I'm sorry you are feeling sick mom but you know,when I did it ALWAYS meant something bad for me and my WH.My intuition was so on target until this very day.

You have to prepare yourself for the long haul here.Your WH is still going to disappoint you, no doubt.That's why you have to keep those walls up still,protect your heart.WS's will forget to call when they are supposed to or may even just not FEEL like it.They still have selfish behaviors during this time.He may have called or taken the call from the OW this morning.Who knows yet.I don't think he thinks your stupid but he is still in the A.He is still acting on HIS behalf,that is his priority right now.

If I were you,I would not call him.Be CALM when he gets home and just talk to him about your feelings.Being able to talk calmly with our spouses in the worst of situations is nirvana.It is what we partly strive for.If we don't then it's an LB fest that takes it's toll on both spouses.

Ask him:(examples)

"Why didn't you call me when you said you were leaving the NH? I would have appreciated letting me know so I can make plans for dinner".

"I noticed a 6 minute call to/from the NH on our cell phone bill.Did you have contact again with OW?"

"Did you see OW today on your way home from work?"

So,if you approach him in a non threatening way but FIRM,letting him know that you care and ALSO letting him know that this continued contact(if it happens to be so) hurts you.this is NOT an LB,to let him know that his actions hurt you.You also have a right to know of his whereabouts.Part of the standard of a WS that wants to reconcile.It is necessary.

o

He is hiding somet hing from me. I know it. I just spoke to him and asked him if he talked to her this mroning. He says NO..But I do not believe him. I asked him why he hand't called me "oh, was I supposed to call you" (referring back to my first post of he conventiently forgets)...He said he would be home in 20 minutes and we would talk. He said this is not the time or the place...Why not? That is what he does, he never wants to talk anymore. I told him I am getting a bad vibe from him.

Why should I trust him...I asked him this the other night....should I trust you? NOOO, do youreally think that the trust is going to come back over night...NOOOOO. And as long as he is sneaking around and hiding things...you know maybe I wouldn't be so paranoid had he not admitted to me that he is not telling me things.

OH, I am so bad at LBing...I dont want to, I really dont...but i cant stop mysefl. I can see us...me just LBing him up and down when we talk. I need hlep...How can I approach this without LBing. HELP

Mom,

If you are going to LB when your WH gets home then physically take your self OUT of the home.It is infinitely better to not be there with WH if you can't hold your tongue then it is to be there and continue to help destroy your own marriage.Go back home later when you feel more calm OR go outside and play with the kids or something until you think you could rejoin your WH and talk.

Try to keep telling yourself that his behavior is to be *expected.If you do,then you might not feel so badly and paranoid about having to keep track of WH.If you expect it and know that it's par for the course,then it takes a bit of the wind out of it's sails.I had to do the same thing.I could have really psyched myself out if I kept thinking of the secretive behavior of my WH.You can address that in calm moments and in MC if you are going to go but NOT if you LB.

O

<small>[ April 09, 2004, 02:23 PM: Message edited by: Octobergirl ]</small>

Mom,

I see we share many of the same qualities. Have you run your list of activities past SH?

You see I did what you were doing - tried to be my H's coach. The goal is that you and your H will be each other's coaches - but not right now.

SH told me I was impeding progress everytime I tried to do his job. Your job is to make & follow your plan. Leave H's plan to him and SH.

I can't believe you're already discussing POJA.

That didn't come up with H & I in counseling for several months.

I know what you're doing; you want recovery fast...well in the beginning things don't move fast at all. We struggled for months alone on writing the recovery plan. Had had to run a few versions past SH before SH found it acceptable.

I just don't want to see you shoot yourself in the foot and/or drive your H away from his recovery.

Back to my main question...does SH approve of the actions you're taking? If so great; if not stick to the homework he assigns.

Mom, see why I'm telling you to detach and you work your plan? Your plan needs to have one focus right now. And that is stop LBing. Remember what I said that SH told me regarding his #1 rule?

It's Safety 1st. If you don't make "you" a safe person for your H to be with; NOTHING else can work. You're currently not safe for your H to be with.

Trust SH...he will cover everything that your H is doing....but he'll do it with your H. Have faith in the process and faith in SH.

SH had to back my H in a corner a few times and hold him accountable for his behavior. I guarantee he will do the same with your H. Just keep notes on what your H is doing that bothers you and what I did is that I faxed my notes to SH ahead of our appointment so he would have them to discuss.

Detach, detach, detach...stop reacting - regardless of what he's done your actions are making things worse.

This is the counter-intuitive stuff that is so very hard to grasp. Your LBing, and lack of self control is hurting your marriage and your recovery.

In fact I suggest you stop any relationship discussions until you've proven to yourself you won't LB. My concern is that your behavior is driving your H back into the arms of OW. Who I can assure you is not LBing him.

Have fun, be loving, meet his top ENs. You're not out of the woods yet; he's not NC, he's suffering from withdrawal - don't give him motivation to be with OW

<small>[ April 09, 2004, 03:16 PM: Message edited by: CSue ]</small>

again, i'm no expert but i can't help but shake my head a lot today when i read your posts. Everyone who has replied to you has had a lot of good points and i would say that you almost need an emergency session w/SH if you cannot control your behavior. remember what we say isn't necessarily an LB it's HOW we say it and HOW we react. the only person you can control is YOU!!

do not rush things, we were all so happy to hear that your H decided to come back and was posting here but remember all the words of caution? take heed, i continually write stuff down about what i want to ask or talk to SH do that. write it over and over so that it's "perfect" and then when you talk to SH check things off and don't be afraid to ask him anything. pray for me as i pray for you and take a breath.

OK, Unfortunately H came home before I got to read your posts. BUT, we are ok. I didn't LB him...too badly anyway <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> Actually, when he came home we hugged each other and I asked him if he stoped to see her on teh way home...he said NO. I said You PROMISE me...and he said YES, I promise you. I told him I didnt' know why I was being so insecure today, but I was very paranoid. All I want is for you to be honest with me. He explained the phone call this morning...he was put on hold. And I didn't even have to tell him that I saw it on the bill...

then we went to the shed to get some things. I told him that we would probably be going to San Fransisco in a few weeks and told him why. He was a bit surprised, but I told him SH would talk to us about it on Tuesday.

THEN on the way home he brings up this personal trainer of mine...good looking, muscular, young (31) and nice. he is edgining me on to run to him or something. I finally asked him...

"do you WANT me to have an affair on you" and he came back with...

"Yeah, cuz I want to feel what you are going thru...I want to feel what it is like to be in your position...also, if you did it, you wouldn't have anything on me anymore" <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

WHAT???

I told him that at this point he WOULD NOT feel what I am going thru...And he didn't WANT to feel what i was going thru cuz it is the absolute worst feeling you could have...Plus I would NEVER cheat on my H, not even in these circumstances.

he also mentioned something about me being such a loyal, understand and loving wife to him even thru all this, him being a cheating husband. I also said that this cheating H and loyal wife will have a long talk tonight. About honesty and the PLAN. He is going to write out his plan tonight...that is HIS HW. and we are supposed to do it together. Also, I am going to let him know how important it is for him to be completely HONEST with me now.

do you agree with that?

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by momto3boys:
<strong>
do you agree with that? </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">mt3b,
I haven't posted to you much, I've kind of watched your situation from afar, and to be honest, I am somewhat envious, that you are able to see, touch and feel your foggy WH/FWH every day. I consider you lucky. You asked if we agree. I'm not sure what you're asking if we agree with, but I'll tell you what I disagree with. The talk, the homework, all of that. If I'm in your situation, here's how I would handle it:
After things settle down, approach your WH with notebook in hand, ready for your "talk". Ask him if he's ready to work at "it" now. Irregardless of his response, tell him that you'll work on that later.

Go bowling, go out to eat, play mini-golf, badminton, go to a movie, throw rocks at passing cars, whatever you can do to have fun!!!! Period!!

No one likes work! You don't have to put it off forever, but put it off tonight. I guarantee you he is already dreading tonight. So do the exact opposite. If you make recovery a chore, then your WS is less likely to want to keep doing it. Do these issues in your M need to be addressed? Yes. But if you aren't working towards a fun, rewarding M, what are you working towards?

My $.02, and good luck,
Ethan

Do you guys ever go out and leave the kids with a sitter?

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by thefurnitureman:
<strong> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by momto3boys:
<strong>
do you agree with that? </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">mt3b,
I haven't posted to you much, I've kind of watched your situation from afar, and to be honest, I am somewhat envious, that you are able to see, touch and feel your foggy WH/FWH every day. I consider you lucky. You asked if we agree. I'm not sure what you're asking if we agree with, but I'll tell you what I disagree with. The talk, the homework, all of that. If I'm in your situation, here's how I would handle it:
After things settle down, approach your WH with notebook in hand, ready for your "talk". Ask him if he's ready to work at "it" now. Irregardless of his response, tell him that you'll work on that later.

Go bowling, go out to eat, play mini-golf, badminton, go to a movie, throw rocks at passing cars, whatever you can do to have fun!!!! Period!!

No one likes work! You don't have to put it off forever, but put it off tonight. I guarantee you he is already dreading tonight. So do the exact opposite. If you make recovery a chore, then your WS is less likely to want to keep doing it. Do these issues in your M need to be addressed? Yes. But if you aren't working towards a fun, rewarding M, what are you working towards?

My $.02, and good luck,
Ethan </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Hi the furnitureman and thanks for posting to me. H has put off this HW for two weeks now. This was his HW from his LAST session with harley, but he never did it. didnt' NEED to do it...his words...He wants to do it tongiht. He has it all figured out in his head, but he just needs to put it down on paper. So, yes, we do need to do this tongiht, he has put it off and off and while he is willing to do it, he will.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by MelodyLane:
<strong> Do you guys ever go out and leave the kids with a sitter? </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">your kidding right <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> Actually we used to go out quite often, but haven't found a good reliable sitter in ages. I have been trying to get ahold of my regular one, which i am not too fond of her, for weeks now and I cant. I dont have another sitter at the moment. But we do spend all day Tuesday's together now. We have lunch and run around or just stick aroudn the house. tonight we are going to snuggle up on the couch and watch a movie. well, that is my idea anyway <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

Hmmm.Mom,just keep your guard up still ok? I know your WH has explained everything away but be wary nonetheless.Keep us posted on things.


O

Mom, glad to see you're doing so much better!

You know it's one of the greatest benefits of counseling with the Harleys. The custom coach recovery plans based on individua circumstances.

In my case my H had to write his very own private recovery plan, get SH's approval; then once it was ready, he presented it to me.

It took months....because my H had a difficult time coming to terms with complete & total empathy on how his affair affected me. He struggled so much - it was almost a deal breaker.

Thankfully, our recovery progressed much faster after that, with only minor stumbling blocks.

Our thoughts to others as we post really are based on our own individual experiences. The Harleys are the pros!! Have a wonderful weekend!