I have not seen or talked to my wife since I last posted, monday night was the last as on tuesday she went down to the hospital and has not returned. So for the last 5 days I have thought long and hard and still have no clue where this is going or where I want it to go. There are times I want the marriage and others I want her gone. Her actions tell me she doesn't care, and no oppurtunites are present to repair this mess. I'm still numbed by the turn of events and still can't think clearly, an empty feeling seems to be my only companion and I guess I'll have to adjust to it.

Another day has come and she has not come home, the more time that goes by the less I feel I know what to do. When she has spent all her time down at the hospital near a man who is in need how do I compete with that? How do you overcome the distance that is being created by such circumstances? I'm clueless except to be pollite when that time comes.

Gazz,

How long will you do the same things and expect different results? You don't understand Plan A...and until you do...it will not work for you. You must show your marriage to be a good alternative to the affair....if it isn't, why should she end the affair?

I must be dumber than I look,(and that's pretty dumb!) I have read plan A numerous times and have yet to see other than negotiation is the brunt of what is presented. Negotiate with the WS to stop seeing OM. Either I am blind as a bat and can't see beyond my nose, which is probably the case or I read it right and I have to negotiate with my wife. At the moment she shows no interest in doing that, no interest in showing her face around me. How do you show someone that you are worth staying with if that person has no desire to be in the same room with you let alone give you any time to sway her opinion? Please if any one can clue me in on how to bridge such a gap and open my eyes on how I might approach this I would be eternally grateful. Getting her attention right now is beyond my grasp, if I had any idea how to make her take a second look I would pursue such an avenue. I guess I must be one of those guy's who just doesn't get it.
Also I still have no proof that any PA took place and am still unsure of why she has chosen the path she has, for all I am aware of she really is not attracted to this man and he was just a welcome diversion from me. The fact that she does not want to be around me is obvious and I only have a small slice of insight as to why, but to change her mind I need an oppurtunity as I see it, and that is sadly lacking. Forgive my ignorence, I am just without ideas here.

Gazz, Plan A is also about getting them to the point where they WANT to end the relationship. It is much more than sitting down and having actual "negotiations." It is trying to meet the WS's needs when the opportunity arises, treating them in a civil manner and avoiding all lovebusters. It is really a program of attraction designed to attract her to you and away from the OP and an end to the affair.

Often it takes work to get the WS to that point.

THAT is the part of Plan A that you should be focused on. I know you don't see her much, but when you DO, you should focus on doing those things. The worst thing you could do at this point is move right to Plan B without having done a very thorough Plan A. The idea is to work Plan A for a while and if it does not acheive the end of the affair, THEN you move to Plan B. Harley, depending on the situation, has recommended Plan Aing as long as 6 months before.

http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi8113_ab.html

and here is a big hug for you:

{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{GAZZ}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}

and a smooch on the cheek:

****KISS****

and a smile:

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Gazz,

It's very hard to negotiate with someone who thinks they are in love with someone else. It is a negotiating strategy, but don't expect real negotiating with your spouse until the A is over. Plan A is all about your spouse....showing your spouse that your marriage is a better alternative than the affair. Here are some guidlines that cerri posted that may be helpful:

Plan A as Harley meant it to be...

Plan A is not (repeat NOT) about making the WS happy, or feeling good.

Plan A is NOT, contrary to popular (and very incorrect opinion), about "making yourself a better person," or "working on yourself."

Plan A is ALL ABOUT the straying spouse. In Willard Harely's ever brilliant words, Plan A is a stategy to end the affair and to entice the straying spouse to reconsider the marriage.

So, it has several elements that should be done at the same time.

First is to eliminate LBers and to meet needs as best you can... recognizing that the unfaithful mate may not allow the betrayed partner to meet needs.

Second is to CONFRONT the unfaithful partner with what you know. Doing so (of course) in a way that is respectful and about you... how you feel, how you are affected by the affair.

Third is to expose the affair to the scrutiny of the world. The lover's spouse or s/o, coworkers, family, friends, church family, children, etc.

ALL OF THAT is Plan A. And it should be done as much as possible simultaneously. (If you don't believe me call the radio show Mondays and Thursdays at 1pm Central Time and ask Dr. Harley for yourself.)

Plan A must have a deadline. It's called Plan "A" because there is a second step... aptly named Plan "B." Willard Harley suggests a max of 6 months for men and 3 months for women before going to the next step. If Plan A hasn't worked in that time, it's not going to.

(I challenge you to find anyone who has done Plan A longer than that and been successful. I define successful as the A ending, n/c promised and verified, and the couple working a good recovery plan which includes meeting needs, eliminating LBers, getting in 15 hours a week of UAT, and most importantly following POJA.)
--

--
Plan A is not about being a nice guy. Plan A is about ending the affair.... being a nice guy is part of that, but only part. That's why confronting and exposing are crucial elements of Plan A... and if you're not doing those things then you can't really say that you're doing Plan A.

~~~~~~

G12 Dr Harley recommends that the BS go to his/her doctor and ask to be prescribed anti-depressants to help deal with the emotional upheaval of the A(affair). The BS emotions could sabotage all his/her hard earned efforts to do a good Plan A by losing all control to avoid love busters (angry outbursts, selfish demands, and disrespectful judgements) and that's where the AD's come in to help the BS avoid doing that (emember that a Plan B can only succeed IF the BS did a good Plan A). The AD's will take a week or 2 weeks to kick in but when they do, you will feel an inner strength and peace that will help you physically and mentally weather the emotional storm.

Gazz,

Was just wondering how you are? What is the status of the cousin? Is he still critical and have you seen more of your wife? Sending prayers your way.

Thank you for your reply, the cousin is still in icu but is showing improvement, he may be moved in a couple of days. My wife showed up last night and filled me in on her cousin. As far as our relationship goes I have decided to treat her with kindness but also indifference. Our conversation last night was good natured but nothing else, I told her that I would help her find an apartment and help move her (We'll have to see if she takes me up on that one!) She also asked me to do some laundry for her and I agreed which is unusual since I'm not what you would call domesticated. So what I am going to do is show her that I have no problem with the status quo but I will be kind. Basically I'm going to turn this around and make her feel that I care but that life has a lot more out there also. I would prefer that she stay's but if she chooses to leave I have no problem with that either. We'll see if this has any impact.

Gazz,

Why not do a real Plan A....it sounds like you are not far off the mark anyway. If by indifference....you mean "detachment" then that would actually help you. But if indifference means "aloofness", I'm not sure that will. It's not a bad thing for her to understand that your life will go on without her, but it won't be good if the message she gets is that you would prefer it that. Please don't encourage her to leave the home if you are serious about trying to rebuild your marriage....that will only make it harder. Sending you sunshine <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Gazz12, I would also recommend you go to http://www.restoreministries.net/ and get a copy of the book for men. This is one book that has helped me to get out of the emotional mess I was in when my waw walked out the door. The funny thing is I never knew we had problems until she left and was unwilling to even attempt to try one thing to keep our marriage together. As far as I know there still has been no adultry in our marriage. There comes a point in time where you have to give up trying and let God work. Smiaj

Star, I am not going to encourage her to leave, I just offered to help her find an apartment. My idea is to be as plesant as I can and try to turn things around. My wife told me that she fell in love with me long before we were married, what I am trying to achieve is to show her that man again. Not one who doesn't care, but one who is not reliant on her! I found in the past that when someone get's to the point that she has that pleading or debateing with them just encourages them that they are right, and in the end normally pushes them for the divorce. I hope to show her I'm not for the divorce but also show her I will not stand in her way and get depressed about it. I don't feel putting pressure on her will make her want to stay. So I'll try and turn the table so to speak and show her the guy she fell in love with, kind, thoughtful, but also independant. Is this making any sence? Thanks star for your input.

Yes, Gazz....it makes alot of sense. Detachment and assertiveness is very much in line with Plan A. Separation usually complicates your ability to fill ENs....BUT I do think it is of great importance (and here is where many fail) to let the WS know that you are capable and prepared to live without them, even if that were not your choice. One of the big problems with separating however is placing them in situation where they don't have to daily face/confront the pain and destruction they have wreaked. That nice apartment gives her a place to eat cake....have her needs easily met in privacy by both of you. It is risky....but I don't pretend to know your wife as well as you do....still....I have reservations. I think you can accomplish what you want to without giving her the benefit of being able to live her secret life more easily.

Wife didn't stay long! Cousin's wife asked mine if she would go back down again to stay with her for the next 4 day's. That bloody family monopolises my wife's time like I've never seen before. Now even the cousin's wife doesn't give a d**n about our marriage. To say I'm a little p*****d off is an understatement.
This will not change my approach to how I treat the wife and she doesn't know that I am mad, nor will she. I even had the gaul to ask my wife to give this women some money to help with her rent! What the h**l's wrong with me? I need a place to let off a little steam so I hope no one minds.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">"I need a place to let off a little steam so I hope no one minds."</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Not at all, and this is the perfect place to do it because the last thing you want to do is explode in front of your W and then push her further away from you. So vent on brother.

Gazz,

Just checking on you and keeping up. I don't have any advice to give, but I know how exasperating family can be. Hang in there.

I decided that the wife spending all her spare time with the cousins wife was just getting to me too much, so last night I went down to where they were staying and knocked on the door. The cousin's wife answered and I asked if my wife was there, she invited me in but I pollitely declined and she went and got my wife. I then told my wife that I was going away saturday and sunday (which she knew might have been a possibility.)Which also meant that she would have to return to take care of our animals, she agreed, (all said in a very dignified manner.) This maybe juvinile but I just wanted to inconvience her. She has done everything her way with little regard for anything. I haven't got a clue what I'm going to do sat and sun, but I guess I'd better find something to do. I'm not sure if I'm giving my wife the right impression or if this falls under Plan A guidelines, but I felt I had to atleast break up the same routine.

Gazz,

I think getting away for a while is a good thing....and if it inconveniences your wife...well that's all part of facing responsiblity. Just keep hold of the LBs...if you do that you are fine. I would really like to encourage you also to let your wife know how much she is hurting you....it has to be done without LBs....but honesty isn't an LB, and it is a big part of Plan A. Sooner or later also, the cousin's wife needs to understand that she is 'sleeping with the enemy'. Witht he cousin so injured....that's a hard call...but she deserves to know. Good Luck.

Star! and anyone else who cares to voice their opinion, As my previous post tells I said that I was going away for the weekend and told my wife as such, but I didn't stray far. So today at about 7 o'clock I drove past the house and saw my wife was not there, so I stopped in to see if she left any signs that she had been here and not to my suprise but dissapointment she had not! Now 3 hrs later I am back after going to Salt Lake and seeing that her car is still there. Now I feel I really need to adress this problem with her cousin's wife. I plan on calling her on her cell phone and trying to make arraingements to meet, but if that fails then show up personally when my wife is not around and try and talk frankly as I can with her about this mess. Star, I know you think this is the next step I should take and I am starting to see this as the next step, but I do wonder if this will cause more harm than good! But I have to admit my patience and trust in my wife is at an end and don't see any positive or viable alternative to this mess! Any help even though it might be too late is something I would value.