I'm so proud of you for sending the letter!!! Hang in there and be strong. Like you, I felt my M was dead for a long time but it just needed rekindled again. My D-Day was 6 mos ago when I found out OM was dating off the Internet (mind you, his D was not completely final...how nice but I guess I deserved it). I still think of him every day--good and bad. Our A lasted 10 months but he was my first true love from high school and I had carried feelings for him over the years. I found when I let OM take over my thoughts it was taking away from my M.

My new year's resolution is to concentrate and get over OM and rarely give him a second thought (not easy to do when he calls and I continue to get hang up calls). I'm so scared that his new "friendship" will fail and he'll be knocking on my door again wanting to rekindle our relationship. He knows my vulnerabilities and I'm sure he knows how much I will always care, he's my addiction. I vow to be stronger and to give everything to make my M work.

You and your W should go away together and focus on each other. H and I did this and we had a great time, even though it was difficult since I was going through initial withdrawal. I loved him and even looked at him in a new light. Of course, we all get back into a routine and the reminders of OM haunt me. I'm so glad you have gotten out of your A before it got worse.

Someone posted here once--there is no decent man who would date another's wife. I held OM with high regard over the years and during the A but he tried to lead me from my M, of course with my obliging. That statement really hit home and can be applied to your same situation. How can a relationship of lies and deceit be trusting in the end?

H and I (along with our boys) are very active in church. I find such peace and it has helped tremendously. Our pastor spoke not too long ago and said life is like a movie or a book. Oftentimes, producers cut out the "bad" parts or chapters. I'm sure there are chapters you would cut out of your life, when you weren't following God's word and command and were not at peace within yourself. That really hit home--mine was definitely during my A.

We are all struggling together but this is the most emotionally devastating time of my life. What a lesson to be learned.

no1mystryf

I mean, I had the keys to her house and car while she was on vacation for a week during the Holidays; even fed her cat!!! Does this sound like your average affair??? I mean she trusted me whole heartedly... if I had been a thief I could have robbed her for everything she was worth!!!

so average it's like reading it in the affair book 101....

Joey without being mean...but brutally honest...
your actions were not those of someone that is trustworthy...
so where is the value in it???

Instead you and she robbed your wife of the truth of trust.......
see the irony...
no one can have it both ways...

sorry joey...
the fog may be thick...but under it lies reality...

I get that it hurts....
but living in deceipt hurts
on all sides of the coin...all parties involved..

ark

Well... it's a brand new day and I feel worse than ever that's it's over!!! I still don't understand why I don't feel any guilt, remorse or shame for the adultery??? All I feel is sadness and lost for throwing away someone I loved and someone who loved me. Something you said below really hit me... that is... me being in my late 40's, I feel like I had finally found my "first true love"!!! I was and have never been in love with my wife like this widowed woman even though we have been married 26 years now!!! I mean from the way she did things in her house, to the way we could just talk about anything and everything. My wife's first reaction was I had found this young, sweet thing! Actually she is 4 years older than I am!!! We were VERY discreet and smart during this time... I basically would go to her house avoiding public advertising. So, my wife would have had to hire a PI to find out because I was too careful. My wife, of course, thought our marriage was just about perfect because we NEVER fought or argued. etc... Sooooo, when I told her what had been going on this past year she was completely devastated, as I'm sure any one would be. It is going to be VERY, VERY hard to forget the OW... I guess you actually never will, huh??? We have been in counseling now 2 weeks but since we communicate fine... I can tell the Counselor is rather at a loss, I guess he sees such awful marriages, with fighting and turmoil that ours looks simple to get back on track. I assume some emotions for my wife will return some day, huh???


</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by no1mystryf:
<strong> I still think of him every day--good and bad. Our A lasted 10 months but he was my first true love from high school and I had carried feelings for him over the years.
no1mystryf </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">

<small>[ January 10, 2004, 12:43 PM: Message edited by: joey1960 ]</small>

Joey, I know exactly how you feel. OM was my first true love and always will be stemming from years ago, but is that kind of love real? I quickly found out what type of person he truly is. Posting an Internet profile? That is someone who is highly insecure. My God, he used to look at me with tears in his eyes over how much he loved me. He would call me crying and had looked at engagement rings 3 months into the A and we were both still married. The OP will say everything and anything to keep you close because a lot of the time they are scared of being alone. Your OW came between you and your M. You were her security and your romance was a fantasy. I was pretty easy to get over it appears but as it has haunted me, someday it will probably haunt him.

MB has taught me so much about myself and about affairs, withdrawal, addiction. It has taught me to try better in my M. I think H and I are going out tonight by ourselves to a nice dinner. We have spent more time together the past 6 months and recognize we need to communicate, just as you say you have done.

I'll leave my email and go back and erase it tomorrow. It is rjg2015@hotmail.com. I'm praying for you and hope that you hang in there. I'm being honest, your title caught my eye and it has reminded me that I can't go back, only look ahead with my H.

no1mystryf

Joey,

My WW recently told me she never loved me. So, in 17 years of marriage, she never loved me. Lets see, if she said she loved me once a month for 17 years, then she lied to me over 200 times with no reason to lie to me. Now I've asked her many times when we were getting along and not getting along if she really loved me, the answer was always yes. Hmm, has she been in the fog for 17 years? Just something to think about...

Love is not just about a feeling. All people in affairs seem to forget about all the commitment and security that a marriage is supposed to bring. Here's a quote from another website about marriages:
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">“Marriage is not supposed to make you happy. It’s supposed to make you married, and once you are safely and totally married then you have a structure of security and support from which you are free to make yourself happy, rather than wasting your adulthood looking for structure”. ….. Frank Pittmam

I agree wholeheartedly with this statement, and I would add that within the framework of security and commitment it is the obligation of each partner to figure out, and then do, whatever it takes to make the marriage a happy and fulfilling place for both spouses. ~ Penny</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I was reading a book by Dr Phil called relationship rescue. He said that your spouse or your lover is not the person that is supposed to make you happy. You are responsible for making yourself happy. So, if you are in a marriage and you're not happy, its not because of your wife, but its because you have lost your ability to make yourself happy. Have you ever noticed happy couples when they are away from each other. These people are still happy and enjoy life. This is because they have found that they are responsible for their happiness. When you are in a good mood and love life, you do things for people. If you spent that energy on your spouse, think how it would make her feel. In turn, she will do the same for you. That is why affairs seem so much like "true love" because you are willing to do things for each other that you used to do for your wife. I know you've been married a long time and remembering back when you first met your W may be hard to do. But, I guarentee you that you had some serious feelings of 'love' for her then. It can be that way again if you put the energy back into your marriage instead of some other person. Just my thoughts. Keep us posted on how you're doing...

To Lost Without Her,
Bravo on that advice. I never really looked at it that way. I wasn't unhappy before my A. It's just that the A gave me a short-lived high. I was more unhappy inside during the A because of the shame, lies and sneaking. You brought tears to my eyes.

Joey, I hope this helps both of us. The first month of withdrawal is the most difficult. It gets easier but you will want to be give into temptations because your brain is telling you that you miss the "high."

H just cuddled with me on the couch. We are going to a nice steakhouse tonight. I didn't even ask, he just made the reservations. When my mind starts to drift to OM, these are the things I remember the most and make me the happiest, not sneaking and lying to my H and to my children.

Joey, keep your chin up! This month will be really hard, like the others say. Just focus on today - not the rest of forever, and it will help. That's what I found worked. Sometimes in the toughest times, it was a minute by minute deal - "you can make it another minute, you can make it another minute..." I would tell myself. I knew that if I minute-by-minuted my progress, enough time would eventually pass and it would get easier. Also, keep yourself as busy as possible - don't give yourself time to wallow in your sorrows, or they just get worse. Keep yourself REALLY accountable to your W. Make sure she knows where you are all the time, call her several times a day, just to say hi. It will be good for both of you.

About never loving your W - like the others said, try to remember back to the very, very beginning. I always maintianed that I had never really loved my H. I must have fooled myself, married him for the wrong reasons.... But I made a very interesting discovery - I pulled out an old diary to start writing again by urging of my counselor. I found that I had written in detail about dating my H. I was shocked to find that I discribed our dating with the same exact high, infatuation, and excitement as what I was saying about the OM!!! How could that be? It told me two things, first, if I stayed with OM for 5 years, I probably wouldn't remember our beginning, and life would probably just be mundane... and second, I actually DID love my H once, and very strongly. It shocked me!!!

There was obviously some connection with your W in the beginning - it errodes so fast, and you never regain it unless you really have a reason for both of you to really work on it.

Good luck. Keep up the strength. We are here and pulling for you!!!

Felina

Well Felina, as you said in one of your previous messages, "I am not the affair goddess"... LOL BUT you do seem to have a REAL handle on what is happening since you have accomplished the NC dealy. At the moment I can hardly believe I have sent that NC email message and I can only assume, since we talked, chatted, emailed, texted, and paged ALL during the day, every day, that she has read it by now. I haven't heard back from her and sent it out Friday night. Ya know, we talk a lot on here about our BS's, oursleves but what about the OW or like in your case, the OM??? What about those people??? I mean, I assume, they have feelings, too??? I just have this horrible feeling like she is also devastated, ya know??? I mean we had discussed many times that this day may come and all... BUT I REALLY believed I was going to leave my wife no matter what happened between the OW and I. I guess I would at least like to KNOW she got the message and to know she is okay.

It is VERY hard for me to believe my wife and I can actually get back on the track now that this has happened. My wife is VERY forgiving and is trying hard to understand, etc... It's ME!!! I have NO, ZERO feelings whatsoever for her when she puts her arms around me and tell me she loves me!!! I am clueless why I can not at least have some kind of feelings... "like, this can work or maybe this will work out", or something!!! Simply numb towards her in every way. I mean I don't hate her or anything like that... I just don't have any love for her in an intimate way... That died soooooo long ago. Then I read on here how some men are dying for their WS's to love them, hold them, tell them they love them and here I am the WH and don't want my wife to touch me!!! What a contrast!!!

Well... you hang in there as well because I am sure you still have obstacles or days that are REALLY tough and you want to call the OM.


</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Felina:
<strong> This month will be really hard, like the others say. Just focus on today - not the rest of forever, and it will help. That's what I found worked.
Felina </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">

Joey,
Have you read the book Surviving an Affair yet? There is a story in it. Sue is a WW and she couldn't get out of her depression and her OM, Greg left her for another woman. Well, she went back home and she had no feelings for her husband, Jon at all. But, they worked with the rules outlined in the book and eventually she regained those feelings again. This is a quote from Sue's letter about her side of the story...

"As Jon kept depositing love units, slowly but surely the days I love Jon increased in number, and the days I didn't love him decreased. I still have a hard time believing that love units could make such a difference in how I feel. I have always cared about Jon but I now understand that my feeling of passion toward him depends on how well he meets my emotional needs. And I understand why I felt so much passion for Greg. It was because he had met my needs, not because he was really my soul mate. My real soul mate is the man I married, Jon. And now he stirs the same passion in me that Greg used to arouse."

Your wife can meet your needs and you can feel the same things you feel for the OW. Your wife is your soul mate. You picked your wife many years ago because she met your needs and you made a commitment to her. Let her meet your needs now and have the marriage you should have always had!

You are going through some serious withdrawals right now. If you haven't gone to your doc and gotten some anti D's, you may want to. Another good idea is to go on a vacation for a week or so with your wife so you won't be tempted to contact the OW. If you contact her, these feelings will start all over. You've almost made it through a whole weekend. The worst feelings last about 3 weeks, so I've been told. So, please hang in there, not just for yourself and your wife, but for all of us who are counting on you... Keep us posted...

Joey,

You are in some serious withdrawal from your "high" of ow. Hang in there, big guy, it WILL pass.

Did you read my post to you? I think it's on Page 4. You need to obtain and read one of the books I recommended for making a plan for recovery.

IF YOU DO NOT HAVE A PLAN FOR SUCCEEDING IN REBUILDING YOUR M, YOU ARE PLANNING TO FAIL.

Joey - yes wondering what OW feels is a hard part - but if you call to see if she's OK, it only starts again. She is human, too, and yes, she will grieve, but also, in time, she will move on. She knew when you started seeing her that you were still married, and that she was taking a risk of losing you, so I am sure that she won't take it as a shock.

I would also suggest, if you haven't already, delete numbers, email addresses, etc. from your cell phone and computer. I took a while to do that, and it only made it more painful, and easier to slip up (the 2 times I did). There were several times when he was still on my IM list - I would see he was online, not IM him, but just seeing he was on, and knowing where he was sitting, etc. made the withdrawals horrible. I have been tempted to add him again, just to "spy" on him, but keep reminding myself how harmful it would be.

With the no love piece - remember, right now you are operating on sensible decisions, not emotions. You will be numb to your W for a while yet, and you have to do things because it is the right decision, not because it feels good - that one was really hard for me - esp after living so long for the high. Everything is emotion, and very strong, and then you have to turn all that off and live by logic. Yeah, it's hard, but it does get better. 3 weeks sounds about right for the worst. Hang in there!!!

You can do it.

Felina

Well... since my last message I have kinda stumbled... I just couldn't stand it not knowing if she received my NC email or not??? so... I sent a VERY short cellphone text message early this morning to tell her again how sorry I am about it all. I have not heard anything back from her and she would normally respond within seconds. At least, now I KNOW she got this because it went to her cell. I am NOT planning to call her and talk to her, etc... or start this up again... I guess I simply wanted some kind of response that she did get my message and was gonna be okay...

I know you guys are gonna jump ALL over me for this but she is a human being with feelings that I care VERY much about... she is not a drug that I can simply flush down the toilet.


</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Felina:
<strong> Joey - yes wondering what OW feels is a hard part - but if you call to see if she's OK, it only starts again. She is human, too, and yes, she will grieve, but also, in time, she will move on.
Felina </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">

Joey,
I slipped up several times. I'm not telling you this to make you think it's ok...just letting you know that you are human and will not always do what is right.

You sound a lot like I did...she's a human being, with feelings...blah blah blah! In other words, I know how you are feeling cause I said and felt basically the same way.

But I finally did learn that by contacting OP I was hurting myself more than anyone because I was prolonging my agony and making withdrawal much harder. NC and pouring out love to your wife is the only way you will turn all this around. Good luck. Diane

<small>[ January 12, 2004, 02:44 PM: Message edited by: diane1223 ]</small>

<small>[ January 12, 2004, 01:39 PM: Message edited by: diane1223 ]</small>

Joey, we are not going to lynch you for a slip-up. I am sure we have all had them. What I see is that you are still on the right track. If you are willing to admit to us that you slipped, you are still thinking in the right direction. All you can do is keep moving forward.

Good luck. Hand in there!

Felina

Joey,

While it's true we are not going to lynch you for "slipping" - but DON'T use this as an excuse to think you are allowed to continue to "check up on her" from time to time.

That will only prolong the hurt, the pain, the deception you are showing your W.

Hang in there, Joey. AND - remember - from now on? Whenever you want to contact ow, you are to call your W and deposit LB$ units!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

OK?

God Bless,

Joey,
Have you told your wife you contacted OW? It is imperative to be honest with your wife even if it hurts both of you. Marriage is built on trust and unless you open up and be brutally honest, reconciliation is going to be very hard for both of you. Yes, you screwed up. Now be a man and tell your wife. Give her the honesty she deserves. After all, that was part of the bargain for coming back - total honesty, accounting for time, money and yes, email. By emailing the OW, now you have given her the idea that maybe you weren't serious about the no contact. How can anyone believe you if you do the exact thing you say you won't do. Go back to no contact, remove OW from your email address book, block email from her, block any messenger accounts you have, possibly change your phone number and definately change your cell phone number and any text message or voice mail accounts. This period of time is very difficult, as you can tell, but it is the only way to set yourself free and be able to reconcile with your wife... Keep us posted and come here for support, even if you don't like what you hear...

joey:

"I know you guys are gonna jump ALL over me for this but she is a human being with feelings that I care VERY much about... she is not a drug that I can simply flush down the toilet."

No, she's a liar and a cheat, not a drug... ...well, the A is as close 2 an illicit drug as anything needs 2 be. And the A SHOULD be flushed down the toilet at the first available oppor2nity. You can't end it if you don't end it. You seem 2 brag about your ability 2 sneak around on your W all this time. Well, con-bloody-gratulations. What a badge! You see? You're a liar and a cheat, 2. You and the OW are humans with feelings, alright, but you seem 2 think that yours are so wonderful and unique. They aren't. You need 2 stop thinking about your A with this woman as somehow a "victimless crime." It was never anything but an illicit relationship between a 2ple of clever liars.

Joey, you have an inflated opinion of yourself. And a twisted view of the kind of woman your W is. I think she sounds like a very courageous person. Try 2 cherish her tenacity right now. Because it might not be there when you need it.

26 years? And you don't think you've loved her for "sooo many years"? I don't believe you for a New York Minute. If that were true, you wouldn't have stayed M'd all this time.

You need 2 find yourself, joey. Your ego isn't letting you out.

-ol' 2long

<small>[ January 13, 2004, 02:29 AM: Message edited by: 2long ]</small>

Joey.
Don't contact her again, you say she has feelings and you need to know she's ok etc........SO HAS YOUR WIFE!
This OW of yours lost her H due to death, how did she feel when he died? Trust me she is giving that same pain to your W! If she knows the pain of losing a spouse, how the hell could she put another woman through that agony? HOW.......Because she is selfish.

Joey, treasure your wife, she is the one that deserves it!

Joey

It's me again. Like a bad penny! I left this post about 4 or 5 pages ago and I am still reading the same stuff. We slip and fall we get up and move on. It's painful but it is our fault. Yes our fault. I did what you did. I struggled. I lied. I cheated. I was killing myself, my wife and the OW. I had to find a way out. I knew it couldn't possibly have been with the OW. Occasionally I think about her. How can I not think of her she was the biggest mistake of my life. It was like she and I had this horrible automobile accident and we tried to repair our damaged cars and bodies together. We tried to keep the thing a secret after all we were both at fault the repair bills and hospital bills would be very expensive. We tried to nurse each other back to health but we didn't have the skill. We got the cars running again but they would never look the same. My W kept asking about my limp but I lied about that. When she asked about the car I said it was a hit and run. Eventually it got so bad that I needed help. The OW was tired of trying to give me a ride and my limp was annoying so she said, "I can't do this any more". My W had to come pick me up on the side of the road I tried to keep everything a secret but she had figured it all out on her own. With the help of many I was able to get back on my feet. The car almost looks as good as it did but we never go far from home in it. Listen to those who have been through the car wreck. They know how and where you should take the car to have it repaired. It will run again, it will look and smell nice. You'll be proud to be seen in it. One day others will call it a "classic" and wish they had one just like yours.

H