Church counseling, can't afford mb right now, and I do think we could use the spiritual guidance....

Any suggestions?

I am a little worried. H does not seem to be doing flip flops.. has threatened not to go once this week, but is still willing.. although claims he is going to tell counselor about my problems and why they are so much a problem for him...

I am throwing my hands up, because he says he wants to go, and that he is not sure if it will help, but that he will try.

thanks for input if anyone has any.

H

Hello Again Honey!

I'm very glad to hear you and H will have some counselng! I think that is great...

If your husband is ready to address HIS problems then the counseling will go well...

If not, then maybe the couseling will bring things to a head where you can decide if you can still handle the alcoholic rollercoaster you've been riding.

If he is not ready to work on himself for himself then you can probably expect the following reactions from him:

He's doing it for you since it is mostly your fault

He will always be able to say, "I tried couseling but our M was doomed"

All she wanted to do was bash me in front of the pastor!

I drink because of you!

You should love me for what I am!

Honey, I'm very sorry if I sound negative. I really don't mean to. It's just that if he is not ready to quit drinking for himself, then it ain't gonna happen. You can trust me on that one!

You have a VERY tuff decision in front of you:

Do you address the drinking problem straight on? This will weed out any false pretense for his going to counseling. But it will also bring a quicker end to your marriage once you 'expose' his problem like that. Are you ready for the '[censored] or get off the pot' talk?

Or do you only talk to the pastor about the symptoms created from the alcoholism. Your anger, his anger, his infidelities, etc. Never to attack the REAL problem and realize the symptyoms will eventually reappear.

Or somewhere in between, dancing on a wire, afraid to to fall on either side?

You seem to be a good person, Honey. You know you deserve better. The question is. "How long do you and the kids wait for Jim to be that better man?"

I truly am praying for you, your kids, and Jim. If you think it would help, I offer my alcoholic story to Jim, so that he can see that we all did not live under the bridge...

Gib

Gib,

You are a gift to this forum. Your perspective from having "been there" and your willingness to "tell it like it is" offers the gift of clarity.

Blessings to you! CSue

<Blush> Thanks CSue! Hey, pass me a beer would ya?

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

Gib

Cute, Gib, Cute!! CSue

Go ahead.. as usual, brace yourself for the worst... for my first MC experience check my thread!

My bottom line so far: defiantely a good idea, clearly a step forward. Remains to find out in which direction :-)

^bump for Honey^

I think she needs more help than just my thoughts...

Thanks a million for the responses Gib- and everyone else! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> My best girlfriend just left and got me pepped up a bunch... but I just called him.. he has ys, and he was not real nice...

He keeps saying he is keeping the door open, but I have all these problems... just like you sd above... he just called me crazy.

I cried for about 20 minutes, decided I hadn't eaten all day and am right now cooking my lunch while I type.

I appreciate the replies - we have had cousneling before, and some of it helped a little... but ws is not addressing drinking.

Says he is not drinking while kids are there? I don't know if this is completely true.

Anyway, he was gruff and mean on the phone, glad to be off.. .worried counseling will be more of the same.

Believe me, he will be bashing, and telling counselor his list of every bad thing I have ever done.
That is where he is.

Thanks, H

bump for input... thanks friends, h

Honey - OK again I see myself in you - I am wondering if you are still going to counseling this week??? What do you hope to accomplish while you are there?? Did you think about maybe writing down your issues?? I mean I know what I want to say usually - but then I get talking to my exhusband and it all goes out the window - and I am usually the one that ends up taking the blame for everything even though I know it wasn't me... I would think that the AA stuff would come up first seeing how that is where the basis of the problems start from right??? I mean I don't think you should let him get away with drinking at all - I mean if he is going to work on these problems he has to face that one head on - And just one more question - why did you call him when he had your son ?? I mean you called him and you were the one that got upset??? I do this all of the time myself - I am feeling ok - than bam I talk to him for some reason and I am right back feeling like crap... Sometimes I think it is so much better just not talking to them - about anything at all - except for the kids.....

I think he may only be going because you want him to.... not because he wants to go. As Gibby1 said, this will give him the opportunity to say, "I tried counselling, and you still didn't change".... or something to that effect. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

Preparing for the worst is great advice too. I'll add onto that that you should expect NOTHING from this visit as well. That way you aren't setting yourself up for disappointment.

I'm not sure if "beating him to the punch" by coming forth with the changes that you know you need to make in yourself would be a good thing or not. But if you let him voice them, then start practicing your, "Yes, your right H. I am sorry. I am trying to work on that." line. And then ask him how he thinks you could do that. I guess that would be doing some 180ing. Do you think that might work for you?

For sure, let us know how it went.

Karen

Topie- I especially like the beating him to the punch theory, as I know he will be saying everything I do wrong.. but funny most of this is in the PAST now... now the question is, can he forgive and let me change..? Can he change?

Maw- Thanks for the encouragement... I am getting better.. most of the time I just get off the phone when he starts.. did this yesterday! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Thanks and hugs, H

Hi Honey, did you have the counseling session yet? How did it go?

Hey Gibby1, if you are reading this would you be willing contact me off line at LegalBeagle86@hotmail.com? I would like to ask you some questions re: the "Program" and what are reasonable expectations for me to have of WH while he is in the early stages of recovery. Thanks.

Brit's Brat/BS-41
FWH-43
DS-13 months
Status: <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

Brit's Brat -

You've got mail... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Gib

I just got back and feel a little sick to my stomach. Jim is basically trying to say... a big part of the problems right now... are:

1. I need to let the kids go on vacation with him on a long drive to atlanta from houston, 16 hrs, of course in denial that he has never done this while not drinking, etc... I know his manhood, fatherhood, etc. is threatened by my expressing my fear of him going on this trip. I offered to go and drive in a seperate car and stay with a relative who is his stepmom who still loves me.... etc. He is saying he does not think we can move forward unless I let him take kids on this trip ALONE..... He is in denial over his drinking as is his father and his grandparents... who he has made a very big deal over visiting with...

opinions?

2. I think he is agreeable to going back.

3. he bashed me a lot, but less than usual...
4. he still says he wants to work it out, just does not know how he will feel safe around me as he thinks I will go balistic ....

ok, gotta go to a evening meeting for mk, my side job.

Hugs and thanks, HONEY

Ok - well - how could he even contemplate a vacation when he doesn't have a job?? And why would he take the kids out of school for a week??And why would he think you would ever let him - if he hasn't shown any responsibility towards the care of the children??? I mean if he is an alcholic the chances of him drinking and driving even with the children are pretty good... Why does he think you are going to go ballastic?? I am confused??? Does he want to come home and try to fix this - or doesn't he??

Honey,

He's trying to punch a button. Your fear of his abandoning you button. But you moved it, right?

Now, I think everyone would agree with me that you would be INSANE to send your children alone, out of state, with a man who can not stay sober, who has threatened to take the children, especially to visit a man who has encouraged your husband to kidnap his kids.

This is where you talk back to your fear, and be a Mamma Bear. Protect your children, regardless of whatever he says. Seriously think about how ridiculous it is for him to say that his stumbling block to marriage to you is that you won't let him take the kids out of state - when he's given every indication that he can't be trusted, and NO indication that he can be...

Don't fall for his lines Honey. He's trying to make you feel guilty... do NOT let him!!! These are not your issues, they're all his.

BR is right, and I'm one of the ones who will say to you, don't you dare let him take those precious boys on a trip!

I'm feeling vindictive tonight, and I'm thinking that if I were in your shoes, I would flat out tell him "no way", and "you'll have to get a court order to do it". But that wouldn't solve anything, I know. If anything, it would only put the idea into his head! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> (and we wouldn't want THAT to happen. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> ).

"He bashed me a lot, but less than usual"

((((((((Honey)))))))))

I don't give a hoot if he wants to come home, BASHING IS NOT ALLOWED!!! He has so much to prove to you that he's worthwhile. And frankly, he's nowhere near that point right now.

I want to send you the MB 2x4 for your H. I'll whallop him a few times, in the hopes that he can see that all of this anger is self induced! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" />

Okay... I better get off of here now. I'm displacing some of my anger towards my H onto yours. Sorry about that. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

If it is SO IMPORTANT that your boys go on this trip, then my suggestion is to send them there via train or bus. H can meet them there. Perhaps you could pick them up for their return trip home? Just some ideas.

Let us know how you feel about your counselling session, once you've had a chance to absorb it more.

Karen

I am having big issues with the situation here...

tonight my mother again overstepped a boundary.. well yesterday... she took ys to get haircut without asking me while I was at work...

I am sure that some of you will tell me to say - thank you mom... - but I cannot thank her for this because my kids always suddenly appear after a visit to their grandparents with a haircut... because my parents think I let it grow too long and shaggy... according to what I have just been told, and also according to my mom and dad.. ws cut ys's hair with scissor's this weekend while visiting.. well he got home sunday night and my mom monday while ys stays with her takes him to haircut without calling me etc. I have just gotten told I don't care about my boys and how they look... etc. because I have asked my MOM repeatedly DO not take sons to get haircut without at least asking me. Sure, he prob. needed it... but I like to take him, and I take him somewhere different than where my mother does.. and she does it without my permission. My dad just told me in my mother's defense that it is like going to the bathroom... do I want my mom to call me everytime they need to go to the bathroom? They are just trying to help they say... I was told to go to HELL... by my mom tonight when I requested she not do this AGAIN, and she went balistic... also told me she is not going to take this SH)T... I am tired and disgusted... called ws and he is yelling and cussing at me and telling me... SEE, your parents take over your life... he says... you let them rule our kids, etc. I say WELL if you were availbable to help me I would not need their help... I get upset and say can you face that you have a drinking issue... about the trip to GA.. .and then he gets madder and madder and says he won't run up his cell phone minutes with me, and that this is CR-P- gee I have a loving family don't I?

Granted my family watched the kids after work while I went to counseling and 2 more dang hours while I went to get better at my ptime job training so I can make ends meet.

I feel like i should give up on my family... who are really trying to help, but won't draw boundaries or respect me,... and tell me I am disrespecting them by getting angry at them... I just tell them.. why don't I get some respect/

OK, is this how codependent families work BRAMBLE? I am so upset at my MOm and her disrespect for simple things. I would really like to take my kids to get their haircut or have their dad do it, and my parents just do it without asking.

My dad also took my os's training wheel's off without asking on a visit over there.. and I let him take ys's off... because I am not the handy wrench kind of mom and his dad was not around when he learned.. we were seperated.. but that is another thing ws brought up today at counseling... etc. etc. and how my family always wants to rule the holidays, etc. etc. Well gee... we can work that one out????? can't we? But let's try being here to help me.

but he wants to argue driving the kids to atlanat... so I am forced to bring up the drinking, and then he gets mad and hangs up... because I guess we don't want to deal with that..

He threatened going to court to get that order.. to take them , and I sd. I do not want to show the courts your drinking problem , but will if I am forced to.

Anyway, what an lb? I guess I am doomed again... this time due to not wanting my kdis in the car for 16 hours with an alcoholic..

thanks, honey

Hi Honey!

OK...take a breath...now, take another one...

Stop and think. Detach yourself and just think. The haircut thing, the training wheels thing, all small stuff. Daily annoyances that are manageable. "DON'T SWEAT THE SMALL STUFF!" Sorry, I did not mean to yell <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> ... Stay focused on what is REALLY important.

IMHO, Your H is trying to prove that he is a functioning drunk, not an alcoholic. He wants to prove this to you, himself, and the world. Afterall, that is the upbringing he had. Honey, he is sick. Just like someone with an illness that could render them incapable of driving at any moment (ie - MS, Epilepsy, etc.) Would you even think twice about sending your kids on a 16 hour drive when the driver has that type of illness? (those of you with a debilitating illness, please understand the intent <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> )

Boundries Honey, boundries...

This advice is guaranteed or your money back! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Gib