LLP,
I'm back just briefly. OK you're not controlling or overbearing. She's as I described my W: indpendent do to being on her own alot ie husband working all the time or odd hours.

Hey here's a novel idea. How about sis coming to your house occasionally. Even if sis has the palace on the hill. It would make you feel better. Right?

See if she keeps her promise to spend more recreational time with you.

BTW, thanks for the explantion on mudding. Wet right over my head.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> In fact she has full reign of the finances! </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Do you have any idea where the $$ go? This may be another area to review. Again maybe nothing wrong but worth a review of the checkbook as well as the credit card statements.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> I told her that she knows how I feel and she promised me tonight that she would be home from now on and spend next weekend with me if I let her go. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">What's the old saying? Actions speak louder then words. It's so true especially in marriages and infidelity. Wait an watch. My guess is that there'll be an excuse or two on the horizon.

You never responded to my comments on meeting her ENs. Did you have any thoughts on that?

Now that I think about the control issue. It seems her sis has quite a bit of control over her. Didn't you say she helped pay for the cell phone?

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> How long b-4 she breaks that in your opinion?</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">The bigger question is how long has she been this independent. I think the answer lies there. If she is having an affair with OM, the answer is possibly never unless you put ALL of Plan A into action immediately.

BTW, are you familiar with the term emotional affair (EA)? It's what happens prior to a married woman having a PA.

cwmac

well its hit the fan. Dont know if Im getting kicked out but I will try to read replies.

Remember I said my wife was at sis house Fri night. I found out from her mom that she was at sis's boyfriends house till 11 THEN went to sis house while stayed there!

Asked my wife why the lie? B/c she didnt want to hear my crap! My son told me when sis's b-friend stays the night he and his cousin stay in one room auntie(aka sis) stays in the bedroom with b-friend and mom stays on one couch while the other (male) friend stays on the other!

Could she possibly be doing something with children in the other room that cazn walk in anytime? 2nd would she stoop to messing with a kid(he's 19 still old enough to have sex I suppose)
Mom has meApparently mentined that sis SWEARS my wife has no attraction to this kid. Sis and mom have a strong relationship btw. I know sis and mom both like me, so if its not this kid then why all the lies??

BTW I know for a FACT this kid is ALWAYS around when b-friend is around. Apparently sis's b-friend had a bad accident and lost a family member so kid is always around to drive. Anyway I called my wife and asked her about the situation and she got FURIOUS, she says she is not hanging on to me financially anymore and that it s none of my business. Looks like I may be kicked out tonight!

LLP,
I had asked about your son spending the night at sis house. How old is your son? Based upon what he's said. He should not be in a situation where he knows that sis is sleeping with boyfriend IMHO.

She's definitely hiding something. What only time will tell.

If she tells you to leave the house, I'd say no. Tell her that you want to take car eof son since he's not in the healthiest situation at sis'

BTW, eventhough mom and sis like you, remember blood is thicker than water.

cwmac

I am very strongly against a married woman attending a gathering that involves unattached men and drinking. It's just asking for trouble in my opinion. Your wife is not being honest with you and is obviously uncomfortable with you attending the parties at her sister's house. Why would she be that way? The answer is obvious, she has something to hide. Do not make the mistake of staying in denial. Tell your wife that you are uncomfortable with her spending the night at her sister's house with a man sleeping in the couch next to the one that she is sleeping on. Ask her how she would feel if the shoe was on the other foot. Your wife is putting your children into an environment that is clearly not in their best interest. Do not trust you wife, as she has given you ample reasons not to trust her as per your previous posts. One of the key principles of rebuilding a marriage is using a policy of joint agreement. In short, both spouses need to eagerly agree on all activities before doing anything that may make one spouse uncomfortable. Just my .02 cents on your situation.

well I talked to her some last night and I was able to convince her that we CAN be nice to each other while I gather cash to move out over the next 2 weeks or so.
I have a few minutes to break down the episode for you but essentially the marrige is over!

Last night my wifes mom told my wife that she should be home working on our marriage, wife told her she WAS home but a few minutes later is when she asked to go to her sis's house. I said ok but mom called here a few hours later. While on the phone I spoke to her trying to get isnight into the situation and she told me me that she doesnt think wife is having an affair but its obvious wife is enjoying coming and going as she pleases. I told mom that why would she break a date just to stay at sis's house, thats when she told me that 1st she wasnt at sis's house, she was with sis at sis's b-friends house till about 10-11 and 2nd that she told mom I broke the date.

I called wife and confronted her and thats where I left off last night in my posts. While she was on the way home I called sis and she told me the same thing her mom told me and also said shes not cheating but I dont know whats gotten over her. She expressed that wife has been complaining about my treatment of her etc...

When wife got home she basically told me that we havnt been toghter since we lived in TN. Incedentally thats when I was promoted and really began spending time away, its alsoa time when I found myself addicted to the computer. I would research for hours sometimes online,play online games etc.. I havent been nearly as bad since I have gotten back to Florida but it appears she has gotten used to a lifestyle that doesnt include me. Sort of phased myself out!


I am disappointed but at this time I am not angry or hateful, its like wake up call. I read earlier that it takes 2 people to make a marriage but just one to make a divorce. She isnt able or willing at the moment to make herself available for me to work things out.

In a little over an hour I report to my 1st day as a sales person, I am going to focus on my career and myself for now and try to save money so I amy move at as quickly as possible. I dont expect much of this relationship anymore, especially if she has been hiding the fact that she has been over this marriage for 2 years now. Essentially I have been around for finincial purposes, according to her.

Well, thats my story. Apparently the bottom line is she is accustomed to being independent and in fact at this point, unwilling to be in a partnership with me. If that includes someone else, it doesnt matter. After hearing what I heard last night I have made up my mind as to what course to follow.
Thanks for the input guys/girls, it is greatly appreciated. I will still check in and see how everyone else is doing and to occassionaly update you on where I am in life and job. All your time is appreciated!

heh,
One more thing before I leave for work. I was relfecting a little about our time in knoxville and I certainly realize now that I have allowed this sort of indepedent lifestyle for about 2 years.
We had mutual friends that were older(50's-ish) and the hubby was paralyzed on one side by a stroke.
They would frequent a local pub about 2-3 times a week and would regularly call to see if we could go. 90% of the time I said no since I usually had to work. My wife went and to me it was ok. The pub was right next door to the store I managed so my co-workewrs went there, I certainly did not have to worry about our friends being up to anything. In short it was comfortable for me to allow her this leisure time, considering my schedule.

In retrospect her behavior here is basically the same except now she is with sis and sis is around guys. Wife is still a social person,doing her thing, hanging etc but now she is going without me being as comfortable due to the circumstances.

About sis and mom...Mom is a straight shooter. Has always been to the point of fault sometimes. Sis I know likes me but I am not sure how much. I do know that they both have been told half truths concerning our relationship but even so, upon questioning, they gave me no reason to suspect an affair.

I must mention one time that I actually did get to drop in on my wife in a social setting unannounced.

About 2 months ago I was able to knock off from work early. Instead of closing and being there till 2-3am I was able to go around 11:30-12. So I went to where my wife, sis and sis's b-friend would be. I walked in went up to the bar and waited to get served. It took about 5 full minutes to get served so I was able to observe the interaction of the parties involved. What I saw was this: Sis and wife talking and laughing, sis's b-friend hanging over sis and b-friends friend trying to bump and grind every other girl in the club. In other words her behavior was just as she told me!

When I approached her to surprise her she got upset, like I was soemwhere I shouldnt have been. It didnt hit me till just now! But it all makes sense.


I have been trying desperately to find that she has had an affair. Why? the 2 other times she has done it while we were married she came back to earth within a month or 2 after discovery. I felt if she is having one(and she may be but..) once I discover it we can work things out again, perhaps permanantly this time!


What I have been trying desperately hard NOT to see is a woman who basically no longer wants to be with me. One that is spending time away from by CHOICE not by the lure of a lover! for no OTHER reason than to be away from me.

This is where I think I am.
That is why I must leave.

LLP,
If I were you (and I know I'm not), I would write a letter to your wife. Tell her how you feel about the current situation. Tell her you feel badly for sacraficing your relationship with her for your career (I know you did it for her but don't say so)Tell her that you love her and you'd like to try and give the marriage another chance. Tell her you weren't aware that she felt so abandoned. Tell her if you'd known you would have made an effort to change. Ask her if she'd consider giving it one more shot. Of course both of you need to be committed to trying to make it work.

Maybe you could enlist the support of sis and mom. Tell them that you'd like the chance to try and show W that you will not ignore her any longer.

LPP, you are taking a fatalistic approach to this meaning you're knida giving up before ever trying. Sorry if that hurts and maybe that's a poor assessment on my part.

I tend to do that also. It's got a name, Passive-Aggressive. I don't have arguments with my Wife. I just retreat. I look hurt. I play the role of victim. Thinking that she's being the angry, stubborn one when in reality we both are but just showing it in different forms.

Don't know if this has helped.

It is after all up to you. Again if it were me, I'd wonder for the rest of my life if I had done everything that I could to make the marriage work.

BTW, I wouldn't move out until divorce papers are served. Once you move out you lose some of the connection that you have to your family.

Try to be upbeat around the W. Swallow any "poor mes" that you feel (I felt alot of them. Still do)

Wish you well,

cwmac

One more thing. Why are you the one moving out? Tell her that you are staying and intend to keep the kids. No judge in their right mind will consider her a fit parent based on the information that you have provided here. Cheating or not, she needs to be the one to move out not you!

Went to work today, it was AWESOME! I think this sales thing is right up my alley. I get to be the psoitive upbeat person that has all the answers(imagine that)!!!!
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> LPP, you are taking a fatalistic approach to this meaning you're knida giving up before ever trying. Sorry if that hurts and maybe that's a poor assessment on my part.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">You are right but if (to her) the relationship has been over for 2 years and she summed it by saying I am just around for financing what is left? These past 4 months or so I HAVE been taking an effort to get her to spend time with me. It is this behavior on my part that has forced her to tell me no or make some other excuse over and over again. I dont know if I can bear to pour that effort into a relationship in which one party has no interest in!

There is a stubborn side to me,I can admit that. but I also do not want to try to impose my will on her when she clearly wants something different.

LLP,
Something's not right. You say you weren't meeting her needs and she was upset about it and now you've been trying for 4 months. Most wives would be thrilled to death. Sooo.. either you're trying hasn't been trying or there is a reason that she doesn't want you to meet her needs......someone else is.

OK I know you're saying impossible but what else is there?

BTW, you said you don't want to force your will on her and you're right you can't force her to love you. But if she does have an OM then until she stops seeing him nothings going to work.

Hang in there a bit more. Maybe if she sees it as her only oppurtunity to get rid of you she amy actually tell you the truth. Crazy logic.

Again if she decides to seperate don't leave the house. She's the one with the attitude. She can leave the house.

MFisher is right her parental skills really suck. Well MFisher said it nicer than that. A child shoulldn't be in a situation where they see mommy and friend sleeping on coaches (whether its innocent or not)

How old is W? and you? Was she depressed during the time you/she struggled with the infertility?

Somethging more is going on.

cwmac

As for OM who knows, I will tell you I managed to get a copy of the cell bill and EVERYTHING checked out. No strange calls or numbers at wierd times. I just cant explain it. Other than that things are status quo!

<small>[ July 01, 2004, 09:03 PM: Message edited by: lakelandpk ]</small>