I was thinking the same thing...more and more it really does seem like he would favor polygamy.

I would think..especially with the spotting and cramping (if true) she would go to the Dr.

I really think you need to make a stand for what it right. Yes, tough love. Being firm in your conviction of not being played for a fool with his wanting both of you. Don't allow him to not make a clear choice.

Mt3b,

I think Pep hit the nail on the head. Seems like Dad wants both women in his life and he does just enough to keeps you and OW hanging on. I fear that it's going to be like this indefinitely, unless you make a choice. Otherwise, he will keep going... You have kicked him out several times, but maintained contact throughout and have allowed him back into the home each time. Therefore, I don't think he really cares much anymore whether or not you kick him out. He thinks that as long as he begs you to come back and tells you all the things that you want to hear, he can eventually come back into the home and then continue his lifestyle. It's worked in the past and he figures it will continue working for him. So far, he hasn't really had to make any sacrifices. He has two women fighting over him and he think that he's a winner.

You have to think long and hard if this is the life that YOU want for YOURSELF and your three boys and make decisions accordingly.

Like Pep said, I fear that Dad wants polygamy and unless you think that you are strong enough to share him with OW and maybe OC, this may go on and on and on...

You cannot ask or force OW to do anything, so there is no sense thinking and wondering about her actions. She is going to do whatever she wants, whether it suits you or not. YOU have to take care of yourself, Mom and secure YOUR future.

I'm so sorry that this had to escalate this way. I really feel for you.

Kati

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><strong> momto3boys: ...H called me last night asking me if I was happy? He then went on to say he was going to call her in front of me...Funny how it takes him actually leaving the house and moving into the hel hole apt he has in the back of his office to "wake up" a bit! </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Orchid: Do you remember the story we told you both at dinner? How WS called me crying from the OWs house after he stayed with her for about 7 days? WS called because he was fed up with the OW and the OW was yelling in the background 'take him home L, take him home.'

This sounds and feels similar to what your H is doing.

It was crazy but I told him to stay with the OW. Didn't last long. This was after many false recoveries. I had had it also. WS had pulled one too many stunts and even my child had asked why his daddy couldn't have 2 wives. That one hurt. I explained this was not how God setup the marriage arrangement for any man to have more than 1 wife or 1 mommy without being properly divorced or due to death. He later told his dad he only had 1 mom and did not need another.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><strong> momto3boys: I dont buy it! I also have a hard time believing this OW is even pregnant. She has not made an appt to see an OB/GYN yet? Ladies, when you found out you were pregnant, did you not make your appt immediately to make sure all was ok and to get the proper care, blood work done, etc? Come on? This woman is crazy! </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Orchid: You mean she hasn't given proof yet? Didn't I ask you to have proof provided before extra stress was given to you?

PBR pulled this stunt 3 times. The 2nd time she called to tell me about 11pm. By this time I was soo worn out that her words didn't even phase me. When she said: "I'm pregnant", I responded: "so why are you calling me, tell your H." <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> She meant to call me. WS was home at that time and even in my bed. See I did not know of their contact. That night he got kicked out and he slept in his truck. That same prego episode she even asked for pre-natal care coverage @ $100.00! Without proof! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> That's extortion. I told the WS, I want to see the bill from the doctor. The hometest pee stick wasn't good enough. Is she starting to show yet? I would demand proof.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><strong> momto3boys: I dont know what is going to happen to my M, but I do know I will not tolerate that OW in it any longer! </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Orchid: You are at a good turning point. Stay on course. It is not going to be easy but now you have the upper hand. It does feel a bit better having more control than when the WS was calling the shot, eh? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

It will get better. The OW has laid out her trumph card but that's all she can do. Unless she claims rape or something, you probably won't hear from her anymore if she can't prove the pregancy.

This OW has dragged this out fro what 3 months? She s/b abou 12 - 15 weeks by now, right? Getting too late to abort?

Make sure you get proof. Check for your rights and see a lawyer. You may want to file charges if she made false pregnancy statments which gave you great duress.

Hugz,
L.

M23B
I never believed from the get go that she's pregnant and now "conveniently" see's spotting. Give me a break. Spotting alright-she's spotting those numbers in her bank account. They're both in the medical field and still there's no proof. She'll continue to be pregnant and "spot" until she has him fully reeled in. What's wrong with him? What hasn't he asked for proof?

I suspect that he too knows it's likely that she's not pregnant. He's not stupid. They're both using that excuse to have contact.

It seems the only time he seems to come out of it is when you kick him out but you let him come home too soon for it to really sink in and the fog to clear.

He wants to come home before or as soon as you kick him out. Like my husband said to me once during a major fog down, I don't want to marry her, I just want to date her. WHAT!!! My husband wouldn't be out of the driveway before he was calling to come home and I made the same mistake you have, I let him come back too soon. And if God would allow me to live that nightmare over again, I would NEVER let him come home.

Life is complicated as it is. Why let his self created complications drag you down anymore? I would give him 3 requirements before he came home
1. Results of pregnancy test by a OB/GYN
2. Restraining order against her to keep her or anyone representing her with the exception of her attorney from contacting or being with 500 feet of him and your family
3. A pound of his flesh preferably from the groin area

Ok, Ok. I know 3 might be a bit extreme but a thought...

Since his word can't be trusted and it seems only the threat of jail time would be a deterent for WOW (wicked other woman), the restraining order might be the answer.

Know this, if she isn't pregnant now, nothing would stop her from trying to get there. His fog won't let him see that.

That is another thing I thought: if she isn't already pregnant then she's working her tail off to get there. I just hope Mom's H isn't too dumb to fall for it. He did say a while back that he saw the proof...she took a preg. test in front of him...supposedly. I wouldn't put anything past foggy A partners...individually or together.

My whole sense of reality was skewed during our ordeal. It can get so surreal...

I am really laughing at this one! NO, she has NOT shown proof! H took a stick up there to the NH, gave it to her, left her alone and later she showed him the stick...it was positive...I asked immediately "did you stay with her while she peed on it"..."NO, I came back later"..."are there any other people there that are PG"..."OH yea, all over the place"

DUH!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" />

He says she showed him some piece of paper from Planned Parenthood that says she is PG...did you know that you dont have to use your real name at Planned Parenthood? Anyone can walk in there and say they are OW? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" />

Let me just let you all know, I am NOT in Plan B yet! Yes, I will go into if it gets bad...WH calls me a while ago..

me: hello
WH: why are you answering the phone?
me: why are you calling me?
WH: I miss you so much, I love you so much, BUt I KNOW...
me: you know that I will NOT tolerate that woman in my life any longer WH!
WH: I know..I know...I really do respect you for what you are doing..I dont blame you for this..I know I need to end it with her

Well, that is a thought

me: WH, why hasn't she made an appt for the DR? Why isn't she taking prenatal vitamins? You know how I was when I found out I was pregnant..I was at the DR's the next week...even when I started bleeding with Aaron at nine weeks, I was in the DR's within an hour to see what was wrong...remember?

WH: yes, I do...and I DO wonder..hmm, you are giving me food for thought

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

WH: yea, why isn't she taking those prenatal vit...and why didn't she go see a DR especially if she is cramping??? hmmmm???

me: yea, why is that?

WH: I DO love you, you know!

me: yes, and I love you too!

WH: well, I need to get back to work..I've been on the pot too long now <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

me: ok, bye

so he respects me for kicking him out...isn't that nice! I just dont get it! Why is it so damn hard to stop calling her if he wants to be with me so badly...he KNOWS all my love for him is almost gone. It is almost like our roles are reversed...he is the one who is Plan Aing and I am just there!

ARGH!

Originally posted by jph:
I suspect that he too knows it's likely that she's not pregnant. He's not stupid. They're both using that excuse to have contact.

Yup.


Know this, if she isn't pregnant now, nothing would stop her from trying to get there. His fog won't let him see that.

Absolutely-efing-right!!!! He's very much in the danger zone.

Pep

Isn't it draino that makes the stick positive? Planned pregnancy? Where's her doctor? Let him show you the proof. He's a doctor, where's his balls!?!?!? Oops.... I mean his bills? I mean his..... oh well.... his back, or did he lose that also when he lost his pants?

He answered that he loved you when you asked about the prenatal vitamins? See how they try to play on your emotions when they get too confused or frustarted? Classic WS reaction. Very very foggy.

Well Mom, I am glad to see you are reaching another positive turning point. Knowing that you finally don't want the OW in YOUR life is a huge leap forward. I know, we never wanted the OW in our lives but to say it with meaning and do something drastic shows guts.

Keep up your progress. Be prepared for a change in his attitude (good or bad). The point is to look not just for change but permanent change.

He needs to show he is protecting his family. Right now he just wants to say he loves you and thinks that is his key back in.

Sorry for your pain. Your incident is bringing back the bad memories of what I went through. YUCK!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

But I survived and know you will also.

take care,
L. (where is that icon with the <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> face shaking the finger - <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> )

I also spent a few hours earlier online looking up restraining orders for Texas...I dont tink I an get one against her in the state? does anyone know about that one?

Yup, I told WH last night that if she aint pregnant NOW, that now is her chance to get pregnant if he goes to her!

LOL orchid! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

ROs are generally done at the local level. City or County. Check those on-line sources. You can even call your local police dept or family court system.

Good evening, Mom! Hanging in there, I see. Good for you!

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by momto3boys:
<strong> This OW doesn't give a rats A$$ about me or my boys...in her eyes, I dont even exist!</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Take a leaf from her playbook, Mom. She shouldn't exist to you, either. See, it is YOUR husband and YOUR marriage. You will not settle for a third party. It is dad's problem to shed himself of the OW. You focus on what YOU want as much as she does. But you are not in competition. Remember that.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by momto3boys:
<strong> After my surgery, he did so much for me...he took such great care of me!</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">He's a doctor. This comes naturally to him. Put the mark much higher. And consider this: he liked taking care of you, having you depend on him. Perhaps he doesn't think you need him very much otherwise? I am very independent (financially and otherwise) and for my husband, feeling like I didn't "need" him made him feel useless. Guess who was needy as can be? My H's OW. Rings a bell, doesn't it?

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by momto3boys:
<strong> He just cant give up this OW...I think it is more of a habit than anything for him... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Think about this. Are you saying that dad is a very weak man who would continue a destructive affair out of habit? Naw, I didn't think so. SHE IS MEETING SOME BASIC NEED(S) OF HIS. This is why it is tough to let her go. He says he can't give up being able to talk with her. It's not just the wild, whorey sex, mom. She fills an emotional need.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by momto3boys:
<strong> How many times is he going to end it with her calling him and gong out of her way to get him back! </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">As many times as you let them.

The fact that she calls him and goes out of her way matters no more than the fact that she doesn't give a rat's a$$ about you. What matters is that he doesn't end it and keep away from her.

What matters is that he wants to keep both of you, not that he takes good care of you when you are recovering from surgery.

What matters is that you care a whit about her, give her space in your head. If you really want her out, that means H goes, too, if it comes to that.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by momto3boys:
<strong> ...and it makes me sick that now she thinks she has him for good. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Don't assume anything. My guess is Dad's telling her the same spiel he gives you: I love you more, I am bonded to you more... AND AGAIN: WHO CARES WHAT SHE THINKS! You only care about what Dad thinks and how he backs it up with actions, actions, actions.

FOCUS, mom, FOCUS! It's all about what YOU want. Not what Dad wants. Not what OW wants. What you want is what matters now. Only that!

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> WH: I know..I know...I really do respect you for what you are doing..I dont blame you for this..I know I need to end it with her
Well, that is a thought [/QB]</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Same song, fiftieth verse. But it works like a charm. If I hear Dad saying "I know I need to end it with her" one more time, then I am going to split a gut or something.

He respects you for what you are doing? Good. But he has a silver tongue and he is a master at twirling your heart around his wishes. Please don't trust your heart with his words any longer.

Hang on, sweetie!!! And tell dear H to start wearing condoms, "just in case."

Take care!

<small>[ August 09, 2004, 08:50 PM: Message edited by: Snowbelle ]</small>

Thanks snow for your insightful post! you are exactly right, dad wants both of us...isn't it sad though that he will give up his precious family for HER...although he continues to tell me he wants US..but yet he wont break it off with HER <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

He ALMOST did it the other night! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

OK, here is where I am today, right now! I cannot do a stellar Plan B and here is why

1.) We are in counselling..not only for ourselves, but for our DS5...he has BP and we are in counseling for it

2.) I need him to be at these sessions

3.) I have also made a committment that whatever happens to US, he will also be their father so we must see each other at these sessions

Now, he called me yesterday, told me I LOVE YOU SO MUCH, I MISH YOU, bla bla bla...

I called him last night..he did not answer the phone, nor did he call me back...I assumed he was with her...I assumed correctly...I went to bed...

this morning the phone rings...I did not get to it in time..It was him...My cell phone rings about 10 minutes later...hmmm, 10 minutes I guess it took him THAT long to dial my number <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> NOT...anyway, he asked where I was...At home...well, why didnt' you answer the phone...I didnt' get to it in time...and you didnt' cal me back?...NO, why should I...

I can tell this mad him upset! OH WELL!

he went on to say that he was with OW last night, but they just discussed all their options! YEA RIGHT!

I asked WHAT OPTIONS??? he wouldn't go into details...but said he ALMOST ended it with her!

Give me a friggin break...you know what, I am done..I told him NOT to call me anymore!

OH, he first called to ask what time DS5's appt was...I told him and he said he woul dbe there! I then told him NOT to call me anymore...I am sick of this crap he is putting me thru...

Seeing him today brought back HORRIBLE memories...He looked horrible...he is not sleeping again, not eating, stressed...He kept looking at me..told me I looked nice...bla bla bla...

I hated being next to him...When we left, he walked the kids to the car, then said good bye to me..I just turned my back and got in my suburban..He again said "bye honey" I didn't say a thing...

I hate that man for doing this to my family! WHY, WHY, WHY! I just dont get it! should i just move away to another city...I am so tired of all the waffling! either he gets it or he doesn't! What is so darn hard about it! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" />

mom - He is addicted. That is why it is so hard. Stay in Plan B. My WH kept telling me (for 14 months now) that OW would be gone. Well gosh, she still isn't.

believer!!! there you are! I've been looking for you! I KNOW he is addicted, but dad gummit! ARGH!

Plan B??? I do Plan just about as well as you do believer! LOL! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

BTW, saw your PICCY! What a hottie you are! NOTHING like I pictured you, but you are soooo darn cute! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

mom -

I always try to follow your stories on this site and the other one. Hope you will keep posting here.

Now you know I love dad. He has some clear moments, and then the fog comes in quickly. My Plan B has not been great. But it has been good enough to let me get over WH. Right now I don't care what he does. When he contacts me, I am friendly. I have finally gotten to the point that life is good without him.

I have been following your posts m3b and I know you've had couple of "false" recoveries and these are the ones that lag the most make Real Recovery more difficult. But aren't you happy you know what's going on? I rather be right in the middle of the sneaking and lying... rather than being taken for an idiot whom would not notice any of this stuff.
I've been told that I'm a courageous little one, but as a BW, I can not be anything else. Your husband is addicted to the OW, and most of them usually are. I see you got some good advice, and just wanted to say you got another pair of eyes watching and hoping things will come out alright for you. It's a long journey, but there is always light out of the tunnel.
Right now your H will do what he has to do to get his emotional needs met, but since he is out of the house, let OW meet his emotional needs. Let him call you... follow plan be since you almost did.
I know you did not want to go into plan B, neither did I.... but right now.. time is calling for some though love. Start with the Plan B letter. Write it to his address, no email...(nothing he can delete without thought)When/if he is back, I hope you can start a true recovery for you marriage!

bisoux!!

Good morning, Mom. Good to hear you sounding relaxed and strong. That is good.

I don't have a lot of time (about to leave for work). But I just wanted to say that I agree with your modified Plan B because of DS5. I think that getting help for his Bipolar disorder requires both of you right now, and that means contact between the two of you. I think continuing the counseling is a good thing, too.

How about setting some hard and fast guidelines for yourself, though, to make your modified Plan B effective? For instance, your guideline could be something like "I will only speak with WS when we have our counseling sessions for our marriage or for son's condition."

Then, when you are tempted to call him, or he calls you, you can ask yourself if making or taking the call falls within your self-imposed guideline.

You make the guideline to offer yourself SOME protection from his actions, see? Hearing about what is going on with he and OW is not helpful to you. So hear about it only during sessions with psych, if then. Concentrate only on your son and your marriage, if that is even possible while OW is still in the picture. I know it is tough, but I hear your love for him dying more and more each day.

Gotta run. Hugs!

~ Snow

Mom, here I am, whining over in Recovery when my H never left, and you have been through extreme hell. Your H is very lucky, because I'm not sure I would have lasted for 5 minutes.

I agree, if she isn't preganat, she's trying like crazy to get pregnant. I think our OW is a witch, your OW is like a creature from hell. I can't believe your H is so stupid to want someone like THAT in his life. At least you know if you leave him, and he goes to her, he will be sentenced to hell.

This is another demand I'd make if you ever take him back. He needs major therapy. MAJOR!!! If he can't even see the pain he is causing his children, you do not want to be with him unless he gets help. I'm telling you Mom, you need to be clear about what YOU deserve. Don't take anything less than that. Your H needs to jump through hoops to get you back. I would be clear about that.

Sorry, I get so angry reading your story. However, I am so happy to feel your strength. Hang very tough Mom! CV