</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Did you read heroswife's thread on exposure the way I asked you to?
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Yes, I did.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> WHY ARE YOU WAITING TO FIND OUT IF CONTACT IS CONTINUING???????????
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I thought it would be more obvious and easier once he moves out. Quite frankly, he's with me all the time or at work and that is a new job that he wouldn't jeopardize by not producing and fooling around. Plus, when he goes somewhere he calls me. Even yesterday, when I took my S to swimming I thought that would be an opportune time for him to be sneaking so I dropped my S off and drove back by the house. He was there, sound asleep.

I know I'm annoying everyone here with my reluctance sometimes, but I am living this and using my best judgement, I think.

The point of getting proof now that there is continued contact is so that you can use that to give him his wake up call to PREVENT him from moving out.

Getting evidence, confronting him and then asking him to move out and Plan B unless he agrees to send a NC letter and follow MB recovery plan.

Like we've been saying...WS's need a wake up call...irrefutable proof is sometimes that wake up call.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> The point of getting proof now that there is continued contact is so that you can use that to give him his wake up call to PREVENT him from moving out.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Forever, he hasn't denied calling her. In fact, he's told me that he can't promise no contact because of their volunteer work. He did say that it is no longer of a personal nature.

I do understand what you're saying though. I've already talked to a PI and the minimum cost will be $500. If I do it, I will have to ask my brother to pay for it. That is my main hesitation especially when there isn't anything going on that I don't know about, meaning I know they are not meeting eachother.

I guess if I did it and found nothing, my peace of mind would well be worth the $500. I'll talk to my brother. The PI said weekends are usually better to find stuff out.

What about first trying the suggestion of a small voice activated recorder under the seat of his car? That would cost lots less, then you could maybe hear if conversations are just about volunteer stuff, or plans to meet, or suggestive talk.

<small>[ March 24, 2004, 08:55 AM: Message edited by: 4give ]</small>

Any idea how much those costs? My H actually has one and I've tried to get it to work without any luck. I guess if I go into Radio Shack they can explain it. I should try that first. Good idea. My H actually used his on me after my A. Needless to say, he never found anything since I totally ceased contact. Anyway, I'll try it.

Question: everytime my H and I get close, the next day I feel like he regrets it because he gets somewhat distant. Any ideas why? Does he feel guilty?

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by wontgiveupyet:
<strong>Question: everytime my H and I get close, the next day I feel like he regrets it because he gets somewhat distant. Any ideas why? Does he feel guilty? </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Standard fare on the Waffle King menu - open 24/7.

WAT

Playing hard ball here.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by wontgiveupyet:
<strong>...he hasn't denied calling her. In fact, he's told me that he can't promise no contact because of their volunteer work. He did say that it is no longer of a personal nature.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">This means he places more importance on the LL board than he does your family, your marriage, and YOU.

OW is being divorced, right?

He may actually INTEND that their contact is no longer personal - giving him a HUGE benefit of the doubt.

But what's HER intention? Hmmmm?

What do you think, since she'll be a divorced Mom with kids?

I'll bet she'll bide her time - again, giving him a HUGE benefit of the doubt that he's not currently involved - and sink her claws into him sooner or later. He may be defenseless.

The only sure way to prevent this is to establish no contact - period.

Either he or she has to exit the board and then establish no contact whatsoever.

Left alone, it's hard to imagine that he's gonna change the status quo anytime soon. Worse case, they re-ignite their fantasy - once again giving him a HUGE benefit of the doubt that they're not there already - and get discovered one way or another by everyone else and MAYBE it won't be too late for you after this accidental exposure.

Or,

Expose them now, fast forwarding to the inevitable outcome.

Ask heroswife if you can borrow her poo fan.

WAT

I think I got one at Office Depot but Radio Shack works.

The other day you repeated again the OW said she doesn't want to be in the middle and this you interpret to mean that your H is the persuer. Although it may be true I don't buy it. The OW in my case said similar stuff about our marital problems. They don't want to be in the middle but they are just enjoying their own relationship with your spouse. She is just protecting herself. When you try to get her help or her side of this you are just aiding the enemy. You can not trust a word that comes out of her mouth.

Please remember it is not in her best interest to admit to anything. She is in the process of a D and her interests need protecting whether they are financial or child custody. Ditto for your H. They will deny as long as they can. Mine drove me crazy with the denial until I finally couldn't take it any more.

I hope your right about him but it still seems like a rollercoaster ride to me and your going along for the wild ride.

Tonight he told me that he looked at apts. yesterday. I guess he's found one but hasn't signed a lease yet. He said it would be a 7 month lease. I don't know if I can stay in this limboland for that long. He decided that he couldn't stay with his mom. Her place is too small and she would drive him nuts. So much for that. I guess he's going through with this afterall.

He says this is about him and dealing with the pain of our terrible M for the past two years. He says he's sorry for hurting me, but he needs to do this. I asked him why solving his problems require him to move out. He said because he wants to get away from the fighting in front of our S and my emotional breakdowns. I told him that the only thing we ever argue about is his moving out and OW. So, if he wasn't moving out and OW isn't in the picture, then why would he still need to deal with this by moving out?

I was very calm and told him I knew I could make him happy and help him to get through this, but he just couldn't see it.

I asked him if he would consider talking to SH before he makes such a big decision. He said it costs way too much. I said, "Isn't $185 dollars worth it instead of possibly risking the consequences of his moving out (what that will do to him, me and esp. our s)?" He said he would think about it, but I doubt he will agree to it.

WAT,Melody, Mthrrhbard, anyone can you make a post to Lostlove4her? That's the name he's registered under but he hasn't made any posts. He says he doesn't have any questions? I said, "Really? Do you know everything?" He laughed.

<small>[ March 24, 2004, 11:26 PM: Message edited by: wontgiveupyet ]</small>

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by wontgiveupyet:
<strong>He said it would be a 7 month lease. I don't know if I can stay in this limboland for that long.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Yes you can, because Plan B will end the limbo part.

Classic, classic, classic foglatin.

$185 is too much? - how much is that lease per month???

Beam this guy back up, Scotty!!

I recommend you STOP trying to talk him out of it. It's driving you nuts and as you can tell, the Mothership is in control. There is NO WAY that you can logic with him. If he goes - which I still doubt - it'll be a necessary step.

I'll get with Mel and mother and discuss your request. Maybe we need to recruit a male former WS for this. Should we use a 2X4 since rationality isn't available?

WAT

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Should we use a 2X4 since rationality isn't available? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Will you be in Texas any time soon? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

He just called. He said he is going to fill out the EN questionnaire I gave him a few days ago. He also said his hope is that we can become better friends through this so that if we get back together we will have a better marriage for it. I thought we could work on being friends within the context of our M, is that so unheard of?????

ahem.............guess who IS in Texas?????


Melody<-------ride em' cowboy from east Texas! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Take him up enthusiastically on the EN questionaire!

Did you fill out one for him??

Perhaps you can reel him in little by little.

No need to be in a hurry. Still 6 days left. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Wow Melody! Houston by any chance?

WAT, yes I have filled one out, but haven't given it to him. I was waiting for him to fill his out. He said he'll do it today, so I guess we can talk about them tonight.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">WAT,Melody, Mthrrhbard, anyone can you make a post to Lostlove4her? That's the name he's registered under but he hasn't made any posts. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Bump.

Did you guys decide on anything?

We're talking about it. Mel, my messages to you are bouncing. Please mail me at DCScandals@yahoo.com

Is he expecting a post to him? Did he ask you to ask us to post?

WAT

No, he's not expecting one. Do you think its a bad idea? He's very sensitive to people not understanding what he's gone through in our M and I've tried to encourage him to post, but he doesn't. However, I don't think he'd be upset if you did. Its WORTHATRY isn't it? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

WAT, I told my H he had a post from you. He was tired and did not want to log on so he asked me to print it out. He read it, agreed with a lot of what you said. But he said, "I'm not going to reply to this. Why would I want to talk to someone I don't even know?"

He liked the part about having a strong foundation. He said this is what we never had. We've always struggled with various obstacles and never had a solid foundation to build upon. He said we were never friends, we always had one problem after another. He said we are so incompatible. I said you can build compatibility by finding things you like to do in common and together, and by filling each other's needs. He said I tried to fill your needs but it was never appreciated. I said it wasn't that I didn't appreciate the things he did, it was just that those things were not the things that made me feel loved (didn't fill my LB). That made him mad. He said, "At least I TRIED!" I said yes you did. He just can't see my point of view. Its like he takes it as a personal attack. Maybe when he reads SAA and HNHN, he will understand what I'm saying. He doesn't think he can make me happy because he doesn't fulfill my needs. I said you could learn if you wanted to. I said I fill your needs in ways that you like (now, not before) and they are not things that come naturally to me becuase my needs are different.

I wish he could understand.

This is what I was afraid of - and pretty much expected.

He's twisting my words to justify his current mindset and rewriting your history. Very typical.

Steve Harley got my WS to read HNHN. She did. She used it to justify why she was so much in love with OM and why she and I as a couple were wrong from the beginning - almost 20 years earlier.

He's still very much in denial. He can't be educated yet. Nothing anybody can say will alter his mindset.

I suggest you stop trying to educate him and get ready to ask him to leave if he doesn't on his own.

WAT