Hi all,
I am determined to endure this till June (this is Atena, aka Genoveffa - former thread: H wants to separate in one year)
H has not turned around and is back into independed behavior. We have financial issues and cannot afford to pay rent elsewhere till June also our son will be out then as he graduates from HS. H announced he wated to separate last August so it has been 5 months now. No chages, we also tried Steve but at the 3rd session H said he wanted nothing to do with me any more and does not want to waste energy in saving M. I investigated and H has no A. He truly seems to enjoy all the time he can alone.
I need to do the 180 degree plan so i can survive this. please give me some advice. i am very sad especially now that the holidays are approaching.
thank you for your help
Atena

Atena:
Please be patient with the weekend here. I am sure tomorrow you will get more replies.

I, myself, don't know much about a good 180, but I think (and someone please correct me if I'm wrong) it would be about being civil and respectful but protecting yourself from any more pain.

Since the 2 of you are still living together and will likely be forced to share some family time with your son, I think this is going to be about all the time when your son is not around.

I think it's going to be difficult doing a plan B without sitting your near-adult son down and discussing the situation. I'm not convinced the two of you are doing your son a favor by not giving him a chance to process this. Surely you raised a self-assured young man? Surely he isn't totally blind to the tension?

I think kids are resilient and that he's likely going to be okay. Also, chances are his life will have variants in college, and you cannot protect him all the time anyway. I think if you want to wait until after Christmas, then fine, but with everything not being on the up and up with the entire family, your actions in a plan B may confuse both the men in your life, not just your husband.

That being said - I'm thinking you need separate bedrooms if you haven't already done that and to stop having sex. I also think you can quit making his coffee or making meals for him other than any meal that son would be home for, doing his laundry, or any niceties that make life easier by being married. (And again...someone correct me if I'm off base with this.)

I think you can stop calling each other and answering the phone and that leaving messages is sufficient. A notebook may also come in handy where you could discuss anything impersonal that needs to be discussed, such as: "I will need money for the light bill by December 31st."

Basically, he needs to start 'feeling' how it's going to be after he leaves and you aren't around anymore.

Maybe a letter explaining your rationale might help (again - wait for further opinions) telling him that since he is leaving in the summer and it will be a long 7 or 8 months, you feel the need to distance yourself emotionally and will no longer be doing his laundry, cooking his meals, or running personal errands for him. ???

thank you Sooly. The reason why i am reluctant to tell anyone is because of the agony i had to go thru since July. H told me he wanted to separate and still leaves with us. that is a torture. I do not want to inflict it on my son.He senses the tention but both H and I are very good at covering it up when he is around. should he know, my son, that we are only together becouse of him he will feel guilty and even more tortured. as far as sleeping in separate rooms: we only have a 2 room house. our son sleeps on couch and we have our room. we have nothing else where to sleep. Financially we are challenged otherwise i would have rented a place in the city and would have moved there with our son. as it is we can make it paying the mortgage, the bills and food, not much else. this is the reality of my situation and as we all know money is needed to have an independent life, without some money...well, then a lot of patience is needed. and that is why the only thing i can think of that will help me survive is a good 180 degree plan. i truly hope to win my H back. i love him.

Atena:

I was surfing the site and did run across this post from General Questions II. I thought it might help you.

The 180
1. Don't pursue reason, chase, beg, plead or implore.

2. No frequent phone calls.

3. Don't point out "good points" in marriage.

4. Don't follow her/him around the house.

5. Don't encourage or initiate discussion about the future.

6. Don't ask for help from the family members of your wayward partner.

7. Don't ask for reassurances.

8. Don't buy or give gifts.

9. Don't schedule dates together.

10. Don't keep saying, "I Love You!" Because if you really think about it, he/she is, at this particular moment, not very loveable.

11. Do more than act as if you are moving on with your life; begin moving on with your life!

12. Be cheerful, strong, outgoing and independent.

13. Don't sit around waiting on your spouse - get busy, do things, go out with friends, enjoy old hobbies, find new ones! But stay busy!

14. When home with your spouse, (if you usually start the conversation) be scarce or short on words. Don't push any issue, no matter how much you want to!

15. If you're in the habit of asking your spouse his/her whereabouts, ASK NOTHING. Seem totally uninterested.

16. Your partner needs to believe that you have awakened to the fact that "they (the wayward partner)" are serious concerning their assertions as to the future (or lack there of) of your marriage. Thus, you are you are moving on with your life…with out them!

17. Don't be nasty, angry or even cold - Just pull yourself back. Don't always be so available…for anything! Your spouse will notice. More important, he/she will notice that you're missing.

18. No matter what you are feeling TODAY, only show your spouse happiness and contentment? Make yourself be someone they would want to be around, not a moody, needy, pathetic individual but a self assured individual secure in the knowledge that they have value.

19. All questions about the marriage should be put on hold, until your spouse wants to talk about it (which may not be for quite a while). Initiate no such conversation!

20. Do not allow yourself to lose your temper. No yelling, screaming or name calling EVER. No show of temper! Be cool, act cool; be in control of the only thing you can control? YOURSELF!

21. Don't be overly enthusiastic.

22. Do not argue when they tell you how they feel (it only makes their feelings stronger). In fact, refuse to argue at all!

23. Be patient and learn to not only listen carefully to what your spouse is really saying to you? HEAR what it is that they are saying! Listen and then listen some more!

24. Learn to back off, keep your mouth shut and walk away when you want to speak out, no matter what the provocation. No one ever got themselves into trouble by just not saying anything.

25. Take care of you. Exercise, sleep, laugh & focus on all the other parts of your life that are not in turmoil.

26. Be strong, confident and learn to speak softly.

27. Know that if you can do this 180, your smallest CONSISTENT action will be noticed far more than any words you can say or write.

28. Do not be openly desperate or needy even when you are hurting more than ever and are feeling totally desperate and needy.

29. Do not focus on yourself when communicating with your spouse. It's not always about you! More to the point, at present they just don't care!

30. Do not believe any of what you hear them say and less than 50% of what you see. Your spouse will speak in absolute negatives and do so in the most strident tones imaginable. Try to remember that they are also hurting and afraid. Try to remember that they know what they are doing is wrong and so they will say anything they can to justify their behavior.

31. Do not give up no matter how dark it is or how bad you feel. It "ain't over till it's over!"

32. Do not backslide from your hard earned changes. Remain consistent! It is the consistency of action and attitude that delivers the message.

33. When expressing your dissatisfaction with the actions of the wayward party, never be judgmental, critical or express moral outrage. Always explain that your dissatisfaction is due to the pain that the acts being committed are causing you as a person. This is the kind of behavior that will cause you to be a much more attractive and mysterious individual. Further it SHOWS that you are NOT afraid to move on with your life. Still more important, it will burst their positive little bubble; the one in which they believe that they can always come back to you in case things don't work out with the affair partner.
_________________________

thank you Solee. I will try my best. it is the holiday season and all i can say now is that my H is still with me, for whatever reason. i can't always be so desperate and should enjoy the time i still have with him. it is hard but it is all i have for now and i love my H. i just hope that in the months to come he will see my changes and start having feelings for me again. i do not want to give up. i know i should plan to move on with my life and i am doing lots of things to keep my sanity. but also i do not want to give up on this yet. and i know MB is not telling me this at all. i am just telling it to myself at a time when i feel most rejected and sad.
happy holidays! thank you for all your help.

Atena, I'm so sorry that it's still so hard. I understand not giving up on this. Plan A or the 180 that Soolee posted will help you get to a more detached place, where his rejection won't feel SO much like it's about you. It's about him, wanting a fresh start. It may be painful to him to get close to you, because he sees what a wonderful person he's hurt. He may not trust himself to not hurt you again. He may feel that with someone new, or just dating, it's a clean slate, someone he hasn't hurt. He may not "get it" yet that his actions are about who HE is, not who he chooses as a partner.

Have you ever heard the Serenity Prayer?

God, grant me the serenity
To accept the things I cannot change
The courage to change the things I can
And the wisdom to know the difference

thank you ears. it is hard, i am stubborn and do not want to give up. the serenity prayer really helps and i recite it whenever i feel desperate. i have to admit that i really need to vent so please bear with me!
H announced he is looking to go into couseling with a local person here in town i also counseled with her a few months ago before entering this forum.
yesterday i cried (not becouse he wants to go to counseling) becouse i could not bear the fact that my H decision is destroying us as a family. I told my H this and said that his decision will have a legacy on our son, grandchildren etc.. for generations. his decision to leave impacts everybody, not only himself. the lies and the hiding of our feelings in the past months is turning us into people we do not recognise. i told him strainght to his face that the way he acts is very much out of character that i barely recognize who he is. i said he should be aware of this as he is deciding his and our future in this fogged state of mind. I asked him to please analyze the situation very well before making a decision that he could regret in the future. i said what you are decinding now is very seriuos and again impacts all of us, not just you. I was nice and polite while i was telling him all this, not upset or angry. i hugged H and told him i love him very much and that I am here for him no matter what. i told him i understand he is going thru a difficult time and that i myself have in the past gone thru difficulties and he has always been supportive of me. now it is my turn to be supportive of him. my H hugged me tight and thanked me for telling me that. he had tears in his eyes and told me it is very hard for him too. i said i am glad he intends to talk to someone. he replied he is very unhappy and he knows he made a hard decision that will impact our future, however he feels that his self esteem is very low, he feels like a failure as a person and he really believes that being alone and starting anew will help him. he says he is confused and hopes that talking to a professional will open up some questions and give him some answers he can understand. he says he does not feel comfortable talking to me about what he is going thru as i am biased of course. i said i understand that.
so my 180 went out of the window yesterday but i feel that our conversation helped him further understand and tell himself that he is in a state of confusion and depression and maybe put a little doubt in his head that he might, just might be making the wrong move by leaving the M.

I am reading with interest these points of the 180 Plan, but I don't understand what situations this approach is supposed to address. It sounds like a lot of avoidance and silent treatment, almost no communication with the spouse.

hi retreat and thank you. yes it is aimed at making it more bareable for the BS to put up with the fog of the WS. the BS distances herself so she is not hurt and rejected constantly and start living her life as if the WS is not longer part of her life.
at this point i should really go into plan b. my h has no affair and my son (18 years old) does not know that my h intends to separate in june.
should i make my h tell my son and then ask h to leave? would that make me look mean in my son's eyes?

Atena, if I remember correctly, Melody has advised a Plan B for some time now. Did I remember tht correctly? I think that was for your own mental health. You amaze me with the changes that you make, and i think that you empower your son with this example of being healthy in hard times, too. I don't think he will hate you. Again I encourage you to go to Alanon to get some IRL support from folks who have been in your shoes. And please keep letting us know how you are. Thanks for posting today.

This might not be the place to insert this...perhaps I should even do a thread...but it is bothersome to me when people use that phrase "kids are resilient, they will be okay."

I am looking at FIVE kids in my blended family who have all gone through divorce. Yeah, they will live, they will survive and they will move forward. But don't kid yourself into thinking they are "over" it. This is a SCAR and a BURDEN they will carry into their future relationships.

When you discuss it with the almost-adult, I would recommend discussing this fact and making sure to re-visit with them THEIR wounds and THEIR viewpoint from enduring this pain.

Just my opinion from this phrase that I see so frequently that it has become a hot button for me.

Thanks for enduring this post....hope it doesn't scar you too!


M

thank you ears and auntiem
i know i should do a plan b, but again i am holding on for my son and i agree with auntiem...the more pain i can spare him the better. i know he would suffer a great deal in these next 6 months before graduation if he knew what we are going thru. i am going thru a lot of pain but i am also aware that he, my son, would have to go thru the same thing were he to know. i am amazed how strong i am and i think the reason i have all this strenght is becouse i only think of my son. i know that he will learn about our separation sooner or later, however if i can ease the pain for him i will. i know there are ways i will be able to gradually break the news to him and after a while he no longer leaves with us he will come to accept it better. this way he will also think he had nothing to do with our separation and that he is not to blame. in fact he is not to blame at all. my H is at fault and i also want to make sure my son gets that at some point but i do not want to make him hate his father.