I know, it's a stretch if she hasn't even said sorry to me yet). </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Agree, or disagree, and why???

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