I was very down these days, my son arriving, the holidays, today is H b.day....
So I went to counseling. The counselor of course validated my feelings but she says that in time I have to overcome the anger issues I have with H otherwise this will effect my future relationships with men in terms of being able to trust them. She also said that in the long run it will effect our son. So she said the goal of IC would be to work on my anger and my issues. She said this will take months and maybe a year or more.
I do not believe I will be able to be on speaking terms with H ever...she said if I do not resolve this anger issue at some point in the future (not right now as the wound is too raw)...it will erode me and will make me become a bitter and angry person and will effect my future. She said I should not have what happened with H be the background music for the rest of my life.

I was also expecting the counselor to be more like: wow you H is really f@!$#d up! She did say he is messed but she also said that concentrating on him and how bad he is it is not going to help me recover. She said that we should concentrate about ME and not him and OW. He will have to deal with the mess he created ... not me.
She also said that I should have kicked him out way earlier (just like you did say) and that I should have been more aware of the neighbor OW, but I told counselor how sneaky H is. See, I do not think people realize the level of deceit and stone face attitude my H has...
What do you think? Does she sound like somebody I should see again?
blessings

atena, IMO the IC is correct. I was right where you are. I was more focused on WH & OW and what they'd done to me, etc. and it was causing me great pain and keeping me stuck in the past. I've been in IC for 5 mths and I am now focused on me and how I got to this point. I cannot change WH nor make him want to change. Forgivness is in the future for me but that's just it, it is for me and not him. It does not mean I will invite him back into my life. It simply means I will let go of my desire to have revenge or get even. It will mean I've completely let him go and I've moved on to the next phase of my life. I will someday be capable of having a healthy relationship as an emotionally healed and healthy person.

The book Boundaries by Drs. Townsend & Cloud is the best book I've ever read. It helped me understand myself. That book, along with my relationship with Christ, is my ticket to a new and healed me.


I understand this. I would say the same about my WH. He was totally heartless toward me. I've come to accept that it was because of HIM and not ME. That was tough. I was not strong in the beginning so it was easy for me to blame myself. But I don't anymore. He is broken but so was I in a different way, but not anymore. I am not the same person because I was able to focus on me and not WH.

If you felt comfortable with her I'd say go back. Not every IC is the right fit. I'm on my 3rd and she is the one for me. But as far as what she is telling you, I agree. I will tell you that in my first sessions I wanted to focus on WH & OW too but I was to learn that it was fruitless.....

Plan B is for you but it does take a while to get focused. Get that book. That is what helped me the most to get started.

I wish you the best.

Oh and I wanted to say I understand the level of deceit you're talking about. My WH brought his OW (plural) into our lives, along with their familes, as friends. So I totally get that!

Thank you verysadtime. That helped me immensely. Makes sense to think of me. The hard part was when IC said: you M is over. YOu have to focus on you and move on into a healthy person who will attract healthy men. At that point i really burst into tears!
blessing

Well I have to say that she doesn't know that your M is over, so I don't agree with her saying that. Nobody knows that. But focusing on you is the thing to do and as you get stronger and feel recovery happening within yourself, you'll be better prepared to face whatever the future holds for you.

She sounds awesome!

Would you have preferred a counselor who recommends you increase your anger and stay angry for a long time?

I think counseling can be a good thing, but it can also be a BAD thing if it focuses on the grief and keeps the patient triggered. There are some studies cited in the book One Nation Under Therapy that showed that grief survivors that went to counseling actually fared WORSE than those who didn't because they stayed perpetually triggered and mired in their grief.

I found the same to be true with myself when it concerned the death of my son and in the past when I went to counseling to address child abuse. It was horrible. I had much better results focusing on rebuilding my life and avoiding grief counseling. I lasted one session grief counseling because I could see it was going to be too traumatic for me. Three years later I ran into another woman whose teenage DD had died the same time as my son. She was still WRECKED and was dependent on all manner of narcotics just to function. Sure, that is anecdotal, but there are studies that demonstrate that very thing.

Dr Harley has spoken often on avoiding the past and focusing on making the FUTURE and the PRESENT great. I think counseling can be of benefit *IF* it does that.

As you can tell, I have a real low opinion of counseling because of my past experience. And believe me, I have LOTS of experience. I have been to no less than 10 counselors in my lifetime becasue of my screwed up past and none helped. Not one. I never understood logically how it could actually HELP to pay someone to listen to myself bloviate for an hour. I could do that for free at home.

And if my best thinking got me into this mess, how could listening to the person who CAUSED the problem, be the solution? That doesn't make a lick of sense to me. What I needed was GUIDANCE. I was a rudderless ship, so how was listening to the rudderless ship jack her jaws going to solve anything? YAKKING doesn't solve problems, changing behavior is what solves problems.

Atena, look at the most productive changes you have made in your life since you have been here. It was taking ACTION by removing yourself from his circle of abuse. You changed your BEHAVIOR. And since you changed your behavior, your feelings are bound to change as a result. In other words, you brought the body, now the mind will follow.

And you can continue to make such changes by further distancing yourself from your gaslighting husband. There are some changes you can make that would be much more effective than going to counseling, ie: moving away, getting another job, selling your house. Those things would help you recover faster, IMO. But being so close to him will not help you get over your anger. You will continue to be triggered every time you see him.

I think counseling mayhave helped me, as my friends were growing weary of hearing about the trauma and pain, but I still needed to get it out.
At some point, however, I realized that I was just covering the same ground over and over again(and paying for it). I realized that I was going to have to get over this on my own and things have worked out well.
I think the concept that really eluded me for a long time and held me back was that my deficiencies caused or contributed to the affair. Talking about my XW's past, as it had been revealed to me by folks who were keeping their mouths shut before the affairs and divorce, in the hopes that she had changed, was incredibly helpful.
Her life pattern just fit right into the disordered model so well. I then realized she had done this type of thing her whole life and had hurt many other people before me.
Once I accepted that I had made a terrible choice in a spouse, I was able to let my anger go.

I'm not in grief counseling at all but I'd agree that if that were the IC's focus it wouldn't be good. My IC helped me see that I had no boundaries and why and we're moving forward with correcting that among other things. That is why the book Boundaries has been so valuable for me. My IC is very good about moving me along if I attempt to focus on WH or what he is doing, thinking, or about the A etc. It's pointless and I see that now. We already covered that and moved on. Staying focused there would be a waste of time for me.

atena, I recommend signing up for daily emails from Divorce Care daily emails. Don't focus on the word "divorce" and just focus on the advice given. It's very helpful.

Who knows what the future holds for our WH's? I pray for mine to choose a personal recovery for himself and to return to his family. It could happen or not. I am, however, preparing myself for either senario. My plan is to continue my path of recovery and trust God. I feel confident that I will know when I'm ready to close one door and open another.

vst, that is great advice! Atena has a similar background as you in that she tolerated some pretty bad crap for a very long time, believing that she was the CAUSE. Her H used to practice very loose boundaries with women and when Atena complained, he accused her of being the problem. He even blamed her for his affairs!

I am glad you are posting to her and think you could be an invaluable resource.

It depends on what your goals are. If your goal is to save the marriage, then this counselor won't help you much. If your goal is to create a healthier you, then the counselor sounds like they're on the right track.

I agree. Don't pay someone to just sit and listen. An IC should help you understand, give you guidance and help you set goals for yourself. I guess I'm lucky. My IC is very good and I wouldn't be where I am right now without her. I was too broken to do those things alone. I don't see her as often as I did in the beginning and I forsee our time together coming to and end in the near future. I personally think IC is great. I also agree some people don't need it. Not all IC's are the same. Shop around 'till you find the right fit for you.

I totally disagree. You must create a healthier you in order to do your part in saving the marriage!

Thanks Mel. It feels good offer help based on my own experiences.

atena, Mel knows where I was. Sounds like you and I had very similar experiences. Hang in there. You'll get stronger with time and focusing on yourself. Plan B is our fortress!

To be honest, I think I derived the greatest benefit from this board and others like it.
My XWW did the same thing, blaming me for her affairs and showing incrdeible cruelty. It really helped me when I saw other good, intelligent , articulate people had been subjected to much the same thing.
I could see that these folks, the BSs, had a lot going for them and it made me realize the problem was with the WSs and their poor coping skills.

I have mixed feelings about counseling. I have a close friend who is in counseling right now and she thinks it has helped her a lot. I myself suffered a little (I think) PTSD as a child and have a phobia now because of it. I have tried to go for counseling and it didn't help me at all.

Anyway, in R, my problem was the obsessing about the A and the negative feelings associated with that. What helped me a lot, I think, was delving back into an old hobby, reading, I really got involved into exercise and joined an online support group for that, and we also got a puppy into early R...those were all things that I refocused myself on each time I started thinking about the A or feeling angry/sad. Defintely not a cure-all but those three things helped me a TON!

T/J, VST, glad to see you back! I was wondering what happened to you

Zelmo, I agree that MB and all the great people was a huge help too. I wouldn't be where I am w/out MB! A combination of God, MB and counseling is what worked for me.

SQ, thanks! It's good to be back!

Atena,

You are you own best IC. My goodness, that post you wrote over on the other thread was outstanding. It sure helped me.

Yes, I do have mixed feelings about IC. The counselor is twice divorced. She seems good,but as a first time session is hard to tell. I will give her 3-4 sessions and then decide what to do. I need a behavioral approach and if she starts digging back at my childhood and past and all that...then I am not interested.
If she pressures me to make contact with h I am out of there the minute she mentions that.
My issue right now is to make sure I get over thinking about him and OW and get rid of the illusion that he will come back to me... so I should put my life on hold till he does.
I have been in therapy in the past with very little results if any. So I have to agree with Mel. Also, most of the sessions I had in the past were actually counter productive. During my H previous A I was in counseling all the time with this therapist who told me it was all my fault if my H cheated on me as I was a nag and should have not asked my H to tell me where he went and what he did. She told me that it is disrespectful to control people and want to be with them all the time.
She said my H hated me for being so pesky and that he was punishing me by having an A. She kept me stuck in a bad M when I actually needed someone to tell me: just kick him out of the house.
This time I found an american therapist and she seems interested in getting me on a track where I emerge as an independent and healthy person.
Again, if after 3-4 sessions (or sooner) I feel I am getting no where....I am out of there.
blessing

A twice-divorced counselor would be a red flag to me. I would ask her to share her past with you a bit before you decide if she is qualified.

I would also directly ask her if one of her goals will be to have you re-establish contact with WH at some point. You need to know that up front. If her direction is counter-productive to YOUR goals, why would you even consider working with her? Find out now.

A BS maintaining NC with a WS does not indicate the BS is not dealing with their anger, but I think many IC's think that is the case.

Yes, one of her goals is to make me re-estabilish contact with H but not now, she said in a year or more. She said for the sake of our son.
If she bring it up again next session I will not see her again.
However,,you said that I can deal with my anger even while maintaining NC with H...how?
blessing

I'd fire her right now. She clearly does not understand the dynamics of an affair nor the devastation to the BS and children. I would not give someone with that mentality access to my feelings and struggles.





If this is her expressed goal, why would you ever go back?





Here's how I see it. Many counselors think that when someone is angry, they need "fixed". I think anger is a perfectly healthy response to certain circumstances. Being angry because WH has cheated, betrayed you, lied, manipulated, and gaslighted you seems like a very healthy response to me. I'm much more concerned when I see a BS come here who doesn't feel anger.

You work through your anger by creating a lifestyle that no longer has room for anger. You do it by creating a life you enjoy, a new life redefined by you and your interests and passions. You cannot do this overnight. It happens over many months/years of living your new life. You allow yourself patience and compassion. You allow yourself to feel angry and to express it in ways that don't hurt you or others. Some ideas are to write, draw, paint, dance...any hobby you enjoy can become a healthy release for your anger and redirect your mind to something more positive. The more you care for yourself (eat healthy, exercise, do things that create positive memories), the less important your anger becomes. Eventually, you look back and realize you are no longer angry. It's behind you....YEARS down the road. If you do those things, it will happen naturally with or without a counselor.

My IC encouraged me to deal with my anger when it came. To take a bat and beat the bed, scream and yell the things I wish I could say, etc. Of course only do those things if DD isn't home. Do things to exert physical energy. And like SMB says, changing your lifestyle. I have a lot of anger toward myself as well, for putting up with WH's behavior and being gaslighted for so so long. Looking at why I didn't do something sooner is what has helped me the most. I had no boundaries. I didn't have the ability to say no, or confront. I held everything inside and lived in a state of deprivation. Now, the IC did have me look at my FOO issues, but very briefly, to determine why I had no boundaries. It helped me a lot and gave me the courage and motivation to push forward to healing myself.

Oh and my IC has never mentioned having contact with my WH. She thinks PB is the best thing for me!

I still can get very angry about WH, when I allow myself to think about it. I just try to not let that happen. I've already dealt with alot of the anger. Any that is left will continue to fade as I move forward. As you get stronger, it will get easier to not think about it. As you get stronger, the future will not look so sad, empty and scary.

I love this quote from the book Boundaries: "You need to get far enough away from abusive people to be able to fence your property against further invasion. And then you need to own the treasures you find in your soul."

Ahh, the treasures in my soul...I love that. I'm on a journey to find my treasures.

The OW, well her treasures are dried up and blackend with sin and adultery. They are gone. Too bad for her.

VST, they used us and abused us because we let them do it. We have to recover so we no longer attract that sort of man.
Of course they were bad and heartless. you do not have to hurt someone just because you can. How can you be so mean? Maybe our H were always that way...we just never got to know them for what they really were!
blessing

Yes I allowed it for sure. I didn't have the tools or knowledge to change things. All I had was what had been modeled for me by my parents. It's been very interesting for me to learn about why I was that way. And putting my attention on my personal recovery/education has really helped me move forward. And yes, I think I just chose not to see him for what he really was. I do however, believe he has the ability to change and become a whole and healthy person, a real husband and father. But that is in his control not mine.

VST, if they decide to change it will be when the sh*t hits the fan with OW. Then they will go to IC to make it work with her as they will be too ashamed to come back to us. Plus, out of site out of mind....they will no longer love us. They no longer do to begin with.
I think we are better off without them.
How old are u? I am 45.
blessing

It's obvious that you have a lot more inner strength than I did atena. It took me a loooong time to pull myself together. I think you've already got your feet on the path to recovery. I had to have a very detailed map!

I'm 45 too.

This is my H second A and since 2004 I have been in a lot of pain in my M. I started last year by reading Eckhart Tolle's books and those put a different spin in my life. I am a very sociable person and have no problem asking for help when I need to. I put my pride aside and like to feel humble. I do not mind if my ego gets put into its place from time to time.
I have nothing to defend as the truth needs no defending.
I am only very hurt by my H behavior. I love him still and would have never dreamed he could have resorted to such a sick and careless behavior. I feel like running away and never coming back here. I feel I want a new life.
blessing

I asked your age because I felt we were pretty much the same age and we are!
I do not know what chances we have to find an OM in our lives. They have so much excess luggage and I would prefer not to deal with it. Here where I live (Italy) a woman at 45 is considered old and definitely if she looks for a relationship she will only find men in their late 50s and 60s.
I know in the states is not that way.
blessings

This is my WH's 2nd that I know of as well. I think there were others though. Mine hurt me very deeply as well. His behavior was just horrid. I've not really thought much about another relationship. I do realize that it would be someone with baggage as well. I don't really know how a 45 yr old divorcee is perceived here..... I've decided to totally leave it up to God and if he has someone for me then it will be right and good. I'd so much rather it be my H though. I feel very strongly that we could have a great M together. But, he'd have to fix himself and be willing and there is no sign of that happening.

What is your situation? Are you in plan b? Is he living with OW? How long as it been since he left? Is he totally indifferent? Mine is, has not made contact, pretends I do not exist. Rented his own place and sees OW when her kids are with her XH, spends all weekends and holidays with her.
blessing

Atena, I am 58. My WW is 48. We met when I was 51 and she was 41. To this day I find her incredibly attractive, even though she's got a few wrinkles and I have thinning hair. I know what you're feeling, and as a man, I have that same fear: It's a young person's world and people like us are "has-beens" to many.

But you know what? I don't believe that we're destined to spend the rest of our days alone. WW has found some "validation" with OM, 44. But I'm sure he will throw her under the bus when either (a) OMW puts the hammer down and either D him (resulting in alimony & child support), or (b) when he finds a younger woman who finds him charming and willing. What happens then?

At my point in life, I have a good steady income, a home, a car that's paid for, good health (I have a back problem, but that hasn't kept me from running marathons -- and I am addressing that with the help of a spinal surgeon) that's covered by health insurance (her coverage ends in ten days). From a strictly creature-comfort point of view, I have plenty to offer. WW has sunk to renting a small apartment, looking for work as a receptionist, driving a car that I own (and may repossess if she doesn't start paying for it) and her running days are limited if she keeps smoking. Some comparison, huh?

In your case, you're letting the characteristics of another culture dictate your viewpoint. I've been to Italy (beautiful country!) and it's true -- the double-standard applies big time! But Italy is also the country of la dolce vita! Some of the most admired Italian women are the ones who dare to "break the mold" (I'm thinking of Sophia Loren). Why can't you be one of them?

One of my A.A. sponsors once said, "It's none of my d*mn business what other people think of me." I try to remember that (although sometimes I forget). The only person I really have to please is me!

Better days ahead. Starting today!

I asked my WH to moved out Feb 09 (before I knew about MB). They work together and neither will leave. I exposed to everyone in April but it didn't change anything. I don't know if the A with her is still on. I went into PB 5 mths ago. He's not tried to make contact. I have no idea what he is doing or with who. The good thing about my sitch, so far, is that he isn't openly with anyone else as far as I know--he isn't subjecting my DD to anyone at least. I feel for you and the pain that causes you. It just makes me sick when WH's do that. It's so very evil.

Thank you Fred it helps to hear that age is not so important. I guess here in Italy you would be a hit. They love americans. My H is literally surrounded by OW. OK he is really very good looking, looks like an actor and has the body of a 20 year old. He is very cool and mysterious.
Even if I am good looking I do not seem to attract men.
I am not ready to date yet. But I am not sure what will happen. I do not like Italian men. They are all mama boys and complain about their liver, their being cold, their diet, their relatives...oh my gosh.
I like the outdoors, could care less if it rains, if it is cold, I still ride my bike , get wet...and have fun.They think I am crazy. I miss the states for the great outdoors and the clean air.
blessing

Oh I see, you are not sure if he is still with OW. I bet he has someone. So you are not in contact with him since April? Do you have any kids?

No I went into Plan B 7/25. I tried to do PB a month or 2 before that but I let him break thru. He went ballistic that time. But not so much this last time. I have a 10 yr old DD.

I guess we will have to see what happens. I do not have much hope here, as I said my H is basically surrounded by OWs, he spends most of his time at the beach in a bathing suit looking great. OW is going to have him cheat on her before she can count to 10.
He is off to a different life, he considers me old and he can get 30 years old to sleep with him.
Who would want someone like that around any more. I really could not trust him ever again. He will never go into IC.
blessing

You have a 10 year old....then you do have a good chance.
blessings

Yes, you have to ask yourself that.....why would you want them anyway?? It's sad to lose your M and family but I would not go back to the way it was. No way.

I don't know about that. I think he has convinced himself that it won't really affect her.

Yes, it was so painful. He was interested in OW the whole M but he was so good at concealing it. He is such a smooth talker and lier. I spent 20 years with him! He pretended to be someone totally different the whole time. And the whole time he was depressed and unhappy and resented being married and not being able to do as he pleased. Gradually, as our son was growing up he realized he could get out of the M and started to actively have As. He never really cared much about me.
Everything got much worse once we came here. Italian women were all over him.

Yep, our stories are very similar...minus 6 years. Having the truth about your life kept from you is a hard pill to swallow isn't it?

The sad part is that I am still the one in pain, kicked to the curb, alone and abused. He is out there having sex and fun and feeling young desired and admired.
It really only boils down to your moral standards. If you do not have any you see things and live you experience using a different set of rules. You do not care if your actions hurt others, you only care about yourself. If you have no morals you really do not get hurt and you remain like a 13 year old for the rest of your life.

I'm going to tell you something I think you already know: Attractiveness is more than just a pretty face. I was attracted first to my WW because of her looks, but as I got to know her (and her physical "imperfections"), there was an awful lot more: the way she smiled, her laugh, a shared interest in sports, politics, and more.

But the first impression wouldn't have gone any further if she hadn't exuded something else. Some indeterminable aspect of her that made her more than just another attractive woman. She had an "aura" about her.

That aura came from her own sense of confidence, determination and purpose. Yet it was tempered by a sense of fragility and femininity that was (to me) captivating.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that WE make ourselves attractive by our demeanor and composure. I spent a lot of years between M1 and M2 not dating and wondering why. I came to realize that I hadn't become comfortable with ME yet. And until I did that, I wasn't seen as being comfortable with anybody else.

I am going to tell you something I've never before put into writing. I've said it to people face to face, but never via the written word.

A dear, late friend of mine named Lynda v.D. once said to me, "Fred, I don't believe God intends for us to be alone. I think there is someone out there for you. She's just not ready for you, yet. So you just have to keep on being the person you were meant to be, and when she's ready, you'll meet."

Now, keep in mind, I don't recall verbatim many things people have told me. Yes, I remember slogans because they are short and pithy. But the above is a word-for-word recitation of what Lynda told me. When I met WW, I thought for sure her prediction had come true. Sadly, it seems I was mistaken.

But I still think Lynda was right. I think my (and perhaps yours, too) experience has just been part of the "journey" we are on to become the people we are supposed to be. I don't have any idea when "that person" will come into our lives, but I'm confident they will.

We are too good to be alone. Have faith. And keep becoming the person you were meant to be.

Thank you for your great post Fred. It makes sense what you are saying. I have always been insecure and afraid. I still am, but making progress. Once I feel good with me, then I will attract people who feel good with themselves.
blessings

Yes he is doing all those things but we've now learned what is on the inside of someone who would do that and I've decided for myself that I want nothing to do with someone like that. I think you have too. It seems like fun but I think they are very broken and empty on the inside and that life will come to nothing but more emptiness. I want more. I want a deep connection with someone of good character and integrity. I'm capable of having that now and hopefully someday I will.

About WS:

A number of people here on MB have suggested, in a number of ways, that my WW is "disordered" or somehow lacking all of the fibers that make us loving, loyal, dependable and faithful spouses. Try as I might, I haven't found the "diagnosis" that confirms this.

But I very much agree with your words above. Well said!

Hear, hear!

I think you are right on. There is nothing like being rejected by someone whom you put your trust, love, energy, and self into. That rejection wounds deeply and can cause you to wonder if you will ever be able to be attractive to someone else, or even if you are worthy of someone else. I see relationships here that have broken after 20 - 35 years, that is a large investment in time, and many of us do not have that much time left to reinvest, so we feel apprehensive. We feel insecure because we are not comfortable with the "new" selection process, not knowing even where to go or how to meet people. We can allow that fear to paralyze us into thinking "why should we bother".

I believe that question was answered last week by someone in the course I was taking. She was commenting about what she was going through in her life's phase and she said "and then I realized Holy Smokes I'm not dead yet, I better get going"

There still is hope unless we willingly give that up. And there is more to attraction than just physical looks. It helps with the introduction but does not sustain a relationship. From what I have read from your posts you have plenty of capability to sustain a relationship as you have character.

I am in sort of the same position, my wife has revealed some facts and has admitted to her A's however. What was that letter, Jacobs letter, where he talked about pieces of a puzzle missing, if one doesn't know what they need to know. There are pieces missing and I too feel our R will not be whole and healthy, in the long run.

I've been to many IC's, which didn't focus at all on the A's, but did help me tremendously with some personal issues relating to childhood. We've had 3 MC's and they focused on my wifes feelings and what made her think she had to do the A's...not much about ME and MY feelings on the matter. I have not gone back.

I know living in the past won't accomplish a lot, but why do some therapist focus on the WS feelings more than the BS? Do we not have feelings? That part I don't understand.

Just speculation on my part: I think therapists and counselors don't consider the BS because "they're okay." It's the WS who is having the emotional and mental issues. I've seen the same thing in addiction counselors, who only give a passing mention to the idea that family members and people close to the addict should go to Al-Anon. After all, the addict is the patient, not the "well people."

Reading Dr. Harley's work, he typically spends some time working with the wayward before working with the betrayed spouse. However, he's often characterized this as working to get the "reluctant spouse" willing to do marriage counseling.

IIRC, he says that nearly all of the couples he counsels have one reluctant spouse, and one willing spouse. If both are willing, the couple resolves their own problems and figures out the solution together. If both are reluctant, they don't go to a counselor, and the marriage dissolves. But if one is willing and one is reluctant, those are the ones who end up in counseling.

That's an interesting observation 'Bb'....maybe over simplified, but accurate.

Hi atena! I realize not many folks know me here anymore, but back when my d-day hit (January 2004) I was posting my brains out here.

I was an extremely hurt, angry, devastated BS. I could not wrap my brain around the fact that my H, who I had been with for 26 yrs., could have been such a jerk. Plus there were a lot of what I call double whammies. An A going on while my dad was dying and died, and worse stuff than that. Oh, we stayed together BTW.

I'm going to answer your question from the POV of a BS, someone who has had IC and plenty of MC, and as a therapist myself. First, I don't think any therapist should be saying "should ofs" to their client. Unless you've walked in a BS's shoes it's easy to say "Why didn't you know what was going on?" The idea that someone we love is destroying us can't always be grasped right away while it's occurring.

I fully believe that for many BSs the A is a trauma that results in PTSD, and if the BS has earlier trauma it triggers it all. One treatment for trauma recovery is to talk about what occurred until it loses it's emotional punch. I am in no way saying all BSs need to do this, but I am saying I did. And, in order to heal with my FWS he had to be willing to go to those dark places with me.

I agree that you don't want to get stuck in your anger. I also firmly believe if you don't deal with it that's when you're going to have problems. Affairs are anger inducing. What I loved about MB is that I could get all my anger out here. I also had a great therapist that never tried to push me to a place that I wasn't at. We had an outstanding MC that never told me to move on or get over it. He understood the trauma and respected my pain, yet also was fair and balanced.

I was with a client today who acknowledged that she buried her feelings for years, and now, because she has been getting them out she is aware of her choices to have a different life. If I would have shut her up the first month, and she has a lot of anger, telling her it's time to move past the anger, she'd still be where she was 6 months ago. I do believe in a behavioral approach also, and I definitely don't believe in pushing the past work onto a client. However, when the past is influencing a person's present it is worth taking a look at.

Anyhoo, just another perspective that I hope helps. Remember, you can't get to the other side of grief without going through it.

QFT. It's been extremely useful for me to be able to create a "short story" version of my life during the affair by rehearsing it. At first, I couldn't say it without breaking down in tears or becoming extremely angry. Now, I can recite it with only a little bit of disappointment and unhappiness... I suspect eventually I'll be able to talk about my experience during my wife's affair in much the same way I talk about high school clubs I was a part of but didn't like much.

I found a similar thing happening after I left the LDS church. At first, it was very raw, very emotional, and very difficult to talk about. As I continued to tell the same story over and over, in time the story just became part of my history, like where I went to college. Now it's almost eight years after the fact, and what I considered the most significant event of my life has paled in significance to what's going on right now in recovering from my wife's affair.

What's in the present, right now, is what matters, but learning to distance myself from the past so that it doesn't impair my ability to function in the present is a huge win.