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Posted By: Still_JM OT - Atkins Diet - 01/22/04 11:44 PM
Umm, I had success doing Atkins Diet for 4 months before Thanksgiving (loss 28 lbs).

But I decided to "relax" and did a somewhat loose form of Atkins (ate more carbs, but considerably less than previous pre-AD). Since Thanksgiving all the way to New Years, I gained 7 lbs which is ok with me.

But I thought I can go back, and it seems easier than said this 2nd time around. I can't seem to remember what motivated me, other than reading about AD here in the MB boards.

Anyway, I want to lose another 22 (15 + the 7 I gained). I already know how much daily carbs I can take to "maintain" my weight.

How are you AD'ers doing?
Posted By: *Takola* Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/22/04 11:49 PM
30 lbs gone and counting!
Posted By: mike_married Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/22/04 11:58 PM
30lbs vanished. At goal weight now and I've increased carbs significantly with no weight gain. I actually eat everything I used to now except sugar and flour. I feel great! Atkins rocks!

Posted By: *Takola* Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/23/04 12:00 AM
I've had so much success that I've revised my goals!
Posted By: cardinal Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/23/04 12:11 AM
Is there a problem that you can see with the increase in fat content/cholesterol/high blood pressure issues?
Posted By: mike_married Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/23/04 12:21 AM
No, actually quite the oppposite. Increasing your natural fat intake and significantly reducing your simple carbohydrate intake is almost guaranteed to reduce both your excess body fat and your blood pressure. Eating foods high in dietary cholesterol (eg. eggs) is not harmful at all.


Originally posted by WFLOWER:
Is there a problem that you can see with the increase in fat content/cholesterol/high blood pressure issues?

Posted By: cardinal Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/23/04 12:25 AM
I don't think that the doctor would agree that it would be healthy for a person with high blood pressure and high cholesterol should do this diet. All of the stress on the venous system with cholesterol clogging up and the high blood pressure, increasing fat intake sounds like a bad idea!

I wonder if anyone has done a medical study on that! BP will go down if you lose a ton of weight but how you lose that weight I think may be important for folks with CVD hi bp and cholesterol levels.
Posted By: mike_married Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/23/04 12:35 AM
WFLOWER... you're in a fog, just like all the other low-fat high-carb followers out there. It's not your fault though, it's what the USDA has been telling us all to do for years with their silly food pyramid. That food pyramid is the surest way to become obese and give yourself a great chance of getting diabetes.

Dramtically reduce your carbs. Increase your fat and protein intake. Take a brisk walk every day. If your blood pressure doesn't drop, I'll send you a box of chocolates.


Originally posted by WFLOWER:
I don't think that the doctor would agree that it would be healthy for a person with high blood pressure and high cholesterol should do this diet. All of the stress on the venous system with cholesterol clogging up and the high blood pressure, increasing fat intake sounds like a bad idea!

I wonder if anyone has done a medical study on that! BP will go down if you lose a ton of weight but how you lose that weight I think may be important for folks with CVD hi bp and cholesterol levels.

Posted By: *^aeri^* Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/23/04 12:45 AM

I suggest you do some research....studies have shown that people who follow the Atkin's diet experience a drop in blood pressure AND lipid levels. For anyone who cares to dispute this and mention studies which were done for the Heart and Stroke Association---just skip it. My friend is a researcher for a nutritional agency---he tells me that the results are ALWAYS in the favour of the company paying for the research.

I have experienced a drop in lipids and the members of the Atkin's message board that I belong to have also experienced it. My family doctor mentioned that I must be doing something right because he hasn't seen lipids drop as significantly as mine, even with drugs such as Lipitor. My blood pressure was always normal--after following Atkin's for 6 months, it dropped to below normal levels---nothing wrong with that!

The book "The Protein Power Plan" does an excellent job of explaining why the absence of carbs and sugar do more to control lipid levels than the absence of fat. The average person doesn't realize that carbohydrates coupled with sugar metabolizes into plaque inside your arteries. For those of you who remember elementary school---when you eat sugar, plaque also forms on your teeth....

Never believe the garbage that government funded institutions feed you. I never learned the key to feeling great and losing weight, unless I researched diets myself. My doctor wouldn't give me his blessing until I insisted that he checked my Post-Atkin's bloodwork---when he read the results, he told me to keep up the good work.

...AND, my last comment---it's healthier to be thin and following a low carb diet, than to be FAT and attempting to eat low fat.....I can't tell you how many of my overweight friends CONTINUE To be overweight because "eating low carb is unhealthy"....RIGHT--but continuously carrying around 100 extra pounds is much better.... [Roll Eyes]
Posted By: cardinal Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/23/04 12:50 AM
Sorry to say to you, that I don't need to lose weight. But, the high fat diet concerns me due to the fact the number one killer of Americans is still heart disease. I don't think it is the carbs that are killing them!
Posted By: *^aeri^* Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/23/04 12:57 AM
OH--well excuse me---YOU don't think that the carbs are killing people with heart, are YOU a cardiologist? Just for your information---Dr. Atkin's was.

You didn't read a word of what I said. Typical--dismissed it. You ARE in a fog, aren't you?

OH--and my sincerest congratulations to you---I found it rather cute how you made sure to tell everyone that you didn't need to lose weight....*clap clap clap*.....
Posted By: mike_married Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/23/04 01:04 AM
You're making the assumption that EATING fat causes heart disease. That is just not the case.

GETTING fat causes heart disease.


Originally posted by WFLOWER:
Sorry to say to you, that I don't need to lose weight. But, the high fat diet concerns me due to the fact the number one killer of Americans is still heart disease. I don't think it is the carbs that are killing them!

Posted By: cardinal Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/23/04 01:05 AM
Gee Aeri, I am sorry!
Posted By: *^aeri^* Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/23/04 01:08 AM
What are you sorry for, your ignorance of this subject?
Posted By: cardinal Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/23/04 01:09 AM
[QUOTE]Originally posted by mike_married:
[QB] You're making the assumption that EATING fat causes heart disease. That is just not the case.

GETTING fat causes heart disease.

Yes, getting fat does cause heart disease. It is also very much inherited.

Just wondering if anyone knows of a legitimate study, outside of special interest groups, that have some facts about the cholesterol.
Posted By: *^aeri^* Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/23/04 01:13 AM

[ January 22, 2004, 07:16 PM: Message edited by: *^aeri^* ]
Posted By: *^aeri^* Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/23/04 01:15 AM
Article One

Article Two

Article Three

[ January 22, 2004, 07:22 PM: Message edited by: *^aeri^* ]
Posted By: Still_JM Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/23/04 01:26 AM
It's not all high fat that is in Atkin's diet.

It's the reduction of carbs and sugars. This reduction leads to the reduction in your craving for more carbs/sugar foods.

Caffeine stimulates this craving for carbs/sugar, so it is adviced to cut or lower caffeine in the first 2 weeks of induction.

Fatty foods are allowed because it's not carbs. Fatty foods also helps satisfy your body of hunger.

There are food with carbs, but they also have dietary fibers which negates carbs as far as AD. So vegetables are good. Some fruit eventually.

Vitamins which I did not take will help out ease craving. That's probably what I should do tonight.

A high protein, low fat with plenty of fibers is a decent meal, and have low carbs. Ceasar chicken salad, my fav!

It's good to hear great progress, and that's what motivated me. I'll do it! We'll see in 2 months if I lose 22 lbs. [Smile]

I remember it was the first 4 days that was horrible. But after that, my body adjusted to the low carb intake. So long as I understood what my body was feeling, I was OK in continuing with AD.

Also, I asked my doc what he thought. He said it's a good start to lose weight, then I could evaluate how my diet habits changed, and change to something I could maintain.

I checked my ideal weight for my height, and it was exactly how much I weight after boot camp when I joined the U.S. Navy 14 years ago.

[ January 22, 2004, 07:31 PM: Message edited by: JM_May1986 ]
Posted By: cardinal Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/23/04 01:29 AM
That does make good sense, JM. What I did was to curb the carbs, and drop the fatty foods, and exercise.

Caffeine is a good one to watch. What about alcohol?

Is the South Beach diet similar to this one?
Posted By: WhirrledPeas Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/23/04 01:58 AM

[ February 14, 2004, 08:21 AM: Message edited by: WhirrledPeas ]
Posted By: believer Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/23/04 02:03 AM
I have been on a modified A diet since July. Have lost 37 pounds. The plan I am on lets you eat carbs once a day. It is very easy to do. I also walk for an hour each day. Also drink a glass of wine each day - the grapes are supposed to keep your blood from clotting.
Posted By: *^aeri^* Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/23/04 02:08 AM
That's great, Believer...

The name of the diet you are on escapes,'s the one with the "reward" meal, right?

I personally don't like that diet, simply because I feel better not having simple carbs. I'd rather just have my veggies and leave it at that. I have no need for bread or pasta....

Congratulations on your loss!
Posted By: jhj75 Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/23/04 04:12 AM

I was on Atkins from August until the end of October (lost 40 lbs). Unknown to me, however, I have a propensity for high uric acid levels. It's never been a problem, but apparently Atkins can exacerbate the issue and make it a problem. The end result? Gout.

So now I've got gout. Oh well. I don't blame Atkins, but I just wanted to spread the news out there to get your blood tested before you start the diet and make sure they test your uric acid. My rheumatologist has told me she's seen a lot of new patients over the last couple years due to Atkins, so FYI...

Posted By: RWD Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/23/04 05:16 AM
Just caught tail end of a special to be on MSNBC on Fri nite in regards to the Atkins Diet. Don't know if it was pro or con.

I started a modified one prior to Christmas and lost a quick 5 lbs, but got off over the holidays(love those carbs). Haven't had the will power to get back on. Have a friend or two that will do it with me though.
Posted By: Slapnuts Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/23/04 06:36 AM
Originally posted by JM_May1986:
How are you AD'ers doing?

Well, W and I have been on Atkins for 12 days and have lost a combined 16lbs. 9 were hers and 7 mine.

I actually am enjoying it, for the most part. I am still learning, and will be tweaking it as I need more fibre, if you catch my drift.

(But I'm used to being full of ****, so nothing is new there.)

I'm finding already that I don't seem to need as much sleep. My energy levels are high, and I don't feel like eating snacks all the time.
Posted By: Riverdog Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/23/04 06:53 AM
Ahhh, finally something I know about. I have been on AD for over 1 year (well, since the crisis with W). Anyway, I am down from 39% bodyfat to 11%. A common misconception about AD though. You are only supposed to eat the high fatty stuff for the first 2 weeks, then it's Poultry, Fish, Eggs, most cheeses and so forth. Also, you need to make sure you are keeping your body's metabolism going, which means eating 6 or 7 meals a day instead of 2 or 3. Don't have time? I'll give you an example of a 2000 calorie diet which I do (except mine is around 3000) Breakfast: 2 eggs (melt a slice of chees on top if you like). Make yourself a nice chicken salad for lunch. Beef jerkey makes a great snack for in between meals (no terryaki). High protein bar can be used to fill the gaps too. Dinner: cook up some fish or even a lean piece of beef. Protein is the essential part of the diet because when you reduce your calorie intake you are going to burn lots of lean body weight (probably close to the same amount as fat). You also have to have your fats but cut out the stuff like sausage and bacon and ham. Olive oil, sesame oil, peanut oil all add nice flavors in your cooking and give you your un-saturated fats and your fatty acids which all aid your weightloss.

Jerky: 100 cals per oz. 1gm fat, 15 gms protein 0 carbs
Eggs: 75 cals each 4 gms fat, 1 gm carbs 6.5 gms protein
Chicken: 25 cals per oz. 0 fat, 0 carbs 7 grams of protein.

Remeber, there is about 120 in one tbsp of those oils.

Remember, if you are losing muscle along with fat, your scale is going down but you will always think you need to lose more weight because you can't see the improvement that fast.

Chicken and Turkey are my main staples. 2lbs. of chicken or turkey is less than 1100 cals so it is really tough to get all your cals from a low fat, low carb, high protein diet. I know Atkins says about .8 gms of Protein per lb of lean body weight but if you are at all active you need more like 1.5-2. I will suppliment with those 0 carb shakes and such. Even more important, if you can find the time, try to get your heart moving for a half hour before you eat bk. You are burning stored fat instead of eaten calories when your glucose levels are low in the morn. A brisk walk, stationary bike (I hate running).

Anyway, I go through more than 40 lbs. of chicken per month so you would think I have some good recipes. Anyone interested, pm me. I can never get bored with chicken.

I think I have spent just about as many hundreds of hours researching and lurking fitness boards as I have MB.
Posted By: Riverdog Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/23/04 07:04 AM
"Unknown to me, however, I have a propensity for high uric acid levels. It's never been a problem, but apparently Atkins can exacerbate the issue and make it a problem. The end result? Gout."

Oh yeah, me too! That sucks. If you have high Uric Acid levels, you can still do AD, just stay away from stuff like Turkey or any yeasty things. Our flying feathered friends don't have the mechanisms built in to get rid of that stuff, mainly because they don't get enough water moving through their systems to flush it. Turkey is the worst of them all. Uric Acid build-up can also be avoided by taking lots of Milk Thistle to help cleanse your bodies main filters like your liver and Kidneys. You can get that at any GNC or other fitness store for about 10 bucks. Lots of water, at least 4-5 liters per day.
Posted By: nelly Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/23/04 11:25 AM

you said you have no need for bread or pasta.

i just can't even imagine that. [Big Grin]

so, i need to ask.....were you a big bread/pasta eater before?
if so, how exactly did you get over that?

i have cut back significantly on bread and pasta, compared to what i used to eat..and i try hard to stick to whole wheat when i do eat it.
but, i still miss it and crave it more than anything.
even more that chocolate chip cookies.
Posted By: jojojo Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/23/04 01:10 PM
WFLOWER As far as I know, South Beach Diet allows fruit which Atkins is really strict about.

I think Atkins works for certain types of eaters/bodies, but it never worked for me. The only thing that worked for me was to continue to eat everything but in smaller meals and in smaller I'd less during a meal but have little snack-meals throughout the day instead of having a diet coke and carrots for lunch and a HUGE dinner.

Slightly OT, but that is a HUGE problem (no pun!) esp if you eat out, portion size. I had to go to a nutritionist to find out what "normal" portions for a woman of my height/goals looked like [Frown]

Anyways, the three things I learned that are really good no matter what are walking, limiting portion size, and cutting out alcohol except, for me, the occasional red wine.

That's just me and I did this a decade ago and so far, so good. I figure whatever diet or plan(including Atkins) works, do that!

Nelly...I could never give up semolina pasta entirely [Roll Eyes]

I send everyone virtual chocolate--no calories!
Posted By: carina dream Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/23/04 01:18 PM
Because of the high amounts of fat that people consume on the Atkins’ diet, many have worried that over the long term, it might have serious side effects. The researchers found no differences in side effects during the 12 months of this study and even found benefits in blood lipid profiles, but they say they’ll look more closely at potential side effects in their next study.

“A calorie is still a calorie, whether the calorie comes from fat, carbohydrates or protein,” Klein says. “But it might be that certain types of calories are more filling than others and result in an overall decrease in total calorie intake.”

My best friend is a registered dietician/nutritionist. This is how it goes.
Every "diet" is a reduction in caloric intake. Certain foods will aid you in losing weight quicker. By eating less carbs and more protein, and drinknig a green tea after every meal, for example, you use your muscle's water stores first and purge excess water from your body. After that, you usually burn some of your muscle tissue first and then fat stores, and the diet will be more effective in the long run.
Every diet is a marketable product. People want to lose weight. The easiest way to lose is through reduced caloric intake and exercize. Atkins does not promote "healthy" eating and the lnog term effects are not proven--NOT THAT I AM DISCOUNTING THE DIET--because I think that the lowered cholesterol and such is from actualyl losing weight and relieving stress from your body.
To me, the buzz words these days are healthy weight loss--well, in a perfect world, we would just lose our recommended 1-2 pounds a week. BUT crap-if anyone is like me, you look at a chocolate bar and boom-there goes a few pounds on the hips.
Atkins works because it allows people to enjoy what they want in moderation (fats, etc) and still lose weight through caloric reduction.

Personally, I did Dr. Berstein and Weight Watchers to lose weight. Compartively, Berstein redudes calories severely and forces your body to eat up muscle stores while you are in ketosis.
That meas going to the gym and building the muscle again after and during the diet.

Losing weight is beneficial for so many reasons, that I do not believe a diet of 3 or 6 months that is different will adversely affect a human body, in comparison if they had stayed obese and carried that weight for the rest of their lives.

Six months of dieting, but healthy weight, or no dieting but unhealthy weight?
Posted By: cardinal Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/23/04 01:24 PM
This is interesting, how it is highly effective for some, and may cause difficulties for others. Getting gout is a rather serious issue.

And if you have to completely cut out a certain kind of food, that won't work for me. But, portion control is an important factor for me.

Certain body types are going to be prone to certain disease processes as well. Metabolism is not always the route. Esp. when that body type is already compromised from previous disease or injury to kidney, liver, intestinal.

I wonder what studies will tell us down the road on the strict Atkins Diet planners. How long has this diet been popular?
Posted By: becontent Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/23/04 01:26 PM
I don't think that the doctor would agree that it would be healthy for a person with high blood pressure and high cholesterol should do this diet.
My husband has lost 35 pounds on it in since May 2003. He takes BP medicine (has for years and years) and had been putting the Dr. off on starting cholesterol medicine.
Dec. 03 May 03
HDL 36 36
LDL 117 155
CHOL/HDL 4.8 6.81

He is down to his goal weight and has been maintaining for a couple of months.

The Doctor was really pleased.

I have lost 90 pounds and my numbers are below:
June 03 June 02
HDL 40 45
VLDL 18 25
LDL 89 114
CHOL/HDL 3.68 4.07

My numbers were after 5 - 6 weeks of the Atkins diet.

We feel really good and have been really pleased.
Posted By: cardinal Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/23/04 01:32 PM
Those are good numbers. But, you will have to stay on that diet for life? Correct? A good question is how healthy will a lifetime of Atkins be on the CVD or the aging patient that has disease process to or just simple aging process to organs that metabolize?

If you go off of the Atkins diet, you will gain it all back, directly.
Posted By: becontent Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/23/04 01:41 PM
The latest long-term study I heard about said that the Atkin dieters lost more weight and did gain back some but they were still below the low-fat dieters at the end of the study.

Atkins is promoted as a lifetime way of eating. Believe me I KNOW - any diet has to be a lifetime way of eating. I have lost and gained this 90 lbs. about 3 or 4 times in my lifetime. This is the first "diet" that I have been on that I was not counting the months to when I would be off the diet and could eat what I wanted. I have no desire to return to my old eating habits right now. I feel I can LIVE with this way of eating.

I was honestly much more hungry when I was eating like a pig. I liked the high carb foods (doughnuts, cookies, etc.), and I am convinced they just cause you to want more. I honestly have no desire to eat these kinds of things. Mostly because I know they will satisfy in the short term and make me hungry within an hour or so. I would have told you I could not live without bread and potatoes and I honestly don't miss them at all.

I just feel SO GOOD. have been very pleased.
Posted By: cardinal Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/23/04 01:55 PM
I was honestly much more hungry when I was eating like a pig. I liked the high carb foods (doughnuts, cookies, etc.), and I am convinced they just cause you to want more.

They do, as they spread out the folds in the stomach, it enlarges the stomach and is absorbed rapidly, leaving the rugae folds open and sensation of empty stomache returns, rapidly. And you need to eat more to quench the feeling of hunger.

I love that add that the folks are in the office for a coffee/doughnut break and the gal giving out the doughnuts has these giant doughnuts she puts around everyone's waist. Sounds about right, don't you think?
Posted By: lavender Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/23/04 03:22 PM
*nod* Thanks for explaining what carbs do to the stomach. I'd noticed that carbs make my stomach feel full, though I don't feel satiated.
Posted By: *^aeri^* Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/23/04 04:06 PM

Good question.

I'm of italian heritage, so bread and pasta was a huge part of my diet before Atkins. I can tell you that I stalled on trying Atkin's because I didn't think I could give these things up.

Now that I've followed Atkin's for so long, I realize that I never *really* liked bread and pasta. They don't appeal to me now AND the couple times that I've tried a plate of pasta, just to see if it tastes better/worse to me now, I suffered terrible heartburn. (Now I know why I suffered with heartburn so much in the past!)

What most people don't realize is that special circumstances need special consideration. If you have high uric acid counts--you should see your doctor before starting a low carb diet. Just like when I suggested this diet for Slappy and he noted that the high protein intake might harm him--I told him--ASK YOUR DOCTOR!

Also, before anyone gets their jockeys in a knot about the unbalanced nature of the diet---Atkin's has four stages---when you follow the stages into maintenance, YOU DON'T GAIN THE WEIGHT BACK.

When was the last time you followed a diet, lost weight, then began to eat twinkies again and DIDN'T gain weight? It's impossible. Any reasonable person knows that.

The Atkin's approach is a lifelong committment to good eating. For those of you who take one quick look at the beginning stages and dismiss it--you're being narrow-minded.....

Slappy----As for you----take a flax seed oil capsule. You'll find that really helps with your little *problem*...hehe
Posted By: SheWill Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/23/04 04:48 PM

I'm so glad you mentioned the four stages. I'm also a low-carber and I get so tired of hearing people talk about induction as if that was the only way. I wish they would educate themselves and read the whole book. The news never seems to talk about the maintenence portion .

I used to love pasta and bread.. now I really don't care for anything sweet. Occassionally a Chocolate craving..which I will indulge either with real candy or they corbolite bars are great.

I don't eat doughnuts anymore. I hate the insulin coma they put me into!

My children have adjusted to a low carb lifestyle very well. They do eat pasta sometimes and whole wheat breads and plenty of fruit and veggies and salad. THey missed it at first..but grew used to it. They did not have weight issues, I'm just training them for life.

You can have your nuts and berries!
Posted By: Still_JM Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/23/04 10:01 PM
IIRC, Gout is some form of arthritis.
And a high protein (beef mostly) diet can contribute to arthritis.

I mean, I had a blood test and the result my doc said that there's a high level of something because of my protein intake and this gives me a high percent chance of getting gout or arthitis.

So, I substitute chicken, pork and fish instead of beef. I also mix in soy burgers/veggie burgers on some meals.

It's great many others are getting good results. Keep it up because I like to hear it and it's motivating.
Posted By: MyBestFriend'sWife Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/23/04 11:05 PM
The first I heard of the Atkind diet was in 1990, a friend had found his original book, published in the 70's in a used book store. It was very informative but I did not try it then.

My father had a gastric bypass two years ago. I personally did a two week induction and then went the protein power lifeplan. My fathers diet set by his doctor and he is not allowed refined sugars, or carbs, even so far as not allowing fruit.

IF you look at the increase in the obesity rates since the 70's it is scary. There are many of us that have problems with the way our body reacts to carbs. Many of us are insulin resistant or have undiagnosed thyroid problems. The Atkins type diets work best for us, it is kind of like an allergy to carbs, processed foods, etc.

I lost 50 pounds in 4 months with my diet plan. 1.25 years later I have kept that 50 pounds off. Yet I did NOT stay strict on the dietplan the past year. I do have a pms flucuation of about 5 pounds, I go up for a week then drop that 5 in two days.

I am going to start again now that I am no longer on the meds that stopped my weight loss. I hope to reach my goal within the next 9 months.

As far as doctors go, well, the doctor I went to about weightloss 3 years ago, told me that the best thing for me would be to stick to a 1000 calorie a day diet and gave me a rx for Phentermine. MOST DOCTORS ARE NOT TRAINED IN NUTRITION!!!!!!!

It still hits me as funny that all these years after Atkin's originally released his book and started PROVING his plan, that suddenly so many diets based on his principles with minor tweaks to them have come out of the woodwork.
Posted By: Riverdog Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/24/04 02:58 AM
Gout is a form of arthritis but is caused by the high uric acid levels. The uric acid (if your body can't filter enough of it out of your system) starts to settle in your joints and crystalizes, mainly in the first joint of the big toe. I have a friend who has it in all of his joints, but this is not common. This is what causes it to swell up and it hurts like hell. Beef is not a big culprit. Remember, animals which are not capable of getting enough water to help flush these substances are goung to be the biggest culprit. Birds, don't have these mechanisms for this so you are likely to get huge amounts of uric acid from this. Chicken is an exception. Also, when you are putting so much protein in your body, your kidneys can't always get rid of it all either. If you stick to beef, chicken and fish you should be ok. Flax seed oil and Milk Thistle will help healthy liver and kidney function and does wonders for preventing gout. Flax oils also does wonders on your joints if you already have problems as well as provides you with your essential fatty acids. Also, the by-product of metabolising yeast is uric acid. Yeast in all things including alcoholic beverages and breads. It is very important you get 4-6 liters of water also to help your body's filters stay clean. It is essential you get tons of protein on Atkins so you can preserve your muscle tissue and utilize more stored fat as energy.

Another thing is you CANNOT gain muscle tissue while on a reduced calorie diet, contrary to what people say. You can only minimize its loss. Your body will only grow if you have excess calories. Increase calories, gain muscle (or fat), reduce calories, lose fat (or muscle). What people usually see when they think they are working out and gaining muscle is the more defined muscles from the workouts that are being uncovered from the fat they are losing. Never the less, it still looks and feels good and you feel better about yourself and that's all that counts.
Posted By: WhenIfindthetime Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/24/04 03:04 AM
after listening to the biochemists with the zone, forget his name, the atkins diets makes alot of sense. . . and i've agreed with it, but now i need to use it. . . ..

so what is the best web site to get the mest information about it. ..


Posted By: Riverdog Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/24/04 07:24 AM

Great site.

I can also give you some variations of the Atkins that I have done with great success. I have turned to bodybuilding as a way to vent and gain my self confidence back. Give me your email if you would like to try them.. Also, there are some great fitness sites ou there that have (forums) great advice too. I have done and tried and researched this almost as much as my marriage and I would be happy to share.
Posted By: jhj75 Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/25/04 06:34 AM is a good one for recipes and support,too.
Posted By: Antanina Celeste Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/24/04 11:41 PM
Atkins, Scarsdale, South Beach, Power Protein, etc., ad infinitum. They're all about lowering carb intake, not about increasing fats.

However, no diet discussion is complete until someone brings up the subject of good fats vs. bad fats. Simply put, good fats make you slim whilst bad fats make you, firstly, obese, then they kill you. The problem these days is figuring out who to believe concerning exactly WHAT are the good fats and which are the bad? The AMA, in all its dubious wisdom, would have everyone injesting margarines, canola oil, and other 'modern' fats which they say are good for us because they are full of 'polyunsaturates'.

Do you know that there is no such thing as a 'canola' in nature? Canola is NOT a foodstuff, but a genetically altered form of rapeseed, which is poisonous due to its extraordinarily high ericuc acid content.

'Canola' is a nickname for "Canadian Oil". It was originally called LEAR oil, but wouldn't sell, so they changed the name to make it less objectionable. 'LEAR' stood for Lower Erucic Acid Rapeseed. It is not a natural or healthy ingredient in any food. It will, over time, give you heart disease and/or circulatory disorders.

Any hydrogenated oil or fat is guilty of the same health-destroying properties as canola oil. Margarine will KILL you, over time.

The AMA and ADA are promoting, as 'healthy' the very diet that will CAUSE the diseases they proport to study with hopes to cure! Just remember, where would the American Diabetes Association BE, if no one had diabetes anymore????

The love of money is the root of all evil.

The truly healthy fats are good, old-fashioned butter, cream, virgin coconut oil, palm kernel oil, beef fat and lard. These fats promote good heart and blood health, as well as assisting in excess weight loss.

MUCH research has been done on the subject, and the information is out there for any one willing to do a little personal investigation.

Here are a couple of links, in case anyone is interested:

Also, Sally Fallon and Mary Enig, top researchers in the areas of healthy vs. unhealthy fats have an excellent book out called Nourishing Traditions. It is a cookbook, but also jam-packed with information on traditional diets, good fats/bad fats, etc.

I have lost forty pounds, and the scale is still going down, eating healthy foods, including fat. I feel great, my labs are better, blood sugars are finally stable, and my skin and hair look better than they have in years. I do not count calories, carbs or fat grams, but I do eat as much as I want of the healthy foods, including lots and lots of natural fats.

True, I did have gastric band surgery last June, but I didn't start losing steadily until I made the adjustments in choosing healthy foods, mainly healthy fats.

An example:

Hot Chocolate

1 teaspoon high quality cocoa powder
1/2 teaspoon stevia
1 cup hot cream, prefearably raw but if not available, at least choose cream that is not ultra-pasteurized

Mix the powders together in a mug and add a bit of hot cream to form a paste. Stir in the rest of the cream and enjoy. Delicious and good for you!

A cup of this at nighttime takes the place of all the ice cream and/or cookies I used to eat, and I feel great because of the sugar-free healthy fat. This hot chocolate does not adversely affect blood sugars, and in fact, it actually helps reduce triglycerides.

Cheers and good eats,

aka Green Jewel
(I lost my password and had to re-register recently.)
Posted By: *^aeri^* Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/25/04 12:03 AM
Hehe, as soon as I read that you'd had the surgery, I knew it was Green Jewel! *laughing*

Great to hear that you've lost 40 lbs!

I agree with everything you've said---thanks for saying it so well!
Posted By: Green Jewel II Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/25/04 01:26 AM
Hi Aeri,

Didn't think anybody'd remember me. It's been quiet a while since the old 'hypothetical scenario' thread. Thanks. ;o)

I re-registered again, so now I'm Green Jewel II.

Yes, I've lost forty pounds since the surgery. The first seven months were tough since I had an undiagnosed leak and I had to go back to Mexico thirteen times for fills, an exploratory surgery and finally two CT scans. But the doc replaced the leaky port (at no charge) and I've been adjusting to banded life for the past few months. It's strange, sometimes I can't eat anything, and others, it's as if I didn't have a band at all.

Proper diet and exercise is crucial after banding, as it is in all successful dieting. The difference is that now, with my band, I can not just give up like I always did before. I may get discouraged or even depressed for a time, but my band is always there to work with me once I get myself back on track. It limits the amount of food I can injest, but I still have to make the right choices.

In typical INTJ style, I've done tons of research lately on traditional diets and healthy fats. It's very 'freeing' to know that the stuff I love to eat anyway is really good for me, as long as I cut out the carbs and sugar. The low-fat, high-carb diet scam was killing me, and I'm so happy to feel this good. I've completely eliminated one diabetes med and reduced the other by two-thirds. My blood pressure is normal, lab numbers are better and the arthritis is improving.

For the first time in my life, I weigh less than my driver's license says. I haven't been this thin in over fifteen years. I have a long way to go still, but I have high hopes that in time, I'll get there.


Posted By: Riverdog Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/26/04 08:00 AM
Gosh Damn Jewel, you're an inspiration. I can't tell you the amount of "just too much work" people I know. I am so tired of excuses. I, myself, know of the blood, sweat and tears that goes into the weight-loss game from first hand experience. A bIG CONGRATS to you for taking the right steps, not only for your sanity, but for the hard work involved. Dam Skippy, A hard days work deserves a HIGH FIVE!!! Keep up the good work Jewel!!!
Posted By: Mortimer Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/26/04 08:45 AM
Could someone please post the time-frames from starting Atkins up to the maintenance phase? I lost the dang book when I was deployed a couple years ago... gained a pile of weight back (+30lbs) and I can't remember the numbers.

Is this about right?

1st 2wks 0 carbs
Weight Loss 20 carbs per day (or was it 70?)
Maintenance ??

Isn't gaining wieght back really stooooooopid? Beer and junkfood for a few months and wham! All that effort down the drain.

Well anyway, would appreciate someone putting the numbers up as I don't want to do it wrong. Already down about 8lbs this month and BP is down from 160/110 to "livable" levels(this was new, maybe scaring the weight off me).

Posted By: *^aeri^* Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/26/04 11:23 AM
1st 2 weeks - 20 carbs per day from allowed VEGETABLES. No low-carb junk food.

Ongoing W/L - Increment your carbs by 5 every week to determine your critical carb level. That's the level of carbs at which you maintain your that point, minus 5 and continue dieting down to your desired weight.

Pre-Maintenance - Within the last 10 lbs of goal.

Maintenance - At goal weight, begin to add low glycemic index fruit (cantaloupe, blueberries) and the ODD starchy veggie
Posted By: MrAlias Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/26/04 05:07 PM
I'm not posting to knock the Atkins diet. I believe it is a very workable diet and has helped a great many people lose weight.

I myself have been doing the South Beach Way of Eating since 9/15. I lost 8 lbs. in Phase 1 (2 weeks) and dropped another 12 before Turkey day. I, like most, slipped during the holidays but only added 4 lbs. back.

South Beach preaches Good Carbs, Good Fats. I'm not going to get into a discussion about what fats are good for you and which ones aren't because too many studies are conflicting. I will only state that I've heard plenty of good stories of both SB and AD participants that have lost weight, reduced cholosterol and blood pressure.

I myself was not overly overweight but wanted to drop 30 pounds to get to a weight some experts state is not considered overweight for my height.

I love how these diets get rid of the cravings. I can walk by a plate of goodies without batting an eyelash. Whereas before I couldn't not grap one.

I also love being able to eat until I feel satisfied. On SB there is no counting, carbs, grams, etc. (except for nuts where you are limited) As long as the food is on the list of acceptable foods you can eat until you feel satisfied.

I eat plenty of lean beef, pork, chicken, turkey. I'm also in Phase 2 so I can eat quite a few different types of fruits. I can have bread, rice or pasta as long as they're made from whole grain products.

Folks on this plan call it a Way of Eating or a Way of Living. Through experience you will be able to find enough foods and recipes to build a large menu for yourself so that you don't need the other foods you used to eat that were so bad for you.
Posted By: *^aeri^* Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/26/04 09:48 PM

Congratulations on your success with South Beach.

Just to give you a heads up--lots of low carb eaters call their "diet" a "way of eating" or "way of living". Dr. Atkin's called low carbing a "way of living" back in if anything, South Beach ripped him off [Wink]

I read the South Beach book and I thought it was alright, but I know from experience (with my body--the ongoing science project) that it won't work for me....The Zone is another one that just doesn't feel "workable" to me---too complicated for the long run...
Posted By: Comfortably_Numb Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/26/04 10:28 PM
Congrats to all who have lost weight on the Atkins diet.

Here is a question, does Atkins advise exercise?

The reason I ask is I'm probably on the reverse-Atkins diet. I eat tons of carbs: wonderful pastas, thick whole grain breads, German beers, fruits of all sorts, etc. Godiva chocolate too.

In fact I was Vegan for about 8 years and took in no animal protein at all. I have been able to maintain my weight . . . infact I weigh at the low end for someone my height and age and bone structure.

What is the magic sercet to this . . .


I run, usually 20-40 miles a week. I have tons of energy and great cholesterol to boot . . . and I get to eat anything that I want. What could be better?

I just wonder how healthy a diet could be if it didn't advocate some serious exercise. I don't know what Atkin's stance on this is so I thought I would ask you all since you seem to be followers of his diet.

This is not meant to be a slam or a taunt at all . . . I just wanted to say there are many ways to loose weight . . . even eating all the carbs you want.

Thinking about giving up carbs and having to force down tons of bacon, eggs, beef, etc. just sound horrible to me. Well I guess it will leave more desert for me!
Posted By: Still_JM Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/26/04 10:59 PM
Originally posted by Comfortably Numb:
What is the magic sercet to this . . .


You are right, exercise is important. But it is 1 of 2 part. The 2nd part is diet.

AD provides a change in lifestyle. It provides a way to lose weight. With that weight loss , it gives more energy to exercise or more active lifestyle.

For many overweight people, going to exercise causes sore muscles, pain, and tiredness. Overcoming that initial muscle burn is hard, and the motivation to exercise is lost. Sometimes, a 2 week exercise routine becomes boring.

Many diets also fail. Eating in itself is rewarding.

AD provides an extreme (and safe) lifestyle: cut the carbs off the diet, etc. Because it's an extreme change, results seem to be positive thus far. And of course, other people are free to make their creative interpretation of AD and they creeate their own "idea" of a better diet.

When I did AD with low impact aerobics, the weight loss was FAST that I was on a 3k calorie daily meals. It's the sugar craving that I needed to overcome.
Posted By: becontent Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/26/04 11:09 PM
I picked up my Atkins book not long after I had started it and the page I opened it to said something about if you are not exercising then you are not on the Atkins diet.

I think the sentence even started with my name. [Smile]
Posted By: *^aeri^* Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/27/04 12:32 AM

I'm sensing that you've never actually had a weight *problem*. Those who are severely overweight wouldn't have very much success following your regimen. For obvious reasons, a person who is severely overweight cannot run 30 miles per day--so what's the solution for the problem in that case? In my opinion, the weight must be shed, using an extreme solution, that will help to shed pounds quickly. Unbalanced weight lends itself to an unbalanced diet in order to equalize.

I'm not sure if you're aware, but many severely overweight people have type II diabetes. Type II diabetes, commonly referred to as "adult onset" diabetes is the most common disease of middle aged people today! Adult onset diabetes is typically caused by a diet too rich in sugars and carbohydrates.

Sure, there are many people who eat ANYTHING they want and never gain a pound. There are those people who eat like there's no tomorrow and WISH they could gain weight....It's not that these people are doing something "right" and all the overweight people are doing something "wrong". People who are predisposed to insulin related disorders (such as type II diabetes) typically gain weight after age 20.

The Atkin's diet works very, very well for severely obese people. The reason WHY ATkin's works is because it keeps blood sugar at even levels. Even blood sugars mean less sugar "lows", less cravings and increased energy and stamina. Increased protein allows for a feeling of being satisfied, longer. For a person who has tried every diet imaginable, only to feel endless hunger pangs, this diet is a godsend. Contrary to popular belief, Atkin's doesn't work because it's essentially a low calorie diet....ATkin's works because the real culprit in weight gain is overproduction of insulin. If you'd like further information on HOW the diet works, there's an exellent explaination in the book THE PROTEIN POWER PLAN and also in DR ATKIN'S book DR ATKIN'S NEW DIET REVOLUTION.

Atkin's advocates exercise. One great side effect of the Atkin's way of eating is increased energy levels. The rapid weight loss in the intitial stages also lends to a person being motivated AND inspired to excercise. On a low fat diet, it could take months of starving for the same person to feel motivated enough to set foot in a gym....

The Atkin's diet limits sugars and carbohydrates--it's not so much that it ADVOCATES eating fat. Contrary to what you've heard about the Atkin's diet, I eat very little bacon and greasy foods. My protein consists of chicken, fish and lean meats. I don't eat processed ANYTHING, including deli meats....My carbohydrates consist of a mixture of healthy vegetables---usually raw...I can honestly say that I eat FAR more vegetables than my friends who follow "low fat" regimens...(they're usually filling themselves with low fat candy bars and treats)....

The point of my post is this---I believe that you probably indulge in all the carbohydrates you enjoy, however, I also believe that some people just aren't predisposed to having a PROBLEM with carbohydrates. I could *NEVER* maintain my weight eating ONLY carbs...even if I ran 100 miles a day! I learned this through my own research---when *I* eat pastas, breads and sugar, I feel as if my brain is in a fog, I feel sluggish, lazy, unable to concentrate AND my body SWELLS.....Carbohydrates cause me to have heart palatations....THiS is how I know that carbohydrates are literally POISON for my body....

I work with a girl who weighs 110 lbs. She works out every day and looks great. Her diet consists of things like Coke for breakfast and chocolates for lunch. AT last check, her cholesterol was through the why didn't her strenuous exercise regimen take care of the cholesterol? Probably because exercise, although beneficial, isn't the central factor. On the other hand, although I'm technically still a bit overweight for my height and other than some swimming, I don't exercise seriously---my cholesterol and lipid counts are normal. They've dropped significantly since I began Atkin's and I'm not the only one---the majority of the people in my Atkin's support group online have found the same results....

I'm very passionate about Atkin's, but only because it works for ME. If I didn't feel great, I wouldn't spend all this time trying to tell people who wonderful the diet is. All I ask is that people try it and see if it works.

I hope this information was useful to you, CN!
Posted By: Riverdog Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/27/04 04:32 AM
Someone asked earlier if you had to be on AD for life. The answer is no. Once you reach your goal weight you need to find out what your new base metabolic rate is (BMR) then you can eat a healthy diet of whatever. You still can't pig out on Twinkies and Oreos. I look at my intake on a weekly basis and try to at least write down what I eat. It's a little work at first, but once your dialed in with the food values of what you are eating you can pay less attention to it. It almost becomes like a Weight Watchers style of eating but without reducing cals. It is a lifestyle change though. AD is more geared toward sedentary people with lots of weight to lose so exercise is not necessary but always a plus. You will lose weight with all reduced calorie diets, carbs or no carbs. The good thing about cutting out carbs is they are a huge part of almost every food and the cals really add up quick so eating breads and pastas you really have to cut down the amount whichs leads you to be hungry all the time. On AD, there is only 1200 cals in 2 lb's of chicken. You could get so full and bloated to eat that much chicken in one day and it has very little food value, except the protein. Add some cardio (50-60% of your max heart rate)before breakfast when your blood glucose is low and the fat just melts off. Another good diet is Body Opus. This one is where you load carbs a couple days a week and go low carbs for the rest of the time. That diet also rocks. The fat melts away very fast. Do a search on Amazon for the book if you're interested. Very interesting chemistry going on there.
Posted By: Comfortably_Numb Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/27/04 03:05 PM
Hello aeri:

No, I’ve never had a weight problem. I’ve always been active though. High school and collegiate soccer, cross-country running, etc. Genetically, It seems that I do have the genes to put on weight. Many of my extended family are, trying to be nice here, heavy.

Boy I don’t think many people could run 30 miles a day, that is more than a marathon each and every day. I said 30-40 miles a week, big difference.

I agree, someone that is severely overweight can’t run 30 miles a week, probably can’t even run at all. That is o.k. The person could probably walk 100 yards twice a week. After one-two months, he probably could walk 1 mile 3 times a week. After six months, he probably could wog “walk/jog” 3 miles 3 times a week. After a year, 5 mile 4 times a week. One needs realistic goals. No one got “fat” overnight, it will take time to get back into shape.

I’m aware of type II diabetes. It mainly affects overweight individuals. I think that the scientific evidence that it is somehow caused by eating carbohydrates is pretty slim. It rarely affects marathoners, even those in there 60's and 70's and they eat tons of carbs. We eat it to extreme before big races . . . it is called carboloading.

I wasn’t aware that the target audience for the Atkin diet was severely obese individuals. I guess such a drastic diet would be suited for those who are in that category. I hear may people who talk about getting on it who appear to be only 20 or so pounds overweight. Is the diet meant for them too?

I’m heartened to hear that Atkins recommends exercise. I will pay more attention to his views since this primary facet of a healthy lifestyle is included in his philosophy.

Here is one reason that I can indulge in the “forbidden foods” for people on the Atkins diet. Let’s say I had a good week and ran 40 miles. I’m 5'11'’, 165 lbs, fairly heavily muscled. I burn approximately 150 calories per mile at an 8 minute pace. So, 40 miles x 150 cal/mile = 6000 calories per week or 857 calories per day. So I have about 850 calories per day that I can devote to anything I wish. For me a calorie is a calorie . . . I will burn these calories unlike someone who is sedentary. This is the reason that I can consume carbohydrates . . . not because my body is somehow special or my insulin production is significantly different from others.

My point to this is carbohydrates are not bad in and of themselves.
Posted By: *^aeri^* Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/27/04 03:20 PM
Carbs aren't food is really BAD, unless it's something that is genetically modified...

I know that carbs are bad for ME.
Posted By: Mortimer Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/28/04 05:01 PM
Exercise is like the force-multiplier while on Atkins. On Atkins alone, I drop weight reasonably well. Throw in a brisk 30-45min walk or a 2-3 mile run (hehe... jog) every day or every-other day and the pounds begin to melt off really fast. I've ordered the literature again for Atkins too, want to go about it right this time will all the information I can get.

Posted By: Riverdog Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/29/04 06:32 AM
One comment on Diabetes II. I havn't read any journals that high carb diets cause this but think about it for a minute. If you do anything too long that increases or decreases your body's production of hormones or, in this case, insulin, your body will react and evolve to compensate. When weight lifters inject testosterone to increase their body's level for growth, the testes shrink and the body stops producing it's own. That was just an example I was thinking of. Why do you think (just an observation) heavy drinkers have a tendancy to develop diabetes. Alcohol IS sugar (both a byproduct of, and a precursor to). Runners use all those carbs and need them. A couch potatoe will just store them as fat. Insulin being a growth factor for both muscle and fat gets all out of whack. Type I people are usually pretty lean naturally for lack of and type II are usually heavy for excess of. Just an observation.
Posted By: MyBestFriend'sWife Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/29/04 09:32 AM

Actually, in my book, The Insulin Resistance Diet it talks about Insulin Resistance as what leads to Type II, Insulin Resistance is also part of Syndrom X, which is a leading cause of Obesity. I think it was calculated at 85% of all obese women have syndrom x, thereby having Insulin Resistance. Which is basically that those of us with Syndrom X, Insulin Resistance, and PCOS do not react *normally* to carbs. It all gets very confusing.

If you have a chance to pick up the above mentioned book, do so, it has been great for me as a maintence after the Atkins approach.

Also, it does mention Gout as being one of the many conditions caused by Insulin Resistance.
Posted By: MyBestFriend'sWife Re: OT - Atkins Diet - 01/29/04 03:54 PM
The following is from a newsletter I receive, I thought it was appropriate for this thread to add it. Some people just seem a little odd to me, or maybe I am the odd one since it made me giggle.

Health Sciences Institute e-Alert

January 29, 2004

".. and another thing

Blinding blinders and the blind people who insist on wearing

I almost got into an argument at my gym last week. Nothing
serious - just a slightly warmed-up exchange of ideas with a
woman who casually commented on the recent news reports that the
Atkins diet had been modified to downplay the fat intake.

I'd just read the New York Times article about Atkins, and the
reply to the article on the Atkins web site, so I told her that,
in fact, the Atkins diet was no different than it ever was.

No, she said - I was wrong. She saw it on TV.

And, I said, no, the TV reports had just picked up the New York
Times misinformation and run with it without checking the

"Well," she said, "my cardiologist wouldn't let me do Atkins

You know I couldn't leave well enough alone, so I pushed it a
little further, mentioning that a Duke University study found
that subjects using the Atkins plan scored equal or higher marks
in all of the heart-health categories when compared to subjects
using the American Heart Association's "Step 1" low-fat diet.
The Atkins subjects had not only lost more weight, but also had
a much larger increase in HDL cholesterol, and a far greater
drop in triclycerides. In addition, neither diet showed a change
in LDL cholesterol.

Now you would think that this information would carry some
weight, right? But the woman responded by saying, "I know. I
read that study."

Well, she had me there! If she read and (apparently) understood
the study, then she already knew that Atkins has not been shown
to do any harm to the heart. In fact, just the opposite!
Nevertheless, her cardiologist wouldn't "let her" do Atkins.

I guess for some folks, blinders are a comfortable fit.

To Your Good Health,

Jenny Thompson
Health Sciences Institute"
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