Another reminder that I'm human.

Or, there really IS a God and I'm Job.

RM's uncle died, and since he was his father's "favorite brother" but his father can't go 2 the funeral, he asked RM 2 go "so that someone from the family would be there." So, RM won't be home this weekend. So, my W and her "chaparone" (her word) won't be going 2 pick up his results this weekend. So, RM's results will be even longer in getting returned.

When she talked 2 him yesterday on the phone, she told him she'd been interviewing out of state. Why is that any of his business?

I know. My W still thinks of him as a friend. But I think of him as an insult.

I "handled" the news well, though. I'm not going 2 influence her upcoming decision about the job one way or the other. It is her choice, and it might be a good one. I want her 2 make the choice, whatever it is, for all the right reasons (and our discussions about it indicate clearly 2 me that she understands the trades she has 2 consider). No reasons for "regret" or "resentment" caused by anything I say or do.

-Job

I was going to hunt you down today and ask what was happening, but you saved me having to do that.

I noticed I'm human too. I have feelings, and what my W does affects them. When we got married, I gave part of myself to her and asked her to take good care of it. Mostly she does.

Job.
Lost it all, but then he got it back double. Sorry for the middle, hope you get the same end that he got.

2long, I think about you quite a bit. I wish I could help more. Northnern Arizona is nice this time of year, 100 miles on dirt roads, and no through streets.

I bet you feel better tomorrow.

SS

Thanks SS, for the response.

Just being reminded that there are people, other than ol' 2long, that care about ol' 2long's fate, makes my day.

I'm feeling pretty much okay, but I do recognize that there's an upwelling of frustration that this lack of closure is going 2 be dragged on for a few more weeks at least. Particularly since I was told way back that the work-related contact would end over a year ago. I will talk 2 her about how I feel about it soon. Believe me. She has 2 give an answer about the offer 2morrow, so I don't want 2 give even the slightest impression that I'm trying 2 sabotage that.

regards,
ol' Job.

Oh, he's VERY human! I thought it was C3PO in disguise at first...but NOOOOOO!!!! Even kinda' cute! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

Don't wait too long to tell her your feelings.

You know what you're doing now. I trust you <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

2long-

This is a thought that flashed through my head. Not that I'm suggesting that you D - but in a way I thought it would be pretty cool if you ever D your wife-

You could move in with SC and the times would really be fun and enlightening at the same time.

I couldn't imagine a better pair of freinds supporting each other whne the times are as rough as they are for both of you.

Thanks kily. If it comes 2 that, I will consider it!

...I ain't shavin' though!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

-ol' 2long

Pep:

Believe me, I won't. I don't want 2 do THAT again so much that I considered broaching the subject while she was deciding about the job. I can wait a 2ple of days.

-2long

Good point kily!! They really are two peas in a pod SC and 2long.

2long, forgive my ignorance, but what are these test results that RM is awaiting? Some final work related thing that links him and your W?

And what about these job interviews out of state? If your wife accepts one of the positions, does that mean you'll all be moving?

I think it's very big of you to leave the decision about the job completely up to her. I hope it turns out for the best!!

Jen

Jen:

Peas? Pods?? I saw "invasion of the body snatchers!" <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

It's work that RM is contracted 2 do for my W that isn't done and the "stuff" he's working on hasn't been re2rned. His input is the only one still outstanding - 2months after the last "draft" of the final report was 2rned in. ...it's hard enough 2 be patient when a former A partner is involved. It's harder when the former A partner is a twit and a fool. ...was that a DJ? YEAH!!

The job would replace the one she's at now, which isn't going well for a bunch of reasons, not the least of which is the "twittering." It's a good job, in her field, with responsibility for qualified people. It's a great offer, because they acknowledge her credentials well enough 2 allow her 2 only have 2 spend 6 weeks of full-time work there, and thereafter she can "write her own ticket" so long as she periodically shows up 2 supervise the progress. It would detract from our working with our son on his problems in school, as well as rebuilding our house, and our M (unless she or I decide we don't want 2 anymore - I can sometimes imagine it as you've seen here, but I don't think she goes there much, which may be a very good sign).

I let her make this decision precisely because she's very good at what she does. She worked hard 2 get where she is. And it's the right thing 2 do.

-ol' 2long

I knew my ears were itching for a reason! Geez, I go away for a day, and suddenly y'all are planning 2L's move-in with me! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

We'd be arrested in less than a week! LOL!!!

Love ya', my friend! You are doing the right thing by allowing these things to happen as they should, and having the faith in yourself and your W to let her make her choices, knowing that in the end it will be the best thing for all of you.

And, like they say: Mi casa es tu casa! (And I'll stop smoking, AND you don't have to shave! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> )

I told her the "Job" thing. I don't think she's ever thought of this R with RM in terms of my feeling "impacted". Meaning, she's commented forever on how she's never gotten her chances, and this is all so unfair 2 HER. I think she empathised in a whole new way.

more 2morrow.
-Job

I told her the "Job" thing. I don't think she's ever thought of this R with RM in terms of my feeling "impacted". Meaning, she's commented forever on how she's never gotten her chances, and this is all so unfair 2 HER.

When it's late at night, and I am tired, I tend to be - not nice.

It's a good thing she is not talking to me. I may say: "Well, now's your chance. You can get a good job, and get rid of me all at the same time."

No, I probably wouldn't say that. I might say:
" If you are serious about not wanting to be married, you have a good chance to do something about it now. You can have a clean break, and get the things you say you always wanted. It would break my heart, but you are free to choose what you want."

I think from what you say, you have conveyed this alrready. Hard to know what to do, easier to wait and see.

I'm still praying for you, and for her too.

SS

Hey 2long,

Are you guys astrophysicists or somethin'? A long time ago, in a previous life, I worked as secretary to the Astrophysics dept at Caltech (in 1987-1988) - I loved it - those guys were amazing!!! But incestuous - I learned not to fear flying, having 2 chalk up the airmiles they accumulated in the 100,000's from flying all over the world, observing. I have no brain at all when it comes to physics - once I had to post a mailing of a paper on "Squeezed States" - of course, the title caught my interest and I cut and pasted my own version onto a postcard to my distant boyfriend (now H - gee, was that really such a good idea?) -

well - just want to let you know I think you are doing GREAT! Well, I believe there is a God, its just that his agenda might a lot of times be different than ours most of the time, but I thought I'd tell you something slightly noteworthy on my end - don't know if you remember last year (probably you don't, but you responded so flabbergastingly outrageously on my thread - maybe you do) - last year, H and I were in the throes of total marriage breakdown, and I had discovered H had a male friend who was acting as some kind of quasi-counselor, and obviously giving him pretty dodgy advice - I had e-mailed this guy (since he is a member of a religious order) asking for his help, and I got back this bizarre e-mail - I then posted a thread called Autonomy in Marriage - asking for help from the forum on how to respond to this guy. Well, I did respond to him, we had an acrimonious exchange by e-mail, with the result that H and I slept apart for the next 3 months!!!

Fast forward to the last 2ple of weeks - H and I have repaired our M - so far, so good, still some backsliding - I find out that this "friend" seems to have developed some kind of condition with his fingers going totally numb at the tips - since he works with wood, this is a problem, apparently after about an hours work, he can no longer feel the tips of his fingers. OK, I'm not supposed to gloat over other's misfortunes - well, I just think its strange - this condition prevents him from doing the work he has chosen to do. Then last week, my H tells me "buddy" thinks he's going to quit being a member of this religious order and go back to his home country - only 6 months after he took his vows to pledge his life to this order. Some level of commitment, huh? Well, I'm not exactly surprised - with attitudes like he has, the only thing consistent about this guy was his string of broken commitments.

I've just been praying that God would reveal this guy for who and what he was, and take care of him for me - get him out of our lives. Prayers answered? Maybe. He's obviously got a lot of problems to sort out and he deserves God's help, too - but it would be nice if he would go somewhere far from us to do it, wouldn't it?

Sorry to hijack your thread - just to show you that sometimes you do get to see someone get their just desserts, when they have done a lot to harm you.

Take care,
LIR

SS:

"No, I probably wouldn't say that. I might say:
" If you are serious about not wanting to be married, you have a good chance to do something about it now. You can have a clean break, and get the things you say you always wanted. It would break my heart, but you are free to choose what you want."

I think from what you say, you have conveyed this alrready. Hard to know what to do, easier to wait and see. "

You know me better than you give yourself credit for. I have conveyed those things 2 her. Usually not when I'm tired, but not always.

yes2rday we went 2 parenting group for my son (he went 2 group with the kids from our parents group). My W asked about telling him about things going on in her life, like decisions about jobs and such. We all agreed that she should ask him how he feels, but that the decision is hers alone. The C ac2ally said, at one point before we finished that the decision was OURS 2 make, and I quickly corrected her and said that there was no way I was going 2 influence her decision one way or the other. It was clear from my W's description 2 the class about the oppor2nity, that she felt she's been denied such oppor2nities in the past, or that she's been granted them grudgingly. Bull Feathers. It was I, 21 years ago, that encouraged her 2 volunteer on a project that essentially "launched" her professional career. She did the same for me a year before, and the rest is his2ry. Unfor2nately, revisionist his2ry since the A started 12 years ago.

I did not bring THAT up in our group, because it would have been out of place. The A and how we recover from it (and the fights before we really got anywhere) are very much a factor in our son's "problems" though. But it is up 2 her 2 decide whether she's comfortable bringing that up in group.

She talked 2 our son last night about the job, and asked him how he felt. He's very empathetic, and thanked her for thinking 2 ask him. (She commented 2 me afterward that she was a little surprised that he knew she had gone for the interview, and it 2k me a few seconds 2 remember that I told him where she was when he asked Monday night "when's mom getting home?" This didn't bother her, at least). She said he showed her a poem that he wrote about love. She said it was a very good poem. I was a little surprised, mainly because he's so quiet. But he is going 2 become a very good man if he keeps going the way he's growing. She said something 2 him about girls in school that he's had crushes on but have BFs, and said "it's better 2 have loved and lost than not to have loved at all". He asked "don't you love dad anymore?" And she said something like "we've all loved and lost", referring 2 our teen years. She didn't tell ME that she said anything in response 2 his question. But I might just be imagining that she didn't. In kind of a blue funk at the moment.

Also at the group, she quoted a "George Elliot" (Mary Anne Evans) plackard that she bought that says "It's never 2 late 2 be what you've always wanted 2 be." I found it interesting that the C didn't respond with excitement at the quote, which was in context with the job offer and decision. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think what my W gets out of that quote is what Elliot meant. In other words, I would add 2 that:

"Your profession is what you DO. It is not what or who you ARE. And though it could someday be too late to do the things you always wanted to DO (because of physical impairments with old age, for example), it's never to late to be WHO you wanted 2 be."

What do *I* want 2 be? My profession, hobbies, skills are all things that, at one time, I thought I wanted 2 BE. Now that I have accomplished many of those things, and particularly now that I've had 2 truly GROW since D-day a year and a half ago, I realize that they are just accomplishments. They may have bettered my life si2ation in many ways (but obviously hurt it at the same time, through "neglect" of the truly important things in life), but they haven't bettered ME. So, 2 answer my own 2uestion: I want 2 be an honest, truthful, forthright, empathetic and understanding, compassionate old man someday. Because it's personal integrity and morality that are important. Not what I do.

I woke up judging my W's "read" of that quote as indicating she's ac2ally a shallow, if intelligent and very capable, person. But that's not fair 2 her. It's more a reflection of my funk due 2 this nonsense with RM going on and on and on and on and on... ...I know that she's as frustrated as I am with it, because she says so. I just keep taking it all personally.

2day will be interesting. She said she'd tell the company her decision about the new job 2day... ...while she's at work at the old job!

I will work on 2rning my funk in2 positive thoughts in her direction.

-ol' 2long

LIR:

I hope I was "flabbergastingly outrageous" in a good sort of way! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Fascinating story. I sometimes feel like my W still "confides" in RM 2 much 2 get real help. She talks 2 him frequently, ostensibly about getting the work done, but it does bug me more than a little bit.

Last night, she was telling me something, can't remember what it was. Sort of a philosophical thing. She started 2 say: "I was talking 2 RM about that 2day" and quickly changed it 2 "I was talking 2 D about that 2day" but after she'd already said his name.

I realize I have 2 let her make her own decisions, and that her choice of friends is one of them. She's also saying, a lot, how frustrating it is dealing with him and his delays, so we're looking at a similar page if we're not on the same one in that regard.

One of her options about the job is 2 take it, starting week after next, go on our vacation next week (we're doing that regardless), and dump the RM problem in her supervisor's lap. Woudn't bother me a bit, but I did tell her that I respect her desire 2 see the project through 2 completion.

-2long

She started 2 say: "I was talking 2 RM about that 2day" and quickly changed it 2 "I was talking 2 D about that 2day" but after she'd already said his name.

"Honey, that's why I believe the friendship and our marriage won't work together. It's still there between us, keeping us apart - can you see what I mean?"

I think back on my conversations, and refine them for the future ( But - OK, I always use the stuff in the present, I admit it.) I have gotten lots better at bringing it up as it happens so she knows what I mean, because if I wait, she remembers it different than I do, and won't acept my version of it. If I can do it right when it happens, but remain calm and loving, she gets it better.

Sometimes she is still so defensive she claims it is "an isolated incident, in no way related to any thing I have ever done before, and I will never do it again so why bring it up?" But she still gets it.

SS

<small>[ July 18, 2003, 01:44 PM: Message edited by: still seeking ]</small>

SS:

I do my best 2 be careful what and how I say stuff 2 her. It's nice that I feel like I can tell her how I'm affected by things now, when I couldn't just a few weeks ago.

The ice is broken and is starting 2 disperse. I'm just not sure what's going 2 be revealed. Save the M? Or not?

She got some of RMs data sent via email by a coworker (who must know more about how 2 do attachments than RM does! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> ) during his lunch. He's going 2 send more in the evening. But the work won't be done for a while yet. Weeks at least.

Gadz, I'm sick of this. But I am looking forward 2 our week off next week. We always have a good time out there 2gether. And she needs 2 get away from this Micky Mouse outfit she works for.

-2long

"I can tell her how I'm affectred by things now."

This is your key toots!

It's not her responsibility to keep you comfortable talking about your difficult feelings ... your integrity will now not permit you to suffer in silence and build up all that steam and resentment.

Behold !!! ... the powerful MAN 'O MARS becomes a sensitive man who can speak his feelings without controlling the outcome!!!! THAT ALONE is enough to make one more comfortable with the idea of a benevolent deity! LOL <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Thanks for the vote of confidence, Pep!

It's still hard, but far from as hard as it was. I still worry about pissing her off, but not like before.

I like SS's suggestion. This "friendship" does keep coming between us. And if it were a harmless friendship, why not invite me in on a conference call or something?

She still hasn't made her decision. I almost wonder if it might be even better for her 2 stay where she is, fight for what she believes is right, get her supervisory role back, and take over writing proposals again...

But that's not what she really NEEDS. Neither is the new offer. That's full time. What she needs is time off 2 get her research project going.

Her decision, though. I'm just trying 2 hang back and let her make it - while not compromising my standards in the process.

Hm... ...nobody had any thoughts on that George Elliot quote of hers? She's pretty proud of it. I'd hate 2 point out my thoughts if they aren't what Elliot intended.

-2long

<small>[ July 18, 2003, 03:33 PM: Message edited by: 2long ]</small>