I figure it is easier to start a new thread. I am the man who started having lunches with a co-worker two weeks ago. I have known her for two years. We went to lunch and now I sense I am on the verge of doing something that I sense is wrong. But I am being drawn in.

I told the woman that it seemed like we were getting too close. I read the stuff on here on emotional affairs. She said this was not about anything sexual. She was not looking to change her life just to add to it. She loves her husband. She said my friendship is different than any other friend she has had. It is just about being friends. I read all the emails she has written me and it is confusing. There is never a word about sex or looks. More about feelings she has about me adding to her life.

I know I should stop it. I have not told my wife and that is a bad sign. But I find myself buying her argument that it is not about sex. We have not held hands or done anythig sexual. She told me that she does not like me that way.

I said before she calls her husband all the time and loves him. Am I sensing that she is falling in an emotional affair? Or am I overreacting?

I read the stuff on emotional affairs and it usually seems the person is unhappy at home and finds someone who makes them happy. This woman is happy

Excuse me for rambling. I think I know the answer I will get, but I guess I need to hear it from a woman to help me undersntand what happened. I never said I loved her or even liked her. I just took her to lunuch and then she took me and then I took her and now this

I always thought affais meant going to hotels for sex.

Hi,

Men and women can have lunches together, if their thoughts and feeling are the same as they would be if the other person was same sex.

When the thoughts are heading in the direction you are indicating, it is time to back off.

I was in a similar situation, except, in my case I know the feelings I started having were because I am unhappy. Originally, I would fantasize about a normal relationship, with a nameless, faceless man. This person, I would have lunch with, I have known since High School, back in HS, and College, we didn't keep in touch much. We worked togehter. Then 3 or 4 years ago, he started working where I do. We met a few times for lunch. Now the nameless, and faceless person took on his face. It was time to stop having lunch with him.

Thanks, Sue.
Here is what I don't udnerstand: I have known this woman for two years. Said hi, how was the weekend. That kind of thing. Never any more than that. The lunch thing was spur of the moment. It seemed like everything changed during lunch. How could that be? You knew the man you are talking bout for years.

I thought back on what I may have said wrong. I mentioned flattering hair style. Asked about her job and what thought of her life and her career. Talked about what I had learned over the years in the business. Nothing about getting all goo goo over her. No drinks or anything like that.

Is an emtional affair, if that is what it could be, bad? I see a physical affair has all kinds of problems but an emtional affairt seems like being extremely good friends. This woman told me she wants to add a friend to her life, not replace anyone elese in it.

Dpoes she make any sense?

I guess the question lies with, what does she mean as "friend". There are those who have male, female relationships, and they are emotionally involved, in a sister, brother sort of way. That I see nothing wrong with.

Is this the sort of friendship that either of you could end if you M was in jeapardy? Do either of you feel you have to hide this friendship from you spouse? Answers to these questions help to determine if this friendship is an okay friendship or a not okay friendship. If either of your spouses objected, would you be willing to discontinue having lunch? Has lunch lead you or her to thinking about the other in inappropriate terms for a married person, such as I experienced?

Where I work, there are many male/female who have formed friendships, and even included their spouses or SO in this friendship, there is one group I recall, that get together at each others houses and this friendship started because they worked to gether. Does she just enjoy your company as she would enjoy the company of another coworker that she likes to spend time with? The same question you need to ask.

Yes, this male, female thing gets quite complicated. What it comes down to, if it is interfering in your M or her M, it is a problem.

I know she has not told her husband about the lunches or anyone else. She told me that people could misconstrue them. She has told me that I make her feel bouyant and happy

You have not said how you feel about this. Going by what you posted on what she said, I would back off. She may be happy with her M, but it looks like this could lead to potential complications.

I would let her cool off before having lunch anytime soon with her again. If you do, keep in in a group. Yes, things can be misconstued, but the trying to hide, it helps to feed the thought process.

I used to meet my friend for lunch in the open in our company cafeteria. As of late, he has been asking me to set up a lunch time when I can. I've been avoiding him. How do I tell him, I can't have lunch with you because I fantasize about you. He knows my M is in jeopardy, and I'm trying to hold it together for the kids at this point. He went through a similar thing with his W. She had the A, and now they are divorced.

She told me she likes the friendship with me because it belongs just to her, a private world. She says she feels a connection wtih me as a friend.

cautious:

do a search on "Tempted"'s posting, his registered number is 20654.

I'm going to tell you, I see red flags going up.

The comment she made sounds similar to the one I made with my pregancys. I hated being pregnant, but I missed it after the baby was born. It was our private time that only baby and I shared. A connections so to speak. I realize that pregnacy does not equate to this, but when someone starts talking like that, I start thinking EA, which could lead to PA. On the flip side, you don't reciprocate because of you love your wife and family (assuming you have a family). She could get hurt my this.

There are those who will say you need to walk away from this. I guess, if you can keep to a respectable office type lunch, then things cannot get out of hand. Maybe I am wrong. My H did not meet his OW at work, from a mutual friend who was introducing OW to a friend of my H's.

The lunches have all been out in the open, very public

RE: Is an emotional affair, if that is what it could be, bad? I see a physical affair has all kinds of problems but an emotional affair seems like being extremely good friends.

I have often heard an affair to be defined emotional and/or sexual energy going outside of the marriage. This is definitely happening in your ‘friendship’. You are having and emotional affair. Emotional affairs are actually worse in many ways then physical ones. This is because our emotions, our hearts are what binds us as humans. If you keep this up, it is very possible that slowly (or maybe not so slowly) your emotions will move away from you wife to this woman. Hers will do the same from her husband to you.

Yes, an emotional affair is like being extremely good friends. But tell me, how many of your male friends will ever tell you that them “feel buoyant and happy”. This is nothing like just friends.

The worst part of an affair is not the sex. It’s the lying, deceit and that your spouse has become emotionally attached to another person. Let’s face it, a one night stand is not much of a threat to a family when compared to the WS falling madly in love with someone.

I’ve heard that old argument about how people are not monogamous by nature. After much contemplation, observation and living I’ve come to a conclusion. Humans are monogamous by nature. It is human nature to bond with a member of the opposite sex, ‘fall in love’, and form a family. It is in our nature to protect that family at all costs. We do not survive well as a species without the strong family structure. However, we are also a species that has adapted to survive no matter what hell or damnation is thrown at us. So when we loose a spouse we bond quickly and easily to another. What happens in an affair is that the WS erroneously gives the ‘survival’ side of them a chance to attach to someone else.

Even in societies that allow polygamy there are very strict rules about how these relationships are carried out. It preserves a sense of monogamy in that the woman must always be monogamous and the man must treat her as such.

RE: This woman told me she wants to add a friend to her life, not replace anyone else in it.

Many, many people who have affairs are still in love with their spouse. They just find that another person is able to meet some of their needs. No spouse can meet all of the other’s needs all the time. How nice to have someone on the side to fill in the gaps. My counselor told me that when people have affairs, the spouse and the other person, become as one. Together they meet all of the WS’s emotional needs. This is very heady because before the affair the WS has probably never had ALL of their needs met all the time. We call a person who wants both their spouse and the OP (other person) a cakeman/cakewoman. They ‘want their cake and to eat it too.’ They just want everything and to not have to give any of it up.

RE: “I know she has not told her husband about the lunches or anyone else. She told me that people could misconstrue them. She has told me that I make her feel buoyant and happy”

You have no business making any women other then your wife feel “buoyant and happy”.

She is wrong. People will not misconstrue your relationship. They will understand exactly what it is.. .an emotional affair. You have already started to cheat on your wife. Before this goes any further please tell this woman that your ‘friendship’ is over. Then tell your wife of your close call. Advise this woman to do the same thing. Otherwise you and she are on a slippery road that will in the very least hurt everyone else you love and could actually destroy our marriages and your families.

You have been given plenty of reasons here by posters and by the material on this web site as to why you are heading down an very dangerous path. You are about to destroy all that you love and care for. This is not mellow dramatic. It is the truth. So please stop before it goes too far.

Neither of you have told your spouses or friends about your relationship. Affairs thrive in secrecy. Open your friendship up to the light of day if you want it to be nothing more the ‘friends’. If you and she cannot tell your spouse about it, then you are not just ‘friends’.

You have come here and asked us this question. Why don’t you ask your wife? Then why don’t you call her husband and share the same info and question with him?

Since affairs are secret, the BS never has a say in the choices made. If this is so innocent, why not give your spouses some way and some choice here? Why not treat them with the love, respect and dignity they deserve.

Turn the table and think of your wife doing what you are doing. Would you like that?

If you are looking to justify your affair. This is not a place where you will find support.

<small>[ September 17, 2002, 11:54 PM: Message edited by: zorweb ]</small>

Dear Zorweb:
What an incredible post. Thank you. I know you don't know the answer to this, but what would make her fall for an emtional affair with me oer just three lunches?

Cautious,

RE: What an incredible post. Thank you. I know you don't know the answer to this, but what would make her fall for an emotional affair with me over just three lunches?

I’m not an expert in all this. But I am student of human nature, so I will venture to respond. Actually this comes right out of the MB concepts.

People fall for those who meet their emotional needs. In those three short lunches you gave her something she is missing… you paid her a complement about her hair so you made her feel pretty. You pay attention to her and probably hang on her every word. She probably feels appreciated, admired and a little romance. These are probably things missing in her marriage.

While one could say that her H is a cad for not giving her these things there is more to it then that. It takes two to make a marriage work. She has 50% responsibility for the current state of her marriage. No one person can meet all of another’s needs all of the time. So it leaves all of us open for the possibility of having an affair. Most people never do… about 40% of all men & women have affairs. Having an affair is a choice usually made one baby step at a time.

It’s so simple, yet so complex; we fall for people who make us feel good. Early in a relationship our ‘love’ or ‘feelings’ are based on the physical, the newness and having needs met that have gone unmet for a while. This is not true love, it is infatuation. It is the pull that brings single people together, helps them not see the other’s faults long enough to get attached. Long enough for real love to develop.

The problem comes in when both are not single.

Have you read the material on this web site? It is very good.

zorweb:
You are very wise. I have told her she looks nice, I do listen to her and tell her she is smart. But I have to be honest with myself. I am enjoying her company. Am I leading her on? I don't think so.
I wish you could meet her. This is the last woman in the world who would have an affair of any kind. She is upstanding, very married and has a child. Calls her husband every; day. Makes plans for weekends with him. all those things. Not sitting aruond complaining about him at all.
Thats what makes no sense to me. She did tell me that she feels fortunate to have me as a friend. But she said it is adding to her life

Yes you are leading her on by telling her these things. She is a little starved for it.

I believe you when you say she is the last person in the world to have an affair. There are many WS here who are the same.

My H is actually the same. His affairs were because he was at the lowest part of his life when I met him. His divorce had just been finalized from a woman who he dearly loved. She had several affairs and left him and the children to live with the last OM. He was at a point in his life when he was vulnerable. He is a good man and a wonderful husband. Just as you describe this woman. But we all have our low moments/days/months/years. I think of that time as him being a man who fell from grace with himself. He is himself again… thank goodness.

And yes, affairs can just add to one’s life. They can add that little bit of something special that takes away the mundane and makes a person feel alive again.

If you find yourself enjoying this woman’s attention, then look at the needs she is filling or you.. Conversation, admiration, affection are most likely amongst them. Then look for those in your marriage.

Why don’t you share a little about your marriage with us? What is good? What is missing?

<small>[ September 18, 2002, 07:51 AM: Message edited by: zorweb ]</small>

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> This is the last woman in the world who would have an affair of any kind. She is upstanding, very married and has a child. Calls her husband every; day. Makes plans for weekends with him. all those things. Not sitting aruond complaining about him at all.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Cautious, you just described my wife here. Her public lunches with her co-worker evolved into a lengthy affair - many years EA, 2.5 PA. Started out just as innocently as your situation. All the while, we got along fine, still did everything that a happily married couple does.

You're playing with fire, and I think down deep you know that. The physical stuff is likely right around the corner, even though both of you claim that it's not about that. My W thought the same thing - look where we are now. Fighting for survival.

The fact that you are uneasy about being with your friend should set off your internal alarm. It's best to deal with that by showing your wife the respect she deserves and end this potentially damaging friendship. Stop the lunches, keep your relationship on a professional level.

It may seem relatively harmless to you now, but know that I'm here on the MB board because my wife was where you are now. Think about it. Do what's right for your family.

Hi Cautious. I'm going to be delicate here. Naw, f*** that! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" />

Look, dude, if EVERYONE is telling you the same thing: keep away! red flags! then maybe you should take their advice.

I think your question has been answered over and over, so I don't have much to add.

But I do hear you being defensive--rationalizing that she has nice pictures on her desk so it must be OK.

It's not OK. No one here is going to tell you it is. And EVERYONE here knows more about this subject (affairs and how they start) than you do. Can you get that? Please.

Stop this now before you ruin someone's marriage. Don't make me come over there. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Cautious

I am WS - I never ever ever thought I would cheat on my H. I always thought that if I ever met anyone who was better than him, I would leave him first.

Well, at the time, I met someone who was better than him (well, not better but different, but meeting my needs, supporting me etc.), and guess what happened?

Cautious, why are you so worried about giving up these lunches? If you and your "friend" are just that, explain to her that you think it best to leave having lunches for a while. What's the worst that could happen from that - she may be cross or angry with you, well she wouldn't be much of a friend would she if she didn't respect your feelings or opinions?

Why is it so important to you to think that both you and she are happily married? You only know what she tells you and the fact she has photos on her desk doesn't mean anything. Is that what you want to think so you can justify your actions, thinking that nothing will come of it?

Believe me Cautious, whether or not this is an EA (I respect the opinions of others on this board, because really, I don't know anything!), if there is the slightest doubt in your mind (and there must be because you are here), give her up now.
I can only add that I would never again intentionally cause the pain and hurt that I have in my H's and my life knowing what I do now.

You know what to do for the best....
Lisa

If this were 'nothing,' you wouldn't be spending so much time dwelling on it. Buy the book Torn Asunder by Dave Carder, read it from cover to cover, and if you still have questions, come back here. He's much more knowledgable about emotional affairs than we are. I have a feeling that one day you will be back here, recovering from a physical affair.

cautious:

Yes, zorweb's posts 2 you are excellent. But DO look up Tempted's threads, as going_crazy suggested. He was in much the same situation as you are now. He came here asking the same questions you are now. He got the same excellent advice you are getting now. PAGES AND PAGES of it. He seemed 2 be "getting it" at times, but always ended up seeing his "friend" again and never telling his W about the friendship.

Basically, he wanted validation for his behavior under the guise of "sincerely" asking for advice. I hope you don't go down the path he seems 2 have followed. You'll cause your W a lot of unimaginable pain. And so will your friend cause her H the same pain. As a BS, who's WS started her A as an EA many years ago, I can assure you that being on the receiving end of that experience is one of the most horrible things you can put someone through. Don't go there.