Hahhaha <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />
Yes, patience and understanding..OHH the BS code of ethics, modus operandi? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> I got this all under control..NOT! I am navigating the waves of the might infidelity surf. WHOOOSH! Opps I just lost my cookies.

UPDATE:
Wifey enthusiasticly agreed to send me a Pledge of No Contact Letter. I don't know how excited I am about it, but YES POJA. It makes me want to just SINGGGGGGGGGGGG.
Harley's POJA!
(To be song to the tune of Village Peoples YMCA!)

Dear Spouse, there's no need to feel down.
I said, Dear Spouse, pick yourself off the ground.
I said, Dear Spouse 'cause and Afair was found
There's no need to be unhappy.

Dear Spouse, there's a place you can go.
I said, Dear Spouse, when you're short on the know.
You can post there, and I'm sure you will find
Many ways to survive an Affair!

It's fun to use Harleys P-O-J-A
It's fun to use Harleys P-O-J-A

They have everything for a BS to enjoy,
You can hang out with all the hurt girls and boys ...


It's fun to use Harleys P-O-J-A
It's fun to use Harleys P-O-J-A

You can get Anti D's, you can learn marriage skillz,
We know just how you feel ...

Dear Spouse, are you listening to me?
I said,Dear Spouse, what do you want to be?
I said, Dear Spouse, you can make real your dreams.
But you've got to know this one thing!

You can do it all by yourself.
I said, Dear Spouse, come to MB for some help,
And just use Harleys, P_O_J_A
I'm sure he can help you today.

It's fun to use Harleys P-O-J-A
It's fun to use Harleys P-O-J-A


They have everything a hurt spouse to enjoy,
You can hang out with all the hurt girls and boys

It's fun to use Harleys P-O-J-A
It's fun to use Harleys P-O-J-A

You can get Anti D's, you can learn marriage skillz,
We know just how you feel ...friend

Dear Spouse, I'm in the same shoes.
I said, I was down and out with the blues.
I felt my spouse didnt care if I were alive.
I felt the whole world was so jive ...

That's when I clicked on the link,
It said, dear spouse, we can help with your grief.
It's a place there called the MB WAY.
They can start you back on your way.

It's fun to use Harleys P-O-J-A
It's fun to use Harleys P-O-J-A

They have everything a hurt spouse to enjoy,
You can hang out with all the hurt girls and boys ...

P-O-J-A
It's fun to do it the POJA WAY
Dear Spouse, Dear Spouse, there's no need to feel down
Dear Spouse, Dear Spouse, pick yourself off the ground

P-O-J-A
It's fun to use Harleys P-O-J-A
Dear Spouse, Dear Spouse, are you listening to me
Dear Spouse, Dear Spouse, what do you wanna be?

P-O-J-A
It's fun to use Harleys P-O-J-A
Dear spouse, A spouse, can do it all by themselves
Dear spouse, Dear spouse, put your pride on the shelf

P_O_J_A
then just do it the MB WAY
P_O_J_A
dear spouse, dear spouse, i was once in your shoes
P_O_J_A
dear spouse, dear spouse, what do you wanna do
P_O_J_A

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> Too Much Caffeine This Morning!

FM:

We gotta get you a new hot wife to entertain you because I think this affair has taken you over the edge!!!! HA!!

Keep Hanging tough.

toosoon

<small>[ September 13, 2004, 07:26 AM: Message edited by: TooSoonToBeComfortable ]</small>

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by TooSoonToBeComfortable:
<strong> FM:

We gotta get you a new hot wife to entertain you because I think this affair has taken you over the edge!!!! HA!!

Keep Hanging tough.

toosoon </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Too much tea/coffee is my only excuse lol.
I think my W is coming around slowly but surely. That was the first time I read the lyrics to that YMCA song...anyone who thinks the village people werent homosexual is in a big fog as well <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

POJA is my mission. Negotiate and come to enthusiastic agreements! It's taking some getting used to, but it does work if applied correctly.

They were?!?!?!?!? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

I think you should email Steve a copy!

FM, you have done great as a man and done great using these principles. (It seems like you had them before MB, but it's just putting a name to them. And associating and getting support from others who have done the same. Absolutely no disrespect to the Harley's--this site and they have helped sooooo many people! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> )

I'm only on my first cup of coffee, so I'm having problems contorting myself into the "P" and the "J"! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

<small>[ September 13, 2004, 07:59 AM: Message edited by: LINY ]</small>

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by LINY:
<strong> They were?!?!?!?!? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

I think you should email Steve a copy!

FM, you have done great as a man and done great using these principles. (It seems like you had them before MB, but it's just putting a name to them. And associating and getting support from others who have done the same. Absolutely no disrespect to the Harley's--this site and they have helped sooooo many people! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> )

I'm only on my first cup of coffee, so I'm having problems contorting myself into the "P" and the "J"! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Yes they were...

Fun with all the boys???? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

ANyway..next subject <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> Yes, Liny I was once called MR. DIPLOMATIC by a former manager. In yet another company, I was the Manager who was called in to calm, deal with and put a smile on the disgrulted clients of my colleagues, why is it that I cannot find a JOB?????

I'm almost ready to pick up the family and move to your area Liny/Brown and work with you guys. Anyone need a LAN Manager/Systems Engineer with 10+ years experience??? The job market in the Washinton Metropolitian Area is flooded! I'm up every freaking day at 5AM getting a jump start on the new job listings. I've been under tremendous pressure, job, WW, bills etc... I took a buyout from Verizon and now I wish I could buy back in, to bad they're DOWNSIZING!!!

GRRRRHHH more coffee, more coffee <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

<small>[ September 13, 2004, 08:52 AM: Message edited by: FamilyMatters ]</small>

Hey FM:

Do you think pursuing your wife pushes her away? It seems like when you start distancing yourself from her she starts moving toward you again.

The book Divorce Busting talks about becoming conscious of the effects of your actions in a marriage, what actions get positive or negative reactions. And then stop doing things that were not working and doing more of what is.

I've been trying to figure out what my FWH has responded to positively so I could do more of it. Of course, this involves some experimentation and trying new things. For me it meant stop initiating relationship conversations, stop calling FWH, stop saying ILY, stop helping my FWH unless asked, keeping my own schedule (doing interesting things regardless of FWH's plans), and always acting happy.

I've found that the less I focus on our relationship, and the more I focus on developing myself, the happier I am. The more happier, stronger, and independent I am, the more interested FWH is in spending time with me.

Oh, I'm probably repeating what others have said so be patient with me. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by FamilyMatters:
Yes they were...

Fun with all the boys???? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Cafeine is getting in the way of seeing sarcasm! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I'm almost ready to pick up the family and move to your area Liny/Brown and work with you guys. Anyone need a LAN Manager/Systems Engineer with 10+ years experience???</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Unfortunately the "business" that we are in downsized our computer area just last week.

One suggestion is go to www.usajobs.gov for a gov't job. See what's out there. With you right outside of DC, you may be able to find a hit. Only other suggestion (which you probably already tried) is to find a headhunter.
I really don't know how the market is around here, but I can always put in a good word to my soon-to-be-ex-landlord for this house! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Thanks LINY
I'll be fine, somethings going to come through eventually. They say if you never quit you never lose right? Your right about the caffeine though, I usually have my first cup around 5 and don't stop until the pot is empty. GEESH, might need to switch to decaf.

My W is sounding very upbeat today. I hope this is a good sign that this weekends conversations didn't send her spiraling back onto the fence. I am hopefully yet realistically optimistic <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> if there is such a thing. I am up for a position in Richmond VA which would require me to stay in a hotel during the week and return home on the weekends. I know this really an opportune time to be on the road, BUT Financial Stability is one of my W's TOP 5 EN's...go figure...OM had a job just above minimum wage, no vehicle and lived with his mother. I remember reading an email where he was stressing how in his financial situation he didn't have anything to offer a woman with 2 children. My W so nice, and understanding she assured him that his finances weren't important. WOW! The double-standards! The reality is, Financial Stability is an EN my W has for her H not for OM. I think she would've been happy with OM regardless if she had to live on the street, the FOG is so FORGIVING... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by FamilyMatters:
BUT Financial Stability is one of my W's TOP 5 EN's...go figure...OM had a job just above minimum wage, no vehicle and lived with his mother. I remember reading an email where he was stressing how in his financial situation he didn't have anything to offer a woman with 2 children. My W so nice, and understanding she assured him that his finances weren't important.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Ready for the nerf 2x4?

[WHACK]

Ok that's twice--next time, no warning buddy! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />

YOU KNOW YOU are so much better than that. She knows not what she said! She will one day realize how much better than that you are--she already started, right? Wouldn't have put it on her EN's. She KNOWS she can have FS with you, that's why it's a need for her.

Check it out anyway, that website. For S&G's. Don't know what salary you are looking for/need, but at least you can compare to what's in the "real" world.

Good luck!

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Loy:
<strong> Hey FM:

Do you think pursuing your wife pushes her away? It seems like when you start distancing yourself from her she starts moving toward you again.


Oh, I'm probably repeating what others have said so be patient with me. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I know what you mean LOY, its a very human thing. The more you pursue the more they recoil. I have learned to simply "BE". I do however show my affection and warmth for her, the key with my W is not to be desperate. I am not desperate nor dying for her, but I do enjoy her companionship as long as its committed and honest. She's a great person when her mind is in a place where she can be. I hope that makes sense.

FM:

I think you should consider locking your wife into a room with no windows for the next 120 days or so. You can cut a hole into the door with a trap door, yes like a jail cell door. It is a way to break her of any contact with the enemy (OM) and tell her you will let her out as soon as she is completely re-programmed or back in love with you.

If you need to extend the time period, add 60 days to it later. Nothing else has worked for you so it might be worth a try.

We can call this the MB-2 Program and it can be used when all else fails. Don't worry about the possible kidnapping charges because you wont let her out till she is completely under your spell or back in love with you. When that happens, she won't want to file charges against you.

Think about. I am sure Dr Harley would support the plan if you explained all your other things you have tried. Yes, if you try it and it works, I am entitled to receive some form of royalty payments, don't you think?

TooSoon

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by TooSoonToBeComfortable:
<strong> FM:

I think you should consider locking your wife into a room with no windows for the next 120 days or so. You can cut a hole into the door with a trap door, yes like a jail cell door. It is a way to break her of any contact with the enemy (OM) and tell her you will let her out as soon as she is completely re-programmed or back in love with you.

If you need to extend the time period, add 60 days to it later. Nothing else has worked for you so it might be worth a try.

We can call this the MB-2 Program and it can be used when all else fails. Don't worry about the possible kidnapping charges because you wont let her out till she is completely under your spell or back in love with you. When that happens, she won't want to file charges against you.

Think about. I am sure Dr Harley would support the plan if you explained all your other things you have tried. Yes, if you try it and it works, I am entitled to receive some form of royalty payments, don't you think?

TooSoon </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> Now that was funny....hahahhah lol
Incredible isn't it? She's home though, isn't that enough? NOPE it's not. As I was cooking dinner tonight my mind began to travel and I realized something, call it an epiphany, call it a vision,..but I came to a form of clarity and realized that contrary to my earlier beliefs...
"This Doesn't Have To Work!"
WOW!
It doesn't. I recall my mindset going into this, years of trying to persuade her to save our M while she skipped thru the tulips letting our finances and her credit rating turn to dog crap! I remember hearing my mother tell me that my W came by the house with some guy. It turns out it was OM but he looked so young and was ridding in the backseat so when my W said he was my D's boyfriend, my mom brought it! I keep going over all the lies, the deception, her making me feel like a total heel of person because I had an A, and acting all sanctimonious like her A was a gift from GOD and a deliverance! I will be myself and if thats not enough, I am done. At this point, I'm okay with things not working out. She wants to have a baby? What the %#^#$^%# How can I even phantom bringing another child into the world with a woman who won't even write a No Contact Letter to her ex-boyfriend? What am I Sam Sausage Head <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> Don't answer that...hahahhahah

Don't get me wrong. I will do what I can, but there will be no more extraordinary actions to sway, persuade or woo my W, at least by me. I am done being the hero who gets nothing in return. I'm only human and this is getting ridiculous. She wants us to just move on? How totally selfish! When I screwed up there was no lets just move on option. There was however a H get lost, better yet let me go screw some kid and neglect my kids, lose our house, spite my spouse, act like I'm 20 for 2 years, accept wedding proposals, wear anothers ring while I'm still married FM go jump in the lake option.

WHEW! It feels so good to vent! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

<small>[ September 13, 2004, 07:09 PM: Message edited by: FamilyMatters ]</small>

FM:

There is a guy in my office that I work with who did what any normal and decent caring and loving family man would do with a wife and six kids....he had an affair with the much younger babysitter and knocked her up. That was enough to have his wife kick him out of the house so he buys a house and moves the pregnant babysitter into the house with him. Guess what, she turned out to be a bit of a nutcase, duh! The baby was born 18 months ago and now he is in IC to try and figure out his life. He came into the office today and told me he is thinking about dumping the girlfriend and letting the house go into forclosure.

I said to him that I was sorry it didn't work out for him, but under my breath, I said "you are a f...... idiot. What did you expect was going to happen".

FM, I too reached a point where my marriage didn't need to work either and it was that revelation that actually bagan making the marriage better. our spouse learns you can live without them but you are willing to keep trying if life can just become better. After my wife better understanding my new independent feelings, she began trying harder to make things work. Maybe today was a big day for you with this new revelation. I hope so.

TooSoon

TS2BC,
Please go read this thread..support me and CYMANCA before we get with a barrage of 2X4's....

MEN SHOULD BE HEROES!!!!!!!

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by weaver:
<strong> I guess if were in your shoes, I would let it drop too, for now.

If you find she has anymore contact with him, you will be forced into Plan B again. Then I am sure you will get the NC letter first before she comes back.

Granted it was something on your "list" and she is disrespecting you, however she is home and there is NC.

If it continues to bother you, and your recovery is hindered then you will be moved to bring it up with her again, hopefully by then she will be really wanting you back fully and completely and she will do what you have asked.

I am no expert, but I would let it drop for now, unless like you said you want another useless battle. Only the followers of MB would really appreciate and understand the NC letter, to all others it would seems needlessly cruel, and even embarrasing to send to someone who you have already broken off all contact.

Still wishing you and Mrs. FM well,

Weaver </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Well things are bad, wife has been sleeping in my D's room for what 3 weeks? It was only supposed to be one night and it has now snowballed. Of course the repeated gloominess my W displays out of the blue, the waves of sarcasm from no where, the total isolation that she yearns for almost every other week led me to suspicions that she is still in contact with OM. I remember this thread, when she lied to me agreeing to the NC Letter upon her return home and then refusing to write it. I remember taking the advice given her not to push it, to simply be happy she was home and begin to work on our M...welp! She hasn't been working with me and today I questioned her on this issue. Today this needed to stop.

I asked her to phone OM and let me hear her state the facts to him. I want to witness it. I want to be sure that she is not in contact. She responded that contacting OM to have him confirm their R is over would make her feel stupid, I told her contacting OM to confirm her committment to our M and Family would make her a Queen a UPSTANDING Wife and Mother trying to regain her H's trust. My W didn't make the call, she doesn't care how I percieve her. She is willing to sleep on the street before she has to make that call. She is willing to drive me crazy with suspicion, she's willing to live with tension and hurt feelings...PLEASE SOMEONE TELL ME LETTING THIS ISSUE DIE WAS IN MY FAMILYS BEST INTEREST ...I thought it was, but I think I've made a mistake. I do not blame anyone, I know you folks were so tired of seeing me in such agony and wanted to give my W the benefit of the doubt.

The bottom line is that how I see her and my emotional well-being should come before all others. I have done many things for my W throughout the years, so so many things that to list them all would be tiresome. It comes down to my W's inablity to be true to herself and to claim her life, mind you: whatever that life may be. I am prepared at this point for her to leave and this M to end, my marriage ending will not drive me crazy, but this back and forth garbage will. The late arrivals from work without a phone call, the out of the blue coldness that reeks of contact with OM, the locked cellphones the sleeping in separate rooms and all of the other nonsense. It must end.

I've done everything in my power to save this M and to reclaim my position as H, Provider, Giver, Servant Leader and Protector, and it has all fallen on deaf ears. I stood for something and now I'll count the days until I gather my strength to remove her from this home. I can't take anymore of this abuse.

Sincerely,

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by FamilyMatters:
<strong> TS2BC,
Please go read this thread..support me and CYMANCA before we get with a barrage of 2X4's....

MEN SHOULD BE HEROES!!!!!!! </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">hero does not equal drooling idiot... you don't get it.

Pep

This is NOT my life!

She left again...but I feel it was inevitable. She should have NEVER been here to begin with. It was an agonizing couple of months full of spite and coldness, indifference and pain. I did it. I forced my automatum, either perform an action that lets me know exactly where you stand with OM or leave. I felt so bad doing that, and OH how I wanted her to call him and confirm that the R is over, Oh she could have written that No Contact Letter but she didn't, she wouldn't. I tried to stop her from leaving, silly man it was you who gave her the choice. I tried to close the door before she could open it, but she was too fast, she's gone and for some reason I feel slightly better already. At least this part is now behind me, I confronted her, I didn't let her weazel out, I stood my ground, and she chose him.

At least she finally chose, of course she will never admit she chose OM, she will probably always say her R with OM ended back soon after D-Day and me needing confirmation was unreasonable, that she opted not to humiliate herself and contact OM to confirm the obvious. I know what happened here regardless to how my FW will repaint history. I only wanted what any H wants in a M, trust, committement, respet, love, admiration and someone to dream with. It's time I started living again and accept I cannot save my W from herself, this is her solo-battle now, I have just been disharged.

Sincerely Yours,
FM

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Pepperband:
<strong> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by FamilyMatters:
<strong> TS2BC,
Please go read this thread..support me and CYMANCA before we get with a barrage of 2X4's....

MEN SHOULD BE HEROES!!!!!!! </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">hero does not equal drooling idiot... you don't get it.

Pep </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Drooling idiot? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

Okay I'm not in a state of mind for that right now...I'll just wait for some encouragement or ideas for what I should do next...


edit)

and I dont think anyone should be a drooling idiot...but we should all know our missions, I also dont think you meant that for me...

I can remember that post...I knew me and Cymanca were gonna get hit with several 2X4's. Pep I was actually joking..

its hard to laugh now...but hey its better than drooling... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

Thanks

<small>[ November 11, 2004, 07:32 PM: Message edited by: FamilyMatters ]</small>

FM:

Gee willikers!

"I have just been disharged."

No, you discharged HER. Or you 2uit.

Rightfully? How the hell should I know?

Think about this, though. *IF* she really did end her R with OM soon after D-day, maybe it IS just 2 hard for her 2 contact him again for ANY reason. Remember, NC is an agreement between YOU and HER, not the OM's business at all. If you get there without ever sending the OM a letter, then you get there.

If it's long after the contact really ended, and I have no idea whether that's the case or not, then it would have been silly 2 contact him 2 tell him NC at this point in time.

She regains your trust in her through consistent actions, not coersion. Considering the na2re of the A and how she was used, it's certainly understandable that she feels withdrawn, cheap, and unworthy. YOU will need 2 earn HER trust in YOU at the same time she needs 2 earn yours.

-ol' 2long

Hey FM,

hang in there!

You're doing your best!

I would say... can you take a rest for a while? Some time for you?
You sound like you need it.