I couldn't have made this happen if I wanted to. New GF is working at the far end of the neighboring county, driving 40 miles of interestate each way during the day. To boot, her employer has lost the thread of how to operate the business successfully, but hasn't really been stung by it yet because GF is so effective that she's bascially carrying her employer and a co-worker on her shoulders. Two conditions she decided to try to remedy by putting out feelers locally. <P>Would anyone believe that the company that bit is in a 10 floor office building along with XW's company? ... in a metro area of 3 million plus people. Frankly, I had no idea whether XW still worked there. Until on Sunday night we cruised by to familiarize GF with the route to her interview, and there was XW's convertible on the first floor of the parking garage ... workaholic as usual. So now I know she's still there. And I bet she remembers GF's physical characteristics and face enough to recognize her in the elevator, even though the only encounter (in a supermarket parking lot when XW was still in her car) was momentary and not up-close. If not, sooner or later the three of us would probably meet up anyway. <P>This puts me in an interesting dilemma. The two CD-Rs that would poison XW's career (I had forgotten there were two) are now out of storage and in my hands. I had almost decided to return them to XW, feeling charitable, forgiving, and frankly having little further need for them. But now, XW has a potential to be a problem for GF and me. Dropping the CD-Rs to XW's boss would assure her swift removal, probably back to her hometown. <P>At this point, I don't want to do it unless she makes trouble. But I'm not of a mind to return the CD-Rs now ... and lose the nuclear option. And I'm not happy about that. <p>[This message has been edited by Sisyphus (edited May 09, 2001).]

THERE you are! I've been wondering what happened to you.<P>Oh, I cannot believe the coincidence of your X and GF in the same building. That's bizarre...<P>I'm not sure what a CD-R is but it sounds like your underlying attitude is to use it as a threat or power tool over your X's head... correct me if I'm wrong here. Or, maybe you're actually acknowledging this behavior in your subject line: New twist for the same old temptation...<P>What is the twist? Your suspicious and controlling behavior or something else?<P>Pursue peace... do the right and honorable thing. Please, it'll save you heartache in the end, don't you think?<P>Cheers! Glad to have you back!<P>------------------<BR>We cannot do everything at once... but we can do something at once

Sisyphus,<P>Glad to see you back! Wish I knew what to say. What makes you so sure that your Ex and GF are going to get into each others hair? If Ex really wanted to make GF's life miserable, wouldn't she have already done it? Seems to me that there are an awful lot of nameless faces in a ten story office building!<P>Bumper

This issue rears its ugly head again.<P>What is your purpose in trying to destroy your ex-wife's career? It seems to me that you still have unresolved anger issues.<P>What is the worst thing that the ex could do to you or your new GF? Send you to Vietnam?<P>Give it up. Destroy the information. Don't breathe another word about it to anyone.<P>You are honor bound to do the right thing. IMHO, the right thing is to move on with your life, hold your head high, and be the man that you think you are.<P>Obsession with hurting your ex diminishes you.

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by OvrCs:<BR><B>What is the twist? Your suspicious and controlling behavior or something else?<P>Pursue peace... do the right and honorable thing.</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Suspicious and controlling? I've never told XW directly that I've got the disks, so I'm not doing anything controlling, and I've no need for suspicion--it's concrete, the family (including XW) has a well-documented history of quite public screaming matches and physical altercations (I once narrowly averted XFIL's arrest [numerous cops and the rescue squad had already shown up] in a restaurant brouhaha that would probably also resulted in XW's and XMIL's arrest as well). <P>I want nothing more than peace. But sometimes you need a capacity for war in order to maintain peace. Poland was frequently overrun ... the better-armed and topographically-defended Swiss--never.<P>Frankly, the scariest thing to me personally would be if XW and GF got together and compared notes ... but on the scary meter, it hardly registers ... I'd come out OK, and if I didn't; well, it's better that it happens earlier than later. GF has no interest in making XW's acquaintance ... she professes that anyway. Curiousity has a way of eroding that kind of resolve. <P>The thing I really fear is XW either getting nasty to GF, or using the old "do it to yourself and blame the other" dirty tricks to claim harrassment, etc. XFIL was rather sophisticated in such matters, and quite litigious, and I'm sure he has much wisdom to impart. GF will be new in her job -- this kind of problem could derail her career there.<P>XW and I are to stay away from each other, per a marital settlement agreement that I myself drafted (I am not sure if putting that in there was an effort to humiliate her for divorcing me, or a genuine recognition of the family's over-the-top traits--probably a bit of both), so sooner or later I'm going to be at that office building for whatever reason, and it's going to look like I'm out of line. What will I do when that happens--will I be unable to pick GF up or drop her off at her work--even for lunch? Will XW raise a stink? And what would I do if she did.<P>I suppose at that juncture I would tell XW that I had the disks, and that she needed to cool it. And I would be prepared to follow through. But unlike my vengeful feelings of several months ago, I wouldn't be happy about it.

Sisy,<P>I don't have any advice for you because I have never been in that predicament. Did your gf actually GET the job yet? Maybe you could avoid some unnecessary problems by picking a different place of employment all together. <P>just popped in to say hello<BR>Dana

Sisyphus!!<P>Missed you, man! Boy, am I glad to see you again. Now, let's get down to business.<P>I'm going to make the following assumptions: you truly have no desire to tangle with or run into your XW, you don't really want to use the CD's, and your XW and her family tend to react rather violently to things. <P>Given those three assumptions, I would suggest that you put the CD's into someone's possession whom you trust--someone who is your wise council. This will make it a little more difficult for you to "lay your hands on them" and you would have to go through a calm, clear-headed, smart, trustworthy friend who could advise you if it was appropriate or not to send them. <P>Next, I would suggest that you explain the situation to your attorney who can explain the situation to her attorney who can explain the situation to her. Thus, she will not think you are lurking in the area if she happens to accidentally see you. Also, you two can work out a semi-reasonable agreement such as: when you come to the XYZ office building to pick up your GF for lunch, you will use the NORTH entrance which is the farthest away from the SOUTH entrance that your XW uses. Frankly, yes, it is irritating that the XW can not deal with this in a more mature manner, but she can't so stop expecting her to. <P>Assuming that the third assumption is valid, RESIST TEMPTATION AND DO NOT CHECK UP ON YOUR XW! Do not look for her; do not talk to her; try to avoid bumping into her (on purpose) accidentally; etc. Purposely have your GF go to lunch at a time that DOES NOT coincide with your XW's lunch. Purposely have your GF go to and come home from work at times that do not coincide with the times your XW is coming and going. I realize that this may seem that you're letting your XW "control" when you come and go, but I'm talking about making the extra effort to avoid her and stay disentangled. It may feel like it's not fair that you have to go to all this, but trust me, the extra effort will be worth it and will keep things peaceful.<P>Last but not least, I will leave it up to you to decide if it is morally correct to destroy your XW's career based on something that might or might not happen. Come on, Sisyphus! You know what is right--now DO IT! You are right that people can get unreasonable in a divorce situation like this, and your XW even has a tendency toward being unreasonable, but don't do a pre-emptive strike. That's why I suggest giving the CDs to a trusted advisor. Your judgement may not be all the clear all the time either, but the friend you trust can help you decide if the time has come to use your ammo or not. <P>It really is good to see you again. I can't speak for everyone here, but I missed your rapier wit and superior debate skills (haha). Okay...I missed the way you make me think!!!! <P><BR>CJ<P>------------------<BR>Judge your success by what you had to give up in order to get it.

Sis,<P>Let it go. She left you, right? What would she care about your gf then? You two don't share kids if I remember correctly, you don't need to be in contact with each other anymore. She's your past, the Cd's are her past. Let it go and die the death it deserves. Destroy the Cd's - they are keeping you tied to her - even if it's a negative tie.<P>Lisa<BR>(aka soon2b)

That's one characteristic of lawyers i don't particularly like:<P>One of a laywer's learned success characteristics is to constantly retrieve the past to use in the present for their own purposes. (retrieving old decisions and writeups for use as precedent in the current case. that thinking tends to perpetuate the past, and slow down change.)<P>This situation is not a business case, it is a personal case, and constantly bringing up the vindictiveness means that:<P>1) you have not healed enough to be in a new relationship<BR>2) you are being your own counsel, and have clouded your judgement due to always relying on someone else to decide the difficult issues (judge or jury).<P>Your anger and your notion of your ability to abuse power or knowledge needs to be dealt with with a trained professional, (aka a head doctor!) Carrying around personal issues of vindictiveness will keep you from healing, and<BR>keep you from truly enjoying your life. You are creating your own problems.<P>As a wise man once said to me, "Most people create their own problems." I have heeded that advice and try to live a life where i don't control/mess with other people just for my own feeling of self worth/importance.<P>Time to consider whether you are holding yourself back, or helping yourself along.

I think I'll just stick 'em back in storage where they belong. My minister just says wait and see.<P>Shrink has in the past said not to get locked in a downward spiral of revenge & reprisal.

Out here in midwest, small town, USA we do cross paths. There aren't 3 million people to camouflage us or a 10 story building full of people coming and going. Who cares?<P>I agree with WIFTT, " 1) you have not healed enough to be in a new relationship"<P>Ragamuffin

Just get rid of the CD's then you would feel no compulsion to wonder what to do with them! Isn't it so?<P>And if she happens to hook up to your girlfriend, maybe you will actually BENEFIT from the knowledge your X can pass on! So she knows what the triggers are without pulling them herself!<P>I don't know... I'm surprised your minister isn't taking the route of forgiveness and do the right thing - rather than have caution. That makes me wonder about him/her!<P>Anyway, search your soul... search truth and GO DO THE RIGHT THING!<P>Cheers!<P>ps - controlling b/c you're even considering using these CDs as weapons. What could you have to gain except revenge from revealing them? <P>------------------<BR>We cannot do everything at once... but we can do something at once

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by OvrCs:<BR><B>ps - controlling b/c you're even considering using these CDs as weapons. What could you have to gain except revenge from revealing them?</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Well, the point would be that they now do have a potential use other than revenge: an <I>in terrorem</I> deterrent to bad behavior; or ultimately a means of assuring XW's removal from the situation if she continues bad behavior even in the face of the deterrent. Before, when that potential use had yet to arise, I was on the verge of returning them to her, as I have been many times before. <P>And if that's controlling, then I guess I'll have to cop to it. It's a hallmark of humanity to be able to control one's circumstances--or should I say a hallmark of any creature with a survival instinct, because animals dig burrows, etc. I always thought of <B>controlling</B> (in the psychologically bad sense) as <I>preventing</I> or <I>causing</I> an action in another to gratify onesself in an unreasonable manner: "don't go to the grocery store -- because I'm jealous and unreasonably fear you'll sleep with the bagboy". <P>If you mean that having the means to protect myself and the willingness to use it is <I>controlling</I>, I'll just have to live with that. I don't expect bad behavior. But should it occur, I think I'm within my rights to use what I've got: first as a deterrent, then if that fails, as a final solution that would remove the problem.<P>If I were going to use it out of destructive anger and a desire for revenge, or just tell her about it in order to cause her mental distress, I would have done it a long time ago. <p>[This message has been edited by Sisyphus (edited May 09, 2001).]

You are looking at the new version of the relationship with a competition/controlling belief, in that her actions will somehow have control/influence over your life, and you are waqnting to prevent that.<P>Does she have vindictive tendencies? If so, she doesn't have to be dealt with a policy of nuclear deterrance.<P>She can be dealt with by living a "good" life, free of anyone requiring to get even with you, or want to mess with you, because you are living the higher road on all accounts.<P>generally, separation and time is required to heal situations like this, and once you are healed, you should be able to look back at yourself, and realize you want ed vindictiveness because you were still hurting. Otherwise, who wants to be vindictive just for kicks? (other than lawyers with too much time on their hands and big chips on their shoulders?)<P>controlling means wanting to manipulate an other's actions to satisfy a reason for you. Your reason: new relationship protection, your method: information and intimidation.<P>no, i disagree that is the hallmark of humanity to want to control OTHERS with means. CONTROL in the psych sense is not control of yourself, everyone has that, whether they choose to use it or not, that is not the issue. Control in this situation is manipulation of another for your own benefit, especially with a disrespectful judgement of expecting bad behavior.<P>Sorry sys, you are are playing mind games with yourself, by dissecting the words to fit your own agenda.<P>

Depends on how bad you want to watch the mushroom cloud.<P>And how far you are away from ground zero.<P>Took a long time for the residents of Bikini Atoll to move back. If you're going to initiate the reaction, first check for partner opportunities in Grand Forks.... Does yor GF express any interest in "Nuclear Winter"?<P>Are all your ducks in a row?<P>Fire in the hole!<P>Listen, I could destroy the STBX's boyfriend's favorite pastime. One call to BSA could fix all that. It's fun to think about, but I think the anticipation is better than the execution. Keep the CD's. Enjoy them vicariously. Then ditch them & move on. Give them to her when you're ready to let go. Then GO.<P>Besides, There's always a headwind in North Dakota. <P>------------------<BR>nick<P>it's only time that heals the pain <BR>and makes the sun come out again<BR><p>[This message has been edited by c00ker (edited May 09, 2001).]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>If you mean that having the means to protect myself and the willingness to use it is controlling, I'll just have to live with that. I don't expect bad behavior. But should it occur, I think I'm within my rights to use what I've got: first as a deterrent, then if that fails, as a final solution that would remove the problem.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>I ask again. Is what she can do to you justify the "nuclear" option? <P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Frankly, the scariest thing to me personally would be if XW and GF got together and compared notes ... but on the scary meter, it hardly registers ... I'd come out OK, and if I didn't; well, it's better that it happens earlier than later. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>You seem to want to kill a fly with a sledgehammer. Just because you are afraid they will compare notes?<P>Give it up. Destroy the CD. If you really want to feel good about yourself, let the ex know you did it.

Hi Sisyphus,<P>Good to hear from you. Well, you do have another option..... There is a new super hero.... The LB Fairy..... unlike the TFC, this one takes your requests and flies in from across the Pacific and LB's your XW according to you instructions and reports back to you. Put out a distress call to this LB Fairy. Right now she (oops - gave away a clue - this one's name is already known - no suspense here) is over on the GQII board giving LB's to some of our WS. In this obscure forum, the Ws will never know what hit them. <P>Hey only joking of course, but on the serious note I would sure hate to see you hurt more. If you have a GF and are happy that should be where your concentration is. Don't worry about the XW. Trouble will find her in enough time. <P>Take Care,<BR>L.

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Sisyphus:<BR><B><BR>...the family (including XW) has a well-documented history of quite public screaming matches and physical altercations (I once narrowly averted XFIL's arrest [numerous cops and the rescue squad had already shown up] in a restaurant brouhaha that would probably also resulted in XW's and XMIL's arrest as well). <P>...The thing I really fear is XW either getting nasty to GF, or using the old "do it to yourself and blame the other" dirty tricks to claim harrassment, etc. XFIL was rather sophisticated in such matters, and quite litigious, and I'm sure he has much wisdom to impart. GF will be new in her job -- this kind of problem could derail her career there.<BR></B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Well, you know the cast of characters here personally. Everyone here who seems to think you have no need of a deterrent does not. The context above, along with the existing court order requiring you to stay away from your ex, would seem to allow for some concern. I have no great faith in the legal system as an instrument of justice, and some means for protecting yourself does not seem unreasonable.<P>Not to engender paranoia, but are you really sure that she doesn't know you have them? Maybe her good behavior and the long silence had to do with fear of what you might reveal. Didn't you finally tell someone about the family secret? If so, she knows you're not afraid to speak out about things if you deem it necessary.<P>Having said that, I think that the concern of many here is because we do know you and the prior struggles you've had with vengefulness. My recommmendation would be to put the CDs well away and <B>forget about them</B>. Only get them out under dire necessity.<P>I'd say that a time limit as to how long you'll retain them if no trouble occurs may be in order. <P>So anyway, I'm somewhat of a lone dissenting voice here, but do share the concerns about the damage you may do yourself if still occupy yourself with thoughts of revenge.<P>It is nice to see you back.<P>Steve

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by grandpabri:<BR><B>I ask again. Is what she can do to you justify the "nuclear" option?</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>It would be necessary in the event of an attempt by XW to harrass new GF, especially if that effort imperiled GF's new job. I can't think of any other circumstances that would warrant its use. <P>

Sis,<BR> I agree with the others, destroy the disks, move on with your life. If I remember, your x didn't want to be married to you and has a restraining order in place on you. <P>Does that sound like she is still interested in dealing with you??????<P>Also your your GF is a big girl, right? She can defend herself. <P>You are going to draw yourself into trouble based on my experiences. I was always trying to figure out what x and om/h were upto and kept myself angry all the time. This resulted in me losing my cool and physically removing x from my house.<P>I have pretty much let go, and don't worry too much about th e kids when they are over "there." My life ride is finally smoothing out.<P>