My H has been distant for about 8 months. I found out about A in July. So I have not been out for dinner, movie, etc. for at least 8 months. I've been trying to work on marriage. OW lives down the street - she and my H go out every morning for breakfast, then many activities in evening and on weekends. Meanwhile I watch her drive by, primping, on her way to meet my H. I am in Plan B now. When I took vows, I made covenant with God and H to forsake all others till death do us part. I do not want a divorce. So here's the point: I have been asked out (to dinner, movie, and football game) by 3 different men. I am not "trolling", one is neighbor, one is a friend's brother, and one is guy I used to date - saw him at the grocery store. My question is can I go to dinner with a man? I loved being married. I do things with friends, but really miss being around a man - it is so different from being with a female friend. OR I am doomed to be by myself the rest of my life while watching OW drive by smiling on her way to see my H?

believer

Both Biblical and secular law recognize adultery as grounds to end a marriage and seek another.

The key word is END a marriage. Thus you must end it first before seeking the companionship of another.

There is no moral issue provided you divorce. However adultery is always adultery Biblical or secular when you become involved with someone of the opposite sex that is not you spouse.

It's a bad bad bad bad bad idea.

#1 you set yourself up for falling for someone, and waaaaay too soon. It's a big mess you NEED TO AVOID!!

#2 If you end up having feelings for another man and he returns those feelings...and you aren't divorced...you're having an affair yourself. NOT GOOD!!!

#3 I know it's hard not being with a man, but you need to learn how to be WITHOUT ONE!! If you do actually divorce, you still need to give yourself 6months to a year to heal from that (unless you have a very long seperation).

It sounds to me like you're trying to escape the pain of this situation by trying to get yourself in to another one. This is NOT a healthy way to proceed.

Yeah, I thought you all would say what you did. I guess I just feel like since I intend to keep covenant, I'm just at my H's mercy, I'll just have to wait until he divorces me. Life is good for me in Plan B, and I know I can continue for a long time. Guess it was just a fantasy.

Yes, you are waiting, but your life hasn't ended. I had and still have a hard time doing things I used to like to do, but sometimes I make myself go out. When I force myself to do this I usually have a good time. Go out with friends. No, I wouldn't advise going out with a person of the opposite sex, but go out with friends. Do some things you've always wanted to do but couldn't. You have alot of free time, so use it and don't just sit around and think about your H. I try not to think about my W, but I know its hard, so I make myself do things. My house is fairly clean most of the time now. I've gone bowling with friends a few times and it was excellent. I started working on some projects around the house that I've put off for a long time. Stay busy, work on yourself, act like you are divorced and go about your life. Just because we are waiting doesn't mean we have to stop living... Keep up your plan B. I think you posted in my thread the other day, so I know you know what to do, just do it. Take care and keep posting....

I guess this is the problem, to get down and dirty. I WILL keep my vows. I know that God hates divorce. Won't do it. Three months ago I was completely crazy and dying inside. Since Plan B. have gotten some relief, I guess to the point that I'm thinking of a life without him. I'm taking care of me, working on issues, house, yard, car, spiritual growth, exercise, etc. However, now that I'm thinking about a life without him, I'm beginning to think about men. Believe me, I have no thoughts at all about anything sexual. By the way, I am 55, not an old hag, but certainly not smoking hot. Anyway, I'm rambling. Just something I've been thinking about.

believer,

I think you are too hard on yourself.

I do agree with the others - that you will be much better off if you resist the urge to seek male companions just now.

But, I think you are putting too much power in your husband's hands by saying that you won't initiate a divorce. I'm not saying that you should or should not divorce; Only you can decide that. But, under the circumstances, I don't believe that it is morally wrong or in any way displeasing to God if you divorce your husband.

While the Bible says "God hates divorce", you've got to keep in mind that divorce was a very different thing in that time and place than it is here and now. No, I'm not drifting into moral relativism. In that society, a woman could not divorce her husband. Only a man could divorce a woman. When he did so, there were no legal structures which required him to give her anything. He simply sent her away, empty handed, without children or money or property or anything - like discharging a servant. It is understandable that God would hate that.

The "modern" divorce is a very different thing - and while it is horribly disruptive - especially to children, it is - especially in your situation, hardly comparable to the divorce which the Bible speaks about.

Think about it. Talk to your pastor about it. Don't be simple-minded about it. God loves you. When he said that he hates divorce, it was out of love for those poor women who were simply being thrown away by their husbands. Your husband has both betrayed and abandoned you. You are free to divorce him. God's sanction against divorce was intended to protect you, not to enslave you. God didn't chain you forever to an unfaithful husband.

This is just my own opinion and understanding. i would never claim to speak for God. (i would be terribly afraid to try.)

-AD

<small>[ October 18, 2003, 07:09 AM: Message edited by: AD. ]</small>

Thanks for the input everyone. Back to fixing up house.

Oh, I think you can be smoking hot at 55!! I plan to be!!! SMMMMMOOOKIN!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

SDFR-

question:
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Both Biblical and secular law recognize adultery as grounds to end a marriage and seek another.

The key word is END a marriage. Thus you must end it first before seeking the companionship of another </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Technically, I was wondering something that I thought you might answer. Isn't the divorced couple still committing adultury unless an annullment is granted?

Just wanted your thoughts...sorry for the hijack.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by hope4future:
<strong> Oh, I think you can be smoking hot at 55!! I plan to be!!! SMMMMMOOOKIN!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Ok H4future,
I read your response B4 I read Believer's and I thought WHAT!??!?! Somebody could be smokin' pot @ 55? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> Ok so I have so sloooow down and read in the right direction! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Now H4f, I expect that you are already one awesome lady. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Believer, keep working on you. That is the one constant thing in your control. The rest of the world could fall apart but as long as you keep your feet planted on the ground, you will be the one still standing when all the dust settles. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

take care,
L.

Believer - There are many here in the same boat as you; I am one of them...I'll wait, I don't want to initiate anything owards D and have that on my conscience. I know some of the feelings you're going through, and there is only so much house cleaning one can do! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> You're in a tough spot but hang in there!

However, I'm wondering why three guys thought you were "available". You're still married, right? Your post implies H is still in the house with you (but maybe I'm wrong). Were you asked out because they assume since he's acting "free" then you might be also? Could you be giving out signals and not realizing it? (Even 55 year olds can do that, I hope! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> )

Orchid - I also mis-read H4F as to say "smokin pot at 55" LOL

<small>[ October 18, 2003, 11:59 AM: Message edited by: avondale25 ]</small>

Kily,

Annulment isa Catholicterm, not a Biblical one.

Now, if you are speaking of God
s provision that a woman is bound to her husband as long as both shall live...then yes...even with a secular divorce, and all the paperwork...God still sees the marriage as still active...andthus both will be committing adultery upon remarriage.

The New Testament provides the way out for the man or woman who's spouse has been unfaithful. It is the church.

Some churches call it an annulment...as if it never took place. God doesnt see it that way. The marriage did take place. God did bind the two together. And He said only He can break them apart.

So, how is that done. Well, the passage that speaks to a woman (or man) is bound to their spouse as long as he or she lives is the key. No matter what, until someone dies...then you are still married to them.

But why then did Jesus say it was permissible to divorce in the case of unfaithfulness? Doesnt that contradict the passage about being bound as long as they live?

Well, God never contradicts Himself. And Jesus said He didnt come to do away with the law, he came to fulfill it. So, where's the answer?

The answer is in Genesis. God told Adam that if he ate of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, he would surely die. Well, Adam and Eve ate from the tree. Did they die? Not physically...at least not for a long time. No, the word usedfor "die" is meant to mean spiritually (and/or physically). They were separated from God.

This word "die" is the ofthe same meaning asthe word used in the New Testament when itsays you are bound to your spouse as long as they "live." That word "live" is of the meaning to live spiritually and/or physically.

So, a woman is free to remarry only in the Lord (meaning to another Christian) once her husband dies. Physically or spiritually.

So, what is spiritual death? Too much to cover here, but Jesus was speaking of this when he spoke of permitting divorce for marital unfaihfulness. And Hebrews 10 does agreat job spelling this out.

Now, the question still remains...who decides if he is spiritually dead? Well, the New Testament speaks of this and tells you to take it to the church. They are the ones to declare your spouse spiritually dead...not you. But again, that isa whole big post that I wont getinot right now.

So, if you are a Christian, youare boundtoyour spouseas long as they live...either spiritually or physically. If they die, then you are free to remarry but only to another Christian.

But first, they must be declared dead. Physically by a coroner. Or spiritually by the church.

Hope that helps.

In His arms.

Well I can speak from a Catholic perspective.

My father had an exit affair when I was one. My mother's side of the family were devote Irish Catholics. Indeed my grandmother only left the convent following a potatoe famine in Ireland and migrated to the US. If she hadn't I might be Baptist. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

My aunt is to this day a nun with 50 plus years of service primarily at Morning Star in Orlando FL.

I remember over the years feeling like our family was the black sheeps because mother chose to divorce my dad....mute point since he had moved away with his secretary and filed for divorce eventually marrying his secretary.

Still grandmother was angry over the divorce from what I heard over the years.

I remember hushed talk over whether or not I could go thru Holy Communion. I think they felt because of my mother's standing or should I say lack of standing in the church there might be some issues.

One of my cousins lived with a man for almost 8 years while he was working on having his first marriage annulled....took a lot of string pulling.
Without the annullment they could not get married in a Catholic church and the wedding would not be officially recognized. Ironically once married they divorced less than two years later.

So only in the Catholic church (and that maybe old) is divorce not recognized. And annullment is lone accepted way to end a marriage according to the Vatican.

So unless you are Catholic then you are not committing adultery my most religions. And if Catholic you must get an annullment first....unless there has been sine changes in the last 10 or so years.

Gee, thanks for all the thoughts. H is out of the house and has been for 3 months. We are Christians, active in church. I have not spoken to pastor about any of this. The reason everyone knows about H's affair is that we live in a small community, and when it first happened, I was crying everyday. No one could believe this happened to us, including me. I think the men that asked me out were just trying to be nice, but who knows, maybe they had ulterior motives. I just feel kind of stuck. Plan B has really helped me in that I'm getting on with my own life, and not obsessing about them. Before Plan B, H kept coming back and saying he loved me, wanted to get back together, etc. But OW was always in the picture. When I asked him what happened to marriage vows he said "I didn't guard my heart." So anyway, life goes on and so will I.

We are Christians, active in church.
Surely your H isn't still active in church while having an affair...did you mean this in the past tense (for him)? If he IS still in your church, perhaps exposing his activities a little more would help bring him around.

My H would have been "disfellowshipped" (kicked out of our church) had he not chosen to leave on his own. However, he is well aware of forgiveness and restitution to the body of Christ if he ever wants to change back to the Godly man he used to be.

I have not spoken to pastor about any of this.
I would encourage you to do so...if "everyone already knows" it won't come as any surprise to him. It would allow someone who is your spiritual leader to know how to pray more effectively for you. I would suggest you make an appointment with him and/or his wife ASAP. Prayers are good <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

So anyway, life goes on and so will I.
You will, and I know you will look back one day and see how strong this has made you!

I agree with the first few posts. You are still married, very newly separated, and have a H who is Christian. All these things should keep you from "dating".

I am 55 also and I agree totally with you about feeling like you may not have too many more opportunities to have a good marriage someday but haste does make waste. You have a lot to realize and work through before anyone else comes into the picture. And yes, I believe it is true that doing things with girlfriends is totally different than doing things with a man but there are alot of things I sometimes want to do. I do have to be alert,though, knowing that what I want alot of the times is not the best for me or even healthy.

Does your WS have any addictions? Did he have repeated affairs? The reason I ask is that in most cases the affair does not lead to happy ever after and could one day end. Your remark about him not guarding his heart seems to indicate he has been blindshided by a trap he does not know how to get out of. You should earnestly pray for God to show you step by step what you need to do. I spent almost 6-9 months asking God if the A was a catalyst for change in our unhappy marriage or was it my open door to get out of the M? God showed me that the door was wide open and He would help me walk through it. It came to light that my H was unwilling to work on our M or make any changes.

Again, it seems like your WS had a real case of not being alert to God's leading. He fell into the snare but he may truly want to get out someday. Of course, there is never any guarantee that he will ever want to reconcile with you so you have to continue with growing, living, and walking God's path each day for you. All in all you do need to heal, grow, be alert and follow God's leading and another person of the opposite sex will truly fog things up big time.

TW

believer - Perhaps you could tell us a little more about your husband and why you think of him as a Christian. Also, what "type" or "denomination" of Chistian do you consider yourself and your husband?

At your ages, I am assuming that your husband's walk with the Lord prior to the affair will have bearing on what needs to be done.

Also, why are you separated and in Plan B? What precipitated this and what has your husband been saying about your marriage?

I am going to hold off on comments until I have a better understanding of what is going on simply because the "advice" given to a Christian is different from what would be given to a non-Christian.

In the meantime, the short answer to your earlier question is that divorce is "acceptable" to God in the case of adultery. The covenant has been broken by your husband. God wants your marriage to survive, but if your husband continues in unrepetant sin, God allows you to divorce without sin to protect your relationship with Him. Should you later marry, it must be with another believer who is not "unjustly" available. There is no "annullment" that God recognizes that is spoken of in the Scripture, that is term pretty much unique to Catholicism. But there is "just cause", and that is adultery.

Lastly, are you in Christian marital counseling?

God bless.