Thanks for the inspiration...you guys are great counselors and give me hope for my marriage. I have to admit I am a bit hesitant to confront H right now after his erratic and mean behavior towards me. Would it better to plan a get-together, call him, or just show up at his doorstep to say hi? I guess I would be afraid to interrupt something I don't neccesarily want to see..it would expose the affair though! And I am curious to see what is so special about this girl. Interestingly (since you believe he may have a drinking issue), he said he liked his flame of his 4-month affair because she was able to just drink beer and watch tv. I was thinking to myself..."Wow, that is pretty shallow...a life fulfilled by drinking beer and watching tv." It certainly is not a comment that the H I married would make!

So you think I should confront him about his drinking? I know he won't be very enthusiastic about moving home. He literally just bought new furniture for his place...all cheap stuff he said. I did consider writing him a letter to see if he would want to look for a place north of where we are at (closer to his new job) so we can start rebuilding in a new environment. Since he recently signed a year long lease, I am not sure if this is possible. I haven't sent the letter and probably won't...his mom didn't think the timing was right and still doesn't.

He definitely has ignored me the past couple days which makes me very nervous about confrontation (I tend to get emotional in these situations)...can't stand the thought of him treating me like crap in front of my face anymore (hurts my love bank!). Furthermore, I am only 5 weeks away from the World Championships in Kona and I don't want to do anything to compromise that. Last time, I had a confrontation with H, I crashed my bike and ended up with foot long gash on my knee (still healing) because my mind was on him rather than on the road! My friends keep telling me to focus on myself...have to keep my own health before I can help him. Losing 10 lbs and crashing my bike did not help my health!

Plus, I am a counselor so it is hard to hold sessions when I am an emotional wreck! He turned my world upside down for a couple weeks and my finances were affected severely...he has it easy because he has a set income. Running my own business, my income is based on clients and I wasn't able to counsel for 2 weeks! And I was supposed to write a book this year which I am now going to postpone with the publisher because I am not very good at sitting down and doing research right now. I love interacting with my clients but cannot sit in a quiet apartment without visiting this site or talking on the phone with friends/family for therapy. I hate that he has compromised all this!

But I will do anything that you think may help our chances at marriage success. With him ignoring me right now, is it best to hang back and just continue my e-mail posts about what is going on in my life and asking him how things are going with him OR should I try to make physical contact with him and initiate a real conversation?

Thanks again for all your great input...you truly have made a difference in my day <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

<img border="0" alt="[Teary]" title="" src="graemlins/teary.gif" />

Ok, I feel like doesn't feel a frickin thing for me anymore. I don't understand how he can just shut off any care or worry for a person he called "the woman of his dreams." Everytime I ask him something, whether it be to go out for dinner as friends or a favor like driving me to the airport, he asks disgusted like I am burdening him. He used to be so willing ot help me out and now it just seems like he wants nothing to do with me. I am having such a hard time with this because I have never turned away anyone like this. I am even friends with previous boyfriends....I feel like there is something repulsive about me to him which hurts. I don't understand <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" /> What could be so bad about me that he can't even see me or talk to me? I just feel so rejected right now. I can't stand the thought of anyone disliking me, let alone my husband who I have only treated with love and respect the past 5 years of our relationship, life together.

When I e-mail him, he sends back these cold responses. He didn't even congratulate me when I send an e-mail telling him about my first big triathlon win on Sunday (just ignored this e-mail). When I try to call him, he doesn't pick up or answers with an obnoxious "yeah". Last time we went out (over a month ago), he wore his sunglasses inside the restaurant the entire dinner and just smirked, acting all arrogant (a major turnoff). Who is this person? Why is content at acting so mean to me when all I have done is been by his side even after all the **** he has done to me.

Help, I am losing hope. My love bank is in debt and I don't forsee any deposits being made in the near future.

Any further inspiration would be greatly appreciated...I am so sick of feeling like this and I hate not knowing what will become of my marriage...don't want to have to wait my life away for someone treating me this ****ty!

So, maybe he does still care??? I am still confused <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

K you aren't a burden so don't start feeling down...it is just WAY too early in the morning (asked him to drive me to the airport). Especially when a shuttle service is available. As for the ride home, it is just too risky cuz sometimes I don't get out of here until 5:30 and it takes over an hour to get just back to PB at that time of day..I would be super late if I had to go furthere down to the airport. You are not a burden so don't think that way, it is just easier if you take the shuttle. We did it all the time before.

-Him

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> Ok...so now I am feeling better. He seems to be out of the fog momentarily. I continue to deposit into his love bank. Below is a recent series of e-mails after a dry period this past week.

ME: I wouldn't suppose you could be my favorite airport chaffeur again??? It will be nice to have help cuz I'll be luggin a bike, my tri-bag, and luggage....ick! Just let me know if this is ok with ya...if not, I'll try to make other arrangements. Thanks a bunch.

HIM: Afraid I can't help ya this time around. The departure means I would have to get you to the airport at 5:30am, which puts me getting up at 4:30 to get ready for work..not gonna happen. And your arrival would be tough for me to make with my commute home during rushour. The shuttle service is good and they handle your bags for ya. You may have to get up earlier than you want on the 9th, but you can rest on the plane!!
Sorry K. Best of luck to you, and don't overdo it. Its just training.

ME: Sorry that I seem such a burden to you.

HIM: K you aren't a burden so don't start feeling down...it is just WAY too early in the morning. Especially when a shuttle service is available. As for the ride home, it is just too risky cuz sometimes I don't get out of here until 5:30 and it takes over an hour to get just back to PB at that time of day..I would be super late if I had to go furthere down to the airport. You are not a burden so don't think that way, it is just easier if you take the shuttle. We did it all the time before.

ME: Sorry, I am PMSing and overly emotional right now. I am sure Jan can take me to the airport since she gets up at 4am.

HIM: Ugg..see getting up at 4am is just not good for you...unless you are going on vacation, which you are. Don't be stressed, just relax and enjoy it. You'll get there just fine and all will be good. Enjoy not having to race and just take in the experience. Have fun!!!

ME: Will miss ya on this trip...do you remember waiting for this opportunity to train for and race at Ironman Wisconsin after your triumphant finish at Ralph's 1/2 Ironman. I was so proud of you and was bummed that I missed your finish due to my unfortunate trip to the medical tent.

I have been super bummed that we have not been able to train together...you have been such an inspiration for me as I got started in triathlon. It is hard to believe I finally have that opportunity to race in Kona after volunteering and vacationing there with you last year.

Racing in Hawaii will be bittersweet. Just knowing that you were at the finishline to embrace me motivated me at my first Ironman . I will miss seeing you at the Hawaii finishline and celebrating with you. Thank you for encouraging me to go after my dreams despite the time it took away from us; in retrospect, I'd take it all away just to be able to have that time back with you.

Perhaps next year, I'll be cheering you on as you train for IM and I enjoy the shorter races and more free time ( : Love always, K

Sorry about all the babbling...feel like I am sharing my whole life story. It just helps to journal my thoughts spontaneously. Having feedback from great people you you is just an added perk.

kjb23,

first let me say, (and this is only my opinion), your WH does not have a drinking problem. He is a guy, a man, men drink, men like to sit and watch tv and drink, men like to come in from work and have a drink, they like to work in the yard and have a drink, they like to sit around in their underwear, don't know why, we just do... AND what guy didn't drink alot in college, think I missed my whole frist two years because of drinking...

If you confront him about the drinking now, that will only give him reason to push away. AGAIN, this is only my opinion, I am no expert, have had no formal education with alcoholics...

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">
feel like there is something repulsive about me to him which hurts. I don't understand What could be so bad about me that he can't even see me or talk to me? I just feel so rejected right now. I can't stand the thought of anyone disliking me, let alone my husband who I have only treated with love and respect the past 5 years of our relationship, life together
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">there is nothing repulsive about you, this is just your WH floating in the fog with his new found adventure with the OW. He has not fallen out of love with you, has not forgotten the love the two of you share, it's just blocked by the perfectness of the A. Continue to give him praise, remind him of all the times you have shared like you are doing in the emails...

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">
Would it better to plan a get-together, call him, or just show up at his doorstep to say hi?
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I would not suggest you just drop by.... like you said, you may run into something you are not ready to deal with, beside the fact this will make your WH feel as though you are following, and checking up on him. Call him, offer to meet for lunch, have a picnic, just talk. He may resist at first, but if you continue to be there for him, understand he is having a hard time and that you are willing to do whatever it takes to help him, he will eventually start to see throught the heavy fog he is lost in...

fogless....

Fogless.....
Can I ask you a question????
My story is too long to post but my WH dropped the bomb on July 20th and is already now telling me he is filing for divorce. We have been married for 14 yrs. and have an 8 yr. old son.

He is still in contact with OW. How can he make such a rash decision about divorce when I just found out? He says he loves me but like a father does a child. What????? What is he talking about? He says our son will be fine and we can still be firends......he is in the fog bigtime. I think I'm doomed for divorce. Will he ever wake up and realize what he's doing??????

TreeReich,

How long as the A been going on???
Any problems in your marriage prior to this??

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">
How can he make such a rash decision about divorce when I just found out? He says he loves me but like a father does a child. What????? What is he talking about?
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I ask the above questions because nothing I have read on these boards surprises me when I read what a H says while having the A. During the affair, everything with the OW is perfect. You don't have the everyday stuff to deal with, bills, kids, etc. The time spent with the OW is normally all "us" time, doing things together, etc. All the WH thinks is hey, I feel so happy and alive when I'm with OW, everything is great... At the same time, he struggles with knowing that he loves his wife and kids, and finds himself caught between two women he loves.

When faced with a fork in the road, the easy road is what we want to choose, now given in the A situation the road you think is easy (the road with the OW) is really the most difficult one, but when lost in the fog the WH does not see that. I had the same feeling, knew I loved my wife, didn't feel any differently about her than I did the day we married, however the perfectness of the A made me think I felt differently, that the love I had for my wife was not the perfect love I should be feeling, (that of which I was feeling with OW).... Hopefully some of that makes sense..

Talk to your H, let him know you are there, that you will love him, that you want to get past this, and will do whatever it takes to make sure the two of you can stay together.....
Remind your H that when he leaves he will no longer be able to kiss your son good night, (a phone call is not the same), there is no quick game of catch in the yard before dinner, no eating breakfast together before school.. Do all these things in a loving way, not a threatening or angry way.

fogless....

Thanks fogless.

I will not confront him about drinking as I agree: I don't think he in an alcoholic. I think we all (not just men) like to unwind sometimes with a drink. However, my H has never really been responsible with drinking...usually has enough to get sick and regret it even if he plans on just having a couple. He is NOT addicted like a true alcoholic though ...he just goes out and drinks heavily every once in awhile (it has been more frequently since he dropped the bomb). I worry about him sometimes...especially with some of his false friends (single guys who don't know us as a couple and who are co-workers he associates with every once in awhile). Last 4th of July, he drank too much and wanted to prove to the party that he could jump from rooftop to rooftop (we were 4 stories up). I freaked out when he actually got on the roof and had to have 2 guys tackle him to prevent him from jumping. I am just afraid that if he gets himself in the same situation with these so-called new friends of his that they will encourage such suicidal behavior...must be that male ego!

His parents have already confronted and talked to him about his drinking (and I didn't even say anything)...if he gets another DUI, he actually will go to jail. He promised them that he would not do anything stupid when he goes out drinking.

He has seemed to grow a bit over the past couple weeks although I would desire more contact. I just get discouraged because I long for the way we used to be and I see flashes of someone who doesn't seem to care. And then it is increasingly confusing when he comes back acting nicer.

Can I ask you when your final revelation occurred, what finally made you come back to your wife? How did you go about confronting her? Was it smooth sailing, a happy marriage from there on out. I would love my H and I to be reconciled before the holidays to avoid that dreaded exposure to extended family as well as to enjoy each other once again during this special time...just don't know how far away he is from actually having a revelation about our marriage together.

Thanks again for your help...it keeps my hope fire burning.

Fogless,

Hey, great post to KJB23. I agree, he's just caught up in the perfect make-believe life.

KJB23,

Hang in there. You have to balance so much right now. You can't hide from the M stress...it's never 2 min. out of your mind so keep from obsessing over stuff you can't do anything about right now. Especially if your in the throngs of PMS. OMG. Deep breath and don't rip anyones head off. Laughing. Train and focus on you. By the way, as a counselor you know better than to draw so much of your worth from others. You need to realize how great your doing! Look at all you accomplishemts! You're awesome so hang in there and don't think about H while riding the bike...I think Pure Bob about killed himself on a dday bike ride. Focus on the competition. We're all rooting for you!

Tree,
You H is fogged over bigtime. Don't trust too much of what he is telling you right now. Lies, deception and attempts to trigger your reaction to validate his justification to stay gone and involved in the A. He's deep in the inital thrill. Its not you. One of the hardest parts for the BS is that they have no control (or feel they don't) over the situation. They would love to step in, shake the crap out of their WS and grab him by the ear and drag him home. BUT... you can't control him. You have to sit back and do what appears to be nothing. You need to go to Mom and Dad's to ride out the storm, take little sprout and take care...there's a storm blow'en your way. I know he is threatening DV. Stall. Tell him your thinking about it but want to consider all the options. The longer you put him off the better. He's not thinking right. His mind has been abducted. Really! Stall. Don't even blink when he makes those comments. Just reply, "I'm thinking about all my options." Smile and walk away. That will get him going. Watch out for the wild emotional swings of the rollercoaster ride. Try not to make life decisions while at a high or low. You'll regret it if you do. Hang in there.

2scared

Fogless and 2Scared........

He says his A has been going on for a year. We have ahd problems in the past but I thought we got past them. Everything seemed fine!
I have told him all the things you've mentioned...it doesn't faze him. He just says he isn't happy and doesn't love me in the capacity of a husband. I don't think he quite understand that he won't be with our son doing all the everyday things that are so special. He thinks our son will be fine...his words!
He says his brothers support him...how can they? I truly don't understand what he is thinking.
Every time I talk to him I get more and more confused! I told him I was willing to do whatever it took to save our marriage. He's not interested. He keeps telling me that I will find someone and be happy. Does he really want another man in my son's life???? What do I do?????

Tree,

Breathe. Slow down, this is a marathon not a sprint. Decisions don't have to be made tonight, tomorrow or even this week. You have a son to care for and a hurricane coming. You freaking H is foggy. Don't accept anything he is saying as fact. The bad news is that the longer the A has gone on (mine was 2 years...1 yr EA second year PA) the more emotionally attached he is to her and the more difficult it will be for him to break free (when he gets to that point). I went 6 months after exposed before I came to my senses. Stall. Why do you feel the need to freak out now for? Take a deep breath and slow down. One step at a time. ONE STEP...which should be away from the incoming hurricane. Hang in there.

I'm praying for you!
2scared

TreeReich,

I agree with 2Scared, step back and take a breather, don't make any quick decisions...

Your H is in the deep woods, fog is worse there. Continue to talk with him like you have been doing. Talk to him about your son, how he needs to have his father around. Were your Hs parents divorced??

My concern is the problems you stated you had in the past and that you thought the two of you had gotten past... Well I'm not sure your H has. Men are very good at acting normal while things eat at them on the inside. You may want try and talk with your H about the earlier issues, let him know that maybe the two of you need to talk about that before trying to work through the A.

Hang in there, the fog will lift, all it takes is just a ray of sunlight to start to burn the fog away..

fogless....

Still trying in Plan A...my question is how do you know if your actions are overkill? When it may be better to back off? My H's mom still thinks I should put him on "ignore" but I am not sure how this will help our marriage??? Thanks for your continued guidance!! Her is my latest e-mail:

Hey S-

I am planning to cook our mean Friday night pasta up for the first time in a long while tomorrow night and wondered if you may be interested in coming over for food and laid back conversation. May be up for a movie too...there is a lot I haven't seen and I know there have been a lot of good movies that came out this summer. Just let me know if you are up for salivating over pasta (ha ha ha), catching up, and going to see a movie.

Have a good day.

Love ya,

K

Oh well...it was worth a shot. He doesn't seem to be jumping at my invites but at least he is responding in a kind fashion. I wish he'd ask me if I wanted to meet him for dinner or to do something during the long weekend...no such luck yet <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> Here is his response followed by mine:

Thanks for the invite, but I'm gonna pass. Traffic is such a nightmare on Fridays that I am just going to work out and have dinner up here. Might see what Kenny and Dan are up since I'm pretty much stuck up here for a few hours. You should invite Brian, Jan, Andy, etc over. I'm sure they would love a good pasta meal!! Plus I've still got lots of stuff I need to do around the new apartment that I've put off too long.

Thanks for the invite, hope you have a good weekend.
-S

ME:
I understand...just will have to salivate over the pasta for several nights with the leftovers accumulated from cooking a whole batch!!! Or I'll roll down the hills with a phat belly at Balboa 4-miler on Sat cuz I have eaten the whole batch by myself! Perhaps a raincheck on this?

I don't know how you do the traffic thing. The traffic just from PAC to PB killed me back in the day I was working at gyms! I hated it. I guess if you have some good music jamming it is not too bad.

If you need help with the apartment, I may be able to lend a hand this weekend. Perhaps you want to display your mountain of medals? If so, I can bring some stuff over for decoration. Of course, my favorite scenario is if you just came home (please know you are always welcome). The lease ends here in October...not sure what I am going to do. I don't think I want to look for a new place after hearing your struggles and I know that 975/month is pretty killer for this area which I love (and don't want to leave). I actually have registered for information for studios/1 BR condos located a block from Tourmaline Beach in North PB starting at 290k. Not 100% sure if I can afford it but sure as heck will see if I can invest in something and earn some money a couple years from now off of real estate!

Well, back to the pile accumulating on my desk. Let me know if you'd like to get together at all this weekend. It would be nice to see you before I head off to IM Wisconsin. Tell Ken and Dan I say Hi. Ken and Jen's wedding is coming up...did you get an invitation? I talked to Jen about a month ago but forgot exactly what weekend their wedding was?

Love always,

K

Hope asking him back home was appropriate...it is certainly what I want when he is ready <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />

K,

You're doing great! Stay upbeat and positive. When I was first out of the house I wished my W would have invited me back. I wish she would have been more encouraging. Stay in Plan A. The offer to help decorate must have been difficult for you because the apartment is a symbol of his separation, but hang in there. If he says "yes" to the decoration jump on it with as many sentimental things as possible. First, it helps remind him daily of you two and second, if he is bringing the OW over it will tick her off and she will LB him. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> That's a good thing!

Other suggestions is to continue to offer to "do" fun things with him. Catch a movie, go to dinner, etc. Offer to meet him there and then he can go on after your done. Keep him wondering if he is really making the right decision. AND... if the OW finds out he's still meeting up with you it will tick her off! Yeah! Note: If he does meet you he will lie to her about it. He doesn't want her to know he's cheating on the OW with his W. Sick, but true. Trust me, when she finds out (the two worlds do collide) she will LB all over him. Reality check! The A is not "perfect"!

Hang in there. We're pulling for you!

By the way, my small studio apartment rents for $395/mo. Laughing. Jealous?

2scared

FYI....

My W has agreed to meet me for dinner tonight at a local restaurant. That's awesome! Nothing life changing but it is a start. She's still so hurt and doesn't trust me. BUT, this is a start! Keep me in your prayers...

I'm scared and want this to be positive.

2scared

2Scared,

That's great news that you are having dinner with your W. Go and enjoy her company, don't push matters, let the night and conversation go where it may. You said this is not a life changing event, but it is a VERY big step for both of you...

Hope all goes well...

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by betrayedinjersey:
<strong> Welcome to MB fogless. I hope you find answers and support for your struggle. My FWH posted only once, but reads frequently. I'll point your post out to him...hopefully he'll jump in.

BS..... please do not try to get answers out of new members. They are confused, and unsure of what's just occured in their lives.

Let them get their feet wet first. They are here for support as well. When a BS flies at them quickly with questions, it rehashes their own pain a little bit.

I hope I haven't offended anyone, I just don't want fogless to run away quickly. He's found a lot of courage to come here as the FWH, and we want him to get help so him and his W can rebuild their M. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">HEY FOLKS!!!
I can answer many questions, as I am a REFORMED FWH who is now a BS. I have TOTALLY been defogged and can look back at my actions and inactions with composure. I might be able to help some of you BS's and FWS's, in fact I feel I need to. I would like to use some of my PAIN to help others AVOID theirs if at all possible. I'm no longer in DENIAL! I realize the effects of my A does not totally go away, even after YEARS of POSITIVE action on my part in my M. I'll be back to comment and answer as honestly as possible how my experiences may reflect the actions of you WS. I hope I can help, though some of my W's actions I do not understand, maybe it's because I'm too close to OUR situation to see all things as quickly and objectively as I would otherwise.

There is always HOPE. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

kjb23,

Your right on track with what your doing and how your handling things. Telling him you want him to come home is perfectly fine, he needs to hear that you want him home, (now don't over do this to the point of nagging)... You need to work on getting him home, things are hardest as long as you guys are separated, once home you can start on really rebuilding that relationship.

Like 2Scared says, offer to meet him somewhere close to his place, (block that traffic excuse), offer to go over and train/workout with him.

Your doing great, keep it up...

Dinner went well. I kept conversation light and about the kids. She did say that she would consider at least one session of MC together. Oh Yeah! I have found a good counselor who is coach trained and focused on restoration...a female so my W will feel comfortable. Maybe next week!

Anyway, there were some smiles and laughing at one point in the conversation. No apparent LB's. Deep breath... patience.

2scared