TMCM, I live by that principal too. I guess I was hoping someone would tell me I could tell him to get lost. I know I won't move his things ,he can use their car. Truth be told they could both use their car. It would only take 2 trips to move all the stuff from the hotel to a house. Maybe 3 but no way it would take more than that.

I did goof when she told me about it and asked if OM was ok with me helping her move. I did love the reply though. "He doesn't have much choice."

He was worried and LB'ing when she would not stand up to him, it's got to be worse now.

DD wrote WW a 3 page letter last night. Wants me to give it to her mom on Wed. She just tells her how wrong what WW is doing is. How much she lothes OM, and that she loves her but is VERY mad at her. I am worried though because DD writes that she wants to meet OM to see why "You would pick OM over Daddy." I'm afraid that if WW sees that she will introduce them to each other.

Can I ask DD to rewrite the letter without that request. I can phrase it in such a way that she would want to do it, but should I?

I know that part of me not wanting them to meet is fear that DD will like him, but mostly it is to protect her from them.

So should I deliver letter as is. Talk her into rewriting, or talk her into keeping it for now?

Thanks D_rose, I'm trying.

<small>[ June 24, 2003, 11:51 AM: Message edited by: hurting12 ]</small>

Hurting I don't share your view that having DD give her mom that letter in which she wants to meet to the OM face to face, will become an opportunity for your DD to be charmed by that weasel OM. In fact, your DD could be instrumental in injecting a toxic dose of reality into your WW's fantasy world. Unlike you, your DD doesn't have to worry about love busting with her mom and OM, and your WW will see how much her choices have hurt one of her children. Be thankful that you are not the WS in this scenario, for it is going to be emotionally very hard on your WW when she is brought to task by her child.

Hurting, deliver the letter as is, straight from your daughter's heart. I take it she's not going to visitation on Wed.

You're doing very well. It sounds like your WW still has one foot on solid land. I hope she wakes up soon. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

I agree. Deliver this letter as is. DD wrote this letter from her heart.

Your WW is going to be brokenhearted by this dose of reality. If she is NOT brokenhearted, then something is really broken inside her.

Do not alter your daughter's letter. your daughter deserves a voice.

Pep

WW came over this afternoon. She needed her Insurance cards and to borrow some money for a Dr. visit. She had a migraine hit again last night and passed out at work.

I had no money at the time. Told her I would get it and take her to get the meds. Also gave her DD's letter.

Called her to tell her I had the money. OM answered and I asked if she was back yet ,as it had only been 15 minutes.

WW came over and tried to eat something but couldn't due to headache. Would not let me take her to Dr. (OM might find out) but did go and get some meds. I called 2hr later and she said she was feeling better, asked what I had made for supper. I offered to bring her some over as OM now has car at work. She refused, said she couldn't get rid of the plate and OM might come back on break and see me. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

This hurts worse than her leaving. My wife is hurting and sick and I can't be there to take care of her. <img border="0" alt="[Teary]" title="" src="graemlins/teary.gif" /> I know I know it is her choice but it still drives me crazy. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> He loves her so much but didn't even take a couple hours off work to take her to Dr. Let her drive around half blind and dizzy. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> I would love to choke this guy to death someday.

Anyways, WW was asleep when I called and I had to let her go after about 5 min as she was falling back asleep. They had given her a shot as well as pills to take.

DD is planning to go to visitation tomorrow. I'm glad she is. It would probably bring WW back sooner if she didn't but I don't want DD to lose her mom completely by shutting WW out due to "A" in case WW never comes back.

Here's a helpful Migraine site.

I predict your WW will have many more migraine headaches before this is over. Aquaint yourself with the material on this site, and you can make love bank deposits OM doesn't have a clue about! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

YOU are doing GREAT!!!!!

Pep <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />

Thanks pepper I used some of that today.

Not much to say about todays visit. All the kids went but the oldest D was the only one to spend more than 5 minutes with WS. I made her a nice lunch and she stayed the usual 75 minutes. All she wants to talk about is work. I can't hold up my end of the conversation because I don't work there. No LB$ but no LB either.

<small>[ June 26, 2003, 04:02 PM: Message edited by: hurting12 ]</small>

Where's the beef?

pepper,
it was a big vent with a question hidden in it <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />
Reading other threads now, calming down and will rewrite it later.

Hurting....but we love reading big vents! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Ok, a little more mellow vent <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />
WW and I still share a bank account. Both paychecks are direct deposited. She gave me her bankcard before she left. I withdraw her money and give it to her on payday. This has gaurarteed that I get to see her an extra time a week.

Last week she made 2 trips to the bank and wrote counter-checks for a total of $160. She didn't tell me about it but there was no way I wouldn't find out. She really did need some of it for food as OM is still paying fines and they have NO money.

Anyway, I told her this had made the utility check bounce and that I needed that money back. I would take $80 this week and $80 next, she agreed. Today she tells me she can only pay $40.

I know $40 is not a lot of money but I needed it. I already figured she couldn't pay any extra beyond CS next week because she missed a day this week due to the migraine so I really needed that other $40 this week.

I was good about it to her though. No LB at all and asked her to come up with a repayment plan for the rest that she now owes me (a little over $300). Then I came here and blew up <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Question? How much should I help her with money when I can? I'm a salesman so sometimes I do have plenty leftover and thats what I mean. I wouldn't help at all when I need it for the kids or anything like that. I don't want to enable the A but I want to be the white knight. Plus I now know that WS only had P-Butter to eat for 4 days last week and it made me cry to find that out.

There was a time 15years ago when I had to let her go hungry some so that we could feed the oldest son. It was bad. I ate every other day so WW could eat a small meal a day so son missed none. This lasted almost a month. I swore I would never let her go hungry again and I meant it by any means it took, I tell you that so you know how much it hurt to see her without food.

Since that time and now she has not wanted for anything you buy with money. If she wanted ,I got it for her.

So. I was good today and even made her smile during the 5 minutes we had together and the kids won't go hungry over the $40, I just feel used badly again and needed to vent a little.

Funny thing is I have missed her worse these last couple days than I have since she left. I'm not even sure if I love her anymore but I sure wished she was here right now <img border="0" alt="[Teary]" title="" src="graemlins/teary.gif" />

Enough for now, I might get on herev later and type some more. I have no one else to talk to except my family. They want me to move on so it doesn't help to talk with them.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Last week she made 2 trips to the bank and wrote counter-checks for a total of $160. She didn't tell me about it but there was no way I wouldn't find out. She really did need some of it for food as OM is still paying fines and they have NO money.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">They are also paying hotel rates on a daily basis for rent right? Do the math. They have plenty of money. They just spend it poorly. Peanut butter is actually fairly nutritous. I say put your shining armor away and let them live on their perceived love for awhile. See how far it gets them.

jmho
ba109

No rent is weekly. About half his take home. He clears about 400 and she gets 130-160 depending on OT. Of course all his fines get paid first then rent then car. Without his fines they are ok for cash. WW told me she thinks fines are about done and she only needs $80/wk. I should probably hold her to that until I've been paid back.
Now I'm going to empty the account on Thursday and just pay cash for everything until Dv. Then of course we will have seperate accounts. The reason I leave her on mine is I get first access to the money B4 she is even awake so I get the CS unless I'm foolish enough to give her some back <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Question? How much should I help her with money when I can? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Again, the answer is ZERO. Helping her/them financially is enabling them. She chose this path so let her walk it.

You're starting to fog talk. Keep your head on straight. You seem to be in rescue mode. You can't rescue her from herself. She made this stupid decision and she has to live with the consequences.

jmho
ba109

When YOUR bills are all paid in full, and YOUR ***children*** have everything they need, and also some of the little extra things they just want, and if you have cash left over after that, put it in a savings account.

The rainy days ahead won't be so bad.

I never recommend providing cash to anyone who intends to piss it down a rathole!

No sugarcoating today .... just the BEEF! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

You are doing Goooooood!!!!!!!

Pep <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />

Hurtin,

Here is a reality check for you. It is no longer your job to make sure gets feed. It is the OM's job. She took that job from you, although you wanted it, and gave it to him. Their financial problems are theirs. You job is to provide for you children and that means having electricity, heat, food, a roof over their heads, and lots of attention from YOU.

Do YOUR job, and don't do OM's job. Split the accounts, get the CS, and let them figure out how to open the peanut butter jar.

I know I sound harsh, but I also see why you are such a soft touch <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> . You care, and you do your best to meet you commitments. Unfortuately, your W and OM are not those kid of people.

Please think about this.

God Bless,

JL

Goodness JL .... you are just so much nicer than I am! .... I really am glad you're here to take the edge off some of my more pungent replies!

I admire your goodness.

<small>[ June 27, 2003, 11:22 AM: Message edited by: Pepperband ]</small>

Ah Pepper,

Trust me you are on the pulse of these things. I suspect my responses differ because of our VAST age difference. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

Actually, I thought I was being pretty firm with Hurtin. You telling me I am mellowing in my old age? My kids would probably beg to differ on that comment.

But, I had better go in for a check up, if you think I am getting soft. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> Heck, I know I am getting soft, that tire around the middle is no longer a steel radial, but a ole balloon tire. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

You keep Hurtin on the straight and narrow Ya hear. I do think you have been giving him very good advice.

Must go, thanks for the compliment, even if it wasn't deserved.

JL

Hurting - Pepperband and Just Learning are so funny and SOOOOO RIGHT!

Your obligation to save your M is to Plan A your little heart out...and you've been doing a great job! You ARE NOT obligated to help them with financial matters. Your wife chose to live with OM, so let him support her. If you give her money, that's just enabling the A and defeating your purpose of showing what it will be like if she continues on this route.

You just seem like such a nice young man, willing to do whatever to be a help to your wife. I find it hard to understand why she would think life would be better with this problem laden OM. She seems to still have doubts so don't make it easy for them!

How are you and the kids doing? Just to let you know, my granddaughter is 12...and very, very wise. Has your wife mentioned reading your daughter's letter?

Hope you're having a great weekend.