New here, yet confused on what to do...

Separated from wife, OW got pregnant.
Beautiful child, i am not ashamed since wife and I had already filed for divorce.

Its time to sign divorce papers, something makes me deeply sad. Wife wants to get back together, but can;t bear to tell her i fathered child with OW. My OW can see my sadness and is hurt.

Wife and I have problems, but i am not sure if we can sovle them. My dilemna is I want to be good father and stay with child, yet i made a commitment to my wife through marriage which can or can;t be saved, don;t know yet.

Any advice would be great.
<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />

lfcfan...

Stick with us here, weekends can be slow.

It sounds as if you are on the brink of "messing" with quite a few lives here, not just your own...but, then again, you know this I am sure.

What are you seeking by coming here?

Marriage help ? Knowledge that you can be a good father to the child if you so choose to return to your wife?

Be prepared that the knowledge of the child is going to cause great pain for your wife and by being honest with her, there is a real possibility that she may make this decision for you.

Also, in regards to the mother of your child. Were you seeing this woman while in the marriage before seperation?

Please don't mistake my frankness for judgement.. there are many factors to consider, and by being upfront here, you will receive the help you need from people who have lived "this".

Bless you.

Eibrab

Eibrab,
Thanks for your support.
I'm seeking understanding if a marriage has failed, is it best not to look back and stay with the new child and OW, or give the marriage a second chance? I feel guilty of abandoning my wife, but at the same time don;t want to do the same to my child. I have no children with my wife, and we are young (less than 30yrs old).

I was with the OW after being separated, and we had a blessing of a child together. It wasn't planned, but thats the story of this message board...

The divorce was getting ugly at the beginning, and i was fully comitted to moving on happilly with my new woman and child together without looking back.
Now...my wife wants to reconcile, but i can;t bear to tell her of the child. She knows i've been seeing other woman, but wants to work through the mess and stay together. I've been with her for 8 years, married for 3. The marriage was hard from the beginning, no intimacy, no conversation, depression, being taken for granted. I supported her without asking for anything, and one day couldn;t see a light at the end of the tunnel. As soon as we got married, it just disintegrated. With the divorce coming next week, we've been talking and communicating more than we did before the marriage. PArt of me feels emoptionally attacheded to her, but i am not sure if it is guilt and a personal emotional trap of mine about being afraid to let go. We hurt eachother many months ago, yet i still tear up when we speak about the good times and getting back together. I feel like I just left her like a peice of garbage which hurts me, and i've broken a lifelong vow i made infront of everyone and God.

On the other side, i will have a child soon with a woman that is fantastic with me. She is everything I need and an incredible mate. We live together, but have sep apartments right now. I feel so much love for my child, that i don;t want to let her down and always be there for her.

This is hard, but i think i just need to be strong emotionally, as someone is going to get hurt like you said above.

I guess if my marriage was in such a sham, is it worth even going back to "try" to fix things. I donl;t know how much one can change aside from "words and promises".

lfcfan..

Please reread your post. Then, reread it again.

And then, type some more if you wish.

You have no COM(children of the marriage), you did not get along with your W before all of this, and you haven't been upfront with your W during the seperation.

While I am a HUGE fan of saving a marriage, and no expert on the subject..what I do know for certain is that sometimes who we thought was perfect for us at 20 years of age, may not turn out to be the best match at 30, or even 40.

Some people change..some people never do.

IF your GF - and I say GF instead of OW, as I see her as this out of respect for not having seen her break up your marriage - is the person you state..good for you and good to you, and everything your STBXW is not..

Then maybe it is time to move on.

This IS Marriage Builders, but in a way, you have forged ahead with a new marriage of sorts.

I feel badly for both women.

Eibrab

Please help with a bit of confusion...

Is the child born yet as your first post alludes to ? Or are you still waiting for his/her arrival?

Eibrab

lfcfan...

After reading your thread in General, I realize that my advice centered more on the here and now of the facts as you presented them.

I bow to the advice given in general.

Eibrab

Well, you've hooked up with an adulteress who has trapped you with a child. But as you say, she is everything you need, and an incredible mate. Good luck. Your wife deserves someone who can keep their vows.

I agree with Believer.

IF you want to do the work, you can save your marriage (if your wife wants you).

Somehow, tho, from your posts, I don't think you're one to man up to it.

Believe me, I've seen it all and lived through the worst.

If you decide to man up, we will be here...and I'll call TH to help you.

As usual, the choice is yours.

Give your wife a choice for once, tho. She's more than due. Tell her about OC.

You may be projecting and assuming your wife would want you back even with the knowledge of a child with someone else.

She needs to know about your child as soon as possible so that she can regroup and take everything into account, including the fact that you would be paying child support for the next 18 years and that any children you have with her will be affected financially and emotionally with a half sibling being raised elsewhere.

You are also assuming the other woman will allow you to go gracefully and not confront your wife with knowledge of the child you have had/are having together. Not likely to happen. She has a huge stake in the relationship and won't want you to go.

You're afraid to confront her, and you're assuming she'll never know about your child. She'll find out eventually, and if you're the one who tells her, you have a bit more control of its delivery.

lfcfan,

I have some good news for you! You are here with people who can tell you how it is and will be BRUTALY HONEST with you.
Best of all, IT'S FREE!!!!!!!!!!!

Now to be more serious:


I still would not crow about it from the rooftops either!
There is NOTHING wrong with the child, but your actions like mine can be called into question.

Your current wife will be devastated by the news that you have a child with another woman. But I can tell you from experience, it does not mean that she will not want you back. If you are like me, you could be making a huge assumtion that just is not true.

Here another thought to chew on, that naggig feeling you have about your W, here is where I suspect it comes from.

You know you have some responsibility in the breakdown of the M. You may not know exactly what is it is, but it is there, TRUST ME. if you bail now, you are going to have to live with that. Now I don't know all the guilty action both you and your wife have done yet, but I am sure there are things on both sides that are bad. Here are a few examples.

Are we guilty of Selfish Demands?
Are we guilty of Independent Behavior?
Are we guilty of Disrespectful Judgments?

These are the big three that has plagued my M and my W and I are going to keep working on them. This is in addition to me deciding to screw around and knock up another woman. (5 years ago)

If you have no Idea what I am talking about, then I can GUARANTEE YOU that your next relationship with your GF will crash and burn as well.

As far as your child, you have every right to be concerned with it's (I don't know if it is a her or him) welfare. Those things can be worked out and I can tell you how.

If you are truly looking for answers about which way to go, then you have got some reading to do.

Here is a start: Love Busters, then His/Her Needs. Some may say Surviving the Affair, but I'm 50/50 on this one.

I would encourage you to tell more of your story here, most here will be biased to fix your M, some will not. Honestly, I want to hear more before I would way in on it.

TH

Honestly, if you are asking what to do, then I'd say put the d on hold, and get your footing.

But you need to tell your wife about the baby.

I can vouch for this much, nothing your wife decides to do will be as bad as YOU'VE blown it up in your head.

Ask TH. Told him the SAME thing.

lfc~

Gobs of issues here, but hands down, no doubt about it, if there's to be any chance at all with your W, you need to tell her about the OC. Even if you/she didn't want to attempt a reconciliation, you owe it to her to be honest.

I'd start there.

Amen!

Thanks for everyones feedback.

I have put a stop to my divorce, literally at the eleventh hour. I decided not to bail, not to do something stupid without a clear head and knowing all the options and what i want.

Looking back, i do see myselfishness and being unsupportive to my wife to work through our issues. I focussed on the issues as a reason to get out, blaming her family for added tension. I opted for the easy way out, and now feel ashamed it took the road which brought me here. My next step is to come clean with my wife, and see where that takes us.

Please help me understand the "fog", why this has happened and now i look back and think what-the-******. Wife and i had big intimacy issues, barely touching eachother during 3yr marriage. I asked about why, and not for my lack of trying, and she could not explain. My tension built, found another woman, and the rest goes from there. I would be worried that if i return to wife and sex life didn;t even look improved, i'd be running to another woman as a cycle of abuse.

My relationship with OW is on the rocks, and you guys hit it on the nail. My head doesn;t know what it wants and i need to think hard and long about this one. I donl;t know if its her preg hormonses or what, she smells the blood now and is clinging on for dear life. I see myself treating her in the same way i treated my wife before we separated: ignoring, uncooperative, unsupportive, selfish, with little communication. Perhaps unconsciously i am just hoping that it will all go away.

How do you make a relationship with child work after this?
I want to be there for her always, don;t want to miss a minute of those precious moments. Thats the tough part for me.

I have booked my professional counceling in 2w time to lay this out.

I'm shouting to TH to come over here.

He mods on another board that Faithy and I mod on....it's at the bottom of Faith's sig line.

Start reading here. It will explain the fog that you are trying to find your way out of.

Your relationship with OW was ALWAYS on the rocks, you just never knew it. You cannot build a home (relationship) on a foundation of sand (lies).

As for the relationship with a child - the answer is you just do.

It's more work than having the baby 24/7 - but you OPTED for this when you and the OW made her. Whether you realized it at the time or thought it through or not, this was always a potential outcome from your choices.

There is no turning back from that, there is just learning from it and making better decisions from here on out.

My husband and I have custody of his OCs (yes two from the same - ahem - woman). You do what YOU have to do for the well being of your marriage and your child.

Period.

If your wife does not want to work it out with you, so be it...but it's up to you to fix yourself so you never make such poor choices again.

- Kimmy

lfcfan..

With a clearer picture that the OW was truly in the scene at the demise of the marriage, I commend you on trying to sort things out.

I wish you luck.

Eibrab

IFC,

OK, so you want to try with your W. That's a good start.

Now let's find out if she wants to work it out with you. To begin a reconciliation, you both need to be positive about it.
Or as Dr H would say, "Enthusiastic". If not, then don't bother, you will just cause her more pain if you go into this in a halfa$$ kinda way.

Once you dump the bomb on her, you need to stay put with her. She is going to have about a million questions. Answer them HONESTLY. Tell her EVERYTHING, and I mean EVERYTHING. DO NOT "PROTECT" HER. She will know if you are holding back and think you are a liar for it.

Next, if she has decided to stay with you and work it out, you need to cut all ties with OW. This does not mean ties with your Girl. But the idea that your going to be a full time dad is just not going to happen. I wished to god I could have my girl more, but it just does not work out that way.

Again, you need to believe this VERY FAST, OW is going to be VERY hurt, then MAD that you decided to stay with your W. Depending on OW, some will just go away (like mine), or they may stock you and your W. In any case, count on paying child support and having limited time with your child IF your W is agreeable. I had a lot of problem getting Policy of Joint Agreement in my head. I'll talk more about this later.

Next, GET DNA for little girl. You need this for court, and while your at it, GET A LAWYER. You are very much going to need that. If you and your W can agree that you two will have contact, then put your guilt over OW in the trash can and protect your visitation rights. Most OW feel that if you are not with them, then you have no right to the children. Think that's not fair, OW's DON"T CARE!!!!!!!!!

Now back to your W. Just be there for her. Hold hands, and if you mean it, tell her you love her. Be there to hold her for hours on end. Just be together. Don't get your self all workup just yet if she say NO CONTACT with the child. RIGHT NOW, just be there for her. You have time to deal with child issues. In fact, you have a lifetime, so get it strait with the W first.

Last but not least, get the books I posted about. If nothing else, they will help you in ANY relationship you may be in.

TH

Ah.

The grasshopper has become the sensei.

Ah so.

Bowing to TH.

TH - I've seen so much growth in you. It's a long way from where you were 14 months ago.

Thank you for stepping into the process of growth. I know we weren't easy on you. You have earned the respect of a seasoned veteran here!

TH,

How did you get through the fog, specifically on fathering a child with the OW? In my case, my W and I have no children in our 3-yr marriage. I feel still trapped in a fog of confusion, more so to the well being of my-to-be child. I just feel depressed knowing that i will not have the relationship with my daughter that i envisioned, before she is even born.

How do you explain to the children later about the OW/W situation, without harming them?

I addressed situation with OW that relationship built on sand, not foundation. ****** breaks loose now...she is trying to cling like velcro. I will always be there for daughters needs though.

Plan to "man-up" this weekend to wife about everything. Head is clearing somewhat now, and I am more understanding of my fault for getting lost in fog. Lots of reading too this weekend!

First personal counseling appointment on Tuesday.

IFC,


It just takes time. About 6-8 weeks of NO CONTACT to start feeling better. There really is no other way to do it. Don't be friends with her, don't call to see how she is doing, try as hard as you can not to sit in your office and wonder about what she is doing, who she is seeing, what she is thinking......... That friendship is GONE.

With your child, you have a different set of rules. Others will disagree with me, but I look at it as if I am a divorced father. Are all divorced father bad parents????
I don't think so. I call my girl at least 2-3 time a week.
The conversation at her age don't last very long, but I want her to know that I do care about her. I am also in the process to get a better legal visitation plan in place.

From your earlier posts, you had serious doughts as to weather you and GF could make it. LISTEN to that!!!!!! Not so much just to save your M, but to save yourself. What would you tell your son if he knock some woman up and didn't love her. Would you tell him to go marry her??????? I think not.

IMHO you do have an obligation to you child, others can disagree, but that is where I come down on it. It does not mean you have an obligation to GF. She willingly jumped into bed with you, she gets at least 50% of the blame for getting knocked up. She knew you were just separated and she darn well knew you were not married to her (GF).

So as I said before, put your guilt over GF in the trash can, because now that your leaning to be back with the W, you are going to have a fight on your hands over visitation.
Again, this is assuming that your W will be agreeable.

The only plus I can see is at least you were not banging both at the same time, it's not much but at least you got that.



I don't think their is a way. You just let your child know that you love them very much.


That conversation did not go well for me either.


Well, just be honest about your feelings for her and with yourself. I will stress again, don't do this halfa$$ed. Not all M work out. Just because you are leaving OW, does not default you to going back to W. If you feel you have a real shot at truly loving your W, then please, do as is suggested. If this is just about you not wanting to be alone, then leave your W alone and proceed with the D.


Counselor's are a funny bunch. The two that we seen told us to divorce. Read the books I posted about starting with Love Busters. Then use the counselor to bounce ideas off of.

TH

So?

We're on pins here.

Spoken out, not much conversation after that.
We have talked more this week, see what the weekend brings.

Conseling was odd...confused me more in terms of what i wanted. Will give it another shot in 2w, but felt being steered away from resolving marriage.

C is not about "steering" - the c is not the one at the helm.

C should be about figuring it out for yourself...find YOUR path.

I know that feeling :-)

If you do your homework as suggested, you will find that the AVERAGE M Counselor does not know there Butt from a hole in the ground when it comes to these situations.

They often default to a "practical solution", such as "you don't have children with your W, yada, yada, yada........."

I can give you real life examples of a couple who do not have children of there own where they are still married and are happy.


What you are seeking is that feeling of "romantic love". We all are, and the question swirling around your head is can you ever get that feeling with your W? Can you be happy with her?

With skill, a plan, and a determination to try, the odds are VERY HIGH.

You can try the "open market", but then your dealing with a lot of UNKNOWNS. With your W, it is PROVEN you can be in love with her. IT CAN HAPPEN AGAIN!

You both need to work at it, but like me, it is good and encouraging to your W to take the lead.

TH

You sounded like the C there!
I don't think he had any idea of what i have bottled in my mind. At least it was a good sounding board to blow it all out in the open. He was very practical and i thought steering to a "quick fix".
I spoke of how i regret being in the situaiton i am today, the fog issues, and how i know my W is a great woman not that i look back and discussed her. Biggest discussion was a reflection from me of how i screwed things up and didn;t care when i was doing it, but now i find myself wearing my wedding band...i stopped wearing my wedding band ~Jan'06 out of personal frustration, and make an effort now to slip it back on every morning.
You are right on the romantic love side, trying to discover if its still there or can be there again. This will take time and patience though.

I have a different C to see next week. My W went to him before, but she stopped going when we separated.

W and i didn't speak much this weekend. But at least we are communicating still. We plan to go out tuesday to honor lost friends at the memorials.

From your earlier posts, you had serious doughts as to weather you and GF could make it. LISTEN to that!!!!!! Not so much just to save your M, but to save yourself. What would you tell your son if he knock some woman up and didn't love her. Would you tell him to go marry her??????? I think not.


I tell my son that if he "knocks some women up" then he has to pay the consquences for it,and if it means marrying her then he should, I can't think of a better reason then to marry someone then for a child, isn't that child worth that? I would never want a child of mine to think that he wasen't worth it. You just sounded so cold to the child and the GF. this is a girl that he met when the divorce was already happening, he states that she is the one for him and now he is talking like she is just clinging to him because she sense's that he is leaving her,,,how sad for her and with her being pregnant, and sad for that baby because this person can't make up his mind.

I do not agree with that at all. So, you would have preferred my FWH leave me and three kids behind for the sake of one child, just because he made a stupid mistake? He made a committment to his wife and that should be honored above all else. An OC should never be put before the commitment you made to your spouse whether you have children or not. The pregnant OW should have known better than to get mixed up with a married man seperated or not. Married is still married. I find it hard to believe you have this view point as a BS. How would you have felt if you were the wife? It is up to the BS to end this marriage, not him. He has no right to no matter what else is going on. It is HER choice as to whether he stays or goes. I don't feel sorry for the OW at all, she got herself into this situation by having an adulterous affair that resulted in a b1st1rd child. She made her bed, now sleep in it. And she still has h&ll to look forward to.

No child deserves to come from a home where the parents married just for the kid. They will eventually resent eachother and the child for being stuck. Yeah, that sounds like a great thing to do.

first of all he was talking in general that if his son "knocked up a women" that is more of what I am commenting on, also this person was already near the end of the D, thats how I took it, now the wife makes a notion that she wants him back and he is leading them both on, thats how I get it. and they don't have 3 kids, they have no kids.

But the divorce was not final, so therefore they are still married. Sometimes it takes the final days of a divorce to stop someone's heart. Reality may have set in and she panicked. He is in a very tough situation. He is living with the OW and unless the BS invites him home, where can he go right now? I do agree with you that he seems to be hanging on to them both in case one of them leaves. Kinda a back up women. And yes, that is infuriating. He does need to make a firm decision and move out on his own ASAP. However, I still don't feel the OC should have any bearing on his decision to try again with his wife. I know it sounds harsh, but the OC should be an after thought compared to his marriage.

yeah, your right on that, the marriage should of come first, I guess if it had there wouldn't of been a D in the first place, I just feel bad for the baby and the GF that he is now lying to cause she obviously dosen't know what he is thinking. I was born out of wedlock in, well along time ago, and raised by an Aunt and Uncle that were awful, thats neither here nor there but I always wanted a "real" mom and dad, people who have that take it for granted, so I guess its just more of a personal issue for me, not meant to hurt anyone else, truly. yes the marriage should come first and he jumped into something he shouldn't of and now who suffers? in the end, the innocent baby, its just a sad situation all the way around and its horrible for a BS to go through that, that is the first thing I asked my WS.

Peace DF.

Sometimes "real" families don't fit the normal mold.

Mine doesn't, but that doesn't make the children less mine or my responsibility.

ETA: ((((((((((((DF))))))))))) It takes a village to raise a child. I'm so sorry your villagers weren't worthy of you!

Thanks DD, I appreciate that, I am ok, turned out fairly normal, oops, no I didn't. look at my marriage LOL
gotta have humor

DF,

It isn't you that wasn't normal about your marriage. Your WH screwed up, not you. Yes you have some accountability in the steps that created the fall of the marriage, but in no way did the A have anything to do with you. The fact that you are on this website and trying to make a difference in your marriage, shows just what kind of character you have. Obviously you excelled dispite your upbringing. And that takes strength that no amount of parenting or lack thereof can give you. And unfortunatly our marrieges are becoming the norm. Sad isn't it? It IS very sad that these children have to pay for their parents selfish and stupid mistakes, but that is the chance a woman takes when she brings a child into these types of situations. Bottom line, leave married men alone and give yourself and your children the best chance possible at a happy life. My family was the opposite of yours, but my husband comes from a very broken and disturbed background. My parents are still married and neither has ever been unfaithful. We went to church every Sunday and had the picture perfect life. But in the end I am still on this website talking to you. My strength may come from a different source than yours, but we are still using it the same way.

Lostandcertain,
Nice post, I agree, and it is sad.

he needs to be honest with both of them.

honesty is an absolute must.

IFC,


Just spend time together.

DoingFine,

I get EXACTLY where his daughter is at. I have a daughter of my own I wish I could be with very much. If I had the choice, I would take my daughter in in a second, but that just is not the case or an option right now.

I am sure he wants to be there for his daughter just like I do for mine.

TH