Oh, and another thing. A daily grit thing:

My W said yes2rday that she just needs 2 get the last of the stuff back from RM that he was working on for the last report, then the next project is in someone else's hands, and they don't plan 2 use him.

She sent him an email saying she needs it back NOW, and that she's SERIOUS. She told me she'd drive out there next week and get it back from him herself if he doesn't send it. I must have winced visibly or something because she said "Don't worry, I'm thinking of taking my mom with me, and she'd be with me the whole time." She said this in front of me and our D, who is working for her as well.

There've been some major changes in my W the past 2 weeks since those emails were written. I have no illusions that she doesn't still feel the way she says she did about M, but I think it's clear she sees ME in a different light. Maybe she's starting 2 trust me? Heck, maybe *I'm* starting 2 trust me, 2! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

-2long

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Blind Sided:

"The only drawback in taking them is that they shrink your huevos!"</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Chemical castration to improve the marriage huh? A definitely extreme application of the old motto 'a better life thru better chemistry', wouldn't you agree? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

2MCM:

Ah, but at his age, what would he use them 4, anyway?

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

I'm gonna duck now!
-2long

2Long.

Never piss off a man take 'roids, unless you are dying (literally) to solve all your marital problems once and for all. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

??? I wonder what "Arnold's" look like now???

TMCM:

Was that "'roids"? Or "rrhoids?" Subtle, but important difference! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

Pepper:

That would only be important if I knew what they looked like be4! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

Thankfully, I don't <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

-ol' stbDEAD 2long! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

HA .... good one 2L

I sent you email @ work. Did ya get it?

P

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by 2long:
TMCM:

Was that "'roids"? Or "rrhoids?" Subtle, but important difference! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Yep one will kill ya while the other one is just a pain in the [censored]. The former will solve all your marital problems while the other one will just add more fun to them. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

<small>[ July 02, 2003, 03:14 PM: Message edited by: T00MuchCoffeeMan ]</small>

Pepper:

No, no new mail. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

-ol' 2long

I just done thunka somefin'.

No insults intended 2 anyone, but I've been thinking about this saying a lot, lately:

"The best revenge is 2 live well" (the 2's my edit).

This is wrong. There is no "best revenge". Revenge is not a good thing. Living well IS a good thing, but living well 2 spite someone who's done ya' wrong is not very high on the moral ground. This saying needs a revision:

"The best response is 2 live well" (but you can spell "two" if you want!).

-ol' 2long

"nasa" still work?

Pep:

It oughta, with the appropriate initials before and after it.

Try spelling out my name, 2. Sometimes I hear mail bounces if I'm abbreviated.

-ol' 2long

My **edit** address is still working, though I notice I erased it from my sigline yes2rday in all the confusion!

There, it's back!

<small>[ July 02, 2003, 03:44 PM: Message edited by: 2long ]</small>

OK

Aww man, look what I started! I guess these threads have to deviate into the "Funny Zone" once in awhile. That's good. Laughter is good medicine. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

By the way, just to make sure that this is completely understood, I am NOT on steroids of any kind, I was just joking! My heuvos are "normal", thank you very much! And, I have plenty of good use for them too Mr. 2Long! I serve-up eggs and sausage several times a week, if you must know! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Ok, I feel better now, the "steroid rage" has worn off. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

Keep doing what you know is best for you 2Long. It is encouraging to see that she addressed your concern immediately upon seeing your reaction. Being sensitive to your feelings is a good sign. Baby steps, but moving forward none-the less! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

2long,

Hey, long time no see <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> I haven't been posting much, mostly lurking, but I have been following your story.

I don't know how useful my input can be, but I believe that your WW just likes attention, she likes your attention, she likes RM's attention. To captivate and keep the two of them she will have to work the two of you in different levels.

Maybe she wants to keep a pull on ol' RM once the project is done. Attention can be addictive.

To be sincere, I believe your letter was very level headed and nice. You have the patience of a saint... or the patience of a rock, it all deppends on how you look at it <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> .

I believe she likes finding excuses to have a soap opera life, be the house in flames, be the marriage issue, hey, if she didn't like marriage at all, she should have said "You know what 2long? Lets get divorced, but still live together".

I think I once explained the tale an old taxi driver told me back at Europe. He said him and his wife were going downhill after years of marriage. They were unhappy, their kids had all grown up, and they just couldn't get over things and be happy like they used to.

They divorced, but stayed together. Somehow the demeaner of his wife changed drastically after the divorce was finalized. They reconciled, and live together as a married couple, just without her bearing the bourdain of being "legally tied" to somebody.

I am not saying that it is a bullet proof plan, but hey, weirder things have happened. I say, just sit down with your wife, explain her you don't want to live like this anymore, and what would she think of a partnership instead of a marriage. The rule of being faithful to each other should hold, but there would be no other legal or traditional "chains" around her ankles.

Maybe you have already done so, I have bad memory... 2 second memory at that <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> . But hey, I just thought it might be worth the try.

ALW:

Hey, good 2 hear from you!

I've ac2ally thought of that idea a couple of times, even recently. Be4, it would have been 2 hurtful 2 me 2 even consider. Now? Well, seeing as I believe even more strongly now than ever be4 that we are responsible for our own happiness, and I also believe that we are responsible for informing those around us if we're unhappy, I think about ideas like that with much less horror than I used 2.

Doesn't mean I want a DV. I really don't. And I have 2 wonder if I'd really want 2 live with her for long if we were DV'd but cohabitating. Truthfully, I don't think I would, but if we're destined 2 be DV'd, getting there with something like this idea might be a reasonable alternative 2 plan B, which would be amazingly difficult for me 2 do. (later edit:) It would also provide us a transition period in which we could decide what 2 do about our house as we rebuild it over the next 2 or 3 years.

Part of my feelings at this moment are affected by my reaction 2 an email from her just now, saying that RM just called her 2 tell her that the stuff he sent back got returned by the shipper AGAIN. I don't believe it, and I've told her this before on several occasions (mainly because there HAVE BEEN several occasions!), so I don't think it would be prudent 2 say it again, at least not until I get home.

I really need 2 get some work done this afternoon, but I may revise that sample email for mental exercise when I can... ...maybe I can make it in2 something I won't feel afraid 2 send.

-2long.

<small>[ July 02, 2003, 04:51 PM: Message edited by: 2long ]</small>

Alrighty!

Well, I've edited that draft. I added some stuff, and 2k a bunch of other stuff out. It's still 2long, so I'll edit it some more. Still don't think I'll send it, but some later version might be worth sending.

I added a sort of apology for reading her emails. I know most say it's okay for BSs 2 snoop, I accept that, and I've certainly advocated it in the past. I also realize that although this appears 2 be a simple case of invasion of privacy versus shattering secrecy, the fact is that, even though her emails were more secrecy than legitimate privacy, I did invade her privacy by reading them. Radical honesty works both ways, and I can't expect it FROM her if I can't give it TO her. What if I had found nothing but work-related stuff in there? I'd have felt like a jerk. Still do feel like a jerk.

Anyway, here it is:

"Mrs 2long:

I’m feeling icky right now. When you left for the airport on Sunday, my computer was still connected to your hotmail account. I read what you wrote to RM after I left [vacation home] for home two weeks ago. I thought we had a great time in [vacation home], but when you called me late that Tuesday night telling me that you were talking to RM, wondering if I was this “mole” of his, it really hurt my feelings. As I told you then, I have no interest in “informing” anybody about your affair. To do so would be vengeful, and I have no desire to be vengeful toward you.

I have been thinking about what you have said about never wanting to be married. I never meant to hurt you or insult your integrity or stifle you as an individual by marrying you 27 years ago. I looked upon you as my best friend, my lover, and the mother of our two wonderful kids. But if you don't feel those same things, I can’t understand why you would want to stay with me. It's not fair for you to live all your life wanting to be free and being stuck with something you never wanted. I want you to be happy. But if you feel trapped by being married to me, then lets take away the pain.

If, on the other hand, you believe I can become that best friend to you once again, if you believe we can make this a partnership where we both can be happy and grow old together watching our kids and their kids grow, then I would be overjoyed to continue being married to you.

I don’t understand how marriage is anything like prostitution. I am extremely saddened that you, the one person that I’ve loved the most in my entire life, the one person that I admire the most as I’ve watched you develop as a professional and mother at the same time, and the one person that I have adored most in all my life, would feel this way about being married to me. But I realize that, though I don’t understand it, this is how you feel. Perhaps more importantly, I realize that my own behavior over the years, the withdrawal, my negative, hurtful reactions when I felt attacked, while still enjoying the physical intimacy we share, must have contributed to your view of marriage as prostitution. I truly would like to better understand why you feel this way. I would like to address those things in my behavior that I have control over that contributed to this view, so that I can turn them into something positive.

You have chosen to stay with me even when I found out about your affair, and I have taken that as a good sign for the past 18 months. For that, I am truly grateful to you. I hope that we can “regroup” as a team, and rebuild our marriage into something much better than it has ever been. I don't want to make assumptions about how you are feeling and what you want out of life from now on, though.

I probably worry way too much, but my feelings have been battered rather badly the last couple of years, just as my behavior over the past 12 years hasn’t helped you to avoid having an affair. I just wish to know what you want, so I can do whatever it takes to give that to you.

-With all my love, always
2long."

Much better! (and I even liked the first draft .... this draft is very warm and leaves the impression of you standing with open arms, but not as a doormat)

I re emailed my thingy. iloveulove wise .... but SC keeps getting all the "large sized" emails bumped to him first ..... let me know.

Pep

Pepper:

Hey, that's really cool!

I think I'm going 2 edit that draft some more tomorrow. I'm glad you think it's good, though!

-2long

I look like my Mom, don't eye?

P <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />