CSue, I'm glad that this thread has been helpful to you. Even though it concerns my mother, it applies to other relationships, especially my marriage.

Another problem I have is trying to balance or distinguish the fine line between being "considerate" of other people's feelings and letting other people's feelings control me.

Bump for more book recommendations....

Also, has anyone used the Simple Abundance Gratitude Journal along with the book?

Susan,

Having thought more about this thread; I think I will do what Pepper recommended and send notes to my dad.

He too can be difficult to talk about regarding anything other than the weather, news, etc. Considers talk about feelings etc to be "unpleasantries".

He's a good dad too; not perfect - but I have to say I understand things much better now that I am a parent. He's done a remarkable job raising my younger sister after my mother died over 20 years ago. And he's not getting any younger or healthier at 76 years old. The note writing will be good for all of us!

Regarding the gratitude journal. I don't have a special journal for that; but have a general journal that I write all that stuff in too. Among other things it serves as a personal progress report so I can check back and see how I am doing now compared to the past. CSue

I'll chime in and say those simple little hello's can be great to rebuild the relationship with ws's too.. they have helped me and ws rebuild.

I got that idea from carolh a while back, ... I was always a big note writer anyway...

But- it definitely helped.. some of you may be oppossed to my doing anything nice to my ws nowadays.. but I think the notes worked! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

When I went to visit they were on the kitchen windowsill... though he never sd a word to me in person thanking me for them.

Hugs, H

Susan,

I think the notes idea is just great. It may be true that your Mother will communicate better with you in writing than in person. She will, as will you, have more time to put thoughts down correctly and strive to get them across.

I am sure your's is not a unique problem especially as parents get older. It is also true that mothers and daughters seem to have trouble. I know my sisters and mother seem to go round and round, while I get along with my mother very well. I also live 3000 miles from her.

My mother used to tell my brother and sisters something that I think you might profit from. When we really annoyed her, especially as teenagers, she would say: "I love you, but I don't have to like you."

I think this is something you need to address. You feel guilt because you are not as close as you would like. Perhaps you need to acknowledge that while you do love and respect your mother deeply, she is not a person you particularly like. It may be that she will never be that person, but you do love her.

As for Christmas, let me put on my problem solver hat. Yeah, I know you ladies don't like us guys to do this. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> That is all I have to say about this.

She is 76 years old and she cannot drive down to your house for Christmas, but you want to be home at Christmas for your children. Then the solution is to drive up 3.5 hours and get her and bring her back. Now, it may be your H that will have to do this or maybe both of you. But do it.

Call her, explain that you really need to be home for Christmas for your family as they are growing up and ready to spread their wings. You would also like to spend Christmas with her. So your solution is to come get her and bring her to your house for Christmas. Can she do this? If she says no, then you have tried. You and H were willing to go the extra mile. You have nothing to feel guilty about.

Susan, I know that at 76 you may have many many more years with your mother, but you also realize you may not have many more either. It is a hard call. My W's parents died 14 and 18 years ago. So my children never really knew them. My father died 14 years ago and my children barely go to know him.

So I suspect I know what you dread on one hand. But, you can only do what you can do. Offer a solution to this situation. If she doesn't want to accept, then so be it. Call her on Christmas eve and again Christmas day. Talk with her. But, she has choices to make as well. Accept that.

You are both adults and like any good friendship it takes effort on both sides. You can love her, but you don't have to like her. That is something she has to address.

Must go. Sorry, I couldn't offer you something really profound to help. I do like the card idea. They become keepsakes and something she can read again if she wishes.

Have a good one.

JL

I knew you would show up sometime!

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I know my sisters and mother seem to go round and round, while I get along with my mother very well. I also live 3000 miles from her.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Wow...so, how do YOU do Christmas with your Mom? Where is it you are again now?

In my "birthday" thread I posted that my sister said she would bring my mother half-way here and I offered to meet them half way. When I suggested this to my Mom, she said "oh, but that would be a lot of trouble".

See, I suspect that she does not really want to come at all. But, by acting as though she really wants to, and then cannot find a way, she can remain the victim.

Now she has many excuses, but no real reason for not coming.

Thank you for your reply. Just Learning, you are a dear! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

IMHO- I think your mom still wants to come, and is willing- maybe- don't know what tone she sd that - that would be a lot of trouble... in. But, perhaps she is giving you an out... b/c it would be a lot of trouble and she feels bad.

Reexplain to her that you don't mind and if you wnt kindly insist she come. If you want to take her out, take it- I suspect she will sit home asnd be sad on the holiday... at her age if she is alone. She may just be using her manners, even though you might not expect that of her. She may have some moments that are kinder and gentler with common courtesies... even if she will be hurt... and others where she really lets her needs known... though in a childish or demading or hurtful way- I think we all do this at times.. unless the art of getting along with others has been mastered completely by someone.

Sometimes we even get more grumpy if we are hungry, tired etc. Once I think I knew what the acronym help meant... or is it hurt? Maybe someone knows.. that you need to stop and take time for yourself when you are getting those ways... such as hungry or tired....

We all need our basic needs met.

I know it is hard to deal with mom's , especially an aging one.

My parents and my mom's sister - they also have a brother, but he is not in on the deal... visit my grandmother 3 hrs away every other weekend. She has a live in during the week but not the weekends... due to ostheoperosis... she is a lot better... but is in her 80's and had PERFECT health prior to the first bone cracking incident....she was even in an assisted living home for a few mnths due to the osteoperosis.. sad for someone of such a quick wit... lately... her bones just started cracking...

Anyway- my mom goes to visit her every other weekend of the year- sometimes only for 1 day, usually I think she spends one night. That is a lot, but I am so glad my grandmother is still here- she gets grumpy and lets it all hang out at times... but is a very sweet lady.... She will often put herself last .. and has one wonderful quality about her kids----

She lets them be.

She is independent and would sit home alone before inconveniencing anyone- these every other wkend visits aren't asked by - by her as far as I know..... I bet she loves them, but she would never wnat to inconvenience - perhaps that makes her easier to get along with.

Will be going.

Hugs and thanks, and luck with Mom...

Honey

<small>[ December 07, 2002, 06:26 AM: Message edited by: Honey ]</small>

Well let me tell you a very, very hard lesson I learned.

I hated my mother for years and years. Oh, you think I'm over-reacting (which, as you know, I am prone to do) but I'm not. I hated her with the kind of white-hot rage that is saved for your truest enemy.

Then two things happened, and I am so deeply in love with my mom that I practically have to pinch myself to remember this is Mom, not my best friend.

Okay, the two things that happened... first, I began to pray for her. I didn't want to, fought it like fire, but did it anyway. It took about a year, no kidding, to begin to soften... and then, out of the blue, she was diagnosed with cancer.

Talk about falling on the floor and having to pick myself up!

I remember the day I let the bitterness and anger go just like it was yesterday (in reality it was seven years ago)... I was in the kitchen, long before my first marriage was ending, and praying for my mother, and it suddenly occured to me that she had her demons and issues, and that she'd done the best she could with me (and I have my own issues and problems that she could not understand)... but most of all, I realized that *I* hadn't given her love for years, and I LOVED HER... I mean, it hit me like *that* - I could lose her, and she could think I hated her... I COULDN'T HAVE THAT. So I sat down and wrote a letter (like Pepper suggests, but longer... a super-letter)... and I began to try to see the good in her... and I prayed REALLY hard for her recovery...

Susan, I am in tears as I write this because I have been given a GIFT. I LOVE MY MOTHER AND SHE LOVES ME, AND THERE IS NO DOUBT ON EITHER SIDE OF THAT TRUTH.

I hope that this thread has given you the little push you need to mend this relationship - for you. I hope your mother can do her part to bring you closer... but most of all, you will be doing YOURSELF a favor by knowing you did all that you could to come together. If *she* cannot, or will not, do what it takes, you will have no regrets.

I hope I'm making sense... I'm super tired, but I couldn't let this slip by...

Hugs!!!

You make perfect sense. It is something I really need to hear.

My Mom has already had breast cancer years ago. And I lost my dad to totally debilitating depression two years ago.

You would think I would learn. I feel so selfish and stubborn!

Thanks for the nudge!

Susan,

You mother said </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> In my "birthday" thread I posted that my sister said she would bring my mother half-way here and I offered to meet them half way. When I suggested this to my Mom, she said "oh, but that would be a lot of trouble". </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Maybe it is because I had a grandmother who used to say that all of the time. OR maybe it is that I am a LOT older than you. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> But, I hear she would like to come IF you really want her to come.

I have also learned when women say "but that would be a lot of trouble." One had better take the trouble. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> It takes us guys a while to learn that one. So don't you be like us guys. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

Make the plans, tell her you really want her to be with you and your family on Christmas and tell her to be prepared to talk to your children. I don't know what it is but children will listen to Grandparents but won't listen to parents. Kids, teenagers, even 20 somethings seem to enjoy stories about how different things were.

Make your mother feel valued Susan, she is valuable to you.

Sheryl made some very very good points. My W lost her parents decades ago, and I have been down to one for 14 years.

Must go.

God Bless,

JL