2B, HW, NG:

Guess I've kept it too myself long enough.

As you know the CLB has tried to contact my W AGAIN.

So its time for a No-contact letter. (we never sent one before as since him resigning his job seemed to be enough of a deterrent).
Then we sold our house and moved....so it seemed like a moot point.
Apparently NOT!

OK here is the question:
In addition to the NC part.....I am going to include some "information" to OMW about the A.

My question to all of you is How much and exactly "what" would you want to know if you were to receive such a Letter about your H's actions.

Keep in mind that OMW knows "something" was going on....but ONLY has OM "side" (LIES) to go on.

OMW doesn't even know that the "Other" OW....(my wife's' coworker & friend) was "real".
[He was doing them both at the same time (about a year) yet neither knew of the other]

The OOW started about a year into my W's A with the CLB .

Yet, they All worked together everyday!
This guy was Smooth. (And remember it ALL took place AT WORK!) With both women.
I've talked to OOW, and it was enlightening.

I want to tell OMW this info. as well.

Why didn't OMW ever get told?

My WW wouldn't and I couldn't.
(The way I got OM to turn on my W was too privately keep pushing his buttons....this got me in trouble with the authorities.....but it got OM "fired" and got him to show his true colors to my W (which gave her heart back to me).

Hey, I've wanted his W to know this ALL from the get go.
But as things turned out, I was going to leave it alone.....as we have moved on.

But since the CLB won't stop....then NOW I feel I have ever right to "expose" and inform. Mostly so he'll just GO AWAY already. Enough is Enough.

Its either this or I go and take care of it myself. (and that's NOT good for any involved).

[Although it will "officially" have to come from my W....so I don't get in any trouble].

So once again, what and how much detail would be "enough" for YOU if you were receiving such a letter. Be honest, please.

So there it is.
Fire away.

Oh yea, NG....hope the hotel stay was memorable. To be able to get away without the kids sometimes is .....$Priceless$! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />

HW…

Ok, so what is it will the names ending with a long E. The FOW in my case her name ends with an I. Uggghhhhhhh <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

I have those same questions you do. I feel sick to my stomach when I cringe because he’s kissing me (sometimes, not all the time). I mean god, he’s my husband it shouldn’t be that way. But I completely understand. I always wonder if he’s thinking about her instead of me. Or wishing it was her instead of me. In doing that, all I am doing is torturing myself. The one question you had about being able to look at him again the way it use to, hit so close to home. Even though I love my husband and things are so much better than they use to be (for the most part, other than my hiccups) it hurts that there is a loss of innocence now. It kills me to know that I will never have that blind trust again. I know the trust will come back and has to some degree but still have a LONG way to go. But I know I’ll never have that trust like it use to be. I wonder if I will always have this doubt in the back of my head or will that go away eventually.

I do believe that the triggers have a lot to do with out doubts and fears. Sometimes I wish I could be more like my husband and go on like everything is okay. Don’t think about it. When I asked him how often he thinks about her he says he doesn’t. It was a horrible mistake and he doesn’t like to think about it. I so badly want to believe him but I know how often I think about her and him, I just don’t see how he couldn’t. He says the only time he really thinks about her is when I bring her up and then it’s more about how he being with her has hurt me so much. I just don’t know…..you know.

But top rope is right. We do need to talk to our husbands and let them know what we are going through. It’s so much easier said than done!!!!!! I don’t have to worry about talking to H tonight because he is working another double. For some reason I can seem to muster up enough courage to talk to him on the phone rather than in person. Pretty weird huh. But I need to talk to him face to face. Like top rope said, he needs to see the pain I am going through and I do need to allow him to help me through it. We both need to allow our H’s to help us through these tough triggers days coming up.

Hang in there HW…..the day will be over soon and tomorrow will start a new day and hopefully be better for you. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Hugs to you!!!!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />
LJB

Mr. Top Rope.

I have to laugh every time you say CLB. That is such a great way to put it! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

How did the CLB find your wife after you guys moved? I would get on the NC letter ASAP, and yes contact his wife. She has a right to know I would want to know. I am still pissed at the guy who kept threatening to expose my H and the OW to me but never did.

So, lets see. What would I want to know if I were to receive a letter. Honestly, I’d want to know enough to where there was no doubt what so ever that what you were telling me was the truth. But I’d want to talk to you in person (over the phone) and get all the dirty little details of what you knew.

I would want to know how you found out, how come you didn’t tell me sooner, especially if you knew I thought something was going on. What exactly went on between them (but like I said, the little details I think are better for something left to discuss over the phone or in person, it’s up to you). It’s hard to say exactly what I’d want to know for sure until I actually talked to you and heard what you had to say. I’d have so many questions that you can probably answer.

YES, she should know there were 2 OW. I mean if nothing else for her own health. So yes you need to tell her that. She as you know is going to be devastated, but I wish the guy that knew about my H and the OW would have said something to me. And the OMW needs to know that he is still trying to contact your wife. You know to expect that she is going to be highly angry at your W also right.

Why haven’t you told the OMW sooner? Did I miss that?

Gosh NO, we don’t want you taking this situation into your own hands. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> That isn’t going to do you or your W any good. You aren’t going to do her any good behind bars. So get that out of your head Mr. Top Rope!!!!!!

But to answer your question in detail that is hard. Yes, she does need to know. I’m not sure a letter would be a good idea, I would rather receive a phone call. But if you are going to do a letter, I would just explain in detail who you are, and basically explain how you found out. I would give her the option to call you if she wants to talk further or needs more answers. It is so hard to explain something like this in writing. But give her when, where, how you found out, that he is still trying to contact your W, that you two are trying to rebuild your marriage, I would explain why you didn’t say anything sooner, that would be one of my first questions. The easiest way I would say to write her is explain to her what you would want to know.

How do you plan on getting this letter to her without the OM finding it or destroying it before she gets it? When do you plan on sending the NC letter, is your W supportive of this idea? Does she agree with telling the OMW, even if she doesn’t I still would. I would have told the OWH but the bimbo was divorced.

So my dear that is what I would do, not sure if I answered your question or not. But we need to get this idea of you taking care of him out of your head and divert that to something else!!!!

Let us know what you come up with! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Hugs! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />
LJB

2B -

You are such a dear to offer me support when you are hurting so bad. I do appreciate it. I am hoping that today will be better although I did go to bed in a foul mood <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> and I woke up in one as well. I started thinking about this time of year last year and I became furious at the thought of how cruel my H is. Yes I know things are 100X better now. The fact remains that he came home from war and decided to leave his family. Then decided he didn't want to leave us but he wanted to bring us to a new duty station. A move that would put him next to FOW, in her neighborhood and working for her on a daily basis. He moved us away from our home, my job, the baby's daycare, my 9 year olds school, my family, our friends so he could be with her....yes he said those words. He told her that. I'm sickened by it all.

So needless to say I'm sad. I'm glad I was able to fullfill his SF needs this weekend and I'm hoping that will keep him away from me for a few days. Mind you I'm usually the aggressor in bed but he doesn't get close to me unless he is 'in the mood'.

I agree 2B. We do need to open up. And like Top-Rope told you in an earlier post....we do have to spell it out for them. Like state word for word what is bothering us. How sad....I feel like asking him if he'd like for me to chew his food up and spit it in his mouth (YUCK)!!! Seriously, if you can't figure this out then you might need some help with the concept of breathing, right? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

I know what you mean about talking to my H more freely over the phone. It's like when he's here in front of me I can't open my mouth. I freeze up. There's a part of me that can't stand the fact that he runs to the bedroom and puts a pillow over his head if he sees that I'm hurting. He will stay in bed until I come get him and tell him it's OK. I'm like, look fella, I'm hurting. I'm not yelling at you or crying and screaming, I'm hurting. You hurt me. I didn't hurt you. I didn't make you do this. I loved you and when you came home from war I was traumatized by what I went through while you were gone and the thought of what you went through while you were gone. I needed you as much as you needed me. Instead of you comforting me you cheated on me. You cheated on our family. You tried to walk out on us. Then you moved us to "HELL" so you could be with another woman. You have never let me be sad. You take it upon yourself to make my hurt all about you! You run to the bedroom and hide your head. I understand you being ashamed. I don't blame you for feeling shame. The cruelty of the situation would shame anyone. But it's not about you right now. It's about me trying to deal with the situation. It's me coming to grips with the fact that the man I love and the father of my children is not the man I thought he was. It's me allowing myself to hurt and feel anger. It's me needing space. While we both want to salvage our marriage and we are moving in the right direction I still need to feel like it is ok to hurt. So while it might be helpful for you to hide your head under a pillow and cry until I come tell you I love you and it is going to be OK, it does not help me. So grow up and realize that you have created this mess. You can't clean it up right now. You can't take away my pain. You can't take your actions and your words back. They are here to stay. We can, however, help each other through this. We can become stronger as Christians, as a family, as a married couple.

OK, nice vent there. 2B - try it. Post what you would say to your H. Maybe it'll help you formulate the words when you decide to talk to your H.


Top-Rope -

Lemme put some thoughts into your request and I'll get back to you. I'm thinking I like the thought of a letter. As long as you give her the option to call you and ask questions if she would like to. There is the issue with the 'law' though so I'm not sure how to go around that. Let me think for a minute.

Love you both. Would like to hear from NG if she's around. How's the hotel visit go?

Top-Rope -

Ok, so you're gonna expose to FOM'sW. You are going to write a letter. How do you know where FOM lives? How do you know he hasn't moved? Does our wife know this? Or is this just a guess? Is he still with his W? Do you have access to OOW (other other woman). Do you plan on letting her know that you are going to expose her R with FOM to FOM'sW? I think she should know. She might get a call from FOM'sW. She should be prepared. Now wasn't the OOW offered her job back after FOM was fired? I think she was, right? Is she still with that company?

Now can you tell me how FOM found you and your wife? Haven't the numbers changed? So how'd he locate you and your W's work number? He called her at work right?

For the letter. If I were to get one of these letters and I already had an idea that something went on. I'd need to see timelines and dates and proof that cannot be disputed. Nothing can be up for her own interpretation. She needs to see that there's no way he can or will ever be able to explain away. I would think she would also need contact information so she can call you or email you if she has questions or would like to talk.

Now in this letter also include MB information. Tell her that you and your wife are working on your marriage but his calling your wife is not helping at all. Offer her support and wish her the best of luck. Do not sound angry with her (I know you wouldn't) and most importantly show that you accept some of the blame. Showing that you realize that this is not her H's fault entirely will speak volumes for your credibility. That's what you want. You want her to see you and your wife as credible and not out to harm her or her H. You just want to deal with this and move on.

How's that? Does that help or hurt?

I'm sorry you are having to deal with that CLB right now.

So on a lighter note tell us what you are going to be for Halloween? I think you should be a super hero because when I picture you I picture a cape and a giant S on your shirt. You are such a delightful person and you are so helpful and honest when helping us. I hope you know how much we adore you and appreciate your point of view.

NG & 2B

I think we should be princesses for Halloween. We will dress in pink gowns and wear a tiara! How can we possibly be sad if we are dressed like royalty?!?!?! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

Good Morning HW….

What a great vent you had. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> Now if we could just muster up enough courage to actually say something like that to our husbands I think we would break all sorts of barriers. It sucks when you go to bed in a crappy mood and then wake up in one as well. H has worked a double shift (god I hope that is what he was doing) the last two nights so it’s been kind of nice to be able to deal with my feelings without him around.

It still just totally floors me how cruel our husbands were during the time of the affair. I told my H that is one of the hardest things for me to deal with is the way he treated me and the horrible things he said to me so he could get away with screwing her. I kills me to think that he was knowingly and willingly hurt me the way he did so he could be with her. When I started asking questions and found out about her, but you know they were “just friends” he degraded me and made me feel like I was such a horrible person for having these doubts about him and in the same breath standing up for her when I questioned if she respected the fact that he was married. He protected her and made her out to be this saint and me out to be this devil ***** of a wife. That kills me that he purposely did that to me.

I am sorry that you are going through all this. Does your H know you come here? Mine doesn’t. Sometimes I wonder if I should tell him but I think he would get mad. He’s not one to share his feelings especially on something like this. But so much of what is said here I think would help them understand what we can’t tell them. Give them a better understanding of what we are going through and the pain that is still so abundant. But I like be able to come here and express my feelings without him knowing also. Catch 22 I guess.

I wish my H would show some kind of emotion about this whole situation. Mine doesn’t show any. So mine needs to take some of your H’s emotions and yours needs to take some lack of emotion from mine and I think then it would be perfect, or is that just wishful thinking. LOL

Do you think that maybe you could cut and paste what you typed (the venting) and give that to your H. What would he do or say? That would be one way to do what top rope said and spell it out for him.

So on a different note…….My puppy had his first training class last night. He did so well. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> He is starting to go in his crate on his own. He went to bed by himself last night. I was so excited. He hasn’t had an accident in the house in almost 2 weeks. I am just so excited. He’s going to the back door like he suppose to, and he’s finally gotten use to the rain. We’ve had it enough here lately he really didn’t have a choice. He is such a sweetie and he is sooooooo a mamma’s boy, I love it. He loves to cuddle. I can’t imagine not having him, he definitely brightens my gloomy days!

Yes, I think we should dress up as princesses.....I would love for someone to zap me into a cinderella story (well the ending anyway...lol) <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

I hope your day gets better…..sending lots of hugs your way!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Love,
LJB

2B -

Yeah that was a pretty wild rant I had. I think I just needed to get it out. I haven't said that to him...at least not like that. I don't think it would help me to send that to him. He'd just ball up and emotionally cut himself off from me.

I am glad he can show emotions....but that's the only emotion I ever see from him. Complete depression....that's it and this is the only situation I have ever witnessed him show emotion. It's like he just wants to crawl into a ball and hide from the world.

My H doesn't come here. I've sent him the link and told him what my screen name is but he doesn't care. He will never come here. I wish he would. I wish he'd read some of the things I write but he wouldn't want to.

Maybe I will rethink sending him my vent...I don't know. I can't see where it would help and it's probably best to let it rest as a vent and nothing more.

I'm glad your puppy is doing well. Sounds like he is bringing you a great deal of happiness! That's good. You sound like you are already in love with him. You have a heart the size of Texas. Did you decide on a name? Let us hear it.

We bought the girls some birds. Rare parakeets to be exact. I like the little bugers. They are fun and loving. Can you imagine that about a bird. My kids love them. The baby named hers Bobby Joe (she names everything that by the way). My older daughter hasn't named hers yet. We call it Bird. I like that name but it will change soon I'm sure.

Hearing you talk about your puppy makes me want one. I have to fight that urge!!!!!! The baby is too mean to have an animal running around the house. She would flush him for sure! We have to watch her with the birds. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Ok, it's settled. We will be princesses! I will imagine my sneakers are glass slippers and my jeans are made of pink toole! We will be lovely!

I hope you are having a good day. I hope you are sleeping well. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

So we are having a Halloween contest here at work and I am still debating if I am going to dress up. We are also having a pumpkin carving contest which I will enter. I love to carve pumpkins. Last year I took 3rd place so this year so we’ll see what happens.

We ended up naming our puppy Kodiak. His registered name is Lord Kodiak Ace of Tyson. We call him Koda though. Yes, I am totally in love with him, he is always doing something to make me laugh, which is nice during the difficult times at night, cause you know me, I don’t know the meaning of the word sleep. LOL

We have so much in common I wish we lived closer. I grew up with birds. We had a parakeet named Chester, a Quaker Parrot named Coco, and a Cockatoo named Casper. He was a sweetie. We taught him how to say, Here kitty kitty kitty, then he would yell, HELP, HELP. He was a riot. Our parakeet that we had was totally in love with my dad. That bird would eat and drink anything my dad would. He loved coke, that bird would go nuts for coke. And our quaker parrot we had, once you would cover him up when it was time to sleep, he would laugh it was almost weird. He had almost one of those devilish laughs. They are great pets.

Your right, it's probably best to leave your vent as that. I don't know what my H would do if I sent him the link. I'm sure he'd come and look but then I think he'd be upset at what I have shared. But I need someone to talk to when I can't talk to him, so tuff. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

Can you believe it's almost November. Christmas is just around the corner and I'm not even close to be ready. This year is going to suck once again. H has to work on Christmas Day. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> I wish he could find a new job, but him finding something that pays what he is making now is almost impossible so once again there is that catch 22. Seems like it is always something standing in the way.

Anyways.....tomorrow is Wednesday and we are almost through the week which means we are one day closer to being done with Halloween. THANK GOODNESS!!!!!!!!!!!! Then maybe this rollercoaster ride with level out a little bit??

My son is done with soccer he had his last game this past weekend. Now he has decided he wants to try karate. That ought to be interesting. Hopefully he won't try any of the things he learns on his sister... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> Then again, might teach her to leave him alone...lol

Today is almost over, hopefully tomorrow will be better for the both of us!

Sending lots of hugs!
<img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> LJB

2B -

You crack me up! I love to carve pumpkins too! I'm not really good at it. Not at all but I like doing it. I saw a picture of a pumpkin the other day that cracked me up.

Now if you are braver you can try this. Go to this link:

http://www.digitpress.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=43651

I'm sure if you are handy with pumpkins you could make this. Alright it's tacky and maybe people will be shocked but it will funny.

One year I won a costume contest by dressing up like my boss. I was lucky he had so much character. I work a grey wig, dressed just like him, reading glasses, handle bar mustache, carried a cigar and made nasty comments to everyone all day long. It was hilarious and I WON!!!! Yes, he thought it was funny but was a little shocked that I would put a pillow in my shirt to appear much bigger then he sees himself. It was awesome!!!

I love the fact that you had birds. I hope we can teach these little fellas some tricks. Do you have any tips. I really do love them. They are so sweet and you can tell they want attention. They keep me company while I'm working.

I love the name Kodiak. That's very unique. I like the offical name too. We had a pomerain named Sir Biscuit of "our last name". He just went by Biscuit. When I had the baby he went nuts. After 8 years we had to find him a new home. He just flipped out. I miss him.

So will you dress Koda up? There are so many different little outfits for animals at the pet store. I love the little elf suits for Christmas. Speaking of which....I haven't started. I'm usually done by now. I am planning to go overboard on the decor and traditions this year.

I bought a book that gives instructions on making mason jars with soup ingredients. Do you think that's corny? I'd love to get something like that. Seriously, I like soup and I like to cook. I like strange things so I"m not a good judge!

HW…..

LMAO….that is too funny. I would love to do something like that but people around here can be pretty proper, drives me crazy sometimes. What a great idea of dressing up like your boss. Sounds like he took it very well.

When we had the birds my parents did all the training, I just played with them. They are great though. I loved it when they would sing. And yes they love attention. I know that when they start to feel neglected or bored some birds will start picking their feathers off their bodies. And you should be getting some white residue, I guess that is the best way to put it, on your hand when you pet the birds, that is good, means they are healthy. I know our parakeet when we had him loved to be scratched on the back of the neck.

No, I won’t be dressing Koda up for Halloween. Boxers are very sensitive to the cold and heat because they have hardly any fur. Even though he has a coat (never thought I would be buying a coat for a dog <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> , but hey what do you do) he still gets cold real easily at night and it is suppose to be pretty cold that night. We got both the dogs Halloween scarves. Koda doesn’t like it too well, but Jasper doesn’t mind.

I love the idea of the mason jars. I love to do that kind of stuff, probably helps that I love to cook. I did the cookies in a jar one year and I bought a little book that had a few ideas of gifts in a jar. I like the idea; I’m like you I like that kind of stuff. I love the idea of soups, especially for the winter time. I love throwing stuff in the crock pot and having it ready when I get home, then I don’t have to cook..lol

I hope your day has gotten better! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> It’s great we can talk about other stuff than the crap we are both going through. Thank you for being you!!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Hugs,
LJB

LJB -

You are a hoot! I can understand people being too proper to get the 'dress up like someone you work with' idea. For the most part the people I work with are like that. I just do things for shock value most of the time. Last summer we had a BBQ contest. You had to design a theme for your booth and come up with a team name. I had so much fun with that. My team name was "Team Road Kill" and I set my booth up like a white trash family reunion (sorry if that offends anyone). I had Christmas lights, road kill menu, bobbing for pigs feet, David Allen Coe on the radio....it was hilarious! We won for best theme....our BBQ was just plain bad....but my thing was the theme I didn't care about the BBQ.

It's funny that Koda gets cold. I guess I never really thought about it. A good friend of mine has a boxer and he is georgous! They also have 2 small children. The dog goes nuts if a stranger gets near the kids. He's very protective. Both the kids adore him. If I got a dog that would be the breed I would get. Does Koda have those neat stripes? I think some are solid brown and some are brown with orange/red stripes.

As for my birds. I think I'm going to move them into my office. Right now they are in my daughter's room. But I'm here all day by myself and I go in there all the time to hang out with them. I'll have to move some things around in here. They do get loud and I can imagine what it would be like with me on conference calls.It would sound like animal kingdom! I wouldn't care.

I'm glad you like the idea of my mason jars. I think I will give it a try. I may not even give them away....who knows. I love my slow cooker! I bought a cookbook for everything that can be cooked in a crock pot. Yesterday I had both of my slowcookers goint. We had a pork pot roast in one and freshly snapped green beans in the other. It was awesome. Since I'm here all day I just get it ready the night before and throw it in there in the morning. My family loves the food I cook and it's healthy for the most part. OK....I probably could leave out the hamhock...but that makes the flavor so I'll splurge.

I'm really wanting to get back to my scrapbooking. Do you know anyone in your group that might know someone in my area that could connect me to a group? I"m in Columbia South Carolina. I'd like a group that meets regularly. I'd really like to get my daughter involved as well. She would love it.

OK, I need to get some work done. I'll check back later. I hope you have a good day. I hope you were able to sleep.

And thank you for being you. I never have friends like this in reality. I tend to make friends that wind up trying to compete with me. I don't understand that.

UGH!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

HW, 2B, (NG?):

Well, lookey at what we got goin on Here! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

I take a self imposed day away from MBers, and a full fledged "friendly discussion" breaks out. What's the world coming too?? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Nay, but seriously......its very REFRESHING to see you gals be able to "connect" on a level Other Than the usual "you know what".
That in itself gives the rest of us hope.
I think its wonderful that you have another Outlet not only for venting and support.....but also just for everyday camaraderie and friendship.
Made me smile. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Just got back from taking my youngest to the Dr.'s office.
She has an abscess on one of her buttocks. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> YIKES!
Its about the size of a quarter and very purple.
She said her "butt" hurt last night (& since she's 4, I thought she just didn't wipe her butt well enough)....so I get the wet wipes out and some baby cream and think it will just take a minute. Then we pull down her pants and there is Blood in her underwear.
I'm like "This is NOT GOOD"! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

Anyway the wound was open and ooozzing puss and blood. (sorry ...I know...Gross)
I of course did the wrong thing and squeezed all the puss out until it only came out blood.
[Dr. said this can make the infection go in even deeper]. OOOPPPSSS!!!!
Anyway, she's going to be on anti biotic (oral and topical) for at least 10 days and up to 20.
This is our 3rd child and NEVER had this happen before.

Next, just wanted to say thanks for taking my question under consideration. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />
You guys mostly said what I was thinking, but I was hopeful to be able to get away with NOT having to write out soooooooo much. But looks like no real way around doing it.
Later I'll try to get to your actual questions (but I want to send you something NOW.....so you know I'm not ignoring ya).

(Side note): HW, the stuff I wrote to 2B could just as well have been said ( and should have been) said to YOU. IN fact, most of it was for you (inside my head).

Maybe I'll join into your discussion at some point.
(Should I ask permission or <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" /> just Butt my way in??)

Like I got myself a "crock pot" cook book recently too?
Actually have used some of the recipes too. (Its SOOO easy, I love it).

And pumpkin carving ...like to try that as well. (Not really all that good, although I have made a ghost {real good}, bat and cat).
Can't make "real life" faces or anything like that though. But I can follow a pattern.

In addition, we have our last soccer game tomorrow. (They got canceled on Sunday because it was so nasty and raw here). So we're making it up on the usual "practice" night.
This is what I was coaching last week.

Anyway this was just to touch base and let you know I did read your responses and DO Appreciate your efforts.

SEE 2B, sounds like just "chatting" here has helped to get your spirits up and your head out of some of the depression thoughts.
So don't hide......come and relieve yourself of all that Baggage and negativity.
We don't just "wallow" in it with you (although that sometimes happens)...NO, mostly we try to pick each other up. Doesn't ALWAYS work......but it does more times then not.

To tell you the truth the one thing that CAN get me down about this place....is when I think a discussion is going along well.....and then BAMMM!....nobody comes and posts for a day or 2 or more <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> ......that can sometimes put me in a "downer" of a mood. (I know, Sad isn't it??)
But hey, its the truth (and we are about radical honesy..right??)

Till next time,
Take good care of yourselves.

Top-Rope -

I'm so glad you decided to join in the fun. I love that you just bought a slow cooker cookbook. They are awesome. Maybe you could share your favorite meal to cook in a crockpot. Mine would be 16 bean soup. You buy the dried beans. Soak overnight. Throw'em in the pot with some hamhock, salt and pepper....cook on low and in about 7-8 hours you have an awesome low fat meal.

I am so sorry to hear about your daughter. I've heard about those. I dont' really know what it is or what would cause it. It sounds terrible. You are a good brave daddy to do what you did though. I hope she is feeling better now. Why would it turn purple? Is it simply infection? I'll go look it up on the internet.


I'll have to go back and reread what you wrote to 2B in a new context.

And did you happen to check out that link I had in my post. The Butt Pumpkin is hilarious!!!! I would love to do that but I've already carved my pumpkin for this year.

So you are a soccer coach. That's admirable. My kids do not play soccer. Sometimes I wish they would. The baby might be my runner. My oldest daughter love softball. I've played my whole life so she loves it. Softball season will be over in a week or so. I'm thinking of signing her up for Karate! 2B's son is doing that as well. My oldest is very shy so I'm hoping that will bring her out of her shell!

Ok, folks. I need to wrap up for the day. My husband is on his way home and I have to get dinner ready. Trying something different tonight....lasagna with a twist. Cross your fingers...I do not do well when I'm outside of my comfort zone.

Have a good evening all.

HW….

I am always shocking someone, I’ve been told I am quite the pot stirrer…lol <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> Not sure if that is a good thing or bad thing. But you will always know where you stand with me…now if I could just be that way with my husband I’d have it made. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

Koda has the t-bone white on his face and some white on his chest and tummy but no stripes. His coloring is still changing some days he looks more red other days he looks more dark tan. I just love his wrinkly head.

Ohhh I think you should give the mason jars away as gifts. I like them because people took time to make them. Means a little more. You can get some really cute fabric to put of the top of the jar and use some raffia to tie bows around the fabric. Would be really cute! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

I’ll have to ask my scrapbooking group if they know anyone in your area. I don’t think they do but I’ll ask next time I see them. With everything that happened I took a break from the group. I finally started making myself go to get out of the crappy routine I was getting myself into. I’m glad I made myself start doing that again. It is such a great outlet for me. I also make cards with Stampin Up stamps, so I have started making my Christmas cards (I cringe to even think about Christmas, but I’m doing it). I usually make a couple of different designs….I love getting cards made by people. Have you ever done it? It’s a lot of fun!

Today is almost over and off to the house I go. Last night I didn’t get home till after 9:00 hopefully tonight won’t be so hectic! Have a great night, talk to you tomorrow!

Hugs,
LJB

Hey there top rope…..

Glad you posted today!!! It’s always great to hear from you, see what happens when you take a day off. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> Your right, it is great that we can talk about other things then what brought us to this board. Connecting on all those levels rather than just the one makes everyone real! Does that make sense?

Kids sure can come up with a lot of firsts can’t they? I swear last year I think we were in the doctors office about every other week. If it wasn’t one thing it was another. I told my doctor I was just going to move into his office before to long. Hopefully your daughter starts feeling better soon and the pain goes away.

When you are writing her the letter, just remember to tell her what you would want to know. It will be a long letter but I feel, as you do, it is something that needs to be done. I know that HW and I had a lot of questions, but you know us woman, always asking questions! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

Oh yeah, I think I can speak for HW also in saying this! You don’t need to ask permission to join any of our discussions. You are more than welcome, you have great insight and have such a great sense of humor, we love hearing from you. So join in!!!!

I am glad I took your advice and stuck with the board, you all did lift my spirits and made the last few days a lot easier to bear! THANK YOU!!!!!!

It’s funny you mentioned getting down when you haven’t heard from someone for a couple of days. It does get hard when you get use to talking to someone almost daily then they are gone for a few days and your not sure why. Even though we haven’t met, I consider you guys my friends and I care about happens to you. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

I wish this place had private messaging. Does anyone know why there isn’t? Just curious!

Anyway, I am headed home in a few. Hope you all have a great night! Sweet dreams!

Hugs,
LJB

2B -

I think I will try to jars. I'm excited to get started. I think I might give that card idea a try as well. Where do I go? How do I start? I was looking for traditions and that sounds like a really good one. I'd like to do a photo card. Can I make the photo card frames? Any suggestions would be appreciated.

My theme will be "HOMEMADE EVERYTHING"! How's that? I've made almost all of my ornaments and I could make my own angel and tree skirt. We'll have homemade cards and homemade gifts. OK...not everything will be homemade. I'm not sure I could create Limited Too clothing for my 9 year old! That's all she wants.

I do think of you as a dear friend. Top-Rope too! I miss Roughroad. I know she's hurting right now but I feel so helpless when I post to her. There's nothing I can do or say that will help her. Talking to you and NG and Top-Rope helps me through my day. I also adore WAT. He gives great advice and is such an inspiration to me. If you ever get a chance read some of his posts. They will blow your mind. He's a smart man.

Koda sounds beautiful. I looked up boxers on the internet and saw the variety of colors. They are such stunning creatures. Very regal looking.

Oh I wanted to say I'm sorry if I hurt anyone's feeling with my 'white trash' reference earlier. I meant no offense. I'm white and I swear my roots are far from classy. I like to think that I was able to raise myself out of the trailer park but that time in my life shaped me to be who I am today and that's pretty grounded!

There's my politically correct speech of the day.

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

So Top-Rope I looked up abscess on the internet and I have to say I was not prepared for that at all. I had an idea but had never really witnessed it before. I cannot believe your 4 year old had to suffer through that. How terrible. They can be dangerous and get really bad really quick. I'm glad you got her to the doctor in time to be looked at.

Ok it's off to be for me. Good night all.

Hey HW...

Go to this website and you'll be able to see my puppy. Since we have gotten our boxer I am totally addicted to this website. A lot of great information on boxers if you are ever interested in getting one. They have a photo gallery so we have a place to show off our babies.... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

http://www.boxerworld.com/photo/showgallery.php?cat=500&ppuser=28607

That should take you directly to my photo gallery!

I'll post again in a bit!

Hugs,
LJB

Good mornin Ladies! (??)

Hope it is for you.

How did I let my life get so hectic?
I am a home body by nature. Yet here I am scrambling day to day.
(keep in mind I (in the past) only let my kids do 1 activity per season to keep things sane).

Unfortunately, this fall that plan has went right out the window.

My 2 older girls are both in soccer. So that's 2 practices and 2 games per week.
(then I got roped [well I volunteered] into being the assistant coach)

Then they have swimming lessons.

Then all 3 started gymnastics. (which they LOVE by the way)

Then they started "awanas" club (its a young person Christian based program) aimed at helping children grow spiritually, socially and even physically.

So the ONLY day I don't have to run here and there is on Friday (wheeew!)

Now that swimming and soccer are ending they ALL want to start Ice Skating.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not complaining (MUCH) but I don't know how the heck all the rest of you have been doing this type of stuff for years. I'm only 3-4 months into it.....and ITS plain wearing me out.

Next, I've made a life change for myself (and family).
I was supposed to go this week and take a 5 week "training" session to further update my job skills.
However, while out walking in the morning (about 3 weeks ago) I got an epiphany.

I am going to work for myself.
(Its something I've dabbled in for years....but never had the courage (or incentive perhaps) to try and do as a Full Time gig.
So anyway, I took my kids out of day care.....and just started doing it.
I have more free time, but also more stress.

So instead of being in Training...I'm home teaching my youngest how to "write' the letters in her full name. (she can spell it already...not so good at making it out on paper)

Then I have to pick my other 2 up early, as they only have a 1/2 day of school today.

One of the reasons I took the other day off from this site, was I was kind of "bummed" out at some of the start off costs to get this started. You know capital. The saying is true (to an extent) it does Take money to Make $money$. But I'm over it now.

Lastly, I've got a few incomplete ramblings that I'm going to post to you gals.
Cause if I wait until I'm happy with what they say....I'll NEVER end up posting them.
I've waited WAAAY too long to get this out to you HW, and now that 2B seems to have many of the same issues........just seems like the right time.
Again they are only probably 25% of what I could and would say on the phone.....but we do the best with this medium we have.
In fact, I'm not even going to go back and reread and edit them.
I'll let them stand on their own (for good or bad??)

They just always seem so incomplete as compared to the "idea" I have in my head.
Its like the skeleton of what I'm trying to convey is there, but the "meat" is missing.
Oh well, guess I am crazy after all.
Hope you take them as they were intended.

HW,(2B)

This is not how I intended to bring this up. But it just seems that NOW is the right time.
(you know what a procrastinator I can be)
So here it goes:
[This is ONE were I sure Wish I could talk to you over the phone or in person, as its more complex then I can communicate effectively on this forum].

What I posted to 2B about being "too" strong for your own good, could and does apply to you as well.
This is one of the things I've needed to say to you, but just never felt entirely comfortable doing.

Why?
Perhaps because you DO seem like such a strong and capable woman.

Mostly because it seems like such a part of you ( so if I seemed to be "attacking" that part of your strategy) then it would be like I am attacking YOU personally.
That I didn't want at all.

But IMO part of what is "hindering" your recovery is your misplaced concern over NOT making your H "feel" guilty.
Combined with your thought that you must be so "strong" for Everyone (else).

NO, truth is...he needs to feel your pain.

But not like a sledge hammer (meaning punishment).
He needs to see it as it "is".....and then be given the opportunity to SHOW to YOU that he can at least Try to make amends for it.

Him feeling your Pain, is the closest thing to a guarantee (that he WON'T do this again) that your going to get in this journey your on.

However, if you constantly "protect" him from your concerns, questions and yes, Pain.....then HE never gets the opportunity to learn and grow.
In effect, your "protecting" him is stunting his ability to gain valuable insights that he needs.

(Much like over protective parents "stunt" their children from maturing and learning responsibility).

In addition, the 2 of you need to be going down this path together. Fact is YOU CAN'T do this alone.
Otherwise, what's the point?

Don't get me wrong...I DO totally understand WHY you are doing this and taking this tactic.
However, just like when a WS is misguided when they "think" they are Protecting and helping the BS by hiding or omitting information when asked.....IMO what your doing is very similar.
Both situations have the best of intentions.....but sadly the opposite results.[from the intended outcome]

In the end, they both just make it worse.

Unfortunately, the thinking also tends to follow along these misguided lines as well.
The WS thinks that since the BS is upset when the lies are discovered, then the solution is too just "lie", cover and hide even better. NO, No, no!
That only makes the problem worse. The solution is too just be open and honest and let the BS be upset at the news AT THE TIME. (BS's can get over almost anything... except MORE lies).

So the same is with you. You see your H's guilt and him being upset when you ask him questions....which come ONLY when you are at your Wit's End and are having a bad day.
Then you feel bad.

SO Your solution is TOO BE EVEN STRONGER and hold all these emotions in by force of will alone.

IMO this is insanity. To keep doing the SAME thing over and Over....Yet Expect a Different result.

So first off, the 2 of you HAVE to have some discussions about the A.
I know for a fact that YOU STILL have questions you NEED answers too.
So you must ask them.

YOU CAN ask and have discussions that are not "fights" or LBing sessions. IT IS Possible.

Your current strategy is making you crazy.
Its a pattern. You stay strong, hold it together...then it gets to be too much and you fall apart.
You "stay strong" and push down or bottle up your emotions.......but then they get TOO much and you Crash into depression.

And then you feel guilty that you weren't somehow STRONG enough.
That in some way you let the Family down.
Wrong, wrong, wrong Thinking!

There is good news and bad news too discussing the A to its conclusion.
The bad:
IT does make for some uncomfortable days. Cause its going to take MANY conversations to get it all out.
Your first questions turn into others you never even thought of.
It seems like your "obsessing" will never end.
The pain of revelation does hurt (at the time).

The good:
Eventually you have all your questions answered.
Then even YOU don't want to talk about it anymore. (Really, its true... I couldn't believe it either)
(Cause even if there is some small minor detail that pops up....you say to yourself.."I know enough".)
The best part comes with finally being able to put the A to rest and STOP Obsessing about it........because you FINALLY have the "truth". (Or as much as you'll ever get without actually being there).
However, since you "know" what went on......you can make some sense of it (TOO YOURSELF) and Deal with it in your own way.
Bottom line is that after totally talking it out, the A loses its "control" and hold over you.

That's not to say you can't still make yourself "feel" bad by thinking about it.

But the difference is, that it is YOU ... who controls whether or not you "think" about it.
NOT the out of control thinking that goes on now.

In our situation, My W preferred that I either e-mail or write out my questions on paper and she would write back to me. She found that she could be MORE honest and more complete using this method. Perhaps it could work for you as well.

She always felt like I was "interrogating" her, when we spoke face to face. (and to some extent I was).

Don't get me wrong. YOU can't ONLY talk about the A.
But we both recognize that NEVER talking about it, isn't working for you either.

Getting ALL your questions and concerns answered will bring you more peace, then all the MC about "moving On" will ever do.
It is the one thing that did indeed let me get "closure" on this most horrible time in my life.

And its not only the getting the actual answers that helps.
It was just as much my W's willingness to share this info. and be OPEN with me....that let me know she wasn't "protecting" either the OM or her "memories" of the A. It showed me that I meant more to her then they did.
In addition, this goes a long way in restoring the trust (as you feel like your the one being protected and are most important Again).

Make no mistake this was NO easy process.
It took about a year for it ALL to come out and for me to gain the abiltiy to stop "obsessing". But without gaining this ability.....I'd still be "obsessing". Just a fact. '
And it was my W who held the key for me to get here.

Truly, Even if we had gotten a D, I would have STILL had all these unanswered questions (but then with NO WAY of ever getting them). She did me a Great Service in Helping me to HEAL myself.
As for The M, well we're still working on that. But at least I am WHOLE again...and I have her to thank for that!

YOU BOTH NEED THIS TOO!

For the 1st year we talked about the A constantly.
But we haven't had an "A" talk now in 11 months. (but I will say I'm about due for one...he, he).
Especially since the CLB keeps popping himself BACK into our lives.

Famous "triple" post. Oh boy.

<small>[ October 28, 2004, 10:10 AM: Message edited by: top rope ]</small>