Okay

6 hours past previous post. Panic mode has set in already. H is at his baseball game. It's a double header. I left at end of 1st game to come home and get dinner ready. Planning to go back to game in a few minutes.

When I walked in the house, the old brain started to spin-----

What time is it in CA? 7 am perfect time to call her. He has his cell phone. He could sit in the dugout and call her. Just to check on her. Right --- with all the other guys around.

Will I be able to endure the constant worry of him contacting her again. Okay in all probability the odds are that he will talk with her again. Maybe even a few times. Maybe he'll never actually stop.

It will be difficult. He can call from his office all day. He has a direct line to the US. There is no printed account of calls from that phone. He has a secure "as in top secret" email account. I can't check it or they'll have to shoot me. If he wants to talk to her basically I have no control. i know this but it still kills me.

TSC

I like your name. But, without the e.

You had some good advice. I have been the one to do the recovery work. He was too busy coming up with lies for me to keep from discovering the contact.

I need to step back and let him do more. I definatly have a problem jumping into recovery and wanting to fix everything immediately.

Thanks for the tip on Wellbutrin. I think FH said he used that as well, but I may be wrong.

We need to talk some more. He needs to know that this is his last time a bat.

Thanks all

marykat

marykat--

is "tracey" a trigger for you? Sorry if it is. I don't know too many "traceys" anymore. Most of my friends call me "Tray" anyway. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Ask your H what his plan is?

Don't fill in the blanks either. Ask him what he intends to do to? When he gets the blank stare look----tell him that he needs to figure this out or your family has no hope of staying together. Please do direct him on the No Contact stuff. In my oppinion, this is a must.

I'll keep checking on you.
much love
tray

marykat - take what tsc said as "gospel". I had much the same thing happen the night my wife moved out. It "forced the issue", if you will. She told me that she expected to feel "free" but actually felt the exact opposite during the 10 minute ride from our home to her apartment.

As for Welbutrin, yes that is what both my wife and I were on. If you have trouble getting it where you are stationed, try Zyban (used for stopping smoking). It's the same thing only Welbutrin usually costs less because it not being "used" for smoking cessation.

Now, for the fears and imaginings. They are real, strong and will be something you battle with a lot. I did anyway. I still do occasionally, but as time has passed and the "backsliding" of contact eventually slid into no contact as the withdrawals lost intensity, it has become much easier to believe and trust rather than worry and doubt.

Just brace yourself for this behavior to be a normal, albeit disgusting, part of the recovery process.

And while I mention recovery....perhaps you might want to migrate back over and have a "homecoming" with the rest of us on that board. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Lastly, a mint MGB (is it a GT) is very nice. Just wait until you two get further along the road of recovery and take it out for a spin! If at all possible, have it shipped back to the States when the tour is up.

God bless, and now is time to be in the Scripture daily and praying for yourself, your husband, and your children. You do know that there are others of us out here who are keeping you and yours in our prayers with God, don't you?

TSC


I like your idea of asking what his plan is. He needs to take responsibility and help establish a way out of this for us. I feel I've focused on rebuilfing for many months and he was just there. He was stuck deciding between the 2 of us. He may still be deciding.

He was quite upset last night. Our D spent a while on the phone with one of my friends from the States. She's a liscensed mental health therapist who deals specifically with kids. She gave us some good ideas to help with our D. I'm afraid DD may have a problem with clinical depression. That scares me to death as I watched my Mother suffer with it all her life. My friend suggested that DD might do well on antidepressants. Maybe I could get a group rate/appointment for all of us.

It's not a new concept but my H was very upset when my friend stated that part of DD problem was the sudden realization that our marriage was not what it appeared. DD thought everything was fine (as did I) when H announced June 2002 that he had ow and wanted a divorce.

He was very emotional and said he's having a hard time holding himself together.

It's like I have to keep being the strong one. I can do it for now, but at some point he's got to take over.

I'm glad we have our appointment with Penny tonight. Hopefully she will give him some guidance. I'm concerned for his stability now.

H said he had a dream last night where we were driving very fast on a dark road. I was driving and it was so dark we couldn't see where we were going. He kept telling me to slow down. Hmm.....

FH

The MG is a lot of fun. (a bit of a money pit). I'm not sure if it's a GT? I know it's a 63 MGB Roadster. We lived in the UK several years back. Our neighbor there worked for MG. He got an old shell and rebuilt it from scratch. It's perfect. We shipped it from the UK to FL and then over here. It'll go back with us.

Thanks for the advice on Welbutrin. I'm going to have to seriously look into it or something for both H and D. Are you still taking it? Any side effects when you stopped?

Thanks

Marykat

<small>[ August 05, 2003, 03:45 AM: Message edited by: marykat ]</small>

FH

Forgot something.

I'll think I'll stay here just a little longer (GQ II). Don't want to jump the gun on this one.

I do appreciate yours and others thoughts and prayers. The support that I've received from you and others here is what has sustained me through all this.

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> Marykat

marykat - I was on Welbutrin for about 6 months, my wife much longer.

I stopped taking it when I reached the point that I thought that I could "deal" with highs and lows. Initially, after stopping the meds, I was a bit surprised at the swinging emotions, but they were nowhere as intense as they were initially after discovery.

Think of it like quitting smoking. The med helped deal with the cravings and emotional attachment, the habits of smoking. When the nicotine had been flushed from the system and new habits in dealing with stress had begun to replace the old habits of reaching for a cigarette, you can stop the medical assistance and rely on your "willpower" to complete the process. Oh sure, there may be occasional days when you get hit with a "craving" to smoke", but it is much easier at that time to tell yourself, "okay, I feel that way, but I don't have to act on it today."

Remember the idea is to have clear thinking that is not caught in the wildly swinging throes of emotional upheaval.

With respect to your daughter, if she is also suffering from depression, then a course of meds might be appropriate. Just make sure that the cause can't be handled by open, honest, discussions with her first. I don't like to medicate any problem unless needed, and then only for as sort a period of time as necessary.

God bless.

God bless.

Hi MaryKat,

I am so sorry you are having to contend with this situation yet again. I know what it feels like to be isolated in another country with no support. I live in England. If you want a friend with MB knowledge feel free to let me know. I do not have an email address that I feel comfortable to share online but we can think of something. At least if you needed someone to chat too I would be only an hour behind. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

I do feel awful with your H's attitude and lack of commitment. Maybe you can not monitor your H's phone line but my guess is his boss can! Just a thought.

Marykat--
Good to hear from you. Keep at it. Don't give up, OR give in.

How is your daughter? After you meet with Penny, let us know. If your husband finds out that her depression has a lot to do with his mistakes and choises....he will feel enormous guilt. Don't let that guilt weigh him down to the point where he is paralyzed. Help him to see that this should motivate him even more to be the man God wants him to be.
God bless,
tray

Hello All

We didn't get to talk with Penny. My phones were acting up and wouldn't connect. We'll try again this evening. Very frustrating.

H is well into withdrawal. Thinks he's the only one who has ever had such intense emotions. He's gone into work for a few hours this morning. He's going to take leave for a few weeks and stay home. He wants to go into work a few times just to stay on top of email and messages so that when he gets back after 2 weeks there aren't a million things piled up. I understand the logic of this; however, his calls to her were from work. This is going to be very difficult for him just to go to work. How will he be able to sit in his office alone and it's so easy to call her.

Question?

Did your spouse know of your postings here at MB. My H doesn't. I don't think. I don't know that I want him to. I don't belive I've posted anything here that I haven't actually said to him, but I'm not sure of his reaction if he were to come across this. Don't know that I want him reading this.

I wish he would read a few pages of SAA or pages off MB. Maybe I could download some for him. I don't want to put too much pressure on him. I scared it would be easy for me to pile way too much on him. Read this book, do this questionair, look at this website. Somtimes I think I've spent too much time here and know too much.

I told him yesterday that I wanted him to start taking some responsibility for the"plan" for our recovery. It shouldn't be let just up to me. I feel like the cruise director.

Last night after our calls to Penny wouldn't go through he knew I was depressed. He snuck into the bathroom and ran a bath for us both. Candles and bubbles. That was nice.

Starting day 3 of withdrawal.

Thanks

MK <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> (small smile)

MK--

I know where you are. You are hoping that this time will be different. It's so hard. Hardest thing I've ever had to do. One of the hardest things for me to accept(still is) was that blocking his cell phone, monitoring his e-mail, seeing his every move was NOT going to keep him away from OW. Ultimately, it was all up to him. His character. His morals. His strenghth to fight his desire for her. Sad thing was, I didn't trust any of those things...and rightly so.
So I was left to cling to the only things I could trust, which were the cell phone, the computer, time accountablity...etc. And thats were you are now. When you feel that there is opportunity for him to betray you, he will. At least that is our fear, right? Nothing I say will give you the magic to get over this part quicker or without as much pain. (Although I highly reccomend some anti-ds) Your husbands actions have left you with few good choices. Again, it is so hard. And I feel for you. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />
You must find it in you to encourage him, and support his "sacrifice". Because that is how he sees it right now. It will be hard for him to live without her for a while, but not as hard as living without his family. Not as hard as looking his kids in the eye and explaining how and why he broke every promise he made to you, to them and to God. Tell him you KNOW that he is better than all of this uglyness. ANd try really hard to believe it yourself. YOU can NOT make him better. Only he can do that. You just have to try to stand beside him, and take those steps with him, not for him.

Hope things are ok with your daughter.
God Bless
tracey

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">You just have to try to stand beside him, and take those steps with him, not for him.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">tracey and tracy - a rather good description of what a "help meet" is according to biblical principles. Bravo! Great advice!

Tsc and FH

What a timely post for me. This is one of the hardest parts for me. Telephone monitor. You're so right that ultimately it's up to him whether he calls her or not.

He's at baseball practice now and it was all I could do not to hide the cell phone before he left.

I have to drive 2 hours to take our S to the orthodonist tomorrow. H is on leave and doesn't really want to go with us. I'm not just thrilled about it either. I asked what he'd do without us here and he's at home all day alone. He said he'd go or I'd have a fit.

I haven't been as supportive as I maybe should have. I guess I've been deceived so much I'm positive it will happen again.

One thing is that yesterday he didn't seem that depressed. Does that mean he's talked to her? It's unreal that I'm disappointed that H isn't as unhappy as I think he should be. He says he can do this without drugs.

Our D seems better and a little more like her regular self. She's ready for school to start. We went for a long walk today and picked blackberries. I'm still giving it time regarding meds for her as well. I watched my Mom suffer severe depression her entire life and all the drugs. I never took Anti -D based on those issues I had with her. I have a hard time taking an aspirin.

I came up this morning and got online to check MB. I usually do this when H is at work. He doesn't know that I visit this forum. He's unaware of the support that I receive here.

Should I tell him? I'm not really keeping it a secret, but I'm not ready for him to read any of my postings here. Again nothing I've posted would be news to him, but they are a little private and perhaps not quite as sugar coated as I would put things for him. Opinions?

Tray

I'm going to go back and imprint some of your words from your last post regarding supporting him and not doing it for him. I forget how hard this is for him. I just want him to do it overnight.

Thanks

MK

marykat - my feeling would be "No" to informing him about MB. Right now it is functioning as a sort of pseudo-IC for you and you should view it that way....Individual.

There may come a time in the future when he would benefit from the site, but for now stick to talks, using the principles you have learned, providing him with reading material if appropriate. Just don't try to "force" reading on him if he is not ready for it himself.

I can only tell you my personal experience and that is that my wife does not visit here and has read very little of the books and information that I have read. But they have helped me to know what to do and what to say or not say. Our biggest help is our daily devotional time together most mornings and attending church together.

God bless.

MK-
I agree with FH. This is your place now. It would benefit him, but only when he is ready. He is not ready yet.
I would start with asking him to flip through parts of SAA, Torn Assunder, or HNHN.
Maybe that would help.

Best of luck to you. And LOTS of love!!!

tray

I'm still here. We're doing okay. No relationship/A talk for 2 days. I figured we needed a break just to enjoy each other. We have plans to celebrate a friends birthday tonight. Should be fun.

I think you're right about not telling him about MB forum just yet. If he asks specifically, of course I'll tell him. It is true that I use it for IC now. I don't know what I would have done without all of you.

"They're coming to take me away, Ha Ha"

He had to go into the office this morning for a meeting. I sure hope his fingers didn't do the dialing.

My lastest question of the day.

TSC is know you said not to contact ow. I'm not planning to right now but here's what I'm thinking.

I sure wish I had called her as he was on the plane flying from states back here last month. Wouldn't it have been interesting to hear her reaction to the fact that he told me he saw her to say it's over when of course he never did that.

What's he telling her that's not inline with what he tells me. Obviously he's been stringing her along as well.

I would like to tell her how seriously committed I am to this marriage. I'm not going anywhere without a fight. A big one.

Sure she could tell me a pile of lies. I wouldn't be looking for "tell me what happened on this particular day", not even "has he called you in the last week". I would just like her to know where I stand and that he has told me that he told her he wouldn't be calling her anymore.

Rather than call I could send an email.

I've told H that I still have doubts that he actually told her goodbye based on his history. He seems sincere, but I've sure been fooled before.

Also, if he really told her NC. I have no desire to give her a reason to contact him and no desire to hurt her further.

Opinions?

Thanks

MK

Yes.

And standing on the tracks yelling at the noisy train that keeps interrupting your peace and calm will make you feel better for a while, especially when you promise it that you will fight it for your peace of mind and peace and quiet in your life.

That is....right up until the time it reaches you and reality intrudes.

You can't change her or your husband. You can influence all you want or can, but ultimately it is your husband that needs to "move away from the tracks" permanently to restore the peace and calm.

As long as the train keeps passing by, the "noise" will continue despite any pleadins, or rantings, you might feel inclined to indulge.

Right now, it's a little less noisy with her shunted to a "spur" (half way around the world) but the noise still creeps in every now and then. Hubby needs to move the house away from all the tracks and leave her to the other trains.

MaryKat,
Reading your posts brings back alot of memories for me. I can sit here and feel the tension you must be feeling 24hrs a day.

No, I would not tell him about MB. This is your outlet and support system right now. He needs counseling by a therapist.

There are lots of signs, if you really look, for them to know if he is calling OW or not. One is that his mood changes from depressed to happy.
Thats how I knew that my EX was up to something. The withdrawel is hell for them its like going off drugs and it just depends on how strong they really are and if he is in mid-life crisis they don't have alot of strength.

I would look up as much information about mid-life crisis as you could. It really helps you to understand how the whole thing works. My EX had classic MLC.

I know you feel that you are on a fine line right now. You don't want to push him but yet you need to know if he is contacting her. Drives you crazy don't it. Just watch him closely, if he is contacting her again you will be able to tell.

Don't nurture him to much. I did that and well it just gave him the feeling that I would be there to take care of him and love him no matter what he did. You can planA without nurturing to much.

By my experience if I had to do it all over again I would have never let my ex come back after the first affair until I was certain he was over her. Having to live with him through withdrawel was hell for all of us. I still say he needs time alone to figure out what he really wants. Also you need time alone to heal and grow. I also had never lived alone until he left. You know what? I did great! Your kids will understand believe me.

You need to do what you feel is best all we can do here is give you suggestions. Just always remember you did not cause this, you did not ask for this and you should not punish yourself by living unhappily.

Take Care,

Jill

<small>[ August 08, 2003, 09:07 AM: Message edited by: jillybean36 ]</small>

MK-- Glad you have had a couple of days peace.
It's nice, huh??!!

As for your question about contacting the OW. I still say "no".
Believe me, I understand wanting to do this. I had my reasons too. I SUFFERED through for weeks until I didn't want to anymore. It was hard, girl.
Getting info from HER isn't going to repair your marriage. It won't make you feel better.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> What's he telling her that's not inline with what he tells me. Obviously he's been stringing her along as well. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Who cares about her?? She dated a married man. Let her sit in the hole she helped dig.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> I would like to tell her how seriously committed I am to this marriage. I'm not going anywhere without a fight </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Believe me, she knows.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> I would just like her to know where I stand and that he has told me that he told her he wouldn't be calling her anymore. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> I've told H that I still have doubts that he actually told her goodbye based on his history. He seems sincere, but I've sure been fooled before. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">And talking to her probably won't help make you feel better either. He has committed to NC. It is for you too. I would feel better about you contacting her if you just wanted to spit on her. (sorry, thats harsh). BUT for you to tell her anything, or ask her anything...I think it is a bad plan. She has no ability to help your marraige at all. AND contacting her, could make her call your husband.
Wait this out. It's too new. If a month or two from now you still have the need....we'll talk again. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Have a nice weekend!! much love
tracey

<small>[ August 08, 2003, 04:46 PM: Message edited by: tsc ]</small>

MK
Just a quick opinion. don't call the OW. I did that several times. It was like talking to a wall. She had a rationalization for everything that she did. Then she would call H and he would get upset with me for stirring things up. At one point she called ME psycho because I called her at work. Wonder why she didn't see anyting wrong with using the work phone to talk to him, but talking to me was just so unprofessional? Whatever.

You are wasting time, effort and your own dignity there. The speeding train analogy is perfect.

Just don't. Hang in there on your H contacting her. He is going to do it until the pain of continuing it is greater than the pain of stopping it and only HE can control that. This is the hardest time of all for me. Waiting to see what H is going to do. Trusting in the almighty that I will be OK no matter what happens, M or not. This is my lesson and I am still learning it. You are doing so great. Keep on the straight and narrow.

And keep MB to yourself for now.
Hugs.,
Anne

MaryKat,

I agree don't call OW. All it will do is to upset you and let her know you are desperate. You don't need that. Remember to alot of OP (not all) this turns into a game. They enjoy being able to steal our spouses away and after they have them for awhile its over. I've seen it alot.

Jill