Sarie

Just get it overwith already.

(sheesh)

M.

<small>[ December 16, 2003, 01:59 AM: Message edited by: Mortimer ]</small>

HI all.
All the messages in this topic were very thoughtful...My intention was to let the BS know that it wasn't their fault if their mate strayed.
You can't MAKE someone cheat on you if they didn't WANT to!

Diane, your message got to me the most!
It helps that you have been where I am, caring and loving another man knowing nothing can ever come of it!
I am going to try your suggestions; try to think of ways to please my husband and bring out more affection! (Perhaps we get as we give!)
I will re-post a part of your message here.

I am going to give a lot of thought to what you wrote and also of telling my good friend of 10 years that it is time to let one another go completely and to devote our thoughts to our own mates.

My husband is a lot like yours was, not very affectionate.(but a good honest guy)
Maybe I can try harder to bring that out in him.
Our talks are not very intimate or about feelings; more about his job, the kids etc.
I haven't a doubt in the world that he loves me.

I will be gone all day today with my sister and two daughters so this will be my last post for awhile.
Thanks to all
Love, Sarah

"You said that you did things for him....but you don't mention talking to him about your needs. My husband was very unaffectionate, and I found it extrememly difficult to communicate to him that I was needed more. After finding this website and reading suggestions from other FWW, (and by the way, I sounded a whole lot like you) I started POURING out love on my husband even though I believed I truely loved the OM but couldn't be with him. I intiated sf, and affection slowly and more often than ever before. I reached for his hand when I could, hugged him often, left him notes, etc. I have been amazed at the results. Now I think of my husband during the day, and wonder what he is doing instead of constantly thinking of the OM.

The posters on this message board are right about NC. Especially since the OM in your life is moving on...you need to let go. Send him a NC letter...you will feel so free after you do it. There will be moments (well, maybe more than moments) of missing and longing for him, but they will begin to diminish if you start pouring out your love to your husband. You have to do something to 'replace' the OM in your life....and it should be your husband!!!! "

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Sarie:
<strong> My intention was to let the BS know that it wasn't their fault if their mate strayed.
</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I hate to be blunt, and no offense but....

I don't believe you. I believe your sole intention is to ramp up your justification for not confessing to your husband.

Further, I wouldn't bother saying the above if I didn't already believe confessing is what you really want to do.

Sarie, it's up to you. But consider this, IMO you will eventually confess. I can see it in your writing. Think long and hard about it. Time does not lessen the impact of the initial wound on the BS. That wound is still going to be an open gash that bleeds horribly. In your situation, "time" is a germ that will only infect and fester in that first wound. Once you get it out, "time" flip-flops and becomes the soothing healer.

Again, no offense Sarie, I'm just calling it like I see it.

M.

I can honestly say that the longer you wait to confess, the deeper the wound. My H didn't confess his 1992 A until 10/21/03. The knowledge that he withheld this information from me for so many years is KILLING me. He actually said to me, "You didn't ask me if I was having an affair, so I didn't lie to you." He doesn't understand that the lie of omission is still a lie. It still hurts.

No, I didn't ask him if he was having an affair. I trusted him and thought he was being honest with me about our relationship all those years. During this A with a coworker, he was meeting OW for SF before work. He was leaving the house at the normal time in the morning and was home before I arrived home from work in the evening. There were none of the "signs of cheating" often written about. There was no reason to suspect.

Instead of being honest with me, he chose to have another affair that started five years later. Again, he did not confess that A until 9/17/03 and by that time our marriage had eroded to the point where we were living as "strangers." And he still doesn't believe his As affected me or our marriage because I didn't know about them while they were happening.

It amazes me how a person can be so oblivious to the pain they are causing others when they live in their own "fantasy" world, where their own feelings/emotions/thoughts are the only ones that matter.

Sarie

I'll tell you now I'm in a dark mood.

Sarie, for 10 years you have not loved your H, you have proved that you hate him. What you do now continues to show contempt for your H. The OM replaced you but still wants to keep your heart twisted away from your H. You say it was loving and caring that brought you and OM together, sure on your part. He niether loved or cared about you or he would never have had the A with you. He proved how good of a friend he was when he helped you destroy your wedding vows. He didn't care for you. But you still eat it up don't you.

You delude yourself that the reason you don't tell your H is because you would cause him pain. You did that 10 years ago when YOU decided to kill your marriage. It died when you choose to give yourself to another man. Its been dead for 10 years. But now your willing to do the little stuff to fix it. What next fetch his slippers, how about making him a nice cup of coffee. Sure that proves how alive your M is. I'm sure it will make up for every single time you and OM had sex, or confessed your love. You say you loved 2 men, again your wrong, you Hated our H, and you lusted the OM, the only one you choose to Love is yourself, and you even failed there.

You don't even show true remourse, if the OM called you over now you would go running. And your fooling yourself if you think that call will never come.

Do you want to redeem your M or just allow your H to believe in something that died. When will your actions follow your words. Go ahead keep this knowlege from your H. You've been very good at making "all the right decisions" haven't you. Why not allow him to have some choices, even if its choosing weither to stay married to you or not. Sure is a risk, but you gladly excepted that risk 10 years ago. The only thing thats changed is that now you risk losing everything.

SO are you going to continue to make your selfish choices, don't pretend to be doing this for your H, its all about you. After all it what you choose thats important right.

You can choose to continue to live in a M that is a lie, or allow your H the opportunity to choose to redeem the M or not.

<small>[ December 16, 2003, 05:16 AM: Message edited by: Silverthorn ]</small>

top-rope

you said...
I believe that some of the reply posts seen here, truly missed the message that Sarah was attempting to convey. It seems that she was truly trying to help the "victims" of infidelity. How? By showing them that they indeed are NOT responsible for whatever it is their WS choose to do. Perhaps many who have been hurt do not wish to Hear what she has to offer.

Sarie's original post was full of implications that other posters here encourage BS to think the actual acts of the affair are somehow the BS fault..

even when betrayed spouses do feel that way..other posters are quick to empathize but also redirect them that they never ever cause the actions of the affair...

She also tries to convey that people here tell WS to get over it...

which is not either how that goes...lots of acknowledgement..

H2o said...
one has mentioned the fact that disclosure can have serious consequences,very powerful emotions are released.Battle murder and sudden death are not out of the question

we did and do discuss that...If the spouse's reason for not telling is out of fear of physical retribution then they should not tell..BUT they also can not stay in that marriage for it is not safe....

Though no expert I think statistically there is little proof of a spouse who has never been physical or violent or showed poor impulse control to suddenly upon hearing such news goes so ballistic they hurt someone...
I think there have been warning flags all along that someone is capable of thus....
look at the number of people here that found out or were told...and though they may have had strong emotional reactions...none have taken it to that extreme...

Sarie herself has never said that she is afraid to tell him due to his physical reaction...if she were she would be advised not to tell...but to also leave the marriage immediately...
no one should live in fear of bodily harm in their own homes...

Sarie the great irony here is that your original post is how you husband met all your needs...and by the third page...we find out he's...

you said...
My husband is a lot like yours was, not very affectionate.(but a good honest guy) Maybe I can try harder to bring that out in him. Our talks are not very intimate or about feelings; more about his job, the kids etc.

see there it is..unmet need ..
husband doesn't know he's not meeting your need for more affection and deep initmate talks...

and never may know

Sarie people here don't deny that you didnt/don't feel deep emotion and love for your other man..
what I would deny here is that is was a fair love to you and him..
see real love is not so one sided based on availibility of clearing schedules, sneaking around, and deceipt..

real love is the ability to nurture one another on demand...not when time permits...and fear of not getting caught
real love is the ability to celebrate that love with friends and families not keep it a secret..

and when you and he the OM settle for less you both are settling for just refections of the real depth and power of love...

And in your ellusive search and maintanance of this shadow of love...you neglect your marriage...
it is the nature of the beast..
each second spent on the phone or computer or with the OM robs and steals you and your husband of ever having an honest deep committed marriage...
and so you are sacrificing so much for nothing that is tangible or real in the sense of being able to really ever fullfill either of you...and neglecting the exact relationship at home that has the potential to do so...

And I believe you are reeling from this..
that he left you to find real tangible walk in the light and left you in the dark...
and that you hold onto and cling to getting back together ..
I can imagine that you are very jealous of the new woman in his life...and that you continue contact based on that fact as well..
ten years is a long time..
ten years of neglecting your husband...that has become very known to you..
your teen-age like rebellion here is understandable.... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />
and yet we are really wasting time...
wasting time in you getting busy and creating the exact type of marriage you desire..
and no matter what..you affair was glorious because you created it and maintained it to be glorious...you fed it the energy and excitement it needed to survive...and then you want to claim it was that way on it's own..but it wasn't..
it was high energy and emotion..because and only becuase you both put high energy in to it..
the same energy you withdrew from your husband and marriage...

I am hesitant to go this route with you...to take it deeper on how you feel...because so much of your MO is still in the operation of twisting others words to meet your own agenda....

ARK

Dear Ark and others.
Thanks again for your thought provoking replies.

Ark, it is not the people here that ever blame the BS for their mates affair, they are always encouraging

It is the betrayed spouse that so often writes, if they had done something different, their spouse would not have had an affair, but that just isn't the way it is.
THEY SHOULD NOT BLAME THEMSELVES.

And what you said about me and the OM and being jealous of his new love is right on target.
For 10 years he NEEDED me, and I was his only emotional support. (And the love-making was beyond exciting, romantic and passionate!)

I needed to be needed by him and now that part is over, and yes I feel a void!

It is a melancholy feeling...I am happy he has someone to share his life with, since it could not be me, it is great he is not alone in his big ole farmhouse.

I agree that the NO CONTACT is going to have to happen soon....
And if I initiate it, perhaps it will give me the feeling of being more in control, that I am doing something to save my marriage (make it better, that is) rather than him doing the NO CONTACT to me, which would make me feel more ashamed for not having the courage to do it first!

Sincerely, Sarah

P.S. Thanks Just Learning & Lisa for your post to Sarie.
Sarie is my ID name, my name is really Sarah. (Sarah had already been taken.)
The thing is I am NOT Lisa's friend that is promiscuis and having multiple sexual affairs!

I am ME and my OM is himself; a special man and friend that I love very much, regardless if we have to have no contact for the rest of our lives!

I am going away for the day with my sister and daughters so won't be able to post anymore until tomorrow.
Love, Sarah

You all are THE BEST, MOST CARING, PEOPLE, the way you take time to write to hurting people, to help them get on the right road and do the right thing.
Thanks!

Sarie - please come over and talk to me on that thread. You may not be now, but I doubt my friend would ever have thought she was then. The point being, anything could happen to you to push you into another situation unless you protect yourself and your H from other As. But having said that, you are still in an EA with OM.

BTW, I was not for one minute making any judgement on whether or not you are promiscuous. That is not my place. I wanted to illustrate how things can get out of hand if you do not address the negative causes in your M.

Lisa

Sarie:

"It is the betrayed spouse that so often writes, if they had done something different, their spouse would not have had an affair, but that just isn't the way it is.
THEY SHOULD NOT BLAME THEMSELVES."

You PERSIST in MISUNDERSTANDING us!!! Why? Sarie, it is absolutely true, by YOUR OWN ADMISSION, that your H is partially responsible for the condition of your marriage. He isn't affectionate enough, so you sought that with the OM. This is NOT an admission that the BS is responsible in ANY WAY for the WS' choice 2 bone another person. YOU MADE THAT DECISION ENTIRELY ON YOUR OWN. Obviously. You certainly didn't ask your H, "would you mind if I escalated my 'affair of the heart' 2 an 'affair of the crotch' with my OM, whom you know nothing about?"

Sarie, you are DODGING THE ISSUE. Forget this nonsensical argument. Do the responsible thing. Restore your integrity. In the process, you just might restore your M, but you have 2 know that you might not. And you won't, so long as you keep going down these blind alleys and listening 2 the misguided advice you want 2 hear.

"And what you said about me and the OM and being jealous of his new love is right on target.
For 10 years he NEEDED me, and I was his only emotional support. (And the love-making was beyond exciting, romantic and passionate!)"

All a fantasy. Live there if you want, but I suspect you'd like a little reality. And some integrity.

"It is a melancholy feeling...I am happy he has someone to share his life with, since it could not be me, it is great he is not alone in his big ole farmhouse."

No, it'd be GREAT if he could be alone for a while. Long enough 2 learn the difference between being alone and being lonely. He doesn't know that yet. You, and now his new GF, were just a fix for his insecuriy. Not a cure.

"I agree that the NO CONTACT is going to have to happen soon...."

It's got 2 happen NOW, not soon. RIGHT NOW.

"And if I initiate it, perhaps it will give me the feeling of being more in control, that I am doing something to save my marriage (make it better, that is) rather than him doing the NO CONTACT to me, which would make me feel more ashamed for not having the courage to do it first!"

Mental masturbation until you DO IT. I agree with ark, you have little 2 worry about regarding your H becoming violent or putting your life or his own in danger from learning about your A. In the off chance that you're worried about this, though, talk 2 a councellor, one in FAVOR of you telling, and get them 2 set up a session with both of you present and THEN tell him.

Stop wasting your fu2re!

"The thing is I am NOT Lisa's friend that is promiscuis and having multiple sexual affairs!"

No, you''re promiscuous and having one sexual affair.

"I am ME"

Yes, and I'm sure you're a wonderful person when you're not fogged in. Right now you're confused and scared. This is no way 2 live.

"and my OM is himself; a special man and friend that I love very much, regardless if we have to have no contact for the rest of our lives! "

Hopefully, some day you'll realize that it's pretty darned difficult for a "special man" or a "friend" 2 take advantage of you. Impossible in fact. He is not special, he 2k advantage of your kindness. He's not a friend, he trashed that the moment he allowed his friendship for you become a secret from your H. But, yes, you have 2 have no contact for the rest of your lives, for your own sanity, Sarie.

best,
-ol' 2long

2ble post

<small>[ December 16, 2003, 12:25 PM: Message edited by: 2long ]</small>