Sally,
Even a small swing upward is better than nothing. I think it is great that you are serious about the MC and that he is at least not totally opposed to it.

By taking the initiative, you are showing him that you WANT to work on the marriage and are not giving up. That provides some hope for him, and maybe some incentive to change some of his ways too.

Try to do one more tiny positive thing today....maybe leave him a note, call him, or give him a hug for no reason in particular. The little things add up...don't be afraid to take baby steps!

Hang in there. Diane

<small>[ January 29, 2004, 09:42 PM: Message edited by: diane1223 ]</small>

Sally, Your welcome, I edited it off just so the whole world doesn't know it - I'm assuming you wrote it down, but if not let me know, I'll post it again.

You will go through a lot of ups and downs before this is over. I remember my first upswing - which was followed by a whole week of depression and turmoil, but then I had another good day, and then more depression... but gradually, the good days (or sometimes good minutes) got a little closer together, until now, they are more frequent than the down times. (and I bounce back from the bad times faster, back to at least neutral instead of down)

Diane has a good point - you have to take baby steps. Focus on one extra positive each day - a hug, a compliment... Something that will make him feel you are still there with him (still there FOR him will come in time.) My motto became "just keep moving forward". Sometimes, the urge to turn around and run as fast as I could, was so strong, that I was all I could muster to just put the brakes on and move one inch. Have you ever seen a mile long freight train go from 0 to 50? I live on train tracks, so I see it sometimes. Even with 5 engines, getting started takes a long time. All the cars creak and bang together, all the engines have to be at full power, and it very slowly starts rolling. But once it all starts rolling, the time it takes to get to 50 is pretty quick - that forward momentum requires the hardest push!! Then the momentum helps push it along.

You are on the right track Sally, and going the right direction, just keep facing forward, take one more small step. You can do it! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Liza

Sally

Thankyou,

I do agree, baby steps. This journey will take a while. It is always better to face a problem.
By you taking this first step, your H took a step himself. Sounds like your both starting to walk together. Isn't it wonderful

I feel sometimes back at square 1, its a lie of course. Somedays you just feel that way. I don't feel it as much as at the beginning after d-day, but there is the odd day. But like the others have said, it does get better.

Time, Patience and Love.

Thank you wonderful people of this board.

TOday has been good so far....juststupid things like seeing white pickup (OMS car) just takes me back--HATE that.

I went out today and bought hubbys bday presents...ironically both their bdays are within days. I bought him some things he's wantedd for awhile. Didnt have the money but wanted to get all this stuff so the ol credit card tookcare of it. I know hes worth it so who cares.

SOmetimes this takes such a detailed focus, like a real pro-active effort to stay on track...cannot beleive that it is this hard to work through the withdrawl as well as tryign reclaim my relationship with my H.

Liza, I did not write it down..could you re-post your addy and I will be sure to write it down.

Diane...thank you as well for your words of encouragement as well as your address.

Sally..

Sally, it's Felina25@aol.com <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Sally, I can hear that you are coming out of the anger, blame, fear, denial stage of the withdrawal, and are starting to focus more on the M. Good job buying the birthday presents! I am sure he will really be happy with them.

Chug, chug, chug, creak, bang, chug, chug, chug <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> the wheels are starting to turn!

Liza

Sally,
My crystal ball shows you and hubby celebrating his birthday this time next year--much happier and secure in your marriage. You may remember OM's birthday....but it you won't attach much signifigance(sp?) to it!!

That is what happened with me. And it sure felt good. Keep taking those 'baby steps'....you may fall down once in awhile...but get back up and keep on trying.

Keep posting. Diane

<small>[ January 29, 2004, 07:50 AM: Message edited by: diane1223 ]</small>

Ok guys...I have aproblem...and please, I need real help here and not criticism ok?

Last night I had every intention when H came home from meeting (10pm) that we would make love (been 2 weeks or a bit more).

So, he had his hands all over me as if he wanted to....we kissed a bit....but, it felt as if I was kissing my brother....like had NO sexual energy at all??

Ended up I kinda shyed away from it and we cuddle (mucht o his dismay I am sure).

I need help here on getting that attraction and feelings back...what can I myself do to help? Is there any help for me regarding this??

Really bummed how last night turned out and Im sure H feels the same.

S.

Sally, I now how you feel. Don't know if you are aware of this little tidbit, but my H is 24 years older than me (I'm 30, he's 54), and during and after the A, it really felt like I was with my Dad, and it turned my stomach just thinking about it. In my very first post, I even said that the thought of being with him repulsed me - boy did I get grilled for that one - but I know exactly how you feel.

The last time we made love, a couple weeks ago, I cried. (H has low drive, and a cast on the legs really dampens things further.)

What I found now, is that, I actually wouldn't mind doing it because I feel that I have more of a connection with him emotionally. As they say, I am starting, a little bit, to fall back in love with him again. I think it takes a lot of time, but really work on the non-sex issues. The romance, holding hands, etc. I think, if you go to the counseling apt, bring it up there. The counselor can talk to both of you about it, maybe help him work with you both. I also have tried remembering the most enjoyable times with H in that area from years ago, and try to recreate them in my mind to remind me what we once had.

This, it seems is the hardest area to reconcile with. I have such a high drive, that for sanity, I just "take care of myself". I know with you, it is your H that needs the SF so badly right now. It could be, too, that you just making the effort, even though it failed, may give him some hope that things are headed in the right direction.

That's a hard one, Sally, and one that ultimately takes time. I hope that I get the true feeling back for H in that area, as I hope that you do to.

Someone else might have more concrete answers.

Liza

<small>[ January 29, 2004, 10:11 AM: Message edited by: Felina ]</small>

Hi Sally

I have to agree with Felina's suggestion of thinking of the past enjoyable times with your H. Things will improve for both of you.

Well back to shoveling more snow for me. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

I hope that things change in that area too....I dont know how long either of us can be in a marriage this way, especially him.

Felina, your H is much older! I was actually surprised to hear you say we are the same age--just thught for some reason you were older then 30.

Thanks guys,
S.

Sally,
This was a real problem for me too. I avoided SF at first (after d-day) because I was afraid I wouldn't be able to respond.

I think you handled it well--(by cuddling)
I believe as time goes on and both of you are less resentful of each other and growing closer emotionally, the sex will take care of itself.

For me, the lack of affection affected my desire to be with him. The communication that increased between us after the A helped solve some of that problem. I don't know if that is how you feel, but most women wanted to be loved and shown affection just "because"...not because a man wants sex. He may not really understand this. You may have to tell him in a loving way....

The book HN/HN explains it all so well. Sexual desire usually returns when the needs come closer to being met. At least that is how it has been for me. Diane

Hi Sally

Well, don't spend to much time dwelling on it. Sometimes worrying about it can make it self defeating. It will get better. Once you are through withdraw things will improve. Your doing really good. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> I waited on Poe for 7 weeks before she felt like having sex. Before she could tell me she loved me. She was in a lot of pain. Knowing she had been used, the pain she caused me, and herself. And, yes over missing him, not understanding why she did. For mew it seemed to be a lot longer. Sally there is a lot of hope. I'm sure your H can wait for SF, especially when he will know you want it just as bad. Work on getting closer, talk, hold hands, hug, kiss. If your inclined you could help H feel good without having intercourse. (sorry for SP)

Speaking for myself, I enjoy pleasuring my W, even if I don't get anything out of it but that feeling. ( <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> Yep no sex for me ath those times.) And, if we both find it pleasing that much the better. I love knowing that my W wants sex just as much as I do. Poe has also done the same for me.

Thanks Diane, Silver...

I understand what you are both saying. Diane, maybe if those feelings of affection were there the sex would fall into place. I just dont feel that is happening. He came home for an hour and never kissed me, I never kissed him eiter...when he left he said "while I guess I have to make the first move". I never thought he was thinkin that way.

As far as pleasuring other ways then intercourse, I dont feel like doing ANY of it. I cant even kiss him. I have NO desire to do ANY of it right now. I am wondering if it is just my libido period, and not him? HE wouldnt understand it if it was...hed take it personally.

I dont like things this way because I know thatbefore I know it, it willbe a month without, then 2 and so on.

Today I have done j**k s**t around here. Very down. Im actually feeling angry today....angry that my life is in turmoil and the OM is working on his M (W never had a clue he drove to another country one day while he was supposed to be at work) and not suffering that loss I am suffering added to that, the marital strife.

Gotta go to work all night, Im tired but theres supper to be made and kids to go get from shcool shortly.

Some days I think "why am i here?" I mean, you wake up, dot he same old stuff, go to sleep and get up and do it all over again. All that work, every day...I just sometimes think "why?" or "whats the purpose of life?" SOunding too philosophical? Just how I feel today.

Sally..

Sally, Sally, Sally.
You have 3 beautiful children: 9, 6 and 2.
You have a wonderful reason to get up in the morning to nurture and guide these little ones.

So you're not horny right now for your husband, so?
It is so easy to just give him your body for the few minutes that sex requires; and he will feel so much more like a man.
He deserves this much from you for all the hurt you caused him from your affair, agree?

Could you maybe get yourself turned on and then call him in to finish?
How about giving him some rear entry, doggie-style, sex?
It is easy on us wives if we are not in the mood and gives him much much pleasure!

You have complained how the house is a mess when you come home from work.
Will he complain to you today, that you have not done enough because you are 'depressed'?

It takes a lot of giving and forgiving to have a happy life, a contented marriage.

Keep telling yourself that today IS the first day of the rest of your life and make it a better day than yesterday.
Love, Julie
P.S. What are your plans for sending or not sending that e-mail card to the OM?
Maybe that is what is really troubling you?

<small>[ January 29, 2004, 01:51 PM: Message edited by: Blessed TIME ]</small>

Blessed;

Well, first of all, my H will KNOW if I am not into it....he picks up on that, easy...and if I am not into it , he will feel not good enough, or like my mind is elsewhere.

Second, you may be partially right on the email and OM. Its weird because I have more moments now, many more, where I think "f**k Om, he never deserved me". To just pitch m e out like yesterdays trash...I get SO angry that I dont feel like sending a well wishing email...so thats good.

Maybe part of being down is fighting that urge to send the email next Tues and knowing how WRONG it would be.

Theres also other issues...money, debt, not liking who I am, how I look, feeling ugly....

I am just really in a bad state I guess.....on the flip side, while reading your very post, my H called.

I told him it was a bad day..he was unhappy with that. I reitterated the need for a MC--he said, he still thought we could work it out without going to see one,and then said the funniest thing.

He said, Ive been reading up on marriage repair, ie ven joined this newsletter "marriage builders newsletter"! I never said a word, but he told me he could tell me about basic concepts and about htis guy Dr. HURLEY (as he said it). IRONIC eh?

I will see what he says tonight when he gets home ...if he expands on that thought.

Should be interesting..I still think we need a MC though.

Last thing Julie, we do it all, doggie, we have tons of "toys" so its not that I am not adventurous, quite contrary....just so not in any mindset for sex.

S.

Well, Sally, I guess we all just have to get to the place and instead of thinking 'Sh** Happens', think 'Blessings Happen'.

Sometimes we are so busy dwelling on our heartaches; we smother the joys of life.

I think tomorrow will be better for you.
I was having a bad day yesterday, kept thinking of my husband with the OW.

Today, I am listening to a book on tape ("Crow Lake") while doing housework. It seems to keep my mind more occupied and away from the other thoughts! (Tomorrow's book "A Time to Dance."

I am going to get a bunch more books on tape next time I am at the library!
Any little thing that helps us get through the day is a blessing!
Love and caring, Julie

<small>[ January 29, 2004, 02:24 PM: Message edited by: Blessed TIME ]</small>

Sally:

I left my WW for this reason. It is my hope that we will be able to forge a new relationship, but right now she is upset at me.

In the year after D-day, I went through a number of phases. Mostly shock-induced. At first I found the thought of me touching her to be repulsive, as did she. AFter all, I'd heard how much better the sex was with him, and for years before the A she regularly rejected me. But, as we tried to work through recovery, I found I needed to have that attraction for me from her. Sadly, it wasn't there.

The real epiphany for me was over Christmas. I realized that just because she didn't find me sexually desirable that didn't mean I had to be sentenced to a life of celibacy. Moreover, sexual attraction aside, we'd forged a new relationship as parenting partners.

I left because I want to find someone with whom I can share a sexual life. I am trying to get my WW to understand this is not punishment; I don't harbor any ill feelings to me. It's not a crime to not find someone attractive. In fact, I think it could liberating experience for the both of us, and allow us to preserve our relationship as parents of our kids by removing this obstacle. We can then focus our energies towards each other to building a non-sexual relationship. Personally, I would like to see us as "amicably divorced"; loving one another, but recognizing not as spouses.

Some here say stick it out; you may find those feelings one day. Maybe you will. Mind you, your H has told you it's over. Maybe it is.

Who knows? You two still have a relationship like we do. You still have kids. You still have an obligation to them, and maybe it would be for the best if you let him go to find someone else who would find him attractive. Maybe that way you could buil

(Sorry! hit the wrong button!!)
Anyways, as I was writing:

..Maybe that way you could build a positive platonic relationship in other ways.

As much as I don't think it's fair to either of you to be in some sort of "duty" or "obligatory" sexual relationship, I don't think it's fair to either of you to deny yourselves sexual lives.

Uphill;

That was a very different response then I normally receive here!

Well, after only about a month feeling this way, I would like to think that there is some hope to regain that sexual attraction.

Well, I really would like to work on this further....I dont want to find someone else to just have sex with..and I know he only wants me...he always says that. Fantasy he explores, but to actual find someone else for sex, I think he'd go without sex rather then do that. HE's very committed to me, I know that.

S.