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Posted By: kstockett I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 12:48 PM
Long story short: I had an affair. I confessed, exposed, AP moved away. Two years later I caught my husband in two affairs within 3 months. The second time I caught him on top of her in the park. This was 2.5 years ago.

Both OW still live/work here. I do not worry about him starting up with them. I DO worry about him not telling me if he sees them because I want honesty in our marriage. My BIG THING is that I trigger horribly, traumatically, when I see them - especially the one I caught him with, so I WANT TO MOVE!
But he doesn't want to. He has suffered enough with my affair and his career is important to him. It's one made of contacts and we've been here 21 years so he would lose a lot.
I feel unloved. He'll do almost anything for me but this.
I feel like I'm still being punished for what I did. He feels I want to punish him for wanting to move.

How do we get on the same team? I cannot accept this because it feels like I'm compromising myself to stay in the marriage. Am I wrong on this?
Posted By: BrainHurts Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 01:08 PM
Originally Posted By: kstockett
Long story short: I had an affair. I confessed, exposed, AP moved away. Two years later I caught my husband in two affairs within 3 months. The second time I caught him on top of her in the park. This was 2.5 years ago.

Both OW still live/work here. I do not worry about him starting up with them. I DO worry about him not telling me if he sees them because I want honesty in our marriage. My BIG THING is that I trigger horribly, traumatically, when I see them - especially the one I caught him with, so I WANT TO MOVE!
But he doesn't want to. He has suffered enough with my affair and his career is important to him. It's one made of contacts and we've been here 21 years so he would lose a lot.
I feel unloved. He'll do almost anything for me but this.
I feel like I'm still being punished for what I did. He feels I want to punish him for wanting to move.

How do we get on the same team? I cannot accept this because it feels like I'm compromising myself to stay in the marriage. Am I wrong on this?

Dr. Harley recommends moving after an affair alot. Especially in your situation where there have been 3 affairs between the 2 of you. I'm sure you'll remained triggered. Why wouldn't he want to protect you from this?

What about writing Dr. Harley and have him talk with your H?
Posted By: BrainHurts Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 01:11 PM
I can't remember which clip it is, but Dr. Harley recommends moving after an affair.
Dr. Harley on How to Deal with Triggers
Posted By: kstockett Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 01:14 PM
my husband is currently reading Love Busters. He asked me to stop with the Angry Outbursts. I can't wait until he gets to the Just Compensation part and how often Harley suggests moving...
Posted By: BrainHurts Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 01:16 PM
Originally Posted By: kstockett
my husband is currently reading Love Busters. He asked me to stop with the Angry Outbursts. I can't wait until he gets to the Just Compensation part and how often Harley suggests moving...

Will he listen to radio clips?

There are some in here. What is Just Compensation
Posted By: BrainHurts Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 01:17 PM
Originally Posted By: kstockett
my husband is currently reading Love Busters. He asked me to stop with the Angry Outbursts. I can't wait until he gets to the Just Compensation part and how often Harley suggests moving...

What are you doing about your AOs? Have you listened to these? Anger Management 101
Posted By: kstockett Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 01:34 PM
just compensation is something that won't hurt you. A job loss would hurt him, in his opinion.
Posted By: BrainHurts Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 01:38 PM
Originally Posted By: kstockett
just compensation is something that won't hurt you. A job loss would hurt him, in his opinion.

But it hurts you, his wife, seeing his OW around and triggering all the time.

Has he even looked for another job?
Posted By: kstockett Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 01:40 PM
no.
his just compensation is he stayed after my affair. He's done compensating.
Posted By: kstockett Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 02:08 PM
maybe I just need to heal, get over my insecurity, and think of my marriage as more important than these occasionall triggers though.
Posted By: SusieQ Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 02:13 PM
Does your H still work with one of the OW? I seem to recall something about that...
Posted By: kstockett Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 02:17 PM
He does not. He does work about 100 yards away. I'm really not feeling anything is going on and that he is in the marriage with two feet.
Posted By: BrainHurts Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 02:21 PM
Originally Posted By: kstockett
He does not. He does work about 100 yards away. I'm really not feeling anything is going on and that he is in the marriage with two feet.

100 yards away from the OW?
Posted By: kstockett Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 02:22 PM
yes.
Posted By: BrainHurts Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 02:25 PM
Originally Posted By: kstockett
yes.

Well no wonder your triggered. He still works with the OW and everyday he goes to work the affair is on. Was this exposed to their jobs?

He needs to not only quit that job. You need to move.
Posted By: kstockett Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 02:30 PM
he does NOT work with the OW. HE works near her office
Posted By: unwritten Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 03:15 PM
Did you expose his A's?

What type of due diligence have you done or are you doing to know that these were the only 2 A's, or that these A's have not continued or there have been no further A's since? (ie. polygraph, transparency to all phone and internet use, spyware, etc)

What type of EP's did you put into place after both your affairs?
Posted By: unwritten Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 03:17 PM
Originally Posted By: kstockett
maybe I just need to heal, get over my insecurity, and think of my marriage as more important than these occasionall triggers though.


You do need to heal. You will NOT do this when you run into the OW's sporadically, or know that your H can run into them any day of the week.

It is not about insecurity, it is about you perceiving a threat to your marriage, because there is one.

You need to rephrase that question at the end, is your marriage more important than your H's job?
Posted By: kstockett Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 03:18 PM
Originally Posted By: unwritten
Did you expose his A's? YES, FAR AND WIDE

What type of due diligence have you done or are you doing to know that these were the only 2 A's, or that these A's have not continued or there have been no further A's since? (ie. polygraph, transparency to all phone and internet use, spyware, etc)
ALL OF THIS - AND I HIRED A PI.

What type of EP's did you put into place after both your affairs?


HE WILL NOT GO WHERE THEY ARE AT, STAY WHERE THEY ARE AT, IF AT A BUSINESS FUNCTION. NO BEING ALONE WITH OPPOSITE SEX, ETC.
Posted By: BrainHurts Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 03:20 PM
Who all did you expose to?
Posted By: kstockett Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 03:27 PM
he will resent it if we move... because he feel he has sacrificed enough.
do you see the dilemma. The choice is in my hands.
Posted By: MelodyLane Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 03:27 PM
Originally Posted By: kstockett
he does NOT work with the OW. HE works near her office


KS, the only way you are going to recover is to move. Dr Harley would tell you to pick up and just move in the hopes that he will follow you. Your marriage will never recover living there. Staying in this position will just wear you down emotionally and physically.
Posted By: BrainHurts Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 03:29 PM
Originally Posted By: kstockett
he will resent it if we move... because he feel he has sacrificed enough.
do you see the dilemma. The choice is in my hands.

How will your marriage survive if he can see the OW everyday? So you're supposed to suffer from his affairs because you had an affair first? Is that correct?

You never answered my question about contacting Dr. Harley and having him talk with your WH.
Posted By: kstockett Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 03:30 PM
he does not see the OW everyday. He says he hasn't seen them in a year.
Posted By: kstockett Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 03:31 PM
Originally Posted By: MelodyLane
Originally Posted By: kstockett
he does NOT work with the OW. HE works near her office
Staying in this position will just wear you down emotionally and physically.


this is where I am at now. Why do therapists NOT understand this!
Posted By: MelodyLane Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 03:34 PM
Originally Posted By: kstockett
he does not see the OW everyday. He says he hasn't seen them in a year.



First off, he is right there, so every time he goes there he is triggered. You know you are triggered? Well, he is too!

And secondly, when he does see her, you are the last person he would tell. How would you know he doesn't see her? If I am a "recovering" alcoholic who sits in the bar every day, do you think I am going to tell anyone when I drink? Hell no. And if I sit in the bar all day, it is just a matter of time before I drink because the booze will stay top of mind and the opportunity is right there within reach!
Posted By: MelodyLane Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 03:34 PM
Originally Posted By: kstockett
Originally Posted By: MelodyLane
Originally Posted By: kstockett
he does NOT work with the OW. HE works near her office
Staying in this position will just wear you down emotionally and physically.


this is where I am at now. Why do therapists NOT understand this!


VERY FEW understand the dynamics of infidelity. It is a foreign world to them.
Posted By: kstockett Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 03:39 PM
Originally Posted By: MelodyLane
Originally Posted By: kstockett
he does not see the OW everyday. He says he hasn't seen them in a year.





And secondly, when he does see her, you are the last person he would tell. How would you know he doesn't see her?


all I have to go on is his integrity. I told him everything and am honest. If he has to trick me into staying married to him well, that's really pathetic.
Posted By: MelodyLane Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 03:51 PM
Originally Posted By: kstockett
[

all I have to go on is his integrity.


That is my point. "Integrity" is non existent when there is an affair. Would you trust me, a chronic alcoholic, [albeit sober 29 years] to go sit in the bar all day? I wouldn't even trust me!
Posted By: BlindSighted2013 Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 03:54 PM
Originally Posted By: kstockett

all I have to go on is his integrity. I told him everything and am honest. If he has to trick me into staying married to him well, that's really pathetic.
His integrity has nothing to do with the strength of addictions. Many good people with integrity still get addicted to pain meds, or to alcohol. That doesn't make them bad people…it makes them addicted people. Do we call them pathetic?

Affairs are addictions. Your husband may not be touching the merchandise, but rest assured that he feels a nice (addicted) high whenever he sees the OW and she looks longingly at him.
Posted By: garak77 Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 06:02 PM
Originally Posted By: kstockett
maybe I just need to heal, get over my insecurity, and think of my marriage as more important than these occasionall triggers though.


No marriage is healthy while there is an affair.
You need to get him out of the affair. Expose and plan a
There are some great people on MB who can help you greatly.
To the best of my knowledge my wife's affair had ended 100 percent.
I could never have it any other way.
Me knowing my wife is having sex with another man would kill me if I knew it was going on while it was going on.
My R seems to be gong well because I followed the advice given here.
Posted By: kstockett Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 06:07 PM
what affair? He's been out of it for 2.5 years. As I said, I exposed far and wide.
I just need help deciding if what he is offering is enough for me. I've been in limbo for 2.5 years because it obviously hasn't been and I need to make a decision for my own emotional health and well-being.
If I leave it's not going to be with him. He has known about my struggle for two years and has chosen not to do anything. So I will chose not to be with someone who doens't make their marriage their first priority.
He has made his decision. It's now time for my countermove. It's like a freaking chess game and there is no room for that in a marriage.
Posted By: garak77 Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 06:12 PM
Sorry,
I didn't catch that in your previous post.
I am always for saving a salvageable marriage.
I this k you need to put your neath before your H in this case, because your husbands choices caused this.
Posted By: unwritten Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 06:37 PM
Originally Posted By: kstockett
he will resent it if we move... because he feel he has sacrificed enough.
do you see the dilemma. The choice is in my hands.


The choice IS in your hands. Everyone has a choice in their hands when it comes to infidelity. Your BS had a choice of whether to recover with you after your A, and under what conditions. And you also have a choice of whether to recover with him after his A's, and under what conditions.

Just because you have tolerated this unacceptable condition for 2+ years, does not mean you have to continue to accept it now if you are not enthusiastic about it. And since true recovery cannot happen under these circumstances, you should not accept it unless you want this infidelity to haunt you for years to come.
Posted By: unwritten Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 06:40 PM
Originally Posted By: unwritten

What type of EP's did you put into place after both your affairs?


I do not think you responded to this. What EP's have you put in place, for both of you? Obviously a highly needed one would be to move away from the AP's and have no further contact with them. (And yes, this DOES apply to just seeing them across the parking lot once in a blue moon) EP's are the only way to make you feel safe again, and make another affair next to impossible.
Posted By: kstockett Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 06:51 PM
page 2 - not quoted very well....

HE WILL NOT GO WHERE THEY ARE AT, STAY WHERE THEY ARE AT, IF AT A BUSINESS FUNCTION. NO BEING ALONE WITH OPPOSITE SEX, ETC.

we have each other's passwords, I've checked on occasion, full transparency from both sides.
Posted By: MelodyLane Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 06:55 PM
Originally Posted By: kstockett
what affair? He's been out of it for 2.5 years. As I said, I exposed far and wide.
I just need help deciding if what he is offering is enough for me. I've been in limbo for 2.5 years because it obviously hasn't been and I need to make a decision for my own emotional health and well-being.
If I leave it's not going to be with him. He has known about my struggle for two years and has chosen not to do anything. So I will chose not to be with someone who doens't make their marriage their first priority.
He has made his decision. It's now time for my countermove. It's like a freaking chess game and there is no room for that in a marriage.


Moving away is a win/win for you. You will win either way. If he follow you that is a win beucase you can get him away from the OW and the triggers and truly recover your marriage. Moving is amazingly therapeutic!

And if he doesn't follow you, you will end up completely detached from and in a better position to walk away and divorce him. That is a WIN if he will not get on board to sea your marriage.

What is a LOSS is to stay there in limbo and allow yourself to get worn down more and more as time goes on. That is a losing proposition.
Posted By: MelodyLane Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 06:57 PM
Originally Posted By: kstockett
page 2 - not quoted very well....

HE WILL NOT GO WHERE THEY ARE AT, STAY WHERE THEY ARE AT, IF AT A BUSINESS FUNCTION. NO BEING ALONE WITH OPPOSITE SEX, ETC.


All empty, meaningless talk. If he were having an affair you would be the last person in the world he would tell. He could be seeing her every day and you would never know it.

He works 100 feet away from the OW? You must be kidding me? Who would put up with that?
Posted By: MelodyLane Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 06:59 PM
Originally Posted By: kstockett
p
HE WILL NOT GO WHERE THEY ARE AT, STAY WHERE THEY ARE AT, IF AT A BUSINESS FUNCTION. NO BEING ALONE WITH OPPOSITE SEX, ETC.


That is NOT an extraordinary precaution. That is like saying :

"I will tell you when I go drunk driving!"
Posted By: BrainHurts Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 07:13 PM
Dr. Harley says all the conditions that allowed the affair must be changed. His OW being 100 yards away was one of the conditions, correct?
Posted By: kstockett Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 07:27 PM
so was him having email and a phone.
Posted By: mrEureka Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 07:39 PM
Originally Posted By: kstockett
so was him having email and a phone.
Do you really think that having email and a phone are threats on a par with being 100 feet from the OW? Who are you kidding?

Monitored access to email and phones ARE typical EPs, so your comparison doesn't even work. Your marriage would be better off with no email, no phones, and being no closer than 500 miles from the OW. If having a phone justifies the situation you are condoning, then you both would be better off without one.
Posted By: MelodyLane Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 07:46 PM
I can see I am wasting my valuable time here.
Posted By: kstockett Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 07:46 PM
i just don't worry about this.
I worry about me triggering and if it's worth it to stay....

He either gets it or he doesn't. He does it again and I'm out. he knows I would hire a PI if I ever need to.
Posted By: BlindSighted2013 Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 07:58 PM
Originally Posted By: kstockett
what affair? He's been out of it for 2.5 years.
I guess that you have the right to think that your H is out of the A.

His enjoying the opportunity to take a hit of that crack pipe (see the OW from across the way) every so often will NEVER allow your marriage to heal. If he is getting any thrill from it (which of course he is), then the A is still ON (even if not physical).

While he still sees her, his choices are going to be selfish, so of course he would not wish to move away. As opposed to being out of the fog and back in love…where his choices will be those of extraordinary care.

Even if he knows about your struggle for two years….he is NOT going to do anything to change it while you are enabling him to continue to SEE this person! It is called cake eating, and every WS does it.
Posted By: BlindSighted2013 Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 07:59 PM
Originally Posted By: kstockett
i just don't worry about this.
I worry about me triggering and if it's worth it to stay....

He either gets it or he doesn't. He does it again and I'm out. he knows I would hire a PI if I ever need to.

So are you saying that as long as the A doesn't return to physical, you are fine with it?
Posted By: Gamma Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 08:19 PM
kstockett,

Did you or your H ever take a polygraph.

You trickle truthed your H which may have lead to his giving up on trusting you.

Was the OM exposed to the same level as your WH?

God Bless
Gamma
Posted By: kstockett Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 08:48 PM
Gamma - no. Although I have told him everything.
He has given up his trust on me? I told him some pretty uncomfortable things. 6 months before he had his affair I was raped. I had to tell him that as well. I almost committed suicide over it. It took him a year before he stopped blaming me. He called it my 2nd affair. It has been very difficult but he doens't do that now.

OM - yes, to job, wife, family... same as I exposed.

Also, hubby said it would be 50/50 on whether or not he would kill either man if he saw them. I tried to point out the double standard. And then I asked how would he feel about seeing them if he "caught me in the act?" He said it would be very hard. Ya think???
Posted By: BrainHurts Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 08:56 PM
Originally Posted By: kstockett
Gamma - no. Although I have told him everything.
He has given up his trust on me? I told him some pretty uncomfortable things. 6 months before he had his affair I was raped. I had to tell him that as well. I almost committed suicide over it. It took him a year before he stopped blaming me. He called it my 2nd affair. It has been very difficult but he doens't do that now.

OM - yes, to job, wife, family... same as I exposed.

Also, hubby said it would be 50/50 on whether or not he would kill either man if he saw them. I tried to point out the double standard. And then I asked how would he feel about seeing them if he "caught me in the act?" He said it would be very hard. Ya think???

Your H calls you being raped an affair? Why is that?
Posted By: unwritten Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 09:32 PM
I didn't see any history about your H's second A, just the first one with the OW you are referencing here. Is there a second OW? Or did he resume contact with the first OW after you found out?

If there is a second OW, is she also in your area?
Posted By: kstockett Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 10:01 PM
yes, on April 18, 2012 I caught him again. I knew something wasn't right and I hired a PI. And I put a VAR in his car. I said to myself if he's clean I'll never spy again. The PI calls me and tells me he's in a park. I go over and he's on top of a woman in her car. I pull him off of her and its' a different woman. This is so painful to write about.
I said i'd file for divorce be3cause of obviously, if he is in another affair 3 months later he doens't want to be married to me. He begged me not to, gave me his phone, I'm the administrator or everything, is totally transparent, etc.
And we've tried to recover ever since. It's been so hard.
Both women in the area.
Posted By: kstockett Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 10:02 PM
because I didn't scream or fight him off.
Posted By: SusieQ Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 10:06 PM
k,
Not sure what to tell you. You seemed to do things based off your feelings/opinions vs following Dr Harley's plan of recovery. You've been here for four years and haven't implemented very much...and your marriage is no better off than when you arrived here, it's worse.

You just mentioned at one point saying to yourself that you will not spy ever again if he's "clean". Huh?? Accountability is good for everybody. Especially someone who has strayed. It helps the BS feel better when they don't find anything, trust starts to be rebuilt. It's win/win.

Why don't you set aside your own ideas of how to fix your M and follow MB.
Posted By: SusieQ Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 10:17 PM
Originally Posted By: kstockett

He either gets it or he doesn't. He does it again and I'm out.


Actually you are the one who doesn't get the purpose of EPs. It's to take risk out of the way and not trust your H to rely on willpower when willpower has failed him TWICE.

I see that we warned you that your H was still foggy and told you he was still wayward, right after you exposed and ended affair #1. We warned you that it was likely as a result of being in close proximity to OW1. Some of the things you have mentioned about your H make it seem like he is still foggy/wayward.

Let us know if you want help implementing MB.
Posted By: Gamma Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 10:27 PM
kstockett,

because I didn't scream or fight him off.
.
Sorry to hear about that.

Did you ever report the rape to the police or do you know who the rapist is?

It could also be that your H felt that it was just another lie, did you offer to take a polygraph.

God Bless
Gamma
Posted By: kstockett Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 10:43 PM
Gamma, yes, we contacted them twice and considered filing a civil suit. and yes, hubby contacted him and said he'd kill him if he ever came near me again.

I have offered. Hubby doesn't consider it a lie. But wishes I would have protected myself more.

Does this have a lot to do with our recovery; His trust in me? I have offered repeatedly to take a polygraph for anything.
Posted By: BrainHurts Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 10:58 PM
What about contacting D. Harley?

Email your questions to Joyce Harley at mbradio@marriagebuilders.com. When your email question is chosen to be answered on the radio show, you will be notified by email directing you to listen to the rebroadcast. If you would like to consider being a caller, include your telephone number. You will be called by us to explain the procedure to you. Every caller will receive a complementary book by Dr. Harley that addresses their question.
Posted By: kstockett Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 11:02 PM
I'm all for contacting them. I'm guessing I get one question. what do you think is the most important one?
Posted By: BrainHurts Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 11:17 PM
Originally Posted By: kstockett
I'm all for contacting them. I'm guessing I get one question. what do you think is the most important one?

Can you be a caller? Will your WH join you?
Posted By: Gamma Re: I need to make a choice - 08/18/14 11:57 PM
kstockett,

You wrote Gamma, yes, we contacted them twice and considered filing a civil suit. and yes, hubby contacted him and said he'd kill him if he ever came near me again.

If some guy raped you why is he not in jail? Isn't this a police matter?

God Bless
Gamma
Posted By: nmwb77 Re: I need to make a choice - 08/19/14 12:07 AM
Originally Posted By: kstockett
I'm all for contacting them. I'm guessing I get one question. what do you think is the most important one?


Actually, you get several questions. Give all your details in the email and include what questions you'd like to ask on the show.
Posted By: kstockett Re: I need to make a choice - 08/19/14 12:50 AM
Gamma- lack of evidence. Believe me, we tried.
I'm going to email in...
Posted By: Gamma Re: I need to make a choice - 08/19/14 01:10 AM
kstockett,

Does the rapist still live within 50 miles of your house? If so your H must be triggered by this on a daily if not hourly basis. This is possibly an even more compelling reason to move than the two OW!

God Bless
Gamma
Posted By: kstockett Re: I need to make a choice - 08/19/14 01:35 AM
No, he lives 8 hours away in a different state..
And really? I'm the one who was raped, although hubby feels it terribly too I know.
Posted By: Jedi_Knight Re: I need to make a choice - 08/19/14 02:09 AM
Originally Posted By: kstockett
i just don't worry about this.
I worry about me triggering and if it's worth it to stay....

He either gets it or he doesn't. He does it again and I'm out. he knows I would hire a PI if I ever need to.


This is a typical example of why Dr. Harley encourages couples recovering from affairs to move out of state
Posted By: BrainHurts Re: I need to make a choice - 08/19/14 02:33 AM
Originally Posted By: kstockett

I'm going to email in...


Let us know when you hear back. Will your WH talk with Dr. Harley?
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