My WS is cake eating. The daily conversations with the OM continue but she is balking at signing the separation agreement. Said to me this morning that this is the biggest decision of her life. I told her that the continued phone calls to OM is very hurtful and disrespectful to me. So how do I get her off the fence without this becoming an adversarial deal? She now wants her lawyer to look over the agreement which her lawyer is going to advise her that it is all one sided (in my favor). I am willing to negiotiate a fair deal but what is not negiotable is staying here and continuing the affair. I feel like I'm fixing to get screwed. But I have to knock her off the fence somehow. we have been getting along great other than the continuing affair. Like Just Learning has said I am planting seeds. I feel she needs to experience letting the OM meet all her needs. I of course haven't meet all needs in this marriage but have been stable and financially supportive and lately have been meeting her needs for conversation and affection, her top 2. Any advise from the veterans out there?

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by hopefulinnc:
<strong>She now wants her lawyer to look over the agreement which her lawyer is going to advise her that it is all one sided (in my favor).</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Regardless of whether you knock her off the fence or let her fall, DO NOT back off everything being in your favor. This is one of the consequences of her decision. Backing off lessens this.

WAT

I'm not backing off. I want to see this agreemnet signed so I can get on with my life. The phone calls from OM are driving me crazy. She has to chose! Their are no other options. I would selfishly like her to sign the agreement because she is basically giving me everything. Makes the consequences much real.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by hopefulinnc:
<strong>Makes the consequences much real. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Absolutely, that was my point.

There can be benefits to the fog when WSs are willing to chuck it all to further their dopamine high. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

I believe affairs that result in divorce over the objections of the BS would be far fewer if there were REAL consequences in the division of assets. Community property laws that split things 50/50 (when WSs fight for their "share") are not marriage friendly, they're legal process friendly.

WAT

Hi Hopeful,

I am in much the same situation as you. I am working on a Plan B letter. I really hope my husband will come back to me but have very little hope. I feel so sad that it has come to this. I have confronted him several times concerning fence sitting each time resulting in an argument because he does not want to get off. Each time he blamed me for sitting on the fence. I still love him very much but OW called my house June 15th and cell phone bill shows he has been calling her back since. He has become distant to me since those calls. Before that he was makeing signs of getting emotionally closer to me. Now it is for nothing. The only thing that will wake him up is a separation. My biggest fear is his threat to start a relationship with a totally new person. That is a risk of loss I must take. I will take this time to work on me and you should do this to. I feel so much of what you are going through. It hurts so bad. I so do not want to lose my husband but I cannot go on with the way he is treating me. I am sure you feel the same way.

Genia-I have been dealing with this for 3 months now. She hasn't had a physical contact with OM since March but the daily phone calls tear my heart out. I am ready for her to SH** or get off the pot. I don't want an adversarial separation though it may come to that. I am not putting up with junk much longer. She wants to stay till youngest son leaves for college Aug 20th-that is no problem but I have to get other issues going like re-financing the house etc. How do I get her off the fence without causing this to become nasty?

HINC,

You said </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">The daily conversations with the OM continue but she is balking at signing the separation agreement. Said to me this morning that this is the biggest decision of her life. I told her that the continued phone calls to OM is very hurtful and disrespectful to me. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">What did she say when you told her the conversations hurt you?? She is balking because it is a big decision and it is one that she has not really thought through. Now reality is starting to hit, because the separation agreement is the start of the end of your marriage and she is now seeing that. She is NOT sure of OM, but that is where she wants to go.

I think that something will happen soon. She may even take really rediculous stand knowing you will not agree to it, to prolong the situation. There is some good news here, she seems to be seeing a new you.

Something to think about.

God Bless,

JL

JL-you always come back with something enlightening to say. Thank you for responding. I agree something is getting ready to happen. I keep gently pushing her to sign so I can get on with things. I told her this morning that I think that she and OM are playing a game of "chicken". I explained to her what that was and she said you may be right. I ready for the chaos to end.

HINC,

Here is something that really annoy you. She may be doing all of the talking to OM to decide if she really is making the right decision, but it also may be to push YOU to take action so that she can deflect some of the blame. H divorced ME, I did not divorce HIM.

The reality is that WS's don't really want to face reality and can be pretty sneaky. So hang on.

I am guessing since you did not answer my question as to her response to stating that the phone calls were really hurting you, that you got little or no response.

Do your best that is all you can do.

God Bless,

JL

To continue JL's thought, you will be better off in the long run if you continue your course and allow her to make the decisions.

Let's assume for a moment that you will not recover your marriage (I'm speaking from experience here).

Very simply, until the mariage is officially dissolved, if you maintain your stance on the moral high ground, biting your lip and enduring more disrespectful pain - that is, not taking her bait that JL described by initiating the divorce proceedings - she will have no choice but to do all the dirty work herself. Do not deny her the responsibility of this task! In this case, you will be WAAAAAAYYYYY better off in the long run. You will exit with a clear conscience, knowing you did all you could. SHE will have made ALL the decisions that resulted in the end of your relationship.

I speak from experience on this point - she will be carrying ALL the burden, and your integrity will be intact. Please do not underestimate the importance to you for exiting with your head held high.

But, I hope you don't have to rely on this logic.

Guys, I am doing all the work to get the separation. It's my lawyer not hers. She has been very passive about intiating proceedings. I guess she thinks this can go like it is. Am I wrong in pushing for the separation? I am not going to let this continue status quo. I may have to be the one who intiates divorce proceedings to get her off the fence.

JL-in response to your question about what she said when I told the phone calls were hurtful and disrespectful-she just started to cry with no verbal response.

I did get my lawyer to make her a copy of the revised, like she wanted, separation agreement. She was to pick it up this afternoon. I winder if she followed through.

JL and WAT keep talking to me. I need your sage and sound advice.

bump

Please refresh my memory of your current situation. She's moved out, right? What have you done so far about finances and jointly held liquid assets, who's covering debts, etc.

Since your children are adults, the only real reason to have a separation document is to nail down finances and control of property, I believe. Doing this is in your best interests and can emphasize for her some of the consequences of her actions.

What does the current draft of the document say regarding your desires for reconciliation? You can make it say anything you want before you get to the financial and property stuff. I suggest you include an affirmative statement that you do not at this time want a divorce and you're initiating the legal separation solely to establish financial and property responsibilities until such time as reconciliation takes place. Something like this clearly spells out that you are not seeking an end to the marriage and she cannot use your separation initiative to claim you are pushing for divorce. This puts more edge on the consequences she has created for herself.

Make sense?

WAT

<small>[ August 05, 2004, 05:31 AM: Message edited by: worthatry ]</small>

WAt-she hasn't moved out yet. She is stalling until youngest son leaves for college (aug 20th). The separation agreement spells out property distribution and how we handle the finances. As it is written now it is much in my favor. She is basically leaving with everything. I have a Plan B letter written that says I don't want a divorce and want this marriage to work but I can't live with her and have the A ongoing. She is moving halfway across the country to a large town where the OM will be her only support. Her children, sisters, mother and father and her local friends here are all opposed to this move. As am I. I am not going to live with this ongoing A. I am gently pushing for her to sign the agreement so I can refinance etc. I had my lawyer revise the original document as she wanted it change and made her a copy to be picked up. She did not pick it up yesterday. I am in the meantime planting seeds with her. Every night this week we have had a great time together. Last nigth we prepared dinner together without young son there and had a blast just cooking. I am taking her to the mountains this weekend for a canoe and camping trip. She plans to leave the first of September and I am trying to make this the most fun month with me she has ever had. So when she gets with the other man and he covers her with manure my seeds will have some fertilizer and start to germminate. That is my hope. In the meantime, I am hanging tough and doing a great Plan A. Meeting all of her needs.

I assume you know you can't Plan B under the same roof.

You need to wait for her to leave before Plan B. DO NOT tell her about Plan B before hand.

The separation document is a different matter. I believe this should be settled ASAP to protect your assets. How do you know she won't liquidate all your holdings and skip town today? Have you already secured your share of assets?

WAT

WAT-everything is jointly held. There is not much cash available for her to take. She could get some and leave I suppose but she is waiting for young son to leave. I do want to get the agreement signed as soon as possible but don't want to force it or she might change her mind and go after half. The Plan B letter will be handed to her on the day she leaves. she is not being proactive in planning for this move. I think she and the OM are playing a game of chicken-who will leave first.

Hi Hopeful,

I got kicked off the site yesterday and could not respond.

Anyhow,

I am so sorry you are going through this. Like I said my husband is doing the same thing but behind my back. Perhaps when she gets out OM may not be all that. It is possible plan B could work, but I am like you. Enough is enough.
But it is so hard. I too want a peaceable separation. The last time I asked WS to leave he made a bunch of threats, packed, but did not leave. I hate for the separation to be ugly but I fear it will be. That is why I think I am procrastinating. I fear the separation. He will talk ugly to me and threaten my property, and try to take everything he can. I am hopeing he will come back yet I know I cannot keep going on with him talking to OW. When she called June 15th his voice was soft and sweet with her. He does not even talk that sweet with me much. I do not even want sex with him no more. And I have a strong sex drive. He disgusts me that he has become such a monster.

Genia-this hard. Trying to work out a peaceable solution is very trying. It sounds like to me you need to consult a lawyer-know what your rights are. Find out! Mine may be adversial but I'm trying to avoid that. If she wants to be with the OM then let's get on with it. I feel I'm in limbo. However I am planting seeds. I am showing her I can change and be the man she wants. So when she does leave she can look back and say damn what a good guy he was to me. Maybe if OM messes up and he will. Then the seeds I have planted will start to grow. I believe in marriage and made a vow to be faithful to her in good and bad times. These are the bad times. Don't know if it will work out but at least I can say I tried.

Day 2 and she hasn't been by the lawyer's office to pick up the separation agreement. She is stalling but I'm not sure why? She is leaving me in limbo and that isn't fair. But an A is not fair either. Any advice on how to get her to move?

Well she pick up the separation agreement from the lawyer's office today but hasn't opened it. She is getting all her annual physical stuff done with the doctors so I guess she has really decided to go. I heard her tell her father that hse would be done to see him the first of Sept. I guess on her way across the country. Dad lives about half way to OM. I hate this. I hate the OM.
I hate my wife for putting me throughthis sh**. I will not let it get me down. I am planting Plan A seeds right now and just hope OM fertilizies them. I think he will but who knows. I scared of being lonely when she leaves. I will implement Plan B the day she leaves. Wht does this have to hurt so much?