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Hi all- don't know when/if you have read any of my sitch. H walked out 5 full weeks ago. I know he sees ow- denies R, "wanting ow for life-raising her family etc...NO CAKE AND NO EATING yelled in my face-I am suffering too and I am NOT on vacation." NEVER has said anything about love with ow. says he will always love me-full blown mid life crisis is what I call this mess. H has admitted to continued contact, thus a false recovery for 17 months before the WALK OUT. H does not return phone calls etc- from our at home/in college sons or me. Also minister whom he reveres and several friends and family members have reached out with no response. If someone sees h in person he will talk- but walks away with "I don't know" as the answer to anyones question of "what are you going to DO?" Sons and I are getting it together- financially good; h still leaving some income in bank for us-emotionally shaky because of the LIMBO of NO COMMUNICATION and physically we have all lost weight and been medicated. There is no official PLAN B as h walked out and didn't look back much. YS hasn't spoken to h AT ALL since the day he left- OS has tried in a sincere but LB way to contact him- I have tried snail mail- email- phone- to not much avail. I get moments of clarity from h, then denial and running for the hills sets in h voice again and he hangs up or walks away. as it is today it has been a week with no communication. I have had to make some decisions and hope they work out without his input. living on the edge is very difficult. Spiritually I have it together. I want our M to endure. I know the work involved. I believe we can be restored. I love him. God put us together and I believe He would like to keep it that way.
its the HUMAN part here that leaves me weary- action-no action- do- don't do- contact-go dark......WHAT?! don't be needy or weak...but don't be drastic and push him away. its all so contradictory........HELP!!!!!!!!
thanks
PEACE OUT
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sprezzatura if my H was in no contact w/ me I would have flailed around (I did this anyway.) between desperation and independence, neediness and strength, etc. IT is a natural, normal reaction. But, after the initial reaction time, it is probably time to act not react. This is something st*rfish has written about plan A: </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Unfortunately, the misconceptions about Plan A abound on MB as widely as they are being described on this one. So please don't think I'm jumping on you guys....the folks over there interpret it the same way...with disastrous results. I am somewhat of a Plan A expert....in the sense that I have been mentoring folks in that plan for some time. With 10,000+ posts on mb...I have some extensive knowledge of Plan A and the misconceptions about it. You all are interpreting it the exact same way that most folks who misunderstand it MB do. It is NOT about being the best you can be. It is not about being a doormat. Kissing Butt being nice not complaining ignoring boundaries sucking it up pretending you're happy etc etc. It's not about any of those things....which is why it fails to help often enough. It has one purpose...and one alone. It is a strategy to end affairs by doing several things simultaneously: 1) addressing ways you as a spouse may have contributed to the incompatibility and vulnerability of the marriage...whether that means hurting the other person, letting yourself go, withdrawing, or witholding whatever....you make an effort and show an interest in correcting those things. (that may sound similar to being the best you can be...but it's NOT the same thing. This about what your spouse needs...not you. 2) You use radical honesty to describe how the affair feels by confronting the spouse with what you know and how you know it. 3)You expose the affair to the light of day. Most affairs require secrecy, exposure can create great conflict within the affair. So all of that is plan A....anything else...or just part of it...is not Plan A. In short, it is an effort to make the marriage an attractive alternative to the affair, let the WS know that their actions are hurtful, and shed light on the affair. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">and plan b: </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">When an affair goes on long enough...two things are likely to happen to the BS....a) The pain becomes so great that it is unbearable. The BS doesn't like who they are or how they feel in the midst of that pain. They find it impossible not to lash out and try and hurt the other person. They can't sleep or eat. Stuff like that. b)The BS finds it more and more impossible to continue loving their spouse when they remain too long in an environment where their feelings and needs are ignored. They are on the brink of just walking away from the marriage and dismantling their family...divorcing. Plan B addresses either of those dynamics...so it essentially does two things....either protects what little love is left so that reconciliation has any hope of occurring, or protecting a BS from the daily painful interaction that often occurs. No contact accomplishes that. It also sets good boundaries for what recovery would look like before considering reconciliation. It further creates an environment where the affair partner must then fulfill ALL the WS's needs....and that is often a challenge that puts great pressure on the affair. Most WS's get something from both their marriage AND their affair...if they didn't, what would be the point. When the marriage gets taken out of the equation....very often, it's possible for the WS to see more clearly what that something was. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">She said it so well. Pray and listen to that voice that speaks to you. When you are still and quiet your heart will speak and you will know what is right. Cali
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egads.... spezz what's not clear is that you say you are not in plan B because he left... and then you talk of different types of contact... why aren't YOU in plan B protecting yourself... OS has tried in a sincere but LB way to contact him- stuff that nonsense...children can and will use whatever means necessary to get attention...that's his issue of reality..sadly you look at pain in their eyes.. <img border="0" alt="[Teary]" title="" src="graemlins/teary.gif" /> without the plans...and not that I am saying plan a or plan is the ONLY way..but without a plan something...you flounder...and you sound like you are floundering... so a week with no contact.. and you made some decisions without him.. and most importantly... you survived.... says he will always love me- means nothing...treat them with the power they deserve... nothing... it's not contradictory in action based on what plan you are in.. it is contradictory based on emotions... as Cali pointed out... why are you in contact with him at all... why are you powerstruggling any words with him.. take another week.. judge his actions... set smaller goals.... think about making the next three interactions totally different from any of the past.. what does that mean to you?? your best bet is to pick a real plan.. a whole week huh.. made some decisions huh... interesting.... no law that plan b letter can't be the next thing he hears from you.... and lay the facts down that address the children.. he's relying on you to all the work.. quit doing... he's relying on you to keep the children aware of him...on the peripheral.... time for him to fly solo?? ark
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Hi ARK- I am usually SHARP but you've got to be very specific with my xanaxed brain these days. The last MEAL I had was May 14th- I've lost 40 pounds and I am hanging on/in/thru. I have done some things- hired attorneys-paid the bills- cleaned up some major CRAP he left behind. Thanks for writing- write more! LOL no kidding- something happens everyday to cause a drama/trauma with this and I am praying for the path out.
Cali- STILL is what I am getting very good at. and i wouldn't put my painfilled baggage down adn pick up my WH luggage for love or tea. he is SO lost. God save him.
PEACE OUT
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Sprezz, You got real good responses from Cali and Ark. Starfish's explanation of plan A vs plan B is classic. It can't be explained better. One week is not enough. Information and reaction travels slow and distorted in the fog. Even in the summertime. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> Give it more time. In the mean time work on you and the children. Even if they are grown up, this is hurting them also. You all need to eat to stay healthy. The A diet help only to a certain point. Make sure your H has someone to come back to and put his arms around. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> The OW is just that, an OW and always will be. A WS will talk fog talk and you need to realize when that is spewing out and how to respond. Reverse babble works sometimes. L.
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</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Reverse babble works sometimes.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">?? no idea if he ever calls what to say or not...way past confused here.....
PEACE OUT
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ok lets just go basic... 17 months of false recovery....was it a backslide or was it constant contact those 17 months...(very disrepectful)... left five weeks ago....? denies currently seeing OP ? he does not contact you but you have been in contact these past five with your iniation... and now none this past week... do you know where he is living you have many options open to you... but you have to choose otherwise you will flounder the road you choose will ground you in what actions to take.... sprezz you need a focus and a goal... and you need to take care of yourself..... you must.. what road do you want... can't address how you should do it..till you know what you are doing.... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> ARK
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hi Ark- periods of time in 17 months with NC. now does see ow- no idea where h LIVES- denies R with ow. denies wanting ow for life and raising a small child. I want my M. thats it.......
PEACE OUT
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sprezz, have you exposed the affair?
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sprezz God love ya... but saying I want my marriage is not enough... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> if it was I would wave my magic wand like my two year old does with a tinker toy stick.. and say... "MAGIC MAGIC POOF!!!" YOU'RE A KITTY CAT...Oooops!! that's what HE says... I would say.. "MAGIC MAGIC POOF" YOU HAVE YOUR MARRIAGE we can't pick your plan... but you should choose.. infact YOU must choose... infact I am waiting for you to choose.... and choosing is an action and action is power and control and action is a goal and I am still waiting for you to choose.. fair?? feh....not even close to being fair.. ark
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I exposed the A to ow h a week after my dday-2002. all parents know now- friends-everyone. I have talked to ow h since my h walked out. ow is still married- sperated by 3000 miles tho. ow h thanks me for information but immed. calls his w and causes a strom with her and my h......and it lands on me. I don't know how to choose and make a plan.
PEACE OUT
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are you afraid to choose??...
because the choice can always be changed or re-evaluated....
but the choice will ground and guide you...
soooo..it's like this if you choose plan a...then people can guide you...
if you choose plan b...people can guide you...
bewarned...
not choosing is a choice also...
but it can cause damage...
it can cause you and or your spouse to become complacent in limbo...
and then it raises the stakes to getting back to what is at hand and of importance...
when you get used placing no importance on anything...then it is difficult to start finding its importance again...
sprezz people will help you...
I am less afraid of your choice..
then I am of your limbo
ark
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hi Ark- plan B doesn't seem to be doing anything . h is getting more blatant in his actions. I would like to call him and say the right thing. what is the right thing? I am off work today- dizzy- need help- THIS is more important than anything- I HAVE to get a plan adn DO something.... thanks....waiting.....are you busy? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> PEACE OUT
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anyway to have a live chat?
PEACE OUT
<small>[ June 28, 2004, 08:02 AM: Message edited by: sprezzatura ]</small>
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I don't have anything set up to chat... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />
sprezz without the letter defining plan b you are not in plan b...
is that your choice
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ok- h walked out and doesn't want to talk. does that put me in plan B? I would happily talk to him-but his convo is short and quickly turns-"I'm busy-not doing this now- not ready" etc.....if I had ANY clue what to say that was different than anything I have tried I would do it in a minute. I am always calm and decent with him. I have asked him straight out- WHY DON'T YOU CHOOSE- TELL US TO PISS OFF OR COME HOME? and have gotten the answer that that is a DJ/LB. ooook. I have also asked straight out "do you want the ow up the street for life? do you want to raise her child? do you want to give up OUR life?" all answers to that are emphatic NO. then I ask do you want a D and he says I don't know- I don't think so. meanwhile......we are falling apart. what say you? I left a msg for Harley to call me- don't know how quick they are.......
PEACE OUT
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h also knows from my talking to him- writing to him-and sons last words to him that we want him to come home and give this M a REAL shot. also friends family that see h tell him the same thing-don't be afraid to go home- they want to work it out.
PEACE OUT
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him walking out is absolutely NOT plan b...
not even close...
because he still has access to you..
he still "knows" where and what you are...
he can still walk back IN that door any second...
plan b is ALL about you choosing out of that chaos..,..
clear
defined
no room for a powerstuggle....
it defines YOU and YOUR intentions with out asking a thing from him till he decided his intentions..
NOT NOT NOT NOT THE SAME!!!!!!!!!!!!11
time for YOU to quit falling apart..and let him do it alone.....
do you have a plan b letter written...
wanna write one...
ark
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I have read all the sample letters for B- don't like any of them-they seem trite. H still leaves his paycheck in the bank so I can run the household. if he takes that away we would make it but it would be difficult- BUT $$$ is NOT any part of the reason I want him home. its just at the moment it is the only thing he is doing for me/us and why throw it away? I am a practical girl and the the bills gotta be paid......might just as well let him do it. he left a MOUNTAIN of debt and I am doing well at getting us out of it since I run the check now- I use ALL of it for bills but keep the minimum for food/gas.
PEACE OUT
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does anyone think I should enlighten the ow h further?
PEACE OUT
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