I've read in Dr Harley's books or on this forum that the SAA methods are more effective than traditional counseling, etc. Some of the statements are estimations from Dr Harley's counseling experience. And I know there are members here who have had great success - both with restoring a marriage after an affair, and moving on and being a better person after divorce.

My question is if there are any % estimations Dr Harley has mentioned, or any outside resources who have compared the MB principles to end an affair vs traditional methods? The principles make a lot of natural sense to me, but it would be nice knowing some comparisons.

He hasn't ever tracked the success of ending affairs because there are so many variables that it would be impossible. You have to factor in willingness. No program will work without willingness and if a wayward is not willing to end an affair, there is no way to force them against their will. Sure, there are things a BS can do to make that more likely, but beyond that, it is out of their control.

And then you have to factor in those BSs who choose not to save their marriages.

From being on the board for 13 years, I would estimate about 50% of marriages are saved when they use these concepts. The ones who don't, have a much greater risk of divorce or separation.

Of course, in your situation, the affair is the least of your problems.

I appreciate your insight. I'm sure there are those who have had similar questions as me, especially since Dr Harley mentions that traditional methods were very inferior to saving marriages. Just wondered how much he had quantified it.

That seems a mean thing to say to me.

I already figured out that getting help for my wife's drinking problem should take top priority - and you helped me see that I couldn't work past the A until she was sober, that it wouldn't work trying. But, from rehab #2 (OM rehab) to mid-June when she sent the No Contact letter, her drinking was much more moderate (2-3 drinks per night, 90% of the time). At that point, the A *WAS* top priority, and if I hadn't taken the actions I did, it would have blown up way worse than it did. Even now, it is definitely not the least of my problems... just not one I am actively working with my wife, until (if) she sobers up.

Just like preparing for the worst if she makes some more poor decisions in the next few days/weeks/months, I am learning as much as I can to get healing for my heartbreak and be as healthy as I can be whether I reconcile or divorce.

It wasn't meant to be mean. I was stating a fact. Talking about the affair is a distraction from the major problem here, which is your wife's chronic alcoholism. That has to be resolved before you can even hope to address the affair and I don't know if that is possible.

I know it's a fact... I'm dealing with it as the current #1 problem, and in the meantime, I'm trying to learn as much as possible. It may be that I never apply the MB principles because my wife never recovers. I accept that as a very real and likely possibility. But, when I have time, I am spending it working through how to deal with the A rebuilding and going to AlAnon. What I should be left with is a better handle on both, and will make her a better husband when she is clear of her double fog, or I will be a better person for it.

I am shocked that you think I was being mean to you. I have bent over backwards to help you.

Sorry... I took it that way, since I was trying to separate the threads, and it seemed that way. Apologies - you have definitely bent over backwards to help me, I am better for it, and I appreciate it.

KSummit,

I've heard it said by Dr. Harley that when both spouses buy into the program, it works 100% of the time, but as Melody said, waywards don't always agree to try it out for various reasons. They are in the fog and they don't wish to be educated.

The key is putting the plan in place on your end and doing your best. Approach it like a warrior and carry out the plan without letting fear interfere with the strategy.

Often when the affair dies, which most do, the fog lifts, and the wayward spouse will be willing to follow the program. And, Ksummit, never say never. After my wife and I divorced, I thought we would never be together again and that her love bank was empty forever. But I learned that Plan A love deposits do work over time, especially when the fog lifts. We are now remarried and happier than ever. I share this so you will understand that the program works in mysterious ways.

And yet, the framework is mathematical. You make deposits; you make withdrawals. The relationship sways with the balance of the love bank account. Marriage Builders principles remind me of a line from my favorite Alabama song, entitled "How do You Fall in Love." The line goes: "Don't ever take it [love] for granted. It's more than sowing some seeds. It takes sun and water, so give it what it needs."

And so our love garden can get overrun with weeds or die from drought. But love can resurrect from the dead if both sides are willing to change for each other and follow the principles in the plan.

Sir,
Dont allow your wife's insane behavior to bring the entire family down.
Are you focusing on your kids during this?
I hope you are.

During my wife's affair, my mom came out to help me for a couple weeks. She commented that I was too worried about my marriage, my cheating wife...while my kids were suffering!

Dont let her bring the whole castle down.

I would apply the MB principles for marriage to an alcoholic! There are a lot of specific recommendations from MB for such a situation.

This is very encouraging thanks for this post, justthe3ofus
Zo